[Nonpareil]

Some people think that 4 is high for an attractive 22 year old, am I hearing this correctly?

4 might be high for the average 22 year old guy, but the average 22 year old guy isn't approached continually.

4 lifetime partners for even an average 22 year old is favorable. You have to accept that the likelyhood of bagging a virgin in the womyn & grrlpower! society we live in is none to sliminal, you're not likely going to be plowing virgin fields.

Original Poster: I would avoid getting into the 'how many partners have you had?' conversation in the future. Either you won't like the answer she gives you or she won't like the answer you give her, it's a no-win situation.

[Kona]

If a decent looking girl tells you she's only had sex with 4 dudes by the time she's 22, somethings wrong with her or she's lying.

4 is low for 22 year old Mormons. For normal American girls it's just unbelievable.

I laughed when I read all of this because last night at a bar some girl told me it was her 22nd birthday. She was drunk, a little chubby, and kind of sweaty. After talking to her for maybe 5 minutes I knew all I had to say was "let's go" and she'd have blown me in the parking lot. Needles to say, but I passed.

This one came up to me now. Think about all of the guys that are approaching better looking ones when the girl in question is out. At 22 she's in the slut prime of her life?

The only time numbers should be an issue is when the girl used to be a whore or has some kind of mental issue and been swooped by 1000-plus dudes. Usually that's not going to pillow-talk it's way into your conversation. The major sluts I've banged that have had an extreme number of sexual partners have told me in one way or another about it early on. You gotta figure out how to spot the dirty ones.

And I'm not hating on girls who've had lots of sex with lots of dudes at all. I like them as much as I like the pure, virginal type. It just depends on my mood.

Aloha!

[Lumiere]

(06-05-2010 08:41 PM)Iceman Wrote:  

Wondering what you guys think about how many guys is it ok for a chick to have slept with before she becomes a no-go for long term relationship material?

Drop the madonna/whore syndrome dude

Its totally fucking retarded and it will cause you only pain

(plus you will miss out big time with some amazing chicks)

[simonh]

It all depends on your background. 4 is a lot for a certain type of girl. If you're a nerdy hot girl at the University of Chicago, 4 is a lot. If you're a beer bonging sorority girl at Arizona State University, majoring in basket weaving, it isn't.

[Willy Wonka]

4 is not a lot for a 22 year old girl. Some of y'all are tripping.

I agree with everything DrArete has said...

[Johnny Dakota]

I've heard a lot of girls use the "count on one hand" theory meaning they don't want to sleep with more guys than they can count on one hand. I think a lot of girls expect that by the time they've reached the 5th guy that'll be the guy they trick into marrying them. Plus, if she only slept with 4 it could mean that she just gives head to a lot of dudes instead.

[3am]

(06-07-2010 10:16 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  

No offense to 3am, but his advice is either out of inexperience or he's not from a 1st world western country.

WTF? Ok, dude...thanks for putting me in my place.

[hydrogonian]

(06-08-2010 04:15 PM)3am Wrote:  

(06-07-2010 10:16 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  

No offense to 3am, but his advice is either out of inexperience or he's not from a 1st world western country.

WTF? Ok, dude...thanks for putting me in my place.

Fair enough. I really didn't mean to cause static with you, and maybe my choice of words wasn't quite right.

But how can you justify stating that a girl who had been with 4 guys isn't long term relationship material?

If thats the case, then 90% of never-been-married girls over 22 years old aren't suitable. And if you want to include only the attractive and sane ones, then the number of suitable girls goes much lower.

If you up the age to 25, then almost every girl who isn't married is out of bounds.

Whats the rationale? Or do you allow for increased numbers with increasing age?

[InternationPlayboy]

4 at 22? I don't know if I know any 22 year old women that has only had sex with 4 people. For an American chick at the age of 22, I think 10 people is acceptable. I guess I just grew up with super skanky chicks that get knocked up when they are 18 though. I figure average age to loose your virginity in the group of kids I hung out with was around 15. I was 15 and I was the last out of most of my friends, and I'm also older than many of the ones I was in the same classes with. A lot of the girls waited until 16, but they didn't wait much longer than that.

[K-man]

Take it from a married man - I have never asked my wife how many men she'd had before me. And things have been great so far (3 years).
Why would I have asked - and how would I have known if she had told the truth or not? I know I wouldn't have.
There are many other great ways to screen a girl for LTR/wife material, not asking stupid questions like that.

[Aylar]

(06-05-2010 08:41 PM)Iceman Wrote:  

Wondering what you guys think about how many guys is it ok for a chick to have slept with before she becomes a no-go for long term relationship material?

I met a pretty attractive chick a few weeks back and she seemed to be fun, intelligent and lots in common and was getting along great so thinking this may be LTR material, and they weren’t any obvious things that set my alarm bells off. However, a couple of nites back we decided it was time to do the talk about exes and she told me she’d been with four guys till now( 2 long term bf’s and 2 short term bf’s).

Now I might sound a bit old-fashioned, but am I all right in thinking this is above average for a 22 year old and strike her off as I was looking for something serious as opposed to a fling.

Wow I can't believe I missed this one. 4 too many for 22? No that is not many at all. You do have to consider you are old fashioned and accept that times have indeed changed. I;m not going to attack you or get upset, but you really can't go judging on that. That is quite a low #. What i'd wonder is whether she's being honest or not. But either way, you shouldn't have asked and she shouldn't have shared.

I consider myself a late bloomer. I lost my virginity at 19, a few months from turning 20. by the time I was 22 i had been with about 12 guys. My number slowed down significantly after that, because I entered grad school , stopped partying, matured and got over the repression anxiety from my strict upbringing, plus a few relationships. Considering, most of the guys girls sleep with are first timers, and i sucked fewer of those mens dicks, (which to me is much more personal and more disgusting with someone i don't know) , i'd be more concerned about how many times she's had her thing used and abused.

A girl who has been in constant long relationships since she was 14 and has been having sex since then, even though they may have only been 7 or 8 , would be something i'd be more worried about. Either way , ti doesn't really matter as long as she is STD-free. No one should know about anyone's sexual past either way. If you didn't' learn that anyway, you should learn that by now. Don't ever ask a woman about her past. it will lead to insecurities and you wondering about whether she is relationship material, just like you are now. It has only lead to issues in my past, so now i keep it to myself in relationships.

(06-05-2010 10:41 PM)Iceman Wrote:  

I thought I was not being unrealistic on 4 being too many for 22 going by Roissy -

http://roissy.wordpress.com/2008/12/29/i...fy-a-slut/

0 lifetime partners: Sweet virginal manna. A bit weird, but you’re confident you’ll break her in.
3 lifetime partners: Typical woman. Wife and mother of your children material.
10 lifetime partners: Above average. Proceed with caution.
15 lifetime partners: Well above average. Be dominant or she’ll cheat.
25 lifetime partners: A whole lot. Use her and lose her.
100 lifetime partners: Stopwatch material. You wonder how fast you can get her from “Hi” to “Spread your ass cheeks, I’m going in”.

I fall right between these two in bold. Guess the only issue is wondering whether i'll cheat, if you've got the balls to be dominant to prevent me from cheating and if you don't, just use me or lose me? Nice.

[Samseau]

Aylar, keep your optimism about your future prospects for a happy family life (if you want one). It's better than facing the fact one cannot be a happy whore and a happy housewife.

[BaronStanley]

What the fuck is wrong with you people? Sluts are the best.

And to original poster, 4 at 22 is low. I also dont see how a very low number correlates to less cheating. I would Hypothesize that low numbers would lead to more cheating, and then average numbers would be the best and then it gets bad again when the girls number is very high. Forming a parabolic curve if graphed.

[doriangray]

Every time I find something like this (the original question) here on the forum, I just find myself thinking how stupid Americans can be? Now I am sorry for this generalization, which is unfair and offensive, but let me try to explain why I probably get this feeling.

American culture seems so hipocratical. Such a sex/looks/money/success oriented culture and yet soooo christian. Or if not christian, super conservative at least. And the amount of double standards used! Makes me sick.

Thanks for hydrogonian and Kona for their posts, they were golden as usual. Unfortunately I cannot say I contributed much myself .

[thekiller]

An American Girl with only 4 lays by 22 is I think by definition a VIRGIN... LOL

Seriously it's a bad indicator of if she's good for an LTR or not.

The questions are really for yourself... Do you TRUST her? Does she keep you engaged physically and mentally? If you got her pregnant would you really want to marry her? Do you think she'd be a good Mother?

You might want to ask her where she sees herself going and doing in 5-10-15 years, does she want what you want etc.

I think most 22 years olds though are too Insane and Fickle (if they're attractive) for a SERIOUS LTR.

[Mrs. Chocolate]

4 is a low number, but... why it does matter?
As far as I remember, men like women who know what they are doing in bed and know how to please a men. I don't know any course about it, so I think they learnt experiencing it.
I mean, there is no need to go arond having sex with everyone who says hello, but more important than how many is her posture outside the room.
In my opinion, the most disgusting thing in the world is a girl who pretends to be a saint and in the end is a whore.

[oldnemesis]

(06-29-2010 01:43 AM)doriangray Wrote:  

American culture seems so hipocratical.

Extremely hypocritical. This basically means most people are extremely insecure, lack the confidence to be themselves, and are typically shocked by others displaying this kind of confidence. I'm out of my fingers counting how many times I've seen shock on people's faces telling them that yes, I'm married and yes, I'm fucking other women, and yes, my wife is fine with that, and no, I don't give shit if you believe me or not because I'm not interested in having sex with you anyway. They seem to be shocked not by the fact I'm really doing that (I bet some of them do it too), but by the fact I'm openly saying that. Hypocrisy at its best.

[oldnemesis]

(06-25-2010 12:18 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

It's better than facing the fact one cannot be a happy whore and a happy housewife.

Why? Don't let bibles think for you, use your brain.

[Aylar]

(06-29-2010 04:28 PM)oldnemesis Wrote:  

(06-29-2010 01:43 AM)doriangray Wrote:  

American culture seems so hipocratical.

Extremely hypocritical. This basically means most people are extremely insecure, lack the confidence to be themselves, and are typically shocked by others displaying this kind of confidence. I'm out of my fingers counting how many times I've seen shock on people's faces telling them that yes, I'm married and yes, I'm fucking other women, and yes, my wife is fine with that, and no, I don't give shit if you believe me or not because I'm not interested in having sex with you anyway. They seem to be shocked not by the fact I'm really doing that (I bet some of them do it too), but by the fact I'm openly saying that. Hypocrisy at its best.

i believed everything you said until you said your wife is fine with that. Just because she says she is, doesn't mean she is. Its not natural. And I Assume, if she really truly is fine with it, she's also screwing around correct?

[oldnemesis]

(06-30-2010 09:09 AM)Aylar Wrote:  

i believed everything you said until you said your wife is fine with that. Just because she says she is, doesn't mean she is. Its not natural.

The way I explain is is typically like that - I am also a skydiver, meaning I jump from airplanes with a parachute. Is this natural? Nope. In fact it goes against all human instincts. But this is still fun.

What is natural or not depends on a person. You know, quite a lot of people say that sex before marriage (or gay sex) is not natural too. There is also a lot of hypocrisy here in America - for example a lot of people talk about "sacred marriage vows" and then got caught cheating, which speaks a lot about what is really natural here. For us? We have been together for last ten years, changed our country of residence twice, and have several kids. While we had our issues too, we still love each others and are happy together.

All those moral restrictions are in your head. Cheating is not fucking another person, it is lying about fucking another person. You are too scared to try new things. Sucks to be you open your mind.

Quote:

And I Assume, if she really truly is fine with it, she's also screwing around correct?

Of course. Generally it is a good relationship test - if it doesn't kill you, it will make you stronger. I firmly believe in equality in relationship. Every girlfriend I had in my life I encouraged to screw around if she wanted to (surprisingly a lot of them did not).

PS. Initially I just replied "sucks to be you", but remembering your picture I decided to elaborate. It pays to have nice legs!

[Aylar]

when i said its not "natural" i didn't mean "abnormal", as in it goes against moral standards, or social norms. I guess your skydiving example is the closest to what i meant to say , in the sense that you're doing something that your body wouldn't normally ask for. Us women aren't driven to several different types of sexual relationships the way men are. our bodies arent built to spread our sperm around. this is natural biological behavior for men, not women. women are naturally designed to emotional closeness, and this comes often in the form of monogamy. which is why we are the mothers, and men aren't. if we did not seek monogamy, and if we weren't "one person" type people, we would leave our children out in the wild to be eaten by the predators.

this is what i meant.

[oldnemesis]

So your definition of "not natural" is "against something your body asks for"? This makes a lot of things unnatural, starting from alcohol and smoking and ending with oral sex and vibrators. Your body doesn't need any of those things, does it?

Now regarding monogamy, this is probably because you're too young. As I said, in lifestyle community the average age of the couple is 45, and most couples I talked too said they were too shy/shallow at our age to even think about doing something like that. Also this is just sex, and you're not getting emotional closeness with most of those people. Still you can have good sex with them, and sometime even become friends. It has nothing to do with children.

Would be interesting to see how you views change when you're 45 or so.

[Aylar]

we have sexual needs, but i personally dont masturbate on a regular basis and my sex drive has died down a lot more ever since i was 18 . i have sexual needs, but they are not nearly a high as a male's sexual needs. that's NATURAL. Alcohol is something that has been around for a long time. people have been making it for thousands of years. it is natural. it has nothing to do with behavior. its a naturally occurring resource on the earth. so is tobacco. i'm not too "shy" to have sex with several men at o ne time, when i was single and in younger relationships, i was hooking up with many people, i am very sexual;y open and always have been with my partners. i have actually convinced several of my partners to do more things sexually than they were willing to. Shallow? what does that have to do with monogamy. and no im not shallow if it makes any difference i havent had a pedicure or manicure in ages. dont have the $ or time. and sex i important to women with a person they have an emotional connection with end of story. otherwise its just not enjoyable. its one thing to not have had sex for a long time with anyone and pick someone up at a club out of sexual frustration, and another thing to be screwing with several men at one time and claim you have an emotional bond with someone too. that person needs their head checked

[oldnemesis]

Sexual promiscuity has been around even longer than alcohol. While such an option for females was historically limited because of female dependency on a male, the history knows a lot of cases of female promiscuity when such a female had power. From Ancient Egypt (Cleopatra VII) to nowadays you can find relevant examples in any historical periods.

What you are saying about your own sex drive seems to be very typical for females in their late 20s to late 30s or so. Then their sexual drive picks up again and peaks at late forties. At this age most of them usually opened their mind and are much less concerned what would others think about them, whether they think she is a slut or or whether it is natural or not. This is the main reason I find older women much more pleasant to deal with - they have significantly less shit in their head. Males sexual needs peak around 18-20, and generally only goes down after that. While there may be cases then the male has higher sexual drive than the female, openness is not just about sex. It is about meeting new people, honing your game and learning more from a new person. My opinion is that you has not grown up yet to this level of openness, or maybe too prude for that, and your examples confirm that (personally I do not know a single person who would be too shy to participate in MMF/MFF if invited - the real challenge is to get yourself invited into it), and having to convince your partners to try something means you're choosing pretty conservative partners. Therefore it is hard for you to understand that - same way as it is hard for a lot of people to understand how someone can enjoy skydiving or BASE jumping. By "shallow" I mean the person does not have enough integrity and depends too much on what others (friends, parents, coworkers, and so on) think/say about their behavior. When you mature, you do not really care about it - this is just not their business. But again, if you never tried it, it is hard to explain.