[assman]

For those who think Zman's following Martin should be illegal, go lobby for a law against it. But I guarantee you that such a law will end up being used against players.

And just like a rape, you won't need a conviction to ruin the guy's life, the accusation and attendant media mention will be sufficient - "Bill, a 35yr old single man, was allegedly stalking the 23yr old girl as she walked outside the bar." Bam. Pervert. Saved to the internet forever.

[scorpion]

(07-12-2013 03:18 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Physically attacking someone is not illegal if it is in self defense and you feel there is an impending threat. Remember, the stand your ground law applies to Martin as well who had no idea who this hostile large man with a shaved head and goatee was following him in the dark by car and foot was.

But again, by this same logic, any woman you approach who doesn't like your look could claim legal justification for attacking you.

"He just had a really creepy, threatening vibe to him. I felt unsafe so I attacked him in self defense before he could hurt me."

I imagine Zimmerman yelled out to Martin something like, "Hey, who are you? What are you doing here? Come over here or I'm calling the police."

Martin, being a wannabe-thug, probably didn't appreciate this kind of disrespect, and went to put Zimmerman in his place with a beatdown. Which he did. Until he got shot.

Just because Zimmerman confronted Martin did not mean Martin had to respond with violence. Why didn't he just leave? Do you really think Zimmerman would have pulled his gun and shot him in the back? Martin didn't even know he had a gun, anyway, so he had no reason to fear such a thing. He could have just ran off.

If Martin was a white kid who attacked a black man I would be saying the exact same thing: if you intentionally initiate violence with someone, you have to deal with the consequences.

[playa_with_a_passport]

Quote:

To say that Zimmerman is entirely responsible would be like saying that if a man approaches a women in the street and talks to her he is guilty of harassment and the woman is lawfully allowed to physically assault him.

(07-12-2013 03:22 PM)assman Wrote:  

For those who think Zman's following Martin should be illegal, go lobby for a law against it. But I guarantee you that such a law will end up being used against players.

And just like a rape, you won't need a conviction to ruin the guy's life, the accusation and attendant media mention will be sufficient - "Bill, a 35yr old single man, was allegedly stalking the 23yr old girl as she walked outside the bar." Bam. Pervert. Saved to the internet forever.

Context matters brahs, if you exit your car and is dark, desolate, you look pissed and start running toward a female to holla at her it is not unreasonable for her to assume you are about to take the pussy.

(07-12-2013 03:31 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 03:18 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Physically attacking someone is not illegal if it is in self defense and you feel there is an impending threat. Remember, the stand your ground law applies to Martin as well who had no idea who this hostile large man with a shaved head and goatee was following him in the dark by car and foot was.

But again, by this same logic, any woman you approach who doesn't like your look could claim legal justification for attacking you.

"He just had a really creepy, threatening vibe to him. I felt unsafe so I attacked him in self defense before he could hurt me."

I imagine Zimmerman yelled out to Martin something like, "Hey, who are you? What are you doing here? Come over here or I'm calling the police."

Martin, being a wannabe-thug, probably didn't appreciate this kind of disrespect, and went to put Zimmerman in his place with a beatdown. Which he did. Until he got shot.

Just because Zimmerman confronted Martin did not mean Martin had to respond with violence. Why didn't he just leave? Do you really think Zimmerman would have pulled his gun and shot him in the back? Martin didn't even know he had a gun, anyway, so he had no reason to fear such a thing. He could have just ran off.

A lot of assumptions here. You are assuming that when Z approached Trayvon 1. He was calm and 2. Trayvon believed that he had the option to walk away. You can ask anybody anything you want when you are in your property but you are not allowed to stop them and/or detain them on a public street. And it is a crime to illegally detain someone and you are not a cop. This is the reason why I don't detain random strangers on the streets because I don't want to get my ass kicked.

Like it has been pointed out before Z was the only one with a criminal record(Domestic Violence and fighting with a cop). Ironic huh? He fights with real cops but doesn't mind acting like he's one. It would not be out of the realm of possibility to assume that Z has poor impulse control and has anger problems. Plus, coupled with the fact that he was white knighting hard for that plain White chick someone posted before chances are that he assumed that Trayvon was the one who broke into this chick crib.

If he gets acquitted maybe he will write an ebook of "Neighborhood Watchman" Game.

[Tex Pro]

If Zimmerman is acquitted, will there be riots?

[el mechanico]

(07-12-2013 05:35 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  

If Zimmerman is acquitted, will there be riots?

Hopefully

[MidniteSpecial]

Zimmerman is a white knight and anyone on his side is a beta white knight follower.

[Easy E]

(07-12-2013 06:24 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

Zimmerman is a white knight and anyone on his side is a beta white knight follower.

Put down the weed and step away from the computer. You are too stoned to post.

[Wadsworth]

(07-12-2013 03:05 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

But the fact is that confronting someone is not illegal, while physically attacking them is illegal.

The standard for the stand your ground laws is reasonable belief of an unlawful threat, with no obligation to retreat. Confronting someone may not be illegal, but doing so in a way that projects a reasonable belief in someone that you're a threat means they have the right to self defense. In other words, a physical attack is not necessary for lawful self defense under this standard.

(07-12-2013 03:05 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

Neither party is "innocent" here, in the sense of being entirely without blame. Zimmerman initiated a confrontation when he shouldn't have, and Martin turned that confrontation violent.

I don't entirely disagree with you about blame, but Martin's actions were lawful by the stand-your-ground standard. So how does it make sense to defend Zimmerman by that standard, yet characterize Martin as a thug by that same standard?

(07-12-2013 03:31 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 03:18 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Physically attacking someone is not illegal if it is in self defense and you feel there is an impending threat. Remember, the stand your ground law applies to Martin as well who had no idea who this hostile large man with a shaved head and goatee was following him in the dark by car and foot was.

But again, by this same logic, any woman you approach who doesn't like your look could claim legal justification for attacking you.

"He just had a really creepy, threatening vibe to him. I felt unsafe so I attacked him in self defense before he could hurt me."

No, the standard is a reasonable belief of unlawful threat. Aggressively following someone who's alone at night in a conspicuous manner is sufficient to meet this standard. Approaching another human being (woman or otherwise) isn't. Aggression can reasonably be considered threatening, merely approaching someone cannot.

[MidniteSpecial]

(07-11-2013 11:06 AM)Muk Wrote:  

why do you keep saying " But but but George isn't a cop!"
no fucking shit, he's not a cop, and he doesn't have to be. you keep bringing up this completely irrelevant point. He doesn't have to be a cop to approach a suspicious looking person and ask questions. and just asking questions does not give Martin the right to assault him. the kid got what he deserved.

(07-12-2013 06:28 PM)Easy E Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 06:24 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

Zimmerman is a white knight and anyone on his side is a beta white knight follower.

Put down the weed and step away from the computer. You are too stoned to post.

I don't smoke til after 10 pm usually and I'm on my cell phone rarely on a computer. And where I'm from people like Zimmerman are called fuck boys.

Dudes 28 years old and obsessed with neighborhood crime watch.

He's not a white knight? He visited the blonde witnesses house twenty fucking times to interview her about a break in that happened at her house. Twenty times.

28 year old men should be getting money and fucking bitches. In that order. Not getting beat up by 16 year olds for being a snitch.

[TheBMan]

Zimmerman was on neighbourhood watch patrol. He was doing nothing illegal.
He was carrying a gun he had a Florida state permit for. That is not illegal.
He saw someone who he did not recognize. This is not illegal. He was suspicious. That is not illegal.
He phoned [non-emergency] to report it. That is not illegal.
The dispatcher asked Zimmerman if the “suspect” were black, white or Latino. Zimmerman replied, “I THINK he is black”. That is not illegal.
The dispatcher asked Zimmerman if he was following Martin. He replied he was and the dispatcher told him that was not necessary. Zimmerman continued past the T where TM had turned. That is not illegal.
Martin approached Zimmerman and asked him if he (Zimmerman) had a problem. Zimmerman said he did not have a problem. So far Zimmerman has done nothing illegal.
Zimmerman reached for his cell phone. That is not illegal.
Martin says, “you got a problem now”, and punched Zimmerman in the face.
At this point Zimmerman has done nothing illegal.
Martin has just committed assault and battery. That is illegal.
The blow broke Zimmerman’s nose and knocked him to the ground.
At this point Zimmerman has done nothing illegal.
Martin gets on top of Zimmerman and pounds him with his fists. Zimmerman still has done nothing illegal.
Martin continues his illegal assault and battery. Martin pounds Zimmerman’s head on the concrete side walk. That is illegal.
Zimmerman cries for help. That is not illegal.
Finally Zimmerman decides to defend himself. That is not illegal.
He pulls his weapon, that he is carrying legally ,and defends himself as Florida’s [SELF DEFENCE] law allows. Zimmerman has done nothing illegal.
The aggressor was Martin who committed assault and battery on another person. That is illegal. This should never have even gone to trial. Wise up.

[Tex Pro]

Quote:

Zimmerman is a white knight and anyone on his side is a beta white knight follower.

We can play this dumb game with just about anything. Obama is a good little beta to his wife, so anyone who supports Obama must be a beta follower. I don't expect you to understand this because it probably too complicated for you to understand, but it is what it is.

[el mechanico]

We established Zims white knighting two pages ago. It's fact

[samsamsam]

(07-12-2013 06:50 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

He's not a white knight? He visited the blonde witnesses house twenty fucking times to interview her about a break in that happened at her house. Twenty times.

28 year old men should be getting money and fucking bitches. In that order. Not getting beat up by 16 year olds for being a snitch.

I think he was trying to shag the blonde. He was playing neighborhood watch game. To Protect and To Service Vagina.

Doesn't matter if he is convicted or not, Zimmerman is gonna be fucked the rest of his life anyway. He may be hailed as a hero by some and a villain by others. But he will always be tainted. And I don't feel bad for him in that regard, even if he is let free. Putting aside all the legal stuff, he went sniffing for trouble. There are no victims in life, everyone plays a 100% role in what he or she gets in life.

[Tex Pro]

(07-12-2013 07:05 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  

We established Zims white knighting two pages ago. It's fact

It is well established that Obama is a beta to his wife. So is anyone who voted for Obama a beta follower?

[MidniteSpecial]

Go around following young black men callin the cops and see how that turns out for you.

Shit dont even go to the hood you can go to a diverse suburb.

He's a snitch that's why he got punched. He's a bitch that's why he had to pull out on a 16 year old kid.

When a grown man with a gun kills someones un armed child it's not self defense , it's murder . Zimmerman should have taken the stand . Only guilty people hide from the truth.

No matter the verdict he has to live with being a bitch on his conscious for the rest of his life.

Y'all are beta as fuck for siding with this slob.

[Tex Pro]

(07-12-2013 07:06 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 06:50 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

He's not a white knight? He visited the blonde witnesses house twenty fucking times to interview her about a break in that happened at her house. Twenty times.

28 year old men should be getting money and fucking bitches. In that order. Not getting beat up by 16 year olds for being a snitch.

I think he was trying to shag the blonde. He was playing neighborhood watch game. To Protect and To Service Vagina.

Doesn't matter if he is convicted or not, Zimmerman is gonna be fucked the rest of his life anyway. He may be hailed as a hero by some and a villain by others. But he will always be tainted. And I don't feel bad for him in that regard, even if he is let free. Putting aside all the legal stuff, he went sniffing for trouble. There are no victims in life, everyone plays a 100% role in what he or she gets in life.

Does this include Trayvon?

[MidniteSpecial]

How could the president of the United States ever be beta? He can fuck whoever he wants.

And when he bagged Michelle she was older and more established.

[Tex Pro]

(07-12-2013 07:07 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

Go around following young black men callin the cops and see how that turns out for you.

Shit dont even go to the hood you can go to a diverse suburb.

He's a snitch that's why he got punched. He's a bitch that's why he had to pull out on a 16 year old kid.

When a grown man with a gun kills someones un armed child it's not self defense , it's murder . Zimmerman should have taken the stand . Only guilty people hide from the truth.

No matter the verdict he has to live with being a bitch on his conscious for the rest of his life.

Y'all are beta as fuck for siding with this slob.

You're are a dummy for thinking that beta even has anything to do with this.

[Tex Pro]

(07-12-2013 07:09 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

How could the president of the United States ever be beta? He can fuck whoever he wants.

And when he bagged Michelle she was older and more established.

He ain't banging shit now. He could bang tons of snatch, but instead chooses to stay faithful to Michelle. Verdict: beta.

See how stupid this shit is.

[MidniteSpecial]

(07-12-2013 07:09 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 07:07 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

Go around following young black men callin the cops and see how that turns out for you.

Shit dont even go to the hood you can go to a diverse suburb.

He's a snitch that's why he got punched. He's a bitch that's why he had to pull out on a 16 year old kid.

When a grown man with a gun kills someones un armed child it's not self defense , it's murder . Zimmerman should have taken the stand . Only guilty people hide from the truth.

No matter the verdict he has to live with being a bitch on his conscious for the rest of his life.

Y'all are beta as fuck for siding with this slob.

You're are a dummy for thinking that beta even has anything to do with this.

I'm a dummy for entertaining this conversation. If you're siding with Zimmerman you're a snitch and I can't fuck with you. I'm going to get a bottle of hornitos. Peace.

[Screwston]

Midnite Special is the forum gangsta?

[Tex Pro]

(07-12-2013 07:12 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 07:09 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 07:07 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

Go around following young black men callin the cops and see how that turns out for you.

Shit dont even go to the hood you can go to a diverse suburb.

He's a snitch that's why he got punched. He's a bitch that's why he had to pull out on a 16 year old kid.

When a grown man with a gun kills someones un armed child it's not self defense , it's murder . Zimmerman should have taken the stand . Only guilty people hide from the truth.

No matter the verdict he has to live with being a bitch on his conscious for the rest of his life.

Y'all are beta as fuck for siding with this slob.

You're are a dummy for thinking that beta even has anything to do with this.

I'm a dummy for entertaining this conversation. If you're siding with Zimmerman you're a snitch and I can't fuck with you. I'm going to get a bottle of hornitos. Peace.

You're dummy and I don't like spending time talking to dummies, so it's nice to see you go.

[Screwston]

[worldwidetraveler]

(07-12-2013 07:13 PM)houston Wrote:  

Midnite Special is the forum gangsta?

Nah, he just read too much feminist propaganda and decided to use their debating style of shaming and calling names.

[samsamsam]

(07-12-2013 07:08 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 07:06 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(07-12-2013 06:50 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  

He's not a white knight? He visited the blonde witnesses house twenty fucking times to interview her about a break in that happened at her house. Twenty times.

28 year old men should be getting money and fucking bitches. In that order. Not getting beat up by 16 year olds for being a snitch.

I think he was trying to shag the blonde. He was playing neighborhood watch game. To Protect and To Service Vagina.

Doesn't matter if he is convicted or not, Zimmerman is gonna be fucked the rest of his life anyway. He may be hailed as a hero by some and a villain by others. But he will always be tainted. And I don't feel bad for him in that regard, even if he is let free. Putting aside all the legal stuff, he went sniffing for trouble. There are no victims in life, everyone plays a 100% role in what he or she gets in life.

Does this include Trayvon?

Yes, he was 100% responsible.

If you read my previous posts. I think all my posts end with I wish the two idiots never met. And I "try" to stay even about it. Though I wish Z would have just called the cops and stayed in the car. And having a gun gave him courage that he wouldn't have normally. So I guess I am 55% for M and 45% for Z.

Trayvon did plenty of things to make this happen, but so did Zimmerman. It wasn't a solo it was a duet. Both are 100% accountable. Trayvon paid his price with his life. Everyone wants to say people are victims, but they are not.

When I am caught in traffic and running late, you know whose fault it is? Mine. I could have fucking left earlier. When I hit the gym today and both squat racks were taken, you know whose fault it was mine - I stayed in the car too long listening to ESPN radio once I parked. But it is much more fun to blame someone or something else.

There are no victims - it just sounds nice. No one can say that it surprised them to hear that there was a conflict between Z and M based on the series of events leading up to it. And once you hear some prior history - it seemed inevitable. Are any of you of you that shocked? Seriously? Should it have happened? Totally an opinion on that, depends on how you see the world. The sad thing is, I guarantee some people were happy to hear a black kid got shot. Just the way it is. No one should be surprised. I think it is pretty tough to lose a kid - but our society doesn't care about a lot these days other than material possessions.

Generally, only when someone is personally impacted by loss does it change our attitudes. Or you are white knighter and it makes you feel good about yourself like all those Kony video watching mother fuckers. Unless you get some sort of payoff, you don't care - it is the way it is. Yes, I went off on a tangent.

But to answer your question again Trayvon is 100% responsible. Responsibility isn't a thing you pick up and put down (that expression "take responsibility" is annoying). Being responsible is a full time gig. So it is mathematically possible that Z was 100% responsible and M was 100% responsible. Either of them could have made the one key decision to keep it from going haywire.