[MikeCF]

Someone posted something that makes a lot of sense. He said that forum drama always spikes during winter.

Maybe all have SAD (seasonal affective disorder) or cabin fever?

Anyhow, I'm in a weird predicament. (If this is a post being dramatic about drama, kill me please.)

I love you bros and enjoy helping out and I learn a thing or two.

But I am weak like all humans and sometimes get sucked into the drama.

I hate to take time away, but it's almost like the forum has become like my kitchen.

If I don't bring junk food home, I don't eat it. If I do bring junk food in, I binge eat. In other words, I have either an iron will or else a weak will - a man of extremes.

Right now there is a lot of junk food (drama, meltdowns, etc.) and I am getting sucked in.

Can we stop being dramatic for a while so that we can focus on building ourselves up as better men?

A lot of us (I am as guilty as the next guy and am in no way holding myself out as being above all the nonsense) are not setting a very good example.

Am I the only one who thinks this?

Solutions?

[Quintus Curtius]

Mike:
It's amazing the timing. I just started a thread a few seconds ago on how much RVF and ROK have helped me, just in one year.

It occurred to me that we so easily forget the good that comes from things. Because good is typically associated with dull and non-dramatic effort.

I am glad to know you, Mikey. You are one of the people who, without this forum, I would never have met.

QC

[MikeCF]

^ Right.

I am just thinking about loud.

This forum is a value add to my life. That's why I answer questions freely. "Freely ye have received, freely ye shall give."

But there has been a lot of "reality TV" going on. And I get sucked in. What can I say...I am weak.

So I'd hate to take time away.

But at some point you gotta look at how you're spending your time and think, "I am wasting it on petty bullshit and reading drama threads. This is not conduct becoming of a man."

[soup]

I get most of my girls in the cold monthes. My dramas usually happen during the summer.

[MikeCF]

And how can we criticism feminism with a straight face when a lot of us have been acting like a bunch of women in a knitting circle?

We should be setting the standard.

Oh and this is in no way a criticism of Roosh/Tuth. They honestly do a fanatic job modding. I do not envy them and would not want to have to wrangle all of us and keep the peace, etc.

Again, just thinking out loud. No criticism or judgment directed at anyone (other than myself).

[Quintus Curtius]

In any large organization, like this one, there will be a dose of conflict and drama. And it is natural to be exasperated with seeing and hearing about it.

But Mikey, consider this. We get a distorted perspective. Internet forums are different from physical assemblages of people. In an internet "club" or "fraternity", like ours, there is no way to hide the drama. In clubhouses or fraternities, altercations may happen in one physical place or another.

But in an electronic forum, the drama plays out in front of everyone's computer screen. It cannot be avoided.

So, we get a skewed perspective. The internet accentuates the highs and lows. One meltdown or freakout is witnessed by everyone. And it upsets everyone.

The phenomenon is "internet dilation"...with all due respect to Einstein...lol.

[samsamsam]

MikeCF, great post.

Aside from setting strict rules on how things are done, or specifically limiting certain things, etc. Maybe we could do some introspection before posting.

I think if people spent time self-policing themselves there could be less drama. If people just asked a couple of questions to themselves before posting:

1) Do I believe this helps to move a conversation/thread forward? Or I am just getting a shot in at the expense of someone else to make myself feel better?

2) Do I have strong emotional attachment to this? In other words, am I writing this in some calm manner or am I feeling some negative emotion/attitude (anger, ego bruised, who the fuck are you telling me sort of thing, or worse yet "I am right and you are wrong with no opening/possibility for learning").

Don't get me wrong, I am far from perfect. I have posted things I have gone back to replace the post with "delete" because I was animated. Plenty of times I have hit the backspace.

I am always a bit surprised when people speak in absolutes, especially in an internet forum where you don't have a rep to protect because most of us are anonymous. To me, I think we can let our guard down a bit, we are trying to help each other (or so I like to believe). But some do find the freedom of the internet to be extra fierce/badass that they wouldn't be in real life. They get to take on a different persona. I never fully understand the trolls, surely there must be a better use of time.

Maybe if people set aside the egos (or tried), realized none of us are perfect and we are all trying our best to be a better man each day then there could be less drama.

[NY Digital]

I was going to post this in the other thread but then I saw this one.

The everything else forum is a really interesting psychological experiment, so to speak. The growth, development, and change in the types of threads and the posts in those threads is interesting to see change over time. There are numerous awkward topics, weird topics, fun topics, etc. that come up. There are various controversial debates that are simply borderline and spark some serious controversy. They get a lot of heat. This is absolutely essential.

We need to get certain threads just out of our system. You can tell after the numerous heavily replied to topics, you can see forum members learning and growing in knowledge and character after each one. Everyone becomes smarter, think of things in a different way, and in a a way, we are all maturing. This maturing allows for higher and higher quality threads/posts the following week. The trolls “come out of the woodwork”, a previously ignorant forum member becomes aware, the amount of improvements is unexplainable.

I can see myself enjoying reading the forum more and more, and the only negative I see is the time sink.However, I find myself not having to look at other websites for info, and while this may sound naïve and ignorant for being well-rounded, it isn’t. The information I get here are from sources I trust, and from people I have respect for. We generally share the same ideals, and although people here disagree on a lot of things, I think that’s the best part of it all.

You never see the same ignorance displayed in future posts and threads, with a few exceptions. Here’s to many years to come. Cheers everyone. I raise this glass of bourbon to you all.

[T and A Man]

You mentioned on D&P a book titled along the lines of "How to make change when change is hard", and a great example was smaller dining plates if you can't control portion size. You may be aware that the drama here is toxic for you, and us, but you can't draw yourself away from it. So the answer is the same principle.

You've added a lot, and we're grown men. We can handle ourselves, some of us even better now because of your insight.

Time away may be good, and align it with a project.

Pick an exit time, pick a return time.. you can even express them here. Diarise the mental effects on time away, share it when you come back.

[MikeCF]

(03-10-2014 12:24 AM)T and A Man Wrote:  

You mentioned on D&P a book titled along the lines of "How to make change when change is hard", and a great example was smaller dining plates if you can't control portion size. You may be aware that the drama here is toxic for you, and us, but you can't draw yourself away from it. So the answer is the same principle.

You've added a lot, and we're grown men. We can handle ourselves, some of us even better now because of your insight.

Time away may be good, and align it with a project.

Pick an exit time, pick a return time.. you can even express them here. Diarise the mental effects on time away, share it when you come back.

Well now you are onto something.

Maybe we should all set a post per week/day limit for ourselves.

If we knew we'd only make x number of posts per day, would we waste it by being a dick or getting sucked into mindless political drivel or drama?

We'd probably make the posts count, right?

[MikeCF]

T and A Man, I have reached a solution for myself. This is the standard I am going to hold myself to:

Quote:

If I wouldn't post it on my blog, I won't post it here.

I don't get into drama on my blog. I just delete the hater comments and move forward.

I also don't put stupid shit. I always think, "Thousands of people are going to read this. Don't waste their time with stupid shit."

That is my personal solution.

I will be posting less but will also be giving more thought to what I post. If I fail to hold myself to this standard, feel free to send me a PM to let me know.

Thank you for helping me work this out.

(Though I'd still be interested to hear from others about what they think.)

[soup]

No- don't limit the creativity.

Focus it.

[dog24]

I just commented on this on the chatroom today, i think its cabin fever.

The are less new members coming in every month, plus among those you have to weed out the trolls.

Senior members in here dont really need help with "game" anymore, they will be getting laid even if the forum shuts down today.
New guys for the most part post the same oneitis stuff that guys are sick and tired off, or otherwise they just lurk because they are afraid of commenting on something they have no experience in.

That results in 15-20 guys who do 90% of the posts on the forum. And since they know each other in real life they are not going anywhere.
After a while it becomes like the gang you are sick and tired of seeing every saturday night at the same club with the same girls.
After a while they start bickering at each other over petty shit (political threads, weightlifting threads) and the group eventually disolves and people move on.

I think one solution would be to give more specifical advice to newcomers, after all they are the ones who will still be here looking for advice if the senior members leave (or get banned), and they will be the ones giving advice to the next generation on this forum.

The newbie forum barely gets any attention other than the generic advice of make money, lift weights, ignore that bitch hit on other girls.

If guys who already have everything figured out just tried to be a little more understanding of young guys still strugling instead of having an elitist mindset i think new talents would be popping up to freshen up the place.

[soup]

Cabin Fever is bullshit.

We are men, we have will power.

Own your shit.

I also think guys need to be able to chill out sometimes.

[Thomas the Rhymer]

(03-10-2014 02:04 AM)soup Wrote:  

Cabin Fever is bullshit.

We are men, we have will power.

Own your shit.

[T and A Man]

No one should take cabin fever lighly brother

All the cabin-fever-maniacs Mean Gene are yelling out my name and lift me to places no mere mortal can go!!

When that adrenalin is pumping, when cabin-fever is running through my veins, pumping blood to my 18 inch pythons, hearing the chant "Cabin... fever.. cabin.. fever..."

Whatycha gunna do brother when cabin-fever-mania runs wild over you??

[soup]

Even if SAD is real.. guys have to make a decision.

If it was a question about how to handle SAD, I'd ask.. where does SAD come from? Why does it exist? Are we denying something that makes SAD happen? Are we evolved to live in good/constant climates?

If the answers and solutions are clear, then the problem boils down to will power.

Do what you need to do, and don't lose track of the bigger goal.

[Jackreacher]

A lot of the drama and meltdowns look like they stem from some form of expectation or entitlement; "I expected an answer!", "I can't believe you did this!" "The quality of the forum is crap now!" and on and on. I'm guilty of doing this sometimes too. So OK a lot of people got sucked into some recent drama, some butts were hurt and some egos are now terribly bruised, lets get this train rolling back onto bigger and better things like more pussy, money and the good life. In the end online drama(of any sort) never really happened, unless you want to believe it did. It's all in one's head.

[T and A Man]

(03-10-2014 02:56 AM)soup Wrote:  

Even if SAD is real.. guys have to make a decision.

If it was a question about how to handle SAD, I'd ask.. where does SAD come from? Why does it exist? Are we denying something that makes SAD happen? Are we evolved to live in good/constant climates?

If the answers and solutions are clear, then the problem boils down to will power.

Do what you need to do, and don't lose track of the bigger goal.

Various effects on ones mental state due to climate are real.

We have the same in Australia called 'going troppo' in the northern section of the country.

40+ degrees celsius and 90%+ humidity every day for 90 days.

We are all acting upon our hormones, men have it a lot easier due to the simplicity of their hormones.

Sometimes we have a mental blank on how we should treat it.

Requesting for bannings, new forums, adjusting other peoples behaviour.. that's feminist.

Requesting "I've hit a blank guys, how should I handle this".. not so much.

[T and A Man]

Of course it is one's head.

People invest in this place, I said as much on the Hoax thread.

Quintus just had a great thread on how other people's investment has improved him personally. It's bound to happen.

[Blunt]

We should work on self moderation...

But... I think the mood will absolutely get better around here when chicks start walking around in sundresses and booty shorts again.

[Capitán Peligroso]

We can choose to read inflammatory posts and especially drama threads or not. All of the guys that have posted in this thread so far have been on this forum long enough to see this shit coming a mile away. So, to indulge it or not, the choice is each of ours individually.

If you're going to read these drama threads, pay attention, and notice your reaction to what someone says. Someone's hamster post is a function of their hamster. Your reaction to what they say is a function of yours.

I can choose the response to my own or someone else's hamster, so can you. Getting sucked in to drama is a choice; so is not getting sucked in. Typing out a response to someone's hamster post is a choice.

1) We can choose to read drama threads or not.

2) We can notice our reaction (and be mindful of our hamster that we all have) or we can remain oblivious to it.

3) We can choose to act on our hamster shit (or someone else's hamster shit), or not.

At every point in this whole process, we can choose our response, or choose not to respond at all. Ultimately, it is a matter of free will <~~~to pretend this isn't the case, or to not be mindful of it, also a choice.


In applying the principles stated above, I stopped commenting in political threads in this forum awhile ago for the most part, because it's rarely ever a productive use of my time. As a general rule, I agree with Hen's political views, and respected his efforts to vigorously argue his positions, which aren't always popular here. His leaving this community is a tremendous loss to it, in my opinion, and I suspect many of his adversaries in those political threads would agree. I've been reading this forum for three years, and I consider him to be in about the top five or six posters here in terms of quality, specificity, and actionability of data. He dropped enough specific data on areas that I know well to know that his data wasn't bullshit; without ever meeting the guy, I know he won't be replaced here anytime soon. When our hamsters get the best of us, it costs us all. This episode is just one example.

Check your hamster, check yourself. You have my word I'll be doing the same.

[soup]

I think Mike has set a good example by being very selective about what he posts- it always has me being curious and reading something when actually does, but I also think that maybe some people can benefit from posting a lot.

I've learned a lot here, and I post a lot it seems. I don't have the best rep point to post ratio yet, but I'm still in the learning process. I'm experimenting with different techniques and approaches right now, and i think it can help me to get feedback from you guys on what to do.

I think the drama here has definitely been picking up lately, and I don't understand why. I think it might have something to do with the popularity of the forum and ROK as well as the new podcasts etc. All of that stuff is great, but we are now transitioning from a little village into a bigger town, and some guys might be getting territorial.

Just about every major poster on here has been trolled by the forum- in some ways the biggest troll on the forum is the forum itself! I think that guys are using it to deal with their emotional issues that they can't share with people in their offline lives, so there a lot of egos to manage.. And there's going to be more as we go through the transition I believe. That said, it will probably come out stronger in the end if we can make it through without imploding.

It's like in Ghostbusters 2 when all of the cities' negative energy turns into a river of pink goo.

[Rutting Elephant]

Capitán Peligroso,
Either I am missing the point completely (very possible), or you seem to be broadening the idea of "hamster" to mean "any forceful reaction whatsoever."
"Check your hamster" sounds bizarre as general advice to RVF members.
Does a guy saying what he feels constitute hamsterism?
I agree that as men we should act rationally, but as I understand the concept, "hamster" does not mean simply "emotion."
How is every form of expression ever not hamster?

[Monty Brown]

I think I over do it sometimes. I chalk it up to sitting in a cubical all day with minimum attention from upper management to prevent me from being on my phone/rvf for most of the day. I'd like to post something of value but all I can really offer are stupid rap songs and wrestling videos for another two weeks or so. Then its all value baby