[speakeasy]

I must say, I have not once in my entire 36 years ever heard a single instance of a man saying a woman deserves to be raped because of what she's wearing. Not once. Yet I keep seeing this boogeyman issues dragged out by radical feminists time and time again. A girl I know posted this on her facebook, and of course it gets a bunch of "likes" and these claims are made all the time by the Jezebel/Slutwalk crowd. Who the hell are they even making this argument too? Do any of you know guys who go around raping women because they're wearing a miniskirt? Most rapes are acquaintance rapes, and involve alcohol by one or both parties. So if feminists want to stop rape, maybe they should be rallying behind prohibition. Fat chance. Another common rape is incest rape, such as uncles molesting a niece. This strawman lie of men pouncing out of alleyways to rape scantily clad women has to stop.

[RougeNoir]

I had a male sociology professor who said that rapes would be reduced if women would dress more conservatively. He said in a tone that blamed the females for it. I am not sure if he was speaking on behalf of his personal opinion on behalf of academia.

[Ovid]

I agree. Statistically, most rapes are definitely not the "sex-crazed man accosts random girl" scenario we usually think of. Facts will never get in the way of a good emotional appeal, though.

That being said, it's still common sense that if a girl really fears rape, she shouldn't put herself in circumstances that obviously leave her more vulnerable to it -like going out wearing clothing that leaves nothing to the imagination, getting completely hammered, grinding on random strangers all night, and traipsing around in unfamiliar neighborhoods in the wee hours of the morning. If she does this enough times, eventually something is going to happen that she feels regret about, which she may or may not rationalize into "rape" in the morning. But heaven forbid that anyone dare suggest women not drink, go out on their own, partake of nightlife, dress slutty, hook up with strange men, etc.! It's hypocritical, of course, but feminists *need* there to be a "rape culture" to rail against, to justify their own relevance.

[scorpion]

Women want to get paid as much as men, but don't want to do the difficult, dangerous or dirty jobs that men do.

Women want total control over their own reproduction, but don't want the man involved to have any say whatsoever.

Women want to be viewed as independent and strong, but don't want to give up government assistance programs, child support and alimony payments.

Women want total equality under the law, but preferential treatment as a minority group by the government, corporations and academia.

Women want to dress like whores and get shitfaced drunk in public, but don't want "creepy" men to try to hit on them.

Women want to ride the alpha cock carousel until they're ready to settle down, but don't want to be judged for their behavior.

Women want to have a sexy body, but don't want to work hard at the gym or give up their ice cream.

Women want a rich, loving, supportive, handsome and strong husband who adores his wife and their children, but still reserve the right to divorce him if they get "bored" in the marriage.

Notice a pattern?

[Only One Man]

It's funny, actually, how obsessed feminists are with rape and the 1 in 4 statistics and all that. Then when someone makes a suggestion on how to reduce their risk of rape, such as:

-Not getting so drunk that you aren't in control anymore and don't know what's going on.
-Not setting your drink down at a bar/party because someone might roofie it.
-Not being out super late in a bad part of town while being visibly drunk.
-Not relying on a group of guys you hardly know to make sure you're safe, get to bed, ect.
-Always carry pepper spray
-Not leading a drunk guy on when you have no intention of having sex with him
-Not dressing super slutty to avoid losers and thugs giving you unwanted attention and harassing you

I've told this shit to my sister and little cousins more than once and they agree because they would rather avoid getting raped than make some delusional feminist point.

For some reason, when these kinds of tips are thrown around to girls to help them reduce their risk of getting raped, feminists go apeshit. Nobody is saying if a girl doesn't heed these warnings that she deserves to be raped or that it's her fault. They're just saying that she needs to be aware of the risks and act accordingly.

[Sombro]

All the arguments boil down to the one thing, and it is the one thing they refuse to acknowledge or prevent:

POOR RISK ASSESSMENT.

[speakeasy]

(01-25-2013 04:59 PM)Only One Man Wrote:  

It's funny, actually, how obsessed feminists are with rape and the 1 in 4 statistics and all that.

Is this 1 in 4 rape thing actually true? Or is it another one of those "women make X cents on the dollar" arguments that gets thrown out and nobody questions? I have a hard time believing 1 out of ever 4 women I know including family members have been raped.

[Thomas the Rhymer]

(01-25-2013 03:56 PM)RougeNoir Wrote:  

I had a male sociology professor who said that rapes would be reduced if women would dress more conservatively. He said in a tone that blamed the females for it. I am not sure if he was speaking on behalf of his personal opinion on behalf of academia.

At one point in my career my duties included the medicolegal examination of raped women. None of them were scantily clad.

Rapists rape out of aggression - they're having a bad day and to make themselves feel better they hunt someone out to physically dominate.

If rape had anything to do with lust, then scanty dress would be a factor. But since rape has nothing to do with lust/horniness, there is no correlation between dress sense and rape.

I'm even going to say that conservative dress makes a woman more inviting to a potential rapist, because conservatively dressed women are perceived as weak and submissive.

I agree that women need to exercise common sense especially with regards to alcohol, but let's not perpetuate this myth that the way a woman dresses has anything to do with being raped, because that's not the way a rapist's mind works. All kinds of women (and girls) get raped, regardless of their dress.

[cardguy]

I would be interested in research into why rapists rape. It has always confused me. Why risk going to prison for ten years when you could just pay a small amount of cash and go visit a hooker? Is it about being horny, or is it about power as suggested above?

If rape is to do with physical dominance then I wonder if it is related to the motivations behind things like prison rape? To be honest I can't get my head around the physical dominance thing. But only because I have always assumed it was to do with an out of control libido.

On a side point. It genuinely pisses me off that people joke about prison rape. I am no bleeding-heart liberal but turning a blind eye to prison rape will one day bring shame on our generation. There is no way that such wide spread abuse would be tolerated if it were widely perpetuated on female criminals, as opposed to male criminals.

There are many reasons why prison rape is wrong. And not just because many innocent people are in prison. But because it is hypocritcial to laugh about prison rape - when, one imagines, the very same people would protest if it were introduced as an official part of the sentence.

And to extend the point further. If you think prisoners deserve to be raped then why not extend the practice by having mixed-sex prison cells?

[Ryre]

Thomas--I'm interested in your experience with this. I don't have the personal experience to argue with you. But I've always thought the "rape is about power, not about sex" was a feminist myth. If it were true, then rape risk would be equal at all ages, but my understanding is that women are most at risk in their prime years of sexual attractiveness, say 16-28 or so.

The "power, not sex" idea could come from women's inability to understand the real intensity of men's sexual urges, and men's ability to divorce sex from emotion.

Anyway, I like Adam Carolla's line on the subject: "rape isn't about sex, it is just like any other crime...except you come at the end."

As for whether the numbers, and women's concerns, are real: I do think the numbers are exaggerated. Some of the surveys of women at universities, for instance, that found very high levels of victimization, defined rape very broadly to include things like "having sex with someone because he gave you alcohol or drugs," or "having sex when you didn't want to" (which could include, for instance, having sex with a boyfriend when she wasn't in the mood). The respondents themselves didn't classify these incidents as rape, but the people conducting the study did.

OTOH, I have had enough conversations with women who revealed that they themselves have been victims that I don't doubt that it happens.

I had an interesting facebook conversation with a couple feminist friends recently, when that bogus rape chart came out. I asked, if these numbers are true, what should be done? "Blah, blah, change rape culture, educate men, make reporting easier." Ok, look: my hometown university is a large state school in a liberal, blue-state city. Student body is 40,000 students. Number of reported rapes in 2011 was 23; fewer the year before.

If 1 in 4 college women are raped, that means there are several thousand rapes happening a year, for a reporting rate of 1% or less. (this math isn't original to me, saw a version of it on a blog somewhere). In fact, total violent felonies in the city as a whole were less than 4,000. So if you believe feminist numbers, there are more unreported rapes just at the university than all violent felonies in the city combined.

That is a crime wave, an epidemic. You don't solve that by "education" and cracking down on frats. We should have 100's of cops and detectives flooding the campus, going to parties undercover, busting rapists and turning them against other rapists (like with organized crime/gangs). Maybe a total ban on alcohol, zero tolerance, throw you out of school and criminally prosecute you for first offense. Panic buttons in dorm rooms, surveillance cameras, cops in every dorm...you get the idea.

And the weird thing was, my feminist friends said, no, don't be ridiculous, your remedies are way too harsh!

My favorite comment on this, I wish I'd noted where I saw it, maybe here, was along the lines of, "We have these arguments about rape, but they don't have anything to do with rape or preventing it. They are all just proxies for arguing about the relative positions of men and women." Lots of truth to that.

[TheRookie]

   

[Thomas the Rhymer]

(01-25-2013 07:54 PM)Ryre Wrote:  

If it were true, then rape risk would be equal at all ages, but my understanding is that women are most at risk in their prime years of sexual attractiveness, say 16-28 or so.

No. What you say does not explain child rape nor does it explain sexual violence against the elderly.

[EisenBarde]

Feminists refuse to acknowledge the nature of predatory men and simultaneously make themselves an easier target while deriding the very people that want to help protect them.

This is gonna bite them in the ass hard as increasing numbers of men just don't give a shit about whether or not they get raped.

[kosko]

It started in Toronto (no surprise) at York University when a cop said more or less that women should not be dressing proactively and like sluts thus bringing the wrong attention if they want to be safe and not a target.

Quote:

“women should avoid dressing like sluts in order not to be victimized,”

A Toronto Star whore-bag columnist went to lunch with it and it eventually birthed the 'Slutwalk' and fueled the type of speech you see present in that meme in the poster @Speakeasy.

The Cop had a point though: If you dress like a whore don't be mad if your treated like one when out in public - Women know what they are doing dressing up like that. If a girl goes out drinking with a dress with her ass hanging out she should not be surprised if it gets grabbed or spanked while out.

Whats interesting is when it comes to this Women don't want to hold up their already shoddy facts. "Its debatable if Women whom are dressed more slutty are subject to more rape/assault" All rape stats are dodgy but its obvious from the amount of sex workers off the streets whom get beat up and assaulted that there is a connection there that Feminists don't want to talk about.

Feminists go leave you Iphones on the table opposite of you at Starbucks or something and count how fast it gets stolen. Then go and shame the thief even though you invited the theft in the first place - No legit cop would waste their time perusing your case... you see where that is going.

Police officer’s remarks at York inspire ‘SlutWalk’

Toronto 'slut walk' takes to city streets

Cop apologizes for ‘sluts' remark at law school

[Screwston]

Most American women have it so easy and will sail through life with no serious problems. They need something to "fight about" to make themselves feel better. I guess feminists choose the rape boogeyman. I'm guessing the ones that are so vocal and paranoid about the rape are well off and have nothing to worry about (like paying rent and keeping food on the table). Why don't some posters in the feminist hellholes and on Facebook ask those girls how they feel about young men getting raped in prison.

Quote:

There are 2 million Americans behind bars. 1 in 5 will be sexually assaulted while incarcerated

[sixsix]

Rape is definitely about sex.

Sex often includes elements of power dynamics, naturally.

You need power to fuck a guy in prison, and your domination and his humiliation will give you more power.

This does not negate the fact that the sex act happened because of an urge to have sex.

Some facts to support this:

1. Rape has declined in countries where internet porn became easily accessible.

2. Prison rape is less frequent when prisoners are allowed conjugal visits (e.g. they can fuck women).

3. Rapists generally target young, fertile women.

"But this doesn't explain child and elderly rape!"

Natural variation is a big part of biology. Just as evolutionary theory explains that most men prefer young, nubile girls as mates, some men deviate from this general rule (e.g. by preferring men, fat women, or children) but that doesn't 'disprove' biology. Same with nonconsensual sex.

[cardguy]

Depending on how you define rape. And because of the large number of men incarcerated in America. I once read that more men are raped each year than women.

Because of prison rape.

Impossible to know for sure - but it could be possible if you compare prisons rapes with the number of rapes, in the worse sense of the word. Like a stranger, in a mask, jumping a girl in the street with the use of violence. Which is the way I was raised to visualise rape through the media.

Of course it is now being extended into the grey areas involving alchohol, and questions of consent and regret when the girl wakes up the day after a one-night stand. Really complicated area there.

[Clyde Rules]

How these Hamsters think about rape.... she thinks she is funny but its just a display of their neurosis.

[Alpharius]

I've had sex when I didn't want to. Countless times I've been tired, hungry, busy, not in the mood, etc... But a girl really wanted to bang. Eventually I gave in.

Does that mean that I was raped?

Yeah, it's 2013. Women should be able to dress however they want. However I draw the line when someone says, "At any time after the fact a woman can decide she didn't have consensual sex, she was raped." Regret doesn't equal rape. This entire argument plays into the idea that all men are out of control sex addicts and the slightest hint of female sexuality is enough to throw guys over the edge.

Gays get the same shit treatment from straight guys. "I don't want a gay guy with me in the locker room, what if he checks me out or tries to grab me?" Not all gays are violent sociopaths, not all men are violent sociopaths. This whole shit just needs to be dropped.

I AM a bleeding heart liberal, and there's shit out there even I can't deal with. A girl I know is in therapy right now because a guy slapped her ass and called her a bitch during sex. She'd been suicidal for a year since then. I really, really want to tell her to get some actual problems.

Congrats, rooshvforum, after hitting post Ill never be able to run for political office until people realise this is just as much bullshit as flag burning.

[WesternCancer]

(01-26-2013 11:18 AM)Clyde Rules Wrote:  

How these Hamsters think about rape.... she thinks she is funny but its just a display of their neurosis.

"this wasn't about race" Starts talking like a stereotypical hoodrat black chick. This chick looks scared just TALKING about rape. I remember from one of those male-feminist videos someone posted where the guy said "many women who are scared of rape have been raped" Maybe thats where their nearly irrational fear of getting raped in every situation imaginable comes from. "see a man walking behind me in the wal-mart parking lot at noon, must be trying to rape me" thats like saying "oh a black man, he must be trying to rob me" "oh a woman wearing heels, she must be a prostitute" Its happened once so they're so scared of happening again they live in constant fear and pass that fear on to everyone else.

[Doulos2Game]

I have had two dates now that I find out that the girl has been raped. I dig into this shit unconsciously and BOOM!!! have you guys ever been on a date where this has happened? I didn't bang on both occasions obviously.

[WestIndianArchie]

(01-27-2013 03:41 AM)Doulos2Game Wrote:  

I have had two dates now that I find out that the girl has been raped. I dig into this shit unconsciously and BOOM!!! have you guys ever been on a date where this has happened? I didn't bang on both occasions obviously.

I've messed with a few chicks that have been raped before, but I find molestation to be far more common issue that chicks bring up.

*doesn't make correlation between incidences of sexual violence and level of DTFness*

WIA

[DarkTriad]

(01-25-2013 07:54 PM)Ryre Wrote:  

Thomas--I'm interested in your experience with this. I don't have the personal experience to argue with you. But I've always thought the "rape is about power, not about sex" was a feminist myth. If it were true, then rape risk would be equal at all ages, but my understanding is that women are most at risk in their prime years of sexual attractiveness, say 16-28 or so.

The "power, not sex" idea could come from women's inability to understand the real intensity of men's sexual urges, and men's ability to divorce sex from emotion.

Anyway, I like Adam Carolla's line on the subject: "rape isn't about sex, it is just like any other crime...except you come at the end."

There are very few things in life that involve an erection and an orgasm that don't involve sex. If you read up on it, you'll discover "It's about power, not about sex" didn't come from a doctor or a study, it was a cool sounding slogan by an ideologue that got endlessly repeated (Much like the Superbowl DV Hoax).

[cardguy]

Just curious. If rape is about sex and not power. Then why don't rapists visit hookers instead of risking getting caught?

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

As always, the truth is somewhere in between those two statements. I think it makes no sense to say that rape is just a desire to dominate and hurt others. Rather, I think it is a combination of both sex drive and an absence of empathy (psychopathy, in other words). Rape trends, such as young women being the most at risk of being raped, and rape rates falling with the rise of porn, surely do point to it.

A normal man (i.e. even remotely civilized) will probably be too disturbed to have sex by his victim trashing around, screaming, bleeding and whatnot to commit rape. By that same virtue, even if he is sex-starved, he will also be more likely to consider the possibility of prison and maybe choose a hooker instead.

Psychopaths don't have that kind of forward thinking and also have an absence of empathy, making rape as simple as taking anything that they want with no regard for consequences, not much different from stealing. But I think that they're still motivated primarily by sex, though.