[cardguy]

Just want to pass along the following article which is entitled 'George W. Bush is smarter than you'. It is an interesting article from one of Bush's fomer policy advisors discussing how smart he is.

http://keithhennessey.com/2013/04/24/smarter/

I agree. I think too many people get sucked in by style over substance. It seems the way people talk often overpowers what they are saying.

Any British readers here will remember when Glen Hoddle and Sven Goran Eriksson managed the England team. They often said stupid things - but came across as profound due to the mannerisms they used when speaking.

To me - somebody like Al Gore is pretty dumb. And you only have to see this clip to see why...

Also - in case it is worth anything. George W. Bush was a pretty big reader as well (95 books in one year):

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123025595706634689.html

I am sure Barack Obama is smart. But the only thing we really know for sure is he is that he is good at reading aloud from teleprompters.

[All of the above is non-political. I just want to use some famous politicians to point out how our perceptions of intelligence is a little skewed.]

[JayMillz]

One of my favorites by GWB

[SpiderKing]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sadjTA5IKCA

[Caligula]

Highly recommend documentary Journeys With George for a candid look at what he's like - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9mdzTrIugo

It was made by Nancy Pelosi's daughter and follows him around on the campaign trail during the primaries. Gives you a good insight into how charismatic he is.

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today, but you can't help but like him after watching that.

The way he manages the press and puts them in their place is spectacular. Contrast with Obama who only gives access to journalists who love him and whose idea of a White House press corps is to release dramatic photos every couple of days taken by his court photographer.

[Aliblahba]

(04-26-2013 09:08 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today

Examples?

[Teedub]

(04-26-2013 09:21 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:08 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today

Examples?

Lying about the WMD's with good ol' Tony wasn't the brightest of ideas.

[el mechanico]

(04-26-2013 09:21 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:08 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today

Examples?

A home of your own from that last vid. He made banks loosen up and write all those bad loans causing economy and real estate collapse. Then the loans backed by insurance got called in causing the gov to bail them out. Basically he caused a problem that allowed banks and insurance companies get away with ripping us off coming and going. They tightened up so much now you cant borrow anymore. So no biz or construction loans. He basically fucked me for over 1,000,000. My approved industrial park loan got shut down @ 1.3 mil and the banks took all my credit lines.

Now America will be broke for a long time. Do I make money? Sure but I'd make 5 times as much and own 30,000 sq of heavy industrial commercial space.

So we shop at wal-mart and eat Mcd for the next ten years. The lifestyle will become the norm.

[cardguy]

Yeah - that is a really good documentary.

[Menace]

^^^ Very true. Try refinancing a house (and not one that has crashed in value). Before it was easy, now it's like you're doing an FBI background check.

[Hooligan Harry]

(04-26-2013 09:34 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:21 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:08 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today

Examples?

A home of your own from that last vid. He made banks loosen up and write all those bad loans causing economy and real estate collapse. Then the loans backed by insurance got called in causing the gov to bail them out. Basically he caused a problem that allowed banks and insurance companies get away with ripping us off coming and going. They tightened up so much now you cant borrow anymore. So no biz or construction loans. He basically fucked me for over 1,000,000. My approved industrial park loan got shut down @ 1.3 mil and the banks took all my credit lines.

Now America will be broke for a long time. Do I make money? Sure but I'd make 5 times as much and own 30,000 sq of heavy industrial commercial space.

So we shop at wal-mart and eat Mcd for the next ten years. The lifestyle will become the norm.

That was Clinton bro.

Bush was blocked by the Dems in 2005 from implementing regulations curtailing rampant lending.

The Dems were responsible for the financial crisis

[clever alias]

loans were also laregely caused by non fov fed.
bush actually seems to change in his mannerisms. he seemed like an intelligent guy until around 06 when he lost it. his speech got highly irregular (LOTS of pauses and stops) and he often mosspoke (fool me once . . . shame on . . . you? fool me twice . . . you fool me onve aint gonna get fooled again. almosf seemed like he had a stroke or something

[Balkanite]

Lol yea Bush told the banks to loosen up the loan restrictions. Then did the opposite and tightened the restrictions. Do you actually believe this?? Real culprit was Wall Street and MBS. Read too big to fail or watch the movie

[Donnington93]

I talked to a Democrat who has worked with both Bush and Obama. He said that as much as he disagreed with Bush's policies, he felt that Bush got a shitty rap for being "dumb" which is totally undeserved.

The guy mentioned that he saw the famous clip of Bush sitting in the classroom staring blankly after being told about 9/11. He said that many people, himself included, just thought Bush was sitting there like a dumbass. After working as part of Bush's administration, he realized that W liked to think about things and gather as much information as possible before making a decision. That 9/11 video that so many people make fun of was really just him running through all kinds of possibilities about what to do next. By contrast, Obama is apparently more comfortable with making snap decisions with limited information.

[Emancipator]

Bush isn't stupid, he's a class act and someone who cares for his country.

The recent picture of all the presidents at the GWB library in Dallas shows Bush sitting in a chair as to not let his father(sitting in a wheelchair) stand out, classy move. And his speech at the end where he teared up shows his passion for his country.

[WestIndianArchie]

Dude puts up one library and the revisionists come out in force.

WIA

[Hooligan Harry]

(04-26-2013 10:52 AM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

Dude puts up one library and the revisionists come out in force.

WIA

What revision?

[scorpion]

I've never thought that GWB was a stupid person. It's literally impossible to become President in the modern era without possessing a high IQ. There's just too much information and calculation you have to stay on top of for months on end, and an insane amount of media scrutiny analyzing everything you say and do. It's very mentally demanding. A person of even above-average intelligence would flame out from the mental fatigue and stress. You need to be very bright to successfully run that gauntlet.

GWB's problem was that he placed too much trust and good faith in his advisers, most of whom were incompetent or corrupt. People who he thought were providing him objective analysis were actually pushing their own agendas. This was most obvious with Cheney, who is a complete piece of shit by all accounts and who basically spent 8 years running his own mini-presidency in GWB's shadow.

GWB's failings had nothing to do with intellect, but rather temperament. At root he's just a laid back guy. He doesn't want to deal with a bunch of bullshit, he just wants to analyze the facts and make a decision then go ride his bike or chill on his ranch. This is why he gave Cheney so much power and authority to handle shit he didn't want to deal with. Especially after 9/11, he felt like he couldn't afford to make a mistake that would result in another attack. So he basically went along with whatever Cheney and Rumsfeld wanted, since they were the experienced national security guys and he felt he could trust them to do the best thing for the country. Unfortunately, this trust was misplaced, since all those two chucklefucks wanted to do was exploit 9/11 as a pretext for invading Iraq, something they had been planning since the mid-late 90's with PNAC.

[Aliblahba]

(04-26-2013 09:29 AM)Teedub Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:21 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:08 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today

Examples?

Lying about the WMD's with good ol' Tony wasn't the brightest of ideas.

Clinton stated in an interview be believed Iraq had WMD's. And they did. Now they are in Syria.

[cardguy]

Everybody in the world thought Saddam Hussein had WMD. The reason was because Saddam was trying to convince the world he had WMD.

Why?

To keep Iran from invading his country. Remember Iran and Iraq lost a million lives fighting each other in the 1980's.

Saddam was always more afraid of Iran than the US.

[Aliblahba]

I spent years with boots on ground over there. Keeping believing what you see on t.v.

[MidniteSpecial]

Had the chance to meet and talk to him. Felt like I was talking to an old college drinking buddy. Alpha and funny dude.

[Caligula]

(04-26-2013 09:21 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 09:08 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

His presidency was a disaster in many ways and sent his party on the desert walk it's on today

Examples?

Increasing federal spending by 60%, doubling discretionary defence spending, more than doubling medicare spending, spending taxpayer funds on bailing out banks without making necessary structural changes paving the way for a double-dip recession, presiding over 1.9 million job losses in the last four months of 2008, presiding over the increase of national debt from 1.4% of GDP to 6.8% of GDP.

He did a lot of good too, but the above is what I was referring to.

[durangotang]

I don't care if he is smarter than me. I am sure if you could hypothetically meet the devil, she would be smart too. What I care about is he good or evil?

I think Bush was evil. Just look at the results of his decision to go into Iraq. Millions dead. A totally failed state. Trillions of dollars wasted. For what? A needless war perpetrated under false pretenses.

[cardguy]

This might seem retarded. But I often wonder how smart you have to be, to carry out the job of president?

I think most average guys could do an okay job.

Don't forget as well that you are surrounded by smart advisors - who you can consult whenever you want.

I just feel that the link between how smart you are - and how good a president you would be is unclear.

Plus as well - most experts are in disagreement with each other - so two really smart people will often completely contradict each other. Which leaves you wondering what the point of having a smart guy is? If other smart people are going to totally disagree with him.

In politics - you often make the right decision for the right reason, the right decision for the wrong reason, the wrong decision for the right reason and the wrong decision for the wrong reason. And - it can be nearly impossible trying to analyse which categories to place any one decision into.

Look at Margaret Thatcher. Even over 30 years after coming to power - it is still too early to tell what the long term impact will be for some of her major policies.

Also - luck plays a large part in how well things go...

I remember Tony Blair admitting that the NICE (Non-Inflationary Constant Expansion - ie. every economists dream) decade he had as Prime Minister was mostly due to luck - since the world economic conditions he happened to inherit were largely responsible for it.

Of course - with a little more hindsight - it seems that such economic growth was just part of a larger credit bubble which finally burst in 2008.

And to end - Errol Morris did a couple of interviews with people with some of the largest IQ's ever recorded. I doubt you would want either of them to be your president:

One is a nightclub bouncer:

And the other is a little creepy:

[MidWest]

Say what you want about Bush, but the guy was a total boss when it came to debates. Here he is destroying Kerry on the issue of Iraq.