[Urban Renaissance Man]

Earlier today I was listening to the podcast of a rather famous ‘PUA,’ (I guess you can call him that) as he took a call from some guy who needed his advice. The caller’s problem is that he feels the girl he is currently dating is too good to be true. Apparently she’s nice looking, respectful, doing well in school, actually comes over and cooks for him, etc. During the call the guy says, “I think she might be too good to be true.” The host of the show chastises him a bit by saying that he should never feel a girl is too good to be true, which suggests he doesn’t deserve the treatment. He goes on to say that the qualities his girlfriend possess and the things she is doing for him is “normal” stuff for a girl to do, and that he’s just so used to dealing with “ratchet ass girls”, he can’t believe it’s true! What sad commentary that a guy is so dismayed by his girl's good behavior that he feels compelled to call into a dating advice show! Granted, this guy could simply be a weirdo and perhaps most men wouldn't have given it another thought, but I don't think so. Perhaps most wouldn't be weirded out by a woman being what is essentially basically cooperative, but I do feel most men would find it very different from what their used to, and even worthy of mentioning to friends!

I thought about the statement of the host. “Those things are normal stuff for a girl to do.” Then I thought, “Is it normal?” I mean, is it today’s normal? I too feel that a decent looking guy with decent game and decent income should be able to find a decent girl. But is that now a normal situation? In fact, if it was normal, shouldn’t a girl be willing to come over and cook, make herself look pretty for you, act happy when you call, not respond to your calls with a text message, stay in school or work a good job, be supportive and suck a mean dick, be the rule and not the exception. However, even under my best dating circumstances, I had to deal with either the threat of being cheated on, (roving eye) or the treat of being broken up with if I didn't fit my attitude to match their ideal. As I continued to listen to the podcast, I thought, “Maybe my (and the announcers) version of normal was 1950’s normal. Maybe there really are more bad women than there are good."

Are we honestly living at a time where finding a basic (normal) good woman is no longer a normal happening, or is it truly just a case of dealing with bottom of barrel women, whom we had no business dealing with in the first place, and then unfairly judging the rest of American womankind based of the experiences with the few “ratchet ass” girls we’ve had the displeasure of knowing?

To be fair, I see couples all over who appear to be happy. Little, beta looking white boys in North Face jackets, holding hands with the cutest blonde girls, slim with perfectly white teeth, drinking coffee at Peet’s. Soy milk, of course. They certainly seem happy, and she seems as pure as Snow White! Perhaps their normal is just different from mine? Or maybe their situation is abnormal?

[MidniteSpecial]

Or maybe your being soft. Read a good dog training book and Apply it to your game. Women/people in general are a lot like dogs. Once you feed them off the table once they will bother you at dinner every time. You have to be the pack leader and call the shots. If a chic doesnt act how you want her to kick her to the curb til you find one that will.

[DarkTriad]

(09-27-2012 02:07 PM)Urban Renaissance Man Wrote:  

Earlier today I was listening to the podcast of a rather famous ‘PUA,’ (I guess you can call him that) as he took a call from some guy who needed his advice. The caller’s problem is that he feels the girl he is currently dating is too good to be true. Apparently she’s nice looking, respectful, doing well in school, actually comes over and cooks for him, etc. During the call the guy says, “I think she might be too good to be true.” The host of the show chastises him a bit by saying that he should never feel a girl is too good to be true, which suggests he doesn’t deserve the treatment. He goes on to say that the qualities his girlfriend possess and the things she is doing for him is “normal” stuff for a girl to do, and that he’s just so used to dealing with “ratchet ass girls”, he can’t believe it’s true! What sad commentary that a guy is so dismayed by his girl's good behavior that he feels compelled to call into a dating advice show! Granted, this guy could simply be a weirdo and perhaps most men wouldn't have given it another thought, but I don't think so. Perhaps most wouldn't be weirded out by a woman being what is essentially basically cooperative, but I do feel most men would find it very different from what their used to, and even worthy of mentioning to friends!

I thought about the statement of the host. “Those things are normal stuff for a girl to do.” Then I thought, “Is it normal?” I mean, is it today’s normal? I too feel that a decent looking guy with decent game and decent income should be able to find a decent girl. But is that now a normal situation? In fact, if it was normal, shouldn’t a girl be willing to come over and cook, make herself look pretty for you, act happy when you call, not respond to your calls with a text message, stay in school or work a good job, be supportive and suck a mean dick, be the rule and not the exception. However, even under my best dating circumstances, I had to deal with either the threat of being cheated on, (roving eye) or the treat of being broken up with if I didn't fit my attitude to match their ideal. As I continued to listen to the podcast, I thought, “Maybe my (and the announcers) version of normal was 1950’s normal. Maybe there really are more bad women than there are good."

Are we honestly living at a time where finding a basic (normal) good woman is no longer a normal happening, or is it truly just a case of dealing with bottom of barrel women, whom we had no business dealing with in the first place, and then unfairly judging the rest of American womankind based of the experiences with the few “ratchet ass” girls we’ve had the displeasure of knowing?

To be fair, I see couples all over who appear to be happy. Little, beta looking white boys in North Face jackets, holding hands with the cutest blonde girls, slim with perfectly white teeth, drinking coffee at Peet’s. Soy milk, of course. They certainly seem happy, and she seems as pure as Snow White! Perhaps their normal is just different from mine? Or maybe their situation is abnormal?

Interesting post.

[iknowexactly]

Well, let me be the devil's advocate, you think that guy with Perfect Teeth Chick is totally dedicated to fucking her one to three times, than ignoring her calls and making believe she doesn't exist? Hilarious that pointing that out could cause a shitstorm with PUAs.... I'm not denying game works, it's just that Miss Teeth may not want to be a "notch."

[Urban Renaissance Man]

I'm not talking about game necessarily, as much as I am about overall belief systems concerning women these days. It would seem like just in general women, due to media or whatever, or growing up more disrespectful and far less accomodating than past years. Yes, this is something we're all already aware of. However, I was wondering if we as men should not adjust our thinking to fit the times. The Host made the comment that a cooperative woman, who caters to the man she's interested in is the norm, and that the caller was simply used to dealing with f*cked up women; which is why he found her good behavior so startling. My contention is that he found her good behavior startling because most women no longer behave good!

[Mr.Wynn]

Yeah I heard tariq's podcast too. Cooperative women are hard as hell to find these days (especially young bitches due to today's Facebook, twitter, & all these other online sites which contain hundreds of Simp ass dudes telling them how "beautiful" they are constantly lettin even the fatties think they can get any dude they want) & this is comin from a good looking dude in his early 20s. Which is why I'm only willing to holla at bitches who are makin their interest in me known

[Urban Renaissance Man]

Dude, I can't recommend that! if what you say is true that women's few of their value is already distorted, you may only be dealing with 10 or 12 women a year who are willing to make I straight up come on to you. I'm sure you can imagine how many of those will be in the 7 to 10 Range!

I didn't want to mention the hosts name, because this is Roosh's bored and I felt it might be a little disrespectful to plug someone else on his board. But since it's out there, Tariq said something else. He said, "You've got to spit at A LOT of women come find the right one." That also ties in with much of what Roosh has had to say as well. Good game and numbers are the only weapons us non rich, non famous guys have to combat this shift in female cooperation. I just can't help but wonder if maybe people like Tariq, and many other guys on this board, are too extreme for the reality we live in. On the other hand, I've never, ever seen weakness work. At least not towards the happiness of the man.

To be sure, there are still good women out there. We all know someone who has one. There are also many more diamonds in the rough, who just need proper leadership and guidance from a strong man. The trick is locating a woman in these 2 categories before we're dead. Lol. Good game and numbers seems to be the only chance.

(10-01-2012 07:04 PM)Mr.Wynn Wrote:  

Yeah I heard tariq's podcast too. Cooperative women are hard as hell to find these days (especially young bitches due to today's Facebook, twitter, & all these other online sites which contain hundreds of Simp ass dudes telling them how "beautiful" they are constantly lettin even the fatties think they can get any dude they want) & this is comin from a good looking dude in his early 20s. Which is why I'm only willing to holla at bitches who are makin their interest in me known

[iknowexactly]

Most genetically good looking young women I see these days who are caucasian wear facial expressions much like guys. Sort of slightly suspicious and antagonistic, or smiling, but it's like a sneer.

That's why I say "genetically" good looking, because they aren't appealing anyway with that look on their face.

[theIVth]

I personally feel like when you submerge yourself in constant PUA related shit while frequently analyzing and over-analyzing women, it somewhat makes you jaded and alters your perception when it comes to women. Good cooperative women aren't that hard to find if your willing to just get out and holla at some. I wouldn't say that a girl being willing to cook and clean for you is abnormal these days. A lot of women will do that shit if they like you. A girl has to like you tho and feel like you like her back to do all of that. The same way we as guys want to put out minimal effort to get chicks that we're not just that crazy about, women feel the same way when their not that crazy about you or can sense that its just a casual sex type relationship that's going nowhere.

Not trying to totally defend them, but women will indeed be cooperative if they really like you. It's not rare and you don't have to be rich or look like a model to get a down ass chick.

[Mr.Wynn]

(10-01-2012 08:53 PM)Urban Renaissance Man Wrote:  

Dude, I can't recommend that! if what you say is true that women's few of their value is already distorted, you may only be dealing with 10 or 12 women a year who are willing to make I straight up come on to you. I'm sure you can imagine how many of those will be in the 7 to 10 Range!

I didn't want to mention the hosts name, because this is Roosh's bored and I felt it might be a little disrespectful to plug someone else on his board. But since it's out there, Tariq said something else. He said, "You've got to spit at A LOT of women come find the right one." That also ties in with much of what Roosh has had to say as well. Good game and numbers are the only weapons us non rich, non famous guys have to combat this shift in female cooperation. I just can't help but wonder if maybe people like Tariq, and many other guys on this board, are too extreme for the reality we live in. On the other hand, I've never, ever seen weakness work. At least not towards the happiness of the man.

To be sure, there are still good women out there. We all know someone who has one. There are also many more diamonds in the rough, who just need proper leadership and guidance from a strong man. The trick is locating a woman in these 2 categories before we're dead. Lol. Good game and numbers seems to be the only chance.

(10-01-2012 07:04 PM)Mr.Wynn Wrote:  

Yeah I heard tariq's podcast too. Cooperative women are hard as hell to find these days (especially young bitches due to today's Facebook, twitter, & all these other online sites which contain hundreds of Simp ass dudes telling them how "beautiful" they are constantly lettin even the fatties think they can get any dude they want) & this is comin from a good looking dude in his early 20s. Which is why I'm only willing to holla at bitches who are makin their interest in me known

I'm a start by saying I meant no disrespect to roosh by my previous post. i guess i only subconsciously realized it just might disrespectful at the time which is why i didn't mention the guy's whole name but i will say i think roosh's information is a lot more helpful & actually instructional to guys like us who are lookin to meet women on a consistent basis. Hence, me joining to this forum. I apologize to Roosh. but on the other hand when i said showin interest i meant at least makin eye contact not just throwin themselves at me. I kinda see your point but If a bitch doesn't even make eye contact I assume she's disinterested & wouldn't wanna put myself in a complete subservient position by trying "win her over" when she didn't even seem interested at first

[rationalize_this]

Interesting post indeed. And yes I do agree with the OP that uncooperative is the new "normal" or modus operandi of American girls today. This attitude only applies in my opinion to the 6s-7.5 range MAX. This does not come without exceptions however. In my experience though, the more attractive the girl, the less she is willing is to supplicate by doing household type things such as cook and clean. These girls KNOW they hold all the cards in the dating market, especially in the US where the majority of their competition is overweight and airheaded. Therefore, they are always scoping to upgrade. That's why you'll meet or see some of the fliest girls being wined and dined at wine bars/nice restaurants, shopping at high end boutiques, or on a boat at a yacht party docked three miles offshore. They don't need to worry about pleasing their men, because American culture has ingrained into most betas that MALES are the ones that need to be pleasing their women, and we're not talking about inside the bedroom.

Don't forget that most American women today have NO IDEA HOW TO COOK! Not only that, they'll say it proudly! I can't count how many times I've had a hot girl offer unsolicited "Omg, i'm so bad at cooking, like, I have no idea how to make pasta." My fucking god, how hard is it to boil water?

There is a caveat to this however. FIND THE FOREIGNERS! Not the eastern europeans either. These have the same looking to upgrade mindset. Find the South American, Central American, Pacific Islander, women. If you preselect and hook one of these, you better be careful because you'll end up 10lbs overweight with an apartment shinier than mr. clean's head.

I can totally relate to the OP's statement that maybe we are dealing with the bottom of the barrell. But this isn't an unfair judgment. These women are the epitome of what American women have already changed into. That's why its so refreshing and unheard of when you find yourself with an affectionate and feminine women. I have a brazilian and argentinian in rotation now that come over and bring me gifts/food/chocolate and are just so genuinly bubbly and happy to be around me that American girls literally give me a bad taste in my mouth. I won't interact with them unless they are unusually beautiful, or have something that I can benefit from by having them in my network.

In sum, get out of America. Or go to to the Deep South or MidWest U.S. where you find 21-23 year old girls that have had 1-2 sexual partners and are looking for soulmate/LTR like relationships. Otherwise, learn game, keep improving, and keep banging the uncooperative.

[beta_plus]

Botched a date with a relatively well off and cute Russian girl because of this. I simply could not believe that she was just being cooperative, I was so used to dealing with American, Canadian, British, and Danish women. I always though the stuff guys wrote on the forum about EE and FSU girls just worked on the margins. It feels like you're hanging out with a different species.

[Urban Renaissance Man]

Aside from the media driven shift in attitude of women, I'm finding more and more of them have emotional problems the exacerbate the situation. It seems there are as many women with anger management issues, as guys! Also, so many women have been molested until either a man hating lesbian or an angry slut are your only two options! Ok, I'm generalizing but you get the point. Again, Game and numbers is the key.

Here's a lesson... I just received an e-mail from an ex-girlfriend, demanding payment for my share of a loan we took out together while we were dating. (I know, bad move) Anyway, my payment was sent long ago. It seems my payment was applied to someone elses account with a similar name, and that caused all the drama. It has been handled and applied to our account, and the loan is not, nor never was in any danger of default. Here's the point... Though I have NEVER been late on a payment, or caused any issues with the loan, she still feels the need to send me an angry e-mail saying, " I got a notice in the mail! I don't have time for this crap! Handle your business! Get me some info that shows your payment has been made ASAP!" Never once asking if something was wrong, what might the problem be, or anything that one would ask before jumping to conclusions that I just simply stopped being who I am, and decided to default on a loan that I've been paying faithfully for 3 years! HOWEVER, I attribute her lack of respect and candor to the Beta way I which I ran my relationship when I was with her. I used to sometimes accept such tongue lashings. Or, when I was feeling 'Alpha', I used to argue back and forth, name calling, like a bitch, instead of just giving her a time out, or flat out kicking her to the curb after a few infractions. Now, even though I have totally changed the way in which I deal with her, (Which is rare, and only concerning the loan) and no longer accept such outburts, she still, 3 years later, feels she can talk to me like that. Now granted, some that is just her personality, angry and uncooperative, but the main reason is because I've already set a precedent. She feels she can do it because she always has. It's hard to change that impression once you make it fellas! Start out strong in the very beginning!! You can always go from lion to sheep, but it's hella hard to go from sheep to lion! Now I agree she should have an explanation or at least some assurance that the situation has been handled, but not by asking like that! I responded to her e-mail with a simple, "Lol." and left it at that. It took control to only send that because I'm in such a habit of either explaining myself, defending myself or avenging myself, that it was hard to simply rise above it! That's where we need to be, above it and above them!