[AFspecOps]

(01-08-2013 09:34 AM)Rex Wrote:  

The perpetrators of black slavery (a number of European capitalists, Arab traders, and African tribal leaders) are long dead.

Unfortunately, that is a myth. Slavery continues today among the Muslims. Islam has never had any type of abolitionist movement. There are several documentaries (some produced by the United Nations) that show slave markets during the 1960s. Here is a bizarre one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFIaja1JRf8

Textbooks don't give Islamic slavery the focus it deserves. After Muslims invaded west Africa and converted the Africans (who mostly had to convert for survival), the stage was set. Once Europeans arrived, the African-Muslim traders were all too willing to sell off the 'animist-infidels'.

And it wasn't just a 'black' thing. Read the book 'White Gold' about the North Africans enslaving a million or so whites (including US citizens kidnapped from merchant vessels). The savagery to these slaves was brutal. The resulting Barbary Wars led the formation of the US Navy.

[tenderman100]

(01-06-2013 01:19 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

I hate to do this but I am going to have to call you out on this. The line about companies wanting to hire educated black men is complete utter B.S. From my experience I believe that to NOT be the case, companies generally hire people that are like them. I know this first hand and actually read this last week in one of the business magazines, this is the "first" thing they look for.
Secondly, they have done studies whereby they have sent out identical resumes with the same qualifications. One resume is clearly from a white person and the other from a black person, now WE all know who got more calls for interviews.
Now I am not some young fresh out of college guy who believes Obama will save the day and this is a new America (Canada in my case). I have been there, actually worked in Canada and Europe. I am in my 40's and still study because I see/know too many guys who are casualties of this job market.
In my latest gig, I have seen little "Jimmy" get a sweet job fresh out of college because Uncle was one of the managers. This at the expense of more senior candidates that were actually doing the same job. My personal favourite is the guy that calls his mate, says he is tired of his current job and would like to work for our company. A month later he is a manager at our company which is hilarious considering the hiring process consists of 6 interviews.
I also know a cute young white girl without college education who lands a decent job with minimum work experience.
Trust me I have more examples but hopefully you get the drift. I am not whining I am stating the reality not the dream that every young, educated, intelligent black male will always walk into a corporate job.

As for Sharpton and Jackson, I won't touch those puppetts for now.

Well, you're welcome to call me out on this, but my experience consulting with dozens of companies, large and small, tells me that educated, competent black males with requisite skills can get jobs.

Of course, small family businesses or closely held businesses are going to hire "their own." And others are right that networking is important and that blacks do not have the extensive networks like whites.

That being said, give me a black male with a 3.2-3.5 in a STEM discipline and who interviews well and has good writing skills, and I could recommend about a half a dozen companies who would seriously consider hiring him.

[RouteBackwards]

When I see shit like this. I realize that I need to only care for myself.

That's it.

North America does not give a fuck about you.

[Blaster]

(01-09-2013 12:28 AM)tenderman100 Wrote:  

(01-06-2013 01:19 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

I hate to do this but I am going to have to call you out on this. The line about companies wanting to hire educated black men is complete utter B.S. From my experience I believe that to NOT be the case, companies generally hire people that are like them. I know this first hand and actually read this last week in one of the business magazines, this is the "first" thing they look for.
Secondly, they have done studies whereby they have sent out identical resumes with the same qualifications. One resume is clearly from a white person and the other from a black person, now WE all know who got more calls for interviews.
Now I am not some young fresh out of college guy who believes Obama will save the day and this is a new America (Canada in my case). I have been there, actually worked in Canada and Europe. I am in my 40's and still study because I see/know too many guys who are casualties of this job market.
In my latest gig, I have seen little "Jimmy" get a sweet job fresh out of college because Uncle was one of the managers. This at the expense of more senior candidates that were actually doing the same job. My personal favourite is the guy that calls his mate, says he is tired of his current job and would like to work for our company. A month later he is a manager at our company which is hilarious considering the hiring process consists of 6 interviews.
I also know a cute young white girl without college education who lands a decent job with minimum work experience.
Trust me I have more examples but hopefully you get the drift. I am not whining I am stating the reality not the dream that every young, educated, intelligent black male will always walk into a corporate job.

As for Sharpton and Jackson, I won't touch those puppetts for now.

Well, you're welcome to call me out on this, but my experience consulting with dozens of companies, large and small, tells me that educated, competent black males with requisite skills can get jobs.

Of course, small family businesses or closely held businesses are going to hire "their own." And others are right that networking is important and that blacks do not have the extensive networks like whites.

Although I do think there is a very strong tendency for groups to hire people similar to themselves, my experience is that for science/tech based jobs most companies don't have much choice. They can't afford to hire someone incompetent and while they're certainly biased towards people they can best relate to socially, they usually don't have the luxury of selecting for that. There just aren't that many qualified candidates.

[rudebwoy]

(01-09-2013 12:28 AM)tenderman100 Wrote:  

(01-06-2013 01:19 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

I hate to do this but I am going to have to call you out on this. The line about companies wanting to hire educated black men is complete utter B.S. From my experience I believe that to NOT be the case, companies generally hire people that are like them. I know this first hand and actually read this last week in one of the business magazines, this is the "first" thing they look for.
Secondly, they have done studies whereby they have sent out identical resumes with the same qualifications. One resume is clearly from a white person and the other from a black person, now WE all know who got more calls for interviews.
Now I am not some young fresh out of college guy who believes Obama will save the day and this is a new America (Canada in my case). I have been there, actually worked in Canada and Europe. I am in my 40's and still study because I see/know too many guys who are casualties of this job market.
In my latest gig, I have seen little "Jimmy" get a sweet job fresh out of college because Uncle was one of the managers. This at the expense of more senior candidates that were actually doing the same job. My personal favourite is the guy that calls his mate, says he is tired of his current job and would like to work for our company. A month later he is a manager at our company which is hilarious considering the hiring process consists of 6 interviews.
I also know a cute young white girl without college education who lands a decent job with minimum work experience.
Trust me I have more examples but hopefully you get the drift. I am not whining I am stating the reality not the dream that every young, educated, intelligent black male will always walk into a corporate job.

As for Sharpton and Jackson, I won't touch those puppetts for now.

Well, you're welcome to call me out on this, but my experience consulting with dozens of companies, large and small, tells me that educated, competent black males with requisite skills can get jobs.

Of course, small family businesses or closely held businesses are going to hire "their own." And others are right that networking is important and that blacks do not have the extensive networks like whites.

That being said, give me a black male with a 3.2-3.5 in a STEM discipline and who interviews well and has good writing skills, and I could recommend about a half a dozen companies who would seriously consider hiring him.

Tenderman, I gave you examples of under qualified white people getting employment/promotions based on nepotism. You give me a sceneario based on the candidate having to be top notch to be "considered" for a job.

After the bitch slap you got from Kona about being anti-Obama and your subtle anti-black comments, not sure why you feel the need to add to this topic.

Blaster, thanks for clearing that up buddy. I think common sense would have made you realize I was not talking about tech jobs.

[worldwidetraveler]

(01-09-2013 09:22 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Tenderman, I gave you examples of under qualified white people getting employment/promotions based on nepotism. You give me a sceneario based on the candidate having to be top notch to be "considered" for a job.

After the bitch slap you got from Kona about being anti-Obama and your subtle anti-black comments, not sure why you feel the need to add to this topic.

Blaster, thanks for clearing that up buddy. I think common sense would have made you realize I was not talking about tech jobs.

White guys in race threads is a lose, lose situation.

[Goldin Boy]

Quote:

Well, you're welcome to call me out on this, but my experience consulting with dozens of companies, large and small, tells me that educated, competent black males with requisite skills can get jobs.

Of course, small family businesses or closely held businesses are going to hire "their own." And others are right that networking is important and that blacks do not have the extensive networks like whites.

That being said, give me a black male with a 3.2-3.5 in a STEM discipline and who interviews well and has good writing skills, and I could recommend about a half a dozen companies who would seriously consider hiring him.

Maybe the companies you've worked for are outliers but research backs up what Rude was saying. Here's a link to study I think he's alluding to "The Mark of the Criminal Record". They initially set it up to see what affect having a prior played on employment opportunities but noticed that White men who admitted to being felons in interviews got more callbacks than Black men with comparable qualifications and no record.

I advise you read it all or just from 955 to 960. Here's a choice quote from the findings:

Quote:

In fact, even whites with criminal records received more favorable
treatment (17%) than blacks without criminal records (14%).
The rank ordering of groups in this graph is painfully revealing of employer preferences: race continues to play a dominant role in shaping employment opportunities, equal to or greater than the impact of a criminal record.

Not complaining or saying you're a liar, just that most people aren't color-blind and they do subconsciously assign value to people based on race regardless of individual circumstances.

[Grit]

Using nepotism to argue about institutional racism is a huge fallacious red herring. Are you trying to suggest that people who prefer family to strangers are racist? I agree that it IS unfair for a worthless family member to be hired over a high achieving stranger, but in reality its the bosses fool's errand, his mistake, and its for him to suffer the consequences.

Back to the original article, in my opinion white people see a black woman with ten daddy babies and think how unfortunate she is. White people see a white woman with ten daddy babies and are disgusted at her poor choices. White people love these 'warm and fuzzy' biased acts of charity. This is behind the whole story, and it influences welfare, taxation, and the extent to which the usa is in debt. Welfare and debt are the root cause of the destruction of the black middle class as well as the white middle class.

[UgSlayer]

5 pages of thread and the only mention of the crack cocaine epidemic is one post quoting the wikipedia article.

Whites and other races were not as affected by trafficking and sale of crack cocaine. Nor has anything in recent American history hit any other racial community the way that crack destroyed black communities.

[TheMan]

(01-09-2013 11:47 PM)UgSlayer Wrote:  

5 pages of thread and the only mention of the crack cocaine epidemic is one post quoting the wikipedia article.

Whites and other races were not as affected by trafficking and sale of crack cocaine. Nor has anything in recent American history hit any other racial community the way that crack destroyed black communities.

What about alcohol and the natives (I don't know, I'm asking)

[kosko]

(01-09-2013 11:47 PM)UgSlayer Wrote:  

5 pages of thread and the only mention of the crack cocaine epidemic is one post quoting the wikipedia article.

Whites and other races were not as affected by trafficking and sale of crack cocaine. Nor has anything in recent American history hit any other racial community the way that crack destroyed black communities.

It is an important part of the Experience.

Lets not forget though that Meth has fucked up rural White communities in West Virginia and Montana and general more urban communities in Arizona pretty fucking hard.

I feel the modern example would be to tie in the general lax view on designer drugs now days. People have done a bump or two for a long fucking time and cocaine has always had its place within subcultures but the rise and acceptance of synthetics in my mind will be the sad game changer that fucked over in the past in other forms got to the Aboriginal peoples (Alcohol), and African-Americans (Crack).

To me the Crack issue was the final nail in the coffin, but to me things had to get to that level to make the crack problem spread like a wildfire the way it did. I think that's why it was so easy for deviant ends whiten the establishment to work hand in hand to bring the stuff in.

[pitt]

(01-09-2013 10:50 PM)Grit Wrote:  

Using nepotism to argue about institutional racism is a huge fallacious red herring. Are you trying to suggest that people who prefer family to strangers are racist? I agree that it IS unfair for a worthless family member to be hired over a high achieving stranger, but in reality its the bosses fool's errand, his mistake, and its for him to suffer the consequences.

No, we are not saying that people who prefer their family or close friends are racists. The problem is that the majority of large corporations are owned by white people. Therefore, they are more likely to employ their own people. This makes it harder for a black man to succeed.

But anyway, im not on here to complain. So far, life has been going well for me as a black man. I have always been given opportunities to move forward in life and if i remember it right, probably i had more black people blocking my way to success than white people. Its crazy when that shit happens in a white country when the general idea is that blacks are more likely to stick together but that hasnt been the case for me.

[Blaster]

(01-11-2013 04:17 PM)pitt Wrote:  

(01-09-2013 10:50 PM)Grit Wrote:  

Using nepotism to argue about institutional racism is a huge fallacious red herring. Are you trying to suggest that people who prefer family to strangers are racist? I agree that it IS unfair for a worthless family member to be hired over a high achieving stranger, but in reality its the bosses fool's errand, his mistake, and its for him to suffer the consequences.

No, we are not saying that people who prefer their family or close friends are racists. The problem is that the majority of large corporations are owned by white people. Therefore, they are more likely to employ their own people. This makes it harder for a black man to succeed.

I understand this idea because I have observed the desire to "hire people like yourself" but in the case of Black Americans I can tell you that I have no data. There simply haven't been any candidates reject. Zero. I don't have a culture-wide sample size but I've probably interviewed a good 30+ people for half a dozen positions over the course of my life.

And to be quite honest, in my field an educated Black American would probably have an advantage in the "hire people like yourself" category given how many of the qualified candidates wind up being immigrants with thick accents and starkly different cultural backgrounds.

I think the issue is upstream (education, etc.) and not hiring. I'm not sure where and I'm not sure to what degree discrimination plays a role.

[JayMillz]

[JayMillz]

[tenderman100]

(01-09-2013 09:22 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Tenderman, I gave you examples of under qualified white people getting employment/promotions based on nepotism. You give me a sceneario based on the candidate having to be top notch to be "considered" for a job.

After the bitch slap you got from Kona about being anti-Obama and your subtle anti-black comments, not sure why you feel the need to add to this topic.

Blaster, thanks for clearing that up buddy. I think common sense would have made you realize I was not talking about tech jobs.

Let me remind you of what you ACTUALLY said. Emphasis mine.

(01-06-2013 01:19 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

I hate to do this but I am going to have to call you out on this. The line about companies wanting to hire educated black men is complete utter B.S. From my experience I believe that to NOT be the case, companies generally hire people that are like them. I know this first hand and actually read this last week in one of the business magazines, this is the "first" thing they look for.

From MY EXPERIENCE -- and I have a whole fucking lot OF experience -- an educated competent black male has a leg UP in the corporate hiring process.

By the way, this is NOT racist, or anti-black, or anti-Obama. Obama has zero to do with it -- except as an example of how far an intelligent black male can go in society today.

Finally, one of the key points of Athlone post is that among black youth today, academic achievement is denigrated. My point was that this is tragic because educated competent black males CAN get jobs.

Note how Athlone -- a guy with impressive academic achievements -- liked that post almost immediately.

Thanks for reading.

[elabayarde]

Yes, Yes, Yes my brotha.

[Hencredible Casanova]

Caribbean nations set to ask for reparations for slavery.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_...story.html

[kosko]

Isn't Hati still owed something along the lines of 50 Billion in today's dollars from France? Just like Germany's gold will never be returned by the USA, these island nations can expect the same treatment - unless you can force it from them they will not pay.

[scotian]

(09-17-2013 08:01 PM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  

Caribbean nations set to ask for reparations for slavery.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_...story.html

I doubt it'll happen but am curious to know how the wealth would be distributed if it did take place? If they give the money to the government would they invest in social service, education, health care, etc or would they keep it for themselves? If they gave it to individuals, it could get complicated, there's quite a few people in places like Jamaica who are mixed race with British, Indian, Chinese, Jewish (Sean Paul) heritage, would they get the same amount as someone who is 100% decended from former slaves?

I think Caribbean governments, Jamaica in particular should focus more on eradicating violence in their countries and diversifying their tourism dependent economies. It blows my mind that when I call my Scotiabank (largest bank in Jamaica) customer service line I get someone in Mexico or especially if I call my Visa and get someone in India or the Philippines, when we have a bunch of English speaking people in our time zone who could use the work.

[Kingsley Davis]

(09-17-2013 08:40 PM)scotian Wrote:  

(09-17-2013 08:01 PM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  

Caribbean nations set to ask for reparations for slavery.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_...story.html

I doubt it'll happen but am curious to know how the wealth would be distributed if it did take place? If they give the money to the government would they invest in social service, education, health care, etc or would they keep it for themselves? If they gave it to individuals, it could get complicated, there's quite a few people in places like Jamaica who are mixed race with British, Indian, Chinese, Jewish (Sean Paul) heritage, would they get the same amount as someone who is 100% decended from former slaves?

I think Caribbean governments, Jamaica in particular should focus more on eradicating violence in their countries and diversifying their tourism dependent economies. It blows my mind that when I call my Scotiabank (largest bank in Jamaica) customer service line I get someone in Mexico or especially if I call my Visa and get someone in India or the Philippines, when we have a bunch of English speaking people in our time zone who could use the work.

My father died with a broken heart for his beloved Jamaica which he had to flee ASAP because of his prophetic views regarding the country's independence from Great Britain. Good luck with your reparation/extortion.

[Therapsid]

(09-17-2013 10:09 PM)Kingsley Davis Wrote:  

My father died with a broken heart for his beloved Jamaica which he had to flee ASAP because of his prophetic views regarding the country's independence from Great Britain. Good luck with your reparation/extortion.

Jamaica's done alright Kingsley. Get a grip. It's not Somalia or Haiti.

[scotian]

I read a book a couple of years ago called "The Dead yard" it was written by a Brit and fairly negative, focused on all of the negatives (there's plenty) and very few of the positives. Jamaica is an interesting country with such a strong culture, all over the world you''ll find Reggae bars blasting Bob Marley tunes (it pretty funny to see Thai Rastas), they have an impressive summer Olympics team (Usain Bolt, etc), Blue Mountain coffee is world renowned, as is Appleton rum and of course the ganja. There's huge dance hall scenes in around the world and if you hit up clubs in Mo Bay and Kingston you'll see Germans, North Americans and Japanese whining on the dance floor. I'd say their flag is one of the most recognizable around the world. Pretty impressive for a country of 2.7 million.

Sadly the transition from British Colony to independant nation hasn't been easy and the power concentrated in the hands of a few wealthy families. Back in the 70's politicians (USA backed?) supplied arms to select garrisons to stomp out opposition as it was feared the island would also turn socialist as some other Caribbean nations did in the Cold War context. Modern day Jamaica has been ravaged by the drug trade as was seen a few years ago when Kingston area (Tivoli Gardens) drug lord Chistopher "Dudas" Coke was extradited to the USA, resulting in almost 100 Kingston residents being slaughtered by Jamaican police and military forces.

Its a tough life down there in the yard but the people get by and are for the most part some of the coolest people you'll ever meet, I recommend checking it out for a week or two, if you stay on a resort, make sure to get away to hang out with some locals.

[Kingsley Davis]

(09-17-2013 10:37 PM)Therapsid Wrote:  

(09-17-2013 10:09 PM)Kingsley Davis Wrote:  

My father died with a broken heart for his beloved Jamaica which he had to flee ASAP because of his prophetic views regarding the country's independence from Great Britain. Good luck with your reparation/extortion.

Jamaica's done alright Kingsley. Get a grip. It's not Somalia or Haiti.

Done alright? You from Rema, Jungle, Tivoli. Waterhouse, Flankers, Salem, etc? Tell the residents of these establishments to get a grip because they could be in Haiti or Somalia.

[Kingsley Davis]

(09-17-2013 11:09 PM)scotian Wrote:  

I read a book a couple of years ago called "The Dead yard" it was written by a Brit and fairly negative, focused on all of the negatives (there's plenty) and very few of the positives. Jamaica is an interesting country with such a strong culture, all over the world you''ll find Reggae bars blasting Bob Marley tunes (it pretty funny to see Thai Rastas), they have an impressive summer Olympics team (Usain Bolt, etc), Blue Mountain coffee is world renowned, as is Appleton rum and of course the ganja. There's huge dance hall scenes in around the world and if you hit up clubs in Mo Bay and Kingston you'll see Germans, North Americans and Japanese whining on the dance floor. I'd say their flag is one of the most recognizable around the world. Pretty impressive for a country of 2.7 million.

Sadly the transition from British Colony to independant nation hasn't been easy and the power concentrated in the hands of a few wealthy families. Back in the 70's politicians (USA backed?) supplied arms to select garrisons to stomp out opposition as it was feared the island would also turn socialist as some other Caribbean nations did in the Cold War context. Modern day Jamaica has been ravaged by the drug trade as was seen a few years ago when Kingston area (Tivoli Gardens) drug lord Chistopher "Dudas" Coke was extradited to the USA, resulting in almost 100 Kingston residents being slaughtered by Jamaican police and military forces.

Its a tough life down there in the yard but the people get by and are for the most part some of the coolest people you'll ever meet, I recommend checking it out for a week or two, if you stay on a resort, make sure to get away to hang out with some locals.

Highly recommend.