[Prowl]

IMO this is bollocks.

Confidence is application specific. A Navy SEAL is going to be very confident clearing a room in Afghanistan, but probably not so confident when it comes to conducting a Japanese Tea Ceremony.

Confidence with girls is borne from success with girls, period. Naturals have confidence ergo they succeed. Structured pickup is "fake it till you make it", designed to manufacture just enough success vis-a-vis contrived devices to eventually get you said application-specific confidence.

Cliffs: Learning to make coq au vin will not get you over your AA. Get out of your house and talk to girls.

[Private Man]

(09-18-2012 03:59 PM)Prowl Wrote:  

IMO this is bollocks.

Confidence is application specific.

Cliffs: Learning to make coq au vin will not get you over your AA. Get out of your house and talk to girls.

Naturally, I disagree to a certain extent. Confidence, an almost zen-like quality, must cover the entire psyche.

Sure, talking to girls is all well and good... but without the confidence sub-routine, social skills, and at least some Charisma, the end result will be failure. When rejection exceeds the confidence sub-routine parameters, a man simply gives up.

The inner sense of coq au vin mastery goes a lot further than "fake it 'til you make it."

[WestIndianArchie]

(09-15-2012 05:44 PM)HoustonRookie Wrote:  

What do you guys think are other skills that may help to improve inner confidence??

Inner game is important. It's a borrowed concept from Tennis.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Inner_Game_of_Tennis

Came out in the 70's and has dominated a lot of business text books, athletic philosophy, and pop psychology.

Taking up a hobby that has a competitive element is a good way to build up that confidence and being ready for success. And this is America, we compete over everything.

That being said, being a master powerlifter or Halo player doesn't always translate to being supremely confident with bagging women.

WIA

[Walderschmidt]

(09-16-2012 06:22 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

Learn to go after what you want without apology. Speak your mind freely. Ignore social mores and do as your heart and your balls desire. If someone judges you for your hunger for conquest, write them off as pussies and avoid them. A little jovial chauvinism helps.

I find martial arts to have a steep learning curve, so it could be a while before you experience any confidence boost. I dropped it before it really did anything for me - boxing, for instance, is very rewarding I'm sure, but it's frustrating when you first start, especially if you're less athletic.

What would you say is the right amount of "jovial chauvinism"?

On the martial arts routine - I think one of the biggest confidence boosters is that getting your ass beat becomes nothing special after a while - just a part of life. Once you aren't afraid getting your ass kicked - the rest will follow.

Wald

[Glass Walker]

I have to agree on the Martial Arts front.

Many, if not all of the most calm, quietly confident people I know (men and women included), have been martial artists.

Learning to fight was especially useful for me in helping me drastically change both my self-conception and how others view me.

Story: most of my life I saw myself as a scrawny, nerdy, kid, scared of fighting and violence. I was that kid everyone picked on. Anyway, one day in my mid twenties I decided that I couldn't be a pussy all my life, and decided I need to know how to fight and took up some ass-beating martial arts.

The change took time, but was quite significant. Weight lifting helps some, but learning to stand toe-to-toe with guys 20-40 lbs heavier than you who's job is to beat your ass transmutes your being.

You learn to face fear, endure pain, channel aggression. You figure out that bruises don't matter, that joints heal, and even cracked ribs get better with time.

In short, I stopped feeling like a 'nerdy kid', and started feeling like a man.

What was most interesting is that other people noticed it as well - on a deep, subconscious level. No one picked on me or looked at me like I was a target. People walked out of my way on the street.

Now here's the thing - I'm not any kind of bad-ass. I'm 5'8, and I'm sure sure I wouldn't last long in a real war or even a really bad part of the city.

However, in polite civilization, learning to spar will make you more of a man than 95% of those around you, and they will look at you differently - even if they don't know why.

(09-20-2012 09:09 AM)Walderschmidt Wrote:  

(09-16-2012 06:22 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

Learn to go after what you want without apology. Speak your mind freely. Ignore social mores and do as your heart and your balls desire. If someone judges you for your hunger for conquest, write them off as pussies and avoid them. A little jovial chauvinism helps.

I find martial arts to have a steep learning curve, so it could be a while before you experience any confidence boost. I dropped it before it really did anything for me - boxing, for instance, is very rewarding I'm sure, but it's frustrating when you first start, especially if you're less athletic.

What would you say is the right amount of "jovial chauvinism"?

On the martial arts routine - I think one of the biggest confidence boosters is that getting your ass beat becomes nothing special after a while - just a part of life. Once you aren't afraid getting your ass kicked - the rest will follow.

Wald

[HoustonRookie]

(09-20-2012 11:05 AM)Glass Walker Wrote:  

I have to agree on the Martial Arts front.

Many, if not all of the most calm, quietly confident people I know (men and women included), have been martial artists.

Learning to fight was especially useful for me in helping me drastically change both my self-conception and how others view me.

Story: most of my life I saw myself as a scrawny, nerdy, kid, scared of fighting and violence. I was that kid everyone picked on. Anyway, one day in my mid twenties I decided that I couldn't be a pussy all my life, and decided I need to know how to fight and took up some ass-beating martial arts.

The change took time, but was quite significant. Weight lifting helps some, but learning to stand toe-to-toe with guys 20-40 lbs heavier than you who's job is to beat your ass transmutes your being.

You learn to face fear, endure pain, channel aggression. You figure out that bruises don't matter, that joints heal, and even cracked ribs get better with time.

In short, I stopped feeling like a 'nerdy kid', and started feeling like a man.

What was most interesting is that other people noticed it as well - on a deep, subconscious level. No one picked on me or looked at me like I was a target. People walked out of my way on the street.

Now here's the thing - I'm not any kind of bad-ass. I'm 5'8, and I'm sure sure I wouldn't last long in a real war or even a really bad part of the city.

However, in polite civilization, learning to spar will make you more of a man than 95% of those around you, and they will look at you differently - even if they don't know why.

(09-20-2012 09:09 AM)Walderschmidt Wrote:  

(09-16-2012 06:22 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

Learn to go after what you want without apology. Speak your mind freely. Ignore social mores and do as your heart and your balls desire. If someone judges you for your hunger for conquest, write them off as pussies and avoid them. A little jovial chauvinism helps.

I find martial arts to have a steep learning curve, so it could be a while before you experience any confidence boost. I dropped it before it really did anything for me - boxing, for instance, is very rewarding I'm sure, but it's frustrating when you first start, especially if you're less athletic.

What would you say is the right amount of "jovial chauvinism"?

On the martial arts routine - I think one of the biggest confidence boosters is that getting your ass beat becomes nothing special after a while - just a part of life. Once you aren't afraid getting your ass kicked - the rest will follow.

Wald

Which martial art did you train? Taking up a martial arts program is something I am very seriously considering doing. At this point, I am just trying to determine which one. I've looked at Jiu Jitsu, Kickboxing, and Muah Thai so far.

Some of the ones like Wing Chun look like they're great in theory but wouldn't be useful until I got really good at them, so I want to avoid those. I'm a skinny guy (160 pounds, 5'11) so I need to take into account that I'll run into a lot of guys bigger than me. Any suggestions?

[Glass Walker]

Houston:

The first thing to know about martial arts, is that even in a fair fight, weight and strength are unfortunately more important than skill. You will realize this very quickly when a 260lb guy picks you up and tosses you like you are a child. Don't look to the martial arts as a skill path to defeating larger and stronger opponents. You can get there, yes, but you have to get VERY VERY good, and that takes a long, long time.

The second, and even more important thing to understand is that most martial arts have very little to do with 'real' fighting. You can be a BJJ master, but if you take a guy down in the street, his friends will cave your skull in with their boots. You can master karate or kickboxing.. but what if the guy has a knife.. or a gun.. or a posse.

That being said, the real, no BS martial arts you mentioned above will help you defeat the most important and ever-present opponent you have - your own inner wuss.

Girls will sense this and will like you more for it.

Guys will sense it too, even the big ones that can easily kick your ass. Confidence goes a long way, and unless you are an idiot and make a point to start shit up with thugs, they will usually find someone who they feel is an easier target to mess with.

(for the record, I studied Karate and Jui-Jitsu, but also tried kickbox, muai thai, bjj, and some weapons arts)

[Hades]

There's a lot of ways to build up confidence, and to be honest nobody really knows all of them, but the best way to do it in my opinion is by learning to destroy your fears and hangups.

What I did was start talking to strangers. Every day I'd make up some bullshit about how I was lost, or looking for a pet store, or out of cigarettes, or late for something, and I'd ask somebody for directions to the nearest ATM, cigarette machine, nightclub you can find girls at, doesn't really matter where. I did this all the time, during the day, late at night, talking to homeless people, sober, drunk, and after a fashion I just lost my fear. Since I had already mastered a skill or two to my satisfaction, and I'm fairly well read, learning to be sociable and how to keep interactions moving is basically critical to all game.

Quote:

That being said, the real, no BS martial arts you mentioned above will help you defeat the most important and ever-present opponent you have - your own inner wuss.

You hit on an important point, Glasswalker. The Germans even have a word for this, the "innere Schweinhund", basically your inner bitch/pigdog. Yeah, you have to kill that before you can really learn defense.

There's a sort of fighting theory that I tend to use a lot in daily life. I haven't implemented it to the extent that the "Gray Man" has (my car is a piece of shit), but it's basically a set of rules that you follow to avoid getting your ass ganked in the street.
1. Draw no attention to yourself.
2. Radiate a quiet and assertive confidence.
3. Plan everything in advance.

Rule 3 has sub rules, like "drive a shitty car with a surprising amount of balls under the hood, just in case", and "pack some kind of heat but don't use it unless there's no other option; once the option presents itself, don't hesitate".

Note: this Grey Man thing is related.
http://www.examiner.com/article/the-grey...on?cid=rss

Quote:

Likewise, those that are prepared and protection experts will also take the grey man approach. The tacti-cool gear, bling, stickers, and attire will be dismissed in favor of less overt clothing and accessories. He is aware, but not outwardly so. He is an expert in personal protection, but does not show off his skills or become a known ‘karate guy’ or ‘gun guy’ in a public setting. The grey man does not want to be seen as a ‘challenge’, or singled out for his preparedness and potential gear.

[HoustonRookie]

(09-21-2012 10:03 PM)Glass Walker Wrote:  

Houston:

The first thing to know about martial arts, is that even in a fair fight, weight and strength are unfortunately more important than skill. You will realize this very quickly when a 260lb guy picks you up and tosses you like you are a child. Don't look to the martial arts as a skill path to defeating larger and stronger opponents. You can get there, yes, but you have to get VERY VERY good, and that takes a long, long time.

The second, and even more important thing to understand is that most martial arts have very little to do with 'real' fighting. You can be a BJJ master, but if you take a guy down in the street, his friends will cave your skull in with their boots. You can master karate or kickboxing.. but what if the guy has a knife.. or a gun.. or a posse.

That being said, the real, no BS martial arts you mentioned above will help you defeat the most important and ever-present opponent you have - your own inner wuss.

Girls will sense this and will like you more for it.

Guys will sense it too, even the big ones that can easily kick your ass. Confidence goes a long way, and unless you are an idiot and make a point to start shit up with thugs, they will usually find someone who they feel is an easier target to mess with.

(for the record, I studied Karate and Jui-Jitsu, but also tried kickbox, muai thai, bjj, and some weapons arts)

Good reply. Out of Muay Thai and Kickboxing, which did you prefer? What were the differences?

[Glass Walker]

In the grand scheme of things, they are pretty similar. Best thing to do is just try both out and see what you like best.

Also, the individual gym and instructor tend to matter more than the style.

Find a place that you enjoy training at - don't be afraid to try out a bunch of gyms and dojos.