The first time I was in EE was in 2001, but I also know guys that started living in CZ, Russian and Poland long before that and we've discussed the topic at length. I consider this post and its assumptions a bit off base, so here is some reality.
Since your name is kraal... and that means king... in Czech or Slovak, so can I assume that you come from one of those countries?
Quote: (08-29-2015 06:01 AM)kral_belial Wrote:
I think Roosh had an interesting post somewhere (ROK?) a while back about how Western guys are no longer treated like Rockstars in EE. So in other words, western men in some EE countries are no longer that exotic and thus not interesting to the local women.
Probably more accurately, the gap between western men in EE countries and the local natives is no longer as big. That covers the areas of money and social evolution, but the EE countries have caught up more in terms of money than otherwise.
Quote: (08-29-2015 06:01 AM)kral_belial Wrote:
Now, I am not "western" since I am local to eastern europe, but I am trying to make sense of the whole nationalities thing - that is to see what countries will work good for me. The thing is that, me going to Western europe/America will be a bad choice for obvious reasons, hence EE is the best place for guys from any country, doesn't matter if you're local or not.
I don't know what the obvious reasons are. If the EE guy is a high level professional, he will be better off in the Western country. Without any in-demand skill, he would have to start at the bottom, which most EE girls are more willing to do than EE guys, IMHO. So your assumption seems to be that without money you are better off in EE. Maybe, maybe not, as other guys pointed out, you have to make your own magic. For many girls it's not about money. It's about the inner self.
Quote: (08-29-2015 06:01 AM)kral_belial Wrote:
Here is how I'm seeing the change since the fall of communism (for Western white guys):
1990s: Good countries if you're white western guy: Poland, Hungary, CZ.
2000s: Poland already no longer the best choice, good choices: Russia, Ukraine
2012/13+: Belarus? Serbia, Moldova, Bulgaria, Romania
In the 1990s it was pretty easy for any Westerner to meet girls who wanted to get out of the country and as I heard it a lot did. But when some got to the USA and discovered that they had to work harder to maintain the same lifestyle they had back home, a lot of them really wanted to go back home. So by the 2000s the EE girls were wise to the game and cast a tighter net and looked for a good provider. But they still weren't sharp enough to catch a honey-tongued seducer, so it was still not so hard.
The big change was after 2004 when a lot of the EE countries joined the EU. At that point girls didn't need the guy for the ticket out, they could just leave.
So over the next few years, a few at first and many later, the big capital cities, Warsaw, Krakow, Prague, that were previously the magnet for the adventure seeking girls from all over EE, emptied out of those girls as they moved on to London, Paris, Milan, etc. A couple of guys I know in these countries all pointed to this event as the major turning point and end of easy game. Similar for Ukraine pre and post the Orange revolution (after that Westerners could come without a visa, so there were a lot more)
From around 2010, with the influx of western companies that brought higher wages, the local EE guys started to be more competitive and have higher self esteem. Then local girls who were comfortable at home and maybe not so good at foreign languages, but still were interested in the financial aspect, were more interested in choosing them as they thought the best way to compete with the foreigners was to spend lots of money. But with more money in their pockets the local guys in the countries like PL, CZ, HU became more confrontational and a bit less welcoming to foreigners. This is especially true in CZ where lately they have had anti-immigration protests similar to the extreme right protests in Germany, except in CZ it is more of a mainstream movement. When their main reasons for not wanting the foreigners revolve around their behavior towards women (e.g. Muslims treat women bad, black guys are horny), it's suspicious as to what their true motives are. The flip side of that is that a lot of the large number of girls who have lived overseas, and are back home, are just trying to figure out a way to go back. They understand western culture and are really open to meeting foreign guys.
Quote: (08-29-2015 06:01 AM)kral_belial Wrote:
It seems, for example as Hungary and the likes are overrun by British stag parties and many other western men then "central europe" these days will work best if you're Western black or western asian...or eastern euro guy from another country.
Russia could still be good choice if you're white western or serbian/bulgarian but can't say, last time I was there was in 2008 so not much recent data.
I think you over emphasize the racial factor in the same way you appear to over emphasize the monetary aspect. Black and Asian guys have their fan clubs. The major detractor for them is that some EE guys think, as you mention, that they are big competition and try to bitch shame girls who go out with them. In reality, their major advantage may be that the girl who is looking for a foreigner may spot them more easily.
I would sum it up by saying, it's not as easy as it was 20 years ago, but there are still lots of opportunities for any guy that has his act together and can show that he has a little bit extra to offer (not only money, just social skills, insight, etc). Countries like belarus, romania, moldava are only more interesting in that they have less tourists so there is less competition for the girls who are looking for a foreigner, but as pointed out above if you have game you can go after all girls and then you don't need to worry so much about the competition.
A bigger factor may be online game. This one has been pointed out a lot elsewhere on this forum. But if you just go online to a website where girls are looking for foreigners (and you are foreign) then it's not too hard in any of these countries. In 1990 girls who wanted to hook up had to go out to do it. In 2015 they have tinder, and a dozen other ways to do it.