[HeyPete]

(08-13-2014 02:05 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(08-13-2014 01:35 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

(08-13-2014 12:54 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(08-13-2014 12:45 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

(08-13-2014 12:39 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Just a few points, a huge proportion of us did not grow up in neighborhoods like this. There's been a black middle class for some time. I just want to make sure you realize that you are talking about a segment of underclass black society, not our entire group. I've long said that unfortunately, the black middle class is largely invisible to many people. It's people like these rioters that are what you see on the news. I go to the main park in my city on Sundays and I see black middle class families everywhere with their kids and having picnics and BBQs after church and enjoying their lives. Let's not paint the entire black race in a broad brush. I tire of that.

Also, let's not continue this narrative of blacks = welfare while immigrants are hard working. There's a lot of myth in that. For example, Blacks, whites and Hispanics use the same percentage of welfare. Blacks have actually been moving off welfare while Hispanic use is trending up. Look at the chart below. Statistics don't always support the stereotype, in this case, the hard working Hispanics vs lazy blacks looking for handouts.

I get what you are saying about the black middle class. But that chart is utter crap.

Hispanics can be Puerto Rican or Dominican or Mexican or Guatemalan or Bolivian etc. and they are all lumped together to make this huge number. So, if they were separate like it should be, the number would be nowhere close to blacks when it comes to welfare.

Well that's me saying the black number is inaccurate because it lumps together black Americans, Haitian immigrants, African immigrants, Somali refugees, etc.

It wouldn't change the per capita welfare rate. It doesn't matter if the Hispanics come from different countries. All that matters is per capita rate.

So, I guess congratulations are in order since after 300 years blacks are finally, albeit modestly, lowering their welfare numbers. And they've been speaking English, sort of, for all that time.

It's amazing that it only took 10 times the amount of time to do what non-English speakers already accomplished.

I'll see if the government will give you a $100.

Why are you being a smart ass? We don't need to go back 300 years. My parents were alive when blacks couldn't even vote or go to school in some states. This isn't ancient history, they can tell me the stories as they lived through it.

And if it weren't for blacks fighting for civil rights you immigrants would've never even been given a chance to come here as non-white immigration was mostly banned prior to the civil rights movement.

You're an elder statesman on RVF and I enjoy this forum immensely, so I will rightly give you respect as an individual. But the immigrant side of my family didn't need anything from and owes blacks absolutely nothing. The US border jumped them, not the other way around. Their land was stolen, all of it and everything on it in the early 1900's.

They didn't riot. They didn't loot. They rolled up their sleeves and starting building again within a new set of rules.

They too were discriminated against. But they didn't use it as an excuse to give up for generations and generations. My parents, well my Dad, can tell me stories about not being allowed in restaurants. Not being able to use drinking fountains, or stay in certain hotels etc. This wasn't black exclusive. So don't go around patting yourself on the back because Martin Luther King went for a stroll in Alabama.

[WanderingSoul]

(08-12-2014 08:37 PM)Enigma Wrote:  

Could some of you be more biased?

I see so many posts about the "growing police state", yet an unarmed teenager is -- based on several eyewitness accounts -- murdered execution style in the middle of a street and you want people to stand around in a circle with candles?

What does a candle light vigil solve? Obviously looting isn't exactly constructive, but it's a result of a group of people who are frustrated to the point of lashing out in any way they can.

There are stories of police using unnecessary force and/or killing coming out on a very regular basis. The rioting is the only reason this particular case is such a large story.

By the way:



Nothing is solved by allowing the "justice" system to run its course either. None of these cops are ever held accountable past a paid suspension.

They haven't even interviewed the friend that was with the victim when he was killed:

And what does "lack of father figures" have to do with it?

Riots aren't limited to black people or the West, so I'm not sure what comments about the family structure in black American communities even have to do with it.

I was raised to hate cops. In my family it's 100x better to be a convict than a cop. I don't like cops at all. I don't trust them, and I think the large majority are pieces of shit with low IQs and a power trip.

With that said, this looting is not blacks lashing out due to anger and frustration. The rioting I would say is, but the looting and destroying of the neighborhood they live in, small family businesses of their neighbors, etc. is just a bunch of pieces of shit looking for an excuse to steal stuff. That's all that it is, period.

Destroy the police station, government vehicles, county offices, the court house, etc. That I would understand 100%. But destroying their own neighborhoods, and robbing black owned businesses? That's ridiculous. Only complete idiots would do that.

As far as the cop shooting an unarmed black man for no reason, I have no idea if that is true or not. What I do know is true is that the media will spin ANY story of a white man killing a black man to turn it into a race issue, fire up the American people, and generate a shit load of money for themselves. They WANT the riots to keep happening. They WANT to divide people and cause controversy. The longer this rioting goes on, the more money they will make.

The truth is that this cop may be a cold blooded murderer who killed an innocent man, or the cop may have been 100% justified in what he did. We will never really know because we were not there, and the media will NEVER tell the truth of what happened. They will only tell us what suits their primary goal, which is profit.

[speakeasy]

(08-13-2014 02:18 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

You're an elder statesman on RVF and I enjoy this forum immensely, so I will rightly give you respect as an individual. But the immigrant side of my family didn't need anything from and owes blacks absolutely nothing. The US border jumped them, not the other way around. Their land was stolen, all of it and everything on it in the early 1900's.

They didn't riot. They didn't loot. They rolled up their sleeves and starting building again within a new set of rules.

Are you suuuure about that? The majority of people rioting during the 1992 L.A. Riots were actually Mexicans: http://articles.latimes.com/1992-06-18/l...eles-riots

[Sp5]

Looks like the wars are coming home.

I love the desert boots, nice fashion touch.

[HeyPete]

(08-13-2014 02:40 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(08-13-2014 02:18 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

You're an elder statesman on RVF and I enjoy this forum immensely, so I will rightly give you respect as an individual. But the immigrant side of my family didn't need anything from and owes blacks absolutely nothing. The US border jumped them, not the other way around. Their land was stolen, all of it and everything on it in the early 1900's.

They didn't riot. They didn't loot. They rolled up their sleeves and starting building again within a new set of rules.

Are you suuuure about that? The majority of people rioting during the 1992 L.A. Riots were actually Mexicans: http://articles.latimes.com/1992-06-18/l...eles-riots

Those numbers are highly disputed. Because there were still waaaaay more blacks. The arrest numbers were overwhelmingly black. The dead were overwhelmingly black.

Dude, look at footage from those riots. Who's beating truckers? Who's shooting at helicopters? Who's amassing in the streets throwing bricks and tearing stuff up. Who's pulling people out of their cars? Who was shooting at fire trucks?

And who started it all because he was driving 120 mph on the 210? Because he had warrants and couldn't pull over.

Are you playing dumb on purpose?

Also, tell me about this -- South Central LA is no longer majority black. And all of a sudden it isn't considered hell on earth anymore. It's actually an up-and-coming neighborhood. Funny, get rid of blacks and the property values go up.

You're kind of tiresome. Accept facts, man. It's OK. It's not your fault.

[HeyPete]

(08-13-2014 02:51 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

Looks like the wars are coming home.

I love the desert boots, nice fashion touch.

Look at that upstanding gentleman. I'd hire him in a second and trust him with all my valuables.

[jariel]

Speak, his world view is based off the experiences from his small neighborhood back in the '70s, people like that you can come with all the information in the world, and they will dismiss it because it doesn't fit the narrative they want to believe.

Look at his comments, his voice doesn't represent even a reasonable percentage of the people he purports to represent.

People like that need a lot more help than the people they direct their vitriol towards, chalk it up as a "W" because you're bigger than that and move on, he took the "L" back in the '70s.

[speakeasy]

(08-13-2014 02:56 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

Those numbers are highly disputed. Because there were still waaaaay more blacks. The arrest numbers were overwhelmingly black. The dead were overwhelmingly black.

The numbers aren't disputed. We know how many people got arrested for looting during the riots. This is publicly available information. No, the Mexicans weren't angry about Rodney King and probably couldn't care less about him. They weren't in the riot for any political reasons, for them it was about looting some free shit while everything was going on. Now I guess the next thing you're going to tell me is that LAPD was ignoring blacks and specifically targeting Mexicans for arrest and that's why their numbers were higher.

Here's a photo from the L.A. Riots since you don't believe Hispanics had any involvement.






But since you don't believe Mexicans riot, I guess you've also forgotten about the Laker riots outside Staples center. Just about all Latino dudes:





Maybe you've forgotten about the May Day Melee where illegal aliens demanding amnesty began throwing rocks and bottles at cops.

Quote:

Also, tell me about this -- South Central LA is no longer majority black. And all of a sudden it isn't considered hell on earth anymore. It's actually an up-and-coming neighborhood. Funny, get rid of blacks and the property values go up.

Lol. That's exactly what whites would say about Mexicans. I don't know about South Central being an "up and coming" area, that's a bit of a stretch. But it's definitely calmed down since the crime wave of the late 80s-90s(and I hope you realized most the gangs were Latino gangs, right?). That's mostly due to gang warfare dying down. And the majority of gangs in Los Angeles are Latino by far. So you don't have a leg to stand on. Seriously. Who the hell would walk around East L.A. in the middle of the night? You're gonna tell me that Mexicans make the neighborhood safe? I'm not bashing Mexicans, but if you're gonna tell me that Mexicans are making L.A. safer, that's just nonsense.

Latino gang members outnumber black even nationwide, yet alone in L.A.:



The most dangerous gangs in L.A. are Latino. Anyone that denies that is lying or woefully uninformed.

These are the muthafuckas you gotta watch your back for:

[MidWest]

The real question you guys should be asking yourselves is why did these riots occur?

Obviously because a black unarmed guy was shot by a white cop what was it 15 times? Don't you think people are going to cry racism? Of course they are, and when people feel like justice isn't being served you get a bad reaction.

All of this could have been prevented with the arrest of the cop. Everybody knows who shot the guy and how many times, why hasn't the cop been arrested? That's just plain murder period, and the fact that law enforcement is trying to cover up for the guy by saying "we are going to investigate more deeply" is just crazy. The city is willing to close down schools, close down businesses, close down the mall, bring the military just to protect this one cop, its insane.

My personal opinion is that I think nothing will happen. If the cop does go on trial he will walk free and the jury or judge will find a way to justify his shooting, similar to what happened in the Zimmerman trial.

[It_is_my_time]

(08-13-2014 04:27 AM)MidWest Wrote:  

The real question you guys should be asking yourselves is why did these riots occur?

Obviously because a black unarmed guy was shot by a white cop what was it 15 times? Don't you think people are going to cry racism? Of course they are, and when people feel like justice isn't being served you get a bad reaction.

All of this could have been prevented with the arrest of the cop. Everybody knows who shot the guy and how many times, why hasn't the cop been arrested? That's just plain murder period, and the fact that law enforcement is trying to cover up for the guy by saying "we are going to investigate more deeply" is just crazy. The city is willing to close down schools, close down businesses, close down the mall, bring the military just to protect this one cop, its insane.

My personal opinion is that I think nothing will happen. If the cop does go on trial he will walk free and the jury or judge will find a way to justify his shooting, similar to what happened in the Zimmerman trial.

I want to stay out of these threads, but I had to respond to this...

#1) Zimmerman walked because a jury found he legally defended himself. Those are the laws of our country.

#2) Why do these riots occur? Because of economic strife. So what is the base cause of economic strife in these areas? Dependence on govt. handouts, rather than free market principles. What causes all the dependence on govt.? Women having kids out of wedlock and with no resources to support themselves. What causes women to have kids out of wedlock? The politicians figured that they can essentially buy votes by just giving poor people small crumbs from the table to vote for them. Which in turn means these people give away their freedoms and aspirations and dreams for a roach infested govt. housing unit in a violent area with shitty schools.

#3) We don't know who the cop was that shot this kid. As of the time of my typing this out they have not released his identity to protect him from the violent mobs, and it appears rightfully so.

#4) We don't know what happened. From what I have heard the police there do not have dashboard cameras. So it will be forensic evidence and any eye witness testimony combined to determine best what happened and if any charges should be pressed. They don't just randomly charge people with serious felonies without evidence. And the FBI is supposed to be collecting this.

#5) It is tough to trust our govt and police, which is amazing because these same neighborhoods overwhelmingly vote Democratic party, which introduces even more govt. and more police into our lives.

#6) It is too bad these people rioting don't realize the source of their frustration is being lied to by politicians for decades and giving up their dreams and hopes in exchange for a shitty living environment. Because nothing will change until the realize this.

[Mentavious]

(08-13-2014 02:58 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

(08-13-2014 02:51 AM)Sp5 Wrote:  

Looks like the wars are coming home.

I love the desert boots, nice fashion touch.

Look at that upstanding gentleman. I'd hire him in a second and trust him with all my valuables.

That comment says it all.

[jariel]

(08-13-2014 02:58 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  



Look at that upstanding gentleman. I'd hire him in a second and trust him with all my valuables.

Ment, just another perspective on that ridiculousness, the guy with the bookbag is untrustworthy, but the guys decked out in combat gear armed with assault weapons are...

[Foolsgo1d]

Are those cops or National Guardsmen?


EDIT. They're cops.

Why do US police forces need military hardware and vehicles equipped to handle .50 cal machine gun placements?

[It_is_my_time]

(08-13-2014 08:38 AM)Foolsgo1d Wrote:  

Are those cops or National Guardsmen?


EDIT. They're cops.

Why do US police forces need military hardware and vehicles equipped to handle .50 cal machine gun placements?

One or both these seem to be the answer...

#1) Because we have a shit ton surplus of it after all the wars in the middle east. So what else will the govt. do with it other than sell it at a discount to police forces.

#2) The US will default on its debt sooner than later. 16 years of Bush/Obama will guarantee it. When that happens there will need to be a massive and strong police presence to keep order. So maybe they are just being prepared.

[Sp5]

(08-13-2014 07:42 AM)jariel Wrote:  

Ment, just another perspective on that ridiculousness, the guy with the bookbag is untrustworthy, but the guys decked out in combat gear armed with assault weapons are...

They're cops - our militarized police. BTW, for years into the future your local cop is very likely to have been kicking in doors in Iraq or Afghanistan in the past for years.

My question is - do you think the "Fuck the police" on the mailbox is real, or a Photoshop job?

[Joga Bonito]

(08-13-2014 02:19 AM)RioNomad Wrote:  

(08-12-2014 08:37 PM)Enigma Wrote:  

Could some of you be more biased?

I see so many posts about the "growing police state", yet an unarmed teenager is -- based on several eyewitness accounts -- murdered execution style in the middle of a street and you want people to stand around in a circle with candles?

What does a candle light vigil solve? Obviously looting isn't exactly constructive, but it's a result of a group of people who are frustrated to the point of lashing out in any way they can.

There are stories of police using unnecessary force and/or killing coming out on a very regular basis. The rioting is the only reason this particular case is such a large story.

By the way:



Nothing is solved by allowing the "justice" system to run its course either. None of these cops are ever held accountable past a paid suspension.

They haven't even interviewed the friend that was with the victim when he was killed:

And what does "lack of father figures" have to do with it?

Riots aren't limited to black people or the West, so I'm not sure what comments about the family structure in black American communities even have to do with it.

I was raised to hate cops. In my family it's 100x better to be a convict than a cop. I don't like cops at all. I don't trust them, and I think the large majority are pieces of shit with low IQs and a power trip.

With that said, this looting is not blacks lashing out due to anger and frustration. The rioting I would say is, but the looting and destroying of the neighborhood they live in, small family businesses of their neighbors, etc. is just a bunch of pieces of shit looking for an excuse to steal stuff. That's all that it is, period.

Destroy the police station, government vehicles, county offices, the court house, etc. That I would understand 100%. But destroying their own neighborhoods, and robbing black owned businesses? That's ridiculous. Only complete idiots would do that.

As far as the cop shooting an unarmed black man for no reason, I have no idea if that is true or not. What I do know is true is that the media will spin ANY story of a white man killing a black man to turn it into a race issue, fire up the American people, and generate a shit load of money for themselves. They WANT the riots to keep happening. They WANT to divide people and cause controversy. The longer this rioting goes on, the more money they will make.

The truth is that this cop may be a cold blooded murderer who killed an innocent man, or the cop may have been 100% justified in what he did. We will never really know because we were not there, and the media will NEVER tell the truth of what happened. They will only tell us what suits their primary goal, which is profit.

Would you mind linking to where you found out that they are robbing Black owned businesses? I'd very interested in reading that since weave shops, convenience stores, and gas station posts are literally never or very rarely actually owned by Black people and the money generated by those shops is usually taken out of the neighborhoods they reside in(along with the owners). In a city like Detroit, there are essentially no Black owned tire shops, corner stores, weave shops, etc. so I would be curious to see how different it is in St. Louis, since both cities share the commonality of having very high Black populations. The same could be said for places like Los Angeles or Philly.

[DjembaDjemba]

speakeasy Wrote:

Lol. Well if that was the solution Brazil should have a lower crime rate than we have!

Actually it's more about me getting laid. I'm selfish like that. It's hard to care about shit like this anymore, people will always blame their problems on someone else. Poor economically hopeless blacks blaming whites for their misfortune.

Go to any thread relating to world issues on pretty much any sphere site and see nerdy hopeless whites blaming Jews for their own underachievement as human beings. Nobody likes the guy above them. Everybody likes to play the blame game.

You can't be held responsible for the dumb shit an underclass does that you happen to by sheer chance share skin tone with. No more than a white dude can be held accountable for the poor white underclass.

Racial kinship died 100 years ago in the west when capitalists like Henry Ford realized that the colour of labour no longer mattered. If he can do the job, he will work. That is what I'm grateful for, and so should every man who believes in freedom and personal choice.


In a capitalist society a man will be made or broken at the altar of his own choices.

As individuals we can be held only responsible for our own choices, we have the option of bettering ourselves or giving in to hopelessness, despair, and devolution of responsibility. If people want to behave like retards, then good luck to them and their endeavours.

[berserk]

(08-13-2014 09:12 AM)DjembaDjemba Wrote:  

Go to any thread relating to world issues on pretty much any sphere site and see nerdy hopeless whites blaming Jews for their own underachievement as human beings.

Nice shaming tactics there, sound exactly like a feminist.

[DjembaDjemba]

Blaming others for personal underachievement is feminism to the core.

It doesn't matter what race, colour, religion or sex a person is. Playing victim is weak.

I associate with a wide variety of people however I have nothing to do with the hopeless self defeatists.

There's no shortage of low class people of all colours who really quite frankly add very little value to themselves or society.

Pointing this out is not shaming.

[KorbenDallas]

I didn't realize Henry Ford was a hopeless white nerd.

Edit: I agree with Djemba, complaining is annoying, but if the roles were reversed, and Christians were dominant leaders of Israel's central bank for the last 30 years, controlled their media, and constantly worked for the opening of their borders for Arab's who don't share their constitutional values, the Israeli's would rightly be upset.

[TigerMandingo]

delete

[DjembaDjemba]

You do have a point there, he was a hardcore capitalist, industrialist, however also well known antisemite. I guess a man of his times.

[Roosh]

Guys, let's keep this thread based on the news of what's happening in Ferguson, not of cultural/race commentary.

[jariel]

[Dr. Howard]

I have been seeing this from the perspective that Rio put down; that is, why do these people "rise up" and steal fancy rims and hair weaves? Are they making mad max combat vehicles with shiny wheels and intricate disguises involving lots of hair? Nope. Compare this to say the Ukraine where the centers of rebellion were on government offices and police stations. When american's 'rise up' and steal consumer goods as their way of striking back I don't think the government needs to be concerned any time soon.

Even compare this to the natives in Canada when they get crazy, they disrupt major commerce routes, blockade things and generally do their best to disrupt things until they get a special audience. Again, if a day comes where there is some sort of violence after a shooting etc. and the people that live in that neighborhood respond by blockading the streets in and out and denying the presence of local authority then there will be problems. The Whiskey rebellion is a good american example from the past, which wasn't a full on anarchy outbreak but just people harassing tax collectors when they came into their neighborhoods...it did escalate though.

Last @IWin, I know a black couple that owns a hair weave shop.