Quote: (03-15-2017 10:53 AM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

Let's ignore "proof" for a minute...As my reasoning always defaults to "follow the money".

Assuming the Earth is in fact flat who benefits from the adumbration? And particularly...how?

you just have to look at Nasa and other space agencies' budgets. Wikipedia says Nasa receives 35% of total spending on academic scientific research in the US. Nasa's budget was 19.3 billions in 2016/

Space is a big business from the scientific community to hollywood movies and even aliens conspiracies. All profit.

a flat earth entails no space.

Mercenary, no pics to represent my statement that "The Earth can be, in theory, flat and spherical at once", especially as I've never heard anyone else say it. It's just something I've been thinking about.

Best I can come up with is an orange as an example. If you exist in a dimension as an orange peel, the inner flesh of the orange seems flat, as it's always pressed up against you at the same distance. It's not until you are peeled off the orange, so to speak, that you can see that the flesh is ball-shaped.

I admit that this "proves" nothing, but I throw it out there just as a reminder that having access to other dimensions can make the impossible possible.

-----

Another example of hyperdimensionality is seen in a normal everyday street parade. A parade watcher will see the parade pass as a series of floats and marchers who appear on the watcher's one side, pass immediately in front, then disappear on the other side. In this manner, the watcher experiences the parade one float at a time. However, a watcher given access to another dimension, for example someone viewing the parade from a helicopter, can see the entire parade and all its floats at once.

Papaya: who "benefits" from the Earth's being flat?

Only those who love the truth (if it's indeed true that the Earth is flat). To me, it's merely a red pill thing, a desire to unplug from the Matrix. If I've been lied to my whole life, I want to know. If instead the Earth is a ball, I want to be able to fully refute the Flat-Earthers.

Quote: (03-15-2017 01:02 PM)Hoser Wrote:  

Another example of hyperdimensionality is seen in a normal everyday street parade. A parade watcher will see the parade pass as a series of floats and marchers who appear on the watcher's one side, pass immediately in front, then disappear on the other side. In this manner, the watcher experiences the parade one float at a time. However, a watcher given access to another dimension, for example someone viewing the parade from a helicopter, can see the entire parade and all its floats at once.

All true, but given earnest FE theory relies on the Earth being literally flat, it's actually an argument against it. Or at least it would simultaneously support a Spherical Earth theory. Still a very good thought experiment.

The argument "The Earth is flat* (*when viewed from a non-standard frame of reference/using a unique definition of "flat")" is sophistry when relied on without being explicit about the caveat.

Quote: (03-15-2017 01:18 PM)Hoser Wrote:  

Papaya: who "benefits" from the Earth's being flat?

Only those who love the truth (if it's indeed true that the Earth is flat). To me, it's merely a red pill thing, a desire to unplug from the Matrix. If I've been lied to my whole life, I want to know. If instead the Earth is a ball, I want to be able to fully refute the Flat-Earthers.

Thats what I asked.

I believe to somewhat Illuminati and all that, they want to keep wealth to that %1 or even %0.1 and there's sense to it.

But lets say, if they had been lying to us all along about world is being round, why do they achieve by that? So what, if we know world is flat? What do they gain by lying to us about world's shape?

Quote: (03-15-2017 11:57 AM)syrianguy Wrote:  

Quote: (03-15-2017 10:53 AM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

Let's ignore "proof" for a minute...As my reasoning always defaults to "follow the money".

Assuming the Earth is in fact flat who benefits from the adumbration? And particularly...how?

you just have to look at Nasa and other space agencies' budgets. Wikipedia says Nasa receives 35% of total spending on academic scientific research in the US. Nasa's budget was 19.3 billions in 2016/

Space is a big business from the scientific community to hollywood movies and even aliens conspiracies. All profit.

a flat earth entails no space.

$19 billion to a US based entity does not drive a global, historic cover up of this scale...That's chump change

Quote: (03-15-2017 02:28 PM)Rossi Wrote:  

Quote: (03-15-2017 01:18 PM)Hoser Wrote:  

Papaya: who "benefits" from the Earth's being flat?

Only those who love the truth (if it's indeed true that the Earth is flat). To me, it's merely a red pill thing, a desire to unplug from the Matrix. If I've been lied to my whole life, I want to know. If instead the Earth is a ball, I want to be able to fully refute the Flat-Earthers.

Thats what I asked.

I believe to somewhat Illuminati and all that, they want to keep wealth to that %1 or even %0.1 and there's sense to it.

But lets say, if they had been lying to us all along about world is being round, why do they achieve by that? So what, if we know world is flat? What do they gain by lying to us about world's shape?

Exactly....Find the "why" and the rest of it would follow

These debates can be interesting exercises but ultimately, they inevitably end up being philosophical discussions Our realities/truths are what we choose them to be albeit for most people, subconsciously

Quote: (03-15-2017 02:28 PM)Rossi Wrote:  

I believe to somewhat Illuminati and all that, they want to keep wealth to that %1 or even %0.1 and there's sense to it.

But lets say, if they had been lying to us all along about world is being round, why do they achieve by that? So what, if we know world is flat? What do they gain by lying to us about world's shape?

It's gatekeeping 101.

People like Dubay or other professional flat earthers will drop a few truth bombs to build trust and lure their low-intelligence followers into a dead end. Those followers end up being useful idiots who destroy the conspiracy brand among the general public, making that public easier to control.

You control the population through self-censorship, by raising the stigma against outliers. If you doubt the official version, then you must be an idiot who believes in shape-shifting reptilians. Or believes that the earth is flat. Because flat earth is literally the most retarded scientific theory ever devised. It's a very potent poison pill, so it's no surprise that it's being actively spread.

The goal is also to weaken the skeptics' ranks by spreading dissonance, strife and division among them. It's a demoralizing cognitive infiltration operation, and it's a fairly effective one at that, given that this thread has already gone 7 pages deep and counting.

Quote: (03-15-2017 02:48 PM)911 Wrote:  

Quote: (03-15-2017 02:28 PM)Rossi Wrote:  

I believe to somewhat Illuminati and all that, they want to keep wealth to that %1 or even %0.1 and there's sense to it.

But lets say, if they had been lying to us all along about world is being round, why do they achieve by that? So what, if we know world is flat? What do they gain by lying to us about world's shape?

It's gatekeeping 101.

People like Dubay or other professional flat earthers will drop a few truth bombs to build trust and lure their low-intelligence followers into a dead end. Those followers end up being useful idiots who destroy the conspiracy brand among the general public, making that public easier to control.

You control the population through self-censorship, by raising the stigma against outliers. If you doubt the official version, then you must be an idiot who believes in shape-shifting reptilians. Or believes that the earth is flat. Because flat earth is literally the most retarded scientific theory ever devised. It's a very potent poison pill, so it's no surprise that it's being actively spread.

The goal is also to weaken the skeptics' ranks by spreading dissonance, strife and division among them. It's a demoralizing cognitive infiltration operation, and it's a fairly effective one at that, given that this thread has already gone 7 pages deep and counting.

No...I'm asking if the world were actually "flat" then who's the beneficiary / sponsor of the overwhelmingly accepted "world is spherical false narrative"?

You want to know the "truth"; you follow the money. If there's no money to follow then the rest of the discussion is non-sequitur

Quote: (03-15-2017 04:46 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

No...I'm asking if the world is actually "flat" then who's the beneficiary / sponsor of the overwhelmingly accepted "world is spherical false narrative"?

You want to know the "truth"; you follow the money. If there's no money to follow then the rest of the discussion is non-sequitur

By hiding all indications to a God and/or creator, religion and faith you can slowly make people be as materialistic and selfish as possible. The profit is endless when people do not any sort of faith to guide their motivations and decisions especially in regard to making and spending money and do not have any spiritual meaning to their lives. Instead of being devinely created we are just all one big accident that is not important in such an endless empty universe. If people suddenly all realised we have only one world with no outer space and no other planets and are probably all being watched every second from above the entire psychology of the world population would change overnight.

Therein lies the profit motive.

Quote: (03-15-2017 04:57 PM)Mercenary Wrote:  

Quote: (03-15-2017 04:46 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

No...I'm asking if the world is actually "flat" then who's the beneficiary / sponsor of the overwhelmingly accepted "world is spherical false narrative"?

You want to know the "truth"; you follow the money. If there's no money to follow then the rest of the discussion is non-sequitur

By hiding all indications to a God and/or creator, religion and faith you can slowly make people be as materialistic and selfish as possible. The profit is endless when people do not any sort of faith to guide their motivations and decisions especially in regard to making and spending money and do not have any spiritual meaning to their lives. Instead of being devinely created we are just all one big accident that is not important in such an endless empty universe. If people suddenly all realised we have only one world with no outer space and no other planets and are probably all being watched every second from above the entire psychology of the world population would change overnight.

Therein lies the profit motive.

How would selling a spherical world as the truth make that objective any easier? I'd argue that it'd be an order of magnitude easier to spin the actual flat Earth as cosmic accident rather than divinely created than the massively elaborate cover up.

Quote: (03-15-2017 05:07 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

How would selling a spherical world as the truth make that objective any easier? I'd argue that it'd be an order of magnitude easier to spin the actual flat Earth as cosmic accident rather than divinely than created than the massively elaborate cover up.

Most major world religions and old mythologies talk about a flat earth...to discredit them you have to "prove" to people that all the old beliefs are all wrong....otherwise you are proving they are right.

But, if you know a way to sell a flat earth with a firmament dome as an accident and make people less religious, and more materialistic and selfish then please share your theory. All ideas are welcome.

Quote: (03-15-2017 05:14 PM)Mercenary Wrote:  

Quote: (03-15-2017 05:07 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

How would selling a spherical world as the truth make that objective any easier? I'd argue that it'd be an order of magnitude easier to spin the actual flat Earth as cosmic accident rather than divinely than created than the massively elaborate cover up.

Most major world religions and old mythologies talk about a flat earth...to discredit them you have to "prove" to people that all the old beliefs are all wrong....otherwise you are proving they are right.

But, if you know a way to sell a flat earth with a firmament dome as an accident and make people less religious, and more materialistic and selfish then please share your theory. All ideas are welcome.

If I knew the answer you'd never hear from me again. I'd be off spending my Illuminati money and ball deep in global elite chix.

If Satan is real and he has power to influence men on a large scale, he would benefit from the ball earth / large universe / other populated planets worldview which, as Mercenary explains, takes people's attention from God.

On the other hand, the Devil also benefits by stirring up the Flat-Earthers regardless of Earth's shape, as (1) it distracts from spiritual issues that are more important, (2) it makes many people of faith seem less reasonable, and (3) it sows discord among brethren.

BTW, I think the ball earth model is 99% certain to be true, and having a system of celestial bodies floating around the universe makes tons of other things make sense, more than the FE model can.

For instance: did Mars formerly pass near the earth every couple of years before there was one super-close pass-by about 2800 years ago that altered the orbits of both Mars and Earth? There are heaps of reasons why this likely happened, but I don't think The FE model could allow this.

Quote: (03-15-2017 04:57 PM)Mercenary Wrote:  

Quote: (03-15-2017 04:46 PM)PapayaTapper Wrote:  

No...I'm asking if the world is actually "flat" then who's the beneficiary / sponsor of the overwhelmingly accepted "world is spherical false narrative"?

You want to know the "truth"; you follow the money. If there's no money to follow then the rest of the discussion is non-sequitur

By hiding all indications to a God and/or creator, religion and faith you can slowly make people be as materialistic and selfish as possible. The profit is endless when people do not any sort of faith to guide their motivations and decisions especially in regard to making and spending money and do not have any spiritual meaning to their lives. Instead of being devinely created we are just all one big accident that is not important in such an endless empty universe. If people suddenly all realised we have only one world with no outer space and no other planets and are probably all being watched every second from above the entire psychology of the world population would change overnight.

Therein lies the profit motive.

A non-Earth centric universe is not in conflict with Christian theology. Both Copernicus and Kepler, the fathers of modern western astronomy, were devout Christians whose work was theologically motivated.

In fact flat earth is being used to portray Christianity as a backwards, anti-science belief system. Those kinds of cliches, along with the narrative of Earth being 6,000 year old earth, have been successfully used by people like Dawkins and Maher to promote atheism and discredit religions.

Earth/universe age: that's another issue in which both sides can be right at the same time. If time has been slowing down, the universe can have experienced 14 billion "years" worth of history in only, say, 6,000 to 10,000 modern years' worth of time.

The speed of light has been demonstrated to be slowing; why couldn't time and energy also be waning in pace?

It may be hard to believe, but there are still plenty of flat earthers all over the globe.

Quote: (03-15-2017 06:08 PM)Hoser Wrote:  

The speed of light has been demonstrated to be slowing; why couldn't time and energy also be waning in pace?

Interesting...citation?

Time to take a look at Eric Dubay's book. Apparently it's from 2014 and it would be interesting to see if that period of time correlates with a planned government-led misdirection of the online skeptic community.

I'm kind of torn between wanted to believe the earth to be flat but knowing it's probably a globe.

A flat earth makes it far more believable that god exists as he can see all of us by looking down on a flat earth. Whereas he won't be able to see us all, and keep us safe with a global earth. A flat earth also makes heaven and hell more believable too.

I can't think what really is to gain for (((globalists))) by pushing a global earth mindset other than what's already been said elsewhere in the thread. If the earth is a globe and there really billions of other planets out there then we are extremely insignificant in this world so our own actions are almost meaningless. So the (((globalists))) can push materialism and keep a disproportionate amount of wealth for themselves.

We already know that gravity doesn't exist. I can prove that by having two exact same balloons. A 10gram balloon filled with oxygen will fall to the ground whereas and 10gram filled with helium will rise. Helium doesn't have a negative weight. It weighs the same as oxygen. Only difference is the amount of energy running through the gas. So the higher amount of energy running through something the higher it gets. Not a lack of gravity. A airplane that's not got its engine running has zero energy running through but one with engines running and travelling at 350mph has a shit ton of energy running through it, hence why it stays in the sky.

Also another points why do magnets in a compass always point dead straight. If the earth was a curve would it not move in a different direction?

Quote: (03-16-2017 04:12 PM)Ethan Hunt Wrote:  

A flat earth makes it far more believable that god exists as he can see all of us by looking down on a flat earth. Whereas he won't be able to see us all, and keep us safe with a global earth. A flat earth also makes heaven and hell more believable too.

God or whatever Creator being would reside in another dimension, where Earth is in 3D. Its obvious that this being has perception of us but not vice versa.
Also isn't it obvious that Heaven is not literally heaven?

Quote: (03-16-2017 04:12 PM)Ethan Hunt Wrote:  

I'm kind of torn between wanted to believe the earth to be flat but knowing it's probably a globe.

A flat earth makes it far more believable that god exists as he can see all of us by looking down on a flat earth. Whereas he won't be able to see us all, and keep us safe with a global earth. A flat earth also makes heaven and hell more believable too.

This is a huge misconception flat Earthers subscribe to.

A round Earth with wast universe would suggest a much more powerful and infinite God.

A flat earth suggests a much smaller world and a small god who can't handle a world bigger then his shoe box.

It's because of the narrowness of their own minds that flat earthers subscribe to a small and flat world because they can imagine a small god overseeing a small world like that, but a God who oversees the infinite Galaxies is too much for their imagination.

They are not the only ones small minded trough - atheists who somehow conclude that round earth and universe having no center (aside from possible point of big bang) means there can be no God are also narrowly minded.

I personally believe in even more then a wast universe made of round stars and planets - I believe there are infinite multiverses like this that exist for billions of billions of years but are but fleeting dreams to the God.

I believe that such a model offers much more perspective and fun via eternal spiritual and scientific adventure for humanity then a stupid and narrow firmament enclosed disc.

I find infinity beautiful.