Wow this thread just got deep. Thanks for your conclusions BAB. I am not sure I can put myself in the same bag since you pipeline and do not do night game. Most of my success comes from bars/clubs and about 20% from day time approaches. I am still assesing if to go to Kiev... Moscow is giving me a taste of what it is like to work for your dinner.
Is it not possible to meet normal/cool girls in Kiev? There is so much talk of throwing money around sometimes I think I am on the wrong forum
When I tried to get some knowledge on Moscow all people would say is you better have huge wads or your will struggle. Rubbish! Sure Moscow is expensive but I don't need 100 of euros a nights to attract women? I went to 3 clubs last night and got plenty drunk and only spent 40 euro : ) Buying Champaign for all my friends will not get me laid with the sort of girls I want to bed. However, one night stands I do not think are possible. I am pretty confident of that but this is usually the case with hot girls so I am prepared to put in the man hours.
This week has been a lot of walking but the best way to get the 8+'s is to street game. Actually most girls have a good level of English so it is not a bigger problem as I first anticipated.
I am still trying to find me feet as far as nightlife is concerned because there are so many options and Moscow being so huge logistics are complicated.
Being from London is a huge bonus. I feel like the only foreigner here... so far this has been my major asset which I least expected from a place like Moscow.
I have leads but no dates yet so I know I will have to extend my stay if I want any kind of success here. This is the big boys league and for sure Eastern Europe is much easier. Girls were falling on my lap in Vilnius and now I am grinding it out like a mo fo. However there is something hugely exhilarating about Moscow and have had a much better time here than in Eastern Europe. I am enjoying the challenge as I know the rewards will be far greater.
A cute geeky girl palmed me her number on an old receipt last night so i am confident I will at least get 1 bang! : )

Quote: (09-30-2012 04:12 AM)gadabout Wrote:  

However, one night stands I do not think are possible.

c'mon, this is a big limiting belief. Females in Moscow are not a homogenus species. Find the right girl at the right time and anything is possible there.

You are right about not needing big wads of cash in Moscow. Just being a foreigner there is DHV, because it is so fucking expensive. And yeah, some people say, oh, those Moscow girls only care about money. And of course it is a massive generalisation, and it does communicate something of the culture there - but there are a lot of very conscious people there whose first priority is NOT getting a black Mercedes S600 4matic.

There is more chance of getting SNL's in Moscow then any other city in the FSU.

Gadabout start a thread on moscow experiences please or your.value will be buried in this kiev thread.

Obviously I.concur gaming kiev and.moscow share many similarities.

You are right I do not know the culture well enough to assess if one night stands are possible here. If they do I need to find the right bar and will probably have to take a dip in quality. I will start a new Moscow thread where I will document my progress.

>If they do I need to find the right bar and will probably have to take a dip in quality.

again, another limiting belief! Quality is so high in Moscow you need not dip!

I may well be in Moscow in a few days and would appreciate your reports as there are few and far between reports about Moscow. Actually, I probably will not have much of a chance to get "out and about" as knowing people there and staying with friends can be limiting in a way - but on the other hand, I will not be there too long, so having such a social circle can work very well in this case.

excellent trip report, thanks. however, my curiosity for ukraine has somewhat faded when reading how hard it is. My eyes turn to Poland again. Good quality girls for a fair effort.

BigAlexBoss, I have to commend you on the other best thread on the Ukraine, I've ever read on here. Which girl did you bang? I missed that.

Keep up the good work. I spent 8 months total in Ukraine and it takes a ton of hard playing!

Quote: (10-01-2012 05:39 PM)michelin Wrote:  

excellent trip report, thanks. however, my curiosity for ukraine has somewhat faded when reading how hard it is. My eyes turn to Poland again. Good quality girls for a fair effort.

Yes Poland is better in many respects but don't think from reading the thread that the Ukraine is a game grave yard. Alex described the difficulties of gaming the top shelf women. However if you just want to bang 7's ( a local 7 is better then a UK/US one ) then you'll have little trouble in the Ukraine if you can invest a couple of weeks there. I think I can safely say we are all getting laid there,we're just not necessarily getting laid with the stunners the country is famed for. If you want to go somewhere and bang lots of women in a short period of time then avoid Ukraine. If however you want to go and have a mini relationship with a feminine woman for a month or two then you'll find that there without too much effort.

Thankyou to all for the compliments - I have to be honest that had I gone to Kiev with a good wing, you all would have received a one sentence trip report!

Going by myself meant RVF became my virtual wing

Ukraine is a country full of some of the most beautiful women on earth - it is in no way a game graveyard! I wanted to be realistic in this thread and not brag I had knocked over 5 9s in two weeks. 2 weeks, 1 bang it was.

The main limiting factor in Kiev game is time. You need 1 month minimum to access the 8s and 9s.

So far, I really like Kiev. I'll do a full writeup when I leave, but the girls here are very hot. With respect to girls:

- I've gotten a makeout/dick rub on a date 2 from a 7, who then promised me sex the next night, but she flaked. Hopefully it was a legit excuse and not an American flake which means I'll never see her again.
- A makeout from a club girl 7.5 maybe who didn't speak any english (her response to everything was "I don't understand"). She didn't even seen that into me, but I just kept going weekend in bernie's style and somehow we started making out. Then some turkish guy grabbed her and her friends and when I tried to intercept some guy came out of nowhere and grabbed me by my collar. So I stood down, not wanting to start any shit at a Ukranian club (plus I'm not a fighter anyway). Eventually found her later randomly on the streets and the turk was trying to get her to go in his car, and her friends took her away. Got her #, see what happens.
- An older girl (32 maybe) helped me get a sim card at the store, started chatting and then she asked to exchange info. She's a 6.5 at best.

I'm a night game guy so no day game yet, but I'd love to start accessing the 8s and 9s. I agree with what the recent posts said, I think in 2 weeks you could easily tap into the 7s. 8s and 9s seem more difficult, as repeatedly stated here.

I have described many times the conflicts with Turks in Kiev and how it is important to impose Balkan superiority on them.What club did you visit?Decadence,D"Lux or Carribean? The make out was from mamba contact?

Quote: (10-02-2012 11:42 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

I have described many times the conflicts with Turks in Kiev and how it is important to impose Balkan superiority on them.What club did you visit?Decadence,D"Lux or Carribean? The make out was from mamba contact?

The only thing a Turk will understand is a knuckle sandwich. They were acting the same here in my local town, thought they owned the place but the locals put them in their place. If that guy grabbed me by the collar, he would have got a full forced fist into the gob.

If they tried to dominate in Serbia they would face soon big disillusionment.One of my dreams is to visit Kiev club with one Serbian and one Bulgarian guy to double the pleasure if you get what I mean.

If they aren't careful, the f***** Turks are going to mess up everyone's fun in Ukraine.

Yes,I have met Turks in CR and Ukraine and they are quite annoying.Contrary to them Arabs are not aggressive at all meaning you can outgame the Arab and he will not say a word while the Turk will react.The Turk will use every weapon in his sleeve from threat to deception and they always think they are superior to Westerners and anyone else.

Quote: (10-02-2012 04:16 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

Yes,I have met Turks in CR and Ukraine and they are quite annoying.Contrary to them Arabs are not aggressive at all meaning you can outgame the Arab and he will not say a word while the Turk will react.The Turk will use every weapon in his sleeve from threat to deception and they always think they are superior to Westerners and anyone else.

Nail on the head Kamaki. Most Turkish guys I have met on my travels have been nothing but annoying along with downright arrogant, rude and sleazy. They have a bad rep in home town even though so few of them live here. They are the decent guys but they are few and far between. The Arab dudes I get on great with. Laid back, down to earth, and passive, not aggressive. There are a few Lebanese and Algerian cafes that I always eat in and have a blast and feel relaxed.

Quote: (10-02-2012 12:22 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

One of my dreams is to visit Kiev club with one Serbian and one Bulgarian guy to double the pleasure if you get what I mean.

Were I not a man with commitments, I'd be on the plane tomorrow, with Partizan and you, and show them hotties some Balkan power.
As it is, I'll just wait until they come here next summer, as this summer's crop has left the beach.

Quote: (10-02-2012 11:42 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

I have described many times the conflicts with Turks in Kiev and how it is important to impose Balkan superiority on them.What club did you visit?Decadence,D"Lux or Carribean? The make out was from mamba contact?

I'll do a full data sheet when I leave Kiev, but I'd like to keep it anonymous until I leave. The place I was at wasn't that big. Also, I went there again last night and not being as drunk, I realized I sat down at someone's paid table, so they had a reason to get me out. It may have been one of the worker's who grabbed me.

Anyway, I was able to bring a solid 8 back home with me, but could not escalate further than a makeout and some ass grabbing which was resisted. What's the secret here? In US a drunk girl coming back is like 80% bang, here nothing more than makeout. Do you just keep escalating? It was actually a big mess as she lost her friends and then came back then we went to look for her friends and then she eventually slept over. In the morning I couldn't stop staring at her face it was so nice as she was showing me youtube videos and dancing around the room. Also, she had lost her purse so she asked me for 2 grivna for the metro. I offered her 50 (that is like $8) since she had nothing on her and she refused the excess amount. Finally, and I feel bad about this, I went to the club with another girl from the online site and when I met this 8 I just left the online girl (a 7) alone and she went home.

I'll be honest, I really like Kiev. I haven't banged yet, but in a few short nights I am interacting with and making out with girls that are much higher quality than my norm. It has to be just supply and demand, there are so many good looking girls here it is mind-boggling. Just earlier my buddy and I were on Kreshatik and we just started laughing at how ridiculous it was the sheer number of hot girls walking around.

If anyone has any tips for increased escalation here, I'm all ears. It's probably been mentioned in this thread but it's quite large to go through (though I'll try).

How does Kiev compare to Poland in your opinion?I had advised roosh to hit Kiev or Lvov.He would get there better results than he did in Kharkov.Kiev is one of the cities you can get one night stands in Ukraine.

Don't feel bad Slubu:

"Anyway, I was able to bring a solid 8 back home with me, but could not escalate further than a makeout and some ass grabbing which was resisted. What's the secret here? In US a drunk girl coming back is like 80% bang, here nothing more than makeout. Do you just keep escalating? It was actually a big mess as she lost her friends and then came back then we went to look for her friends and then she eventually slept over. In the morning I couldn't stop staring at her face it was so nice as she was showing me youtube videos and dancing around the room. Also, she had lost her purse so she asked me for 2 grivna for the metro. I offered her 50 (that is like $8) since she had nothing on her and she refused the excess amount. Finally, and I feel bad about this, I went to the club with another girl from the online site and when I met this 8 I just left the online girl (a 7) alone and she went home. "

Exactly my experience - reread my case studies from the first post and you will see we are on the same page experience wise. These girls are rationing out kino and sex as if they have an internal inviolable timetable in their heads.

Quote: (10-03-2012 07:24 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

How does Kiev compare to Poland in your opinion?I had advised roosh to hit Kiev or Lvov.He would get there better results than he did in Kharkov.Kiev is one of the cities you can get one night stands in Ukraine.

Poland:
- Nicer, kinder, friendlier girls
- Bigger breasts
- Girls have better conversations
- More impressed with the fact I was from LA
- Less impressed with me in general (lots of polite rejections)
- Would be better girlfriends, had one apologize to me profusely when she couldn't meet me out one night
- Seem to get attached more (after one makeout jokingly said I shouldn't make out with any other girls)
- Girls do not cockblock, but Polish guys try to cockblock you

Kiev:
- Gorgeous city
- Girls party more and harder
- Worse conversations (very boring)
- Lots of silences in conversations
- Girls are wayyyy hotter (only Russia can compete)
- Girls like to drink a lot
- Girls like me more here for whatever reason (getting lots of eye contact)
- They seem flakier (friend had 2 dates cancel on him, the girl that rubbed my dick on D2 and promised sex flaked on me)
- More "jungle" atmosphere; people blatantly try to rip you off
- Girls do cockblock, but Ukranian guys do not try to


Of course this is only a few days into each city, but those are my general thoughts.

By the way, does anybody know what night is ladies night at Shooters? I've heard Sunday, Wednesday and Thursday. Maybe someone can translate this calendar for me?

http://shooters.kiev.ua/index.html?option...65&lang=ru

^ trick with Ukrainian girls to have a good conversation is to talk about stuff like russian books (tolstoy, dostoyevsky, ESPECIALLY BULGAKOV, etc) and culture. talk about the themes and characters in these books especially, how much you love bulgakov, etc... Ukrainian and Russian girls I find Live in Books. Bulgakov is probably #1. Also talk about how beautiful and melodic ukrainian language is (this is actually true though, for me anyway).

anotehr thing to talk about is difference between ukrainians and other peoples.

you see those statues all over Ukraine that you see lines of people pose with? those are characters from literature!

this concept does not exist in the US, but literature is really popular in the FSU.

thinking about all the posts ive read in here about FSU, it seems like the guys with the most success in eastern FSU are slavophils/russiophils who speak some russian and genuinely like FSU culture.

this is a huge time investment though, if your just in a for a few weeks and looking to get with lots of girls, i don't think Ukraine is the place to go.