[CtrlAltElite]

Let me begin by stating that I have read a lot of game, especially from this site and Roissy's. I am aware or at least know of game and its workings in theory. But it is just that, theory. I have almost no application of game in my life, save for body language/posture adjustments (like having a wide stance, holding drinks by the waist, speaking slowly, etc).

It stays theory for me because I have a problem with approaching girls. A girl can give me IOI's, but I STILL won't approach. I often psyche myself out, my head plays through thousands of scenarios in which I fail or get rejected horribly. I've never had self-confidence growing up, which I'd like to attribute the problem to.

When a girl does talk to me, or approach me first, even the game that I have "learned" disappears from my brain. Thus, I make mistakes, messing up in the process. It is only after the conversation that I am able to remember how I messed up (shit tests, etc). Quite frankly, the only rule I haven't broken yet is the fact to never buy her a drink.

I come here after a NYE party in which I attended. A few girls gave me smiles and IOI's, but I didn't approach. Even a guy noticed, and he tried to convince me to approach, but I still didn't. In the back of my head, I know that I will probably never see these girls again, but that wasn't the main thought when I stood there, utterly psyched out.

For the record, I have only been 21 for less than 2 months. I also look young, as one of the bouncers thought my ID was a fake as well.

[Screwston]

Hi newbie. I'm 24 and look like I'm about 19 so don't use that as an excuse around here. I would just smile and say "hey what's up?" and then go from there based on her response. You should get Roosh's Day Bang book.

[CtrlAltElite]

(01-01-2012 10:22 PM)houston Wrote:  

Hi newbie. I'm 24 and look like I'm about 19 so don't use that as an excuse around here. I would just smile and say "hey what's up?" and then go from there based on her response. You should get Roosh's Day Bang book.

Not an excuse, man. I find it as a blessing, actually. I don't have Day Bang, but I do have Bang.

At this point, is my only viable option to start approaching anyway, at least until the AA wears off?

[Screwston]

Yes, it is a blessing to look young. I used to hate it until some guys on here started talking about the benefits

Yeah, just start talking to girls and see what works for you. Everyone has their own game and tricks. You'll find out what works for you if you approach over and over and over.

[YoungGunner]

3 things you have to keep in mind.

1. Only way to get consistently laid is to approach, plain and simp. If you don't approach you'll not only not get laid now, but you also you won't improve your game and won't correct your game mistakes so you're technically shooting yourself in the foot for the future. You have to embrace the rejection and you have to make mistakes and learn from them. The more you approach, the more quickly you'll identify eliminate those mistakes (and bang girls on the way) and the more quickly you'll develop better game, which will let you get more girls/better quality girls in the future. If you spend time reading game books/material, you learn how to get girls in the future at the expense of having sex with girls right now, and you'll still have to overcome you're A.A in the future. If you approach now, you get to have sex with girls right now and from that experience learn how to snag more/better girls in the future. Even if you're not confident in your game, by statistical laws if you approach enough you'll get laid. Read Roosh's post on "Sex is Mathematics"

2. So what if the girl rejects you? Her loss, her lack of judgement, she missed out on a fun night and great sex. You learn from your mistake, you hone your game, and you approach another girl.

3. Stop giving a shit about if other people see you fail/get rejected. Imagine they already hate you, that they're unhappy and want you to be unhappy and not getting ass, and that this approach is like saying "I don't give a fuck if you like me I'm getting my dick wet" to them.

[WesternCancer]

(01-01-2012 10:19 PM)CtrlAltElite Wrote:  

I come here after a NYE party in which I attended. A few girls gave me smiles and IOI's, but I didn't approach. Even a guy noticed, and he tried to convince me to approach, but I still didn't. In the back of my head, I know that I will probably never see these girls again, but that wasn't the main thought when I stood there, utterly psyched out.

You answered your own question there. Remind yourself that the current time is the only opportunity you'll ever have to talk to her, you will never see her again so why not see what can happen.

[kimleebj]

I think this extreme approach anxiety is a problem that should be addressed quickly and easily. Find a populated area one hour away. Resolve to talk to at least ten women. Tell them you are a tourist or student doing a study, whatever. The first one can be a store clerk. Others can be grandmothers. It doesn't matter. Eventually you should have the balls to say "Hi, I'm Manny the Martian, what's your favorite flavor bowling ball." Maybe it will suck. But look on the bright side - after ten approaches you can go home. You drove a whole hour and don't want to return, so get it over with.

Once your approach anxiety is under control, you can gradually work on other skills. But this problem is crippling your whole social life, and is easy to fix. I think this will be a valuable exercise. Please report back.

[Iceinthewater]

Trying to tell yourself things won't work because your FEELING of anxiety will still be there. You need to take action in a way that over time alleviates your fear.

It may sound totally crazy but I made a HUGE leap in getting over my fear by actually telling girls "I never do this, I'm so nervous I don't even know what to say - I just think you're beautiful."

I'd say this, and girls would smile really big and be super nice after that.

Now I'm not saying this is the best way to open, but it's a good way to get started because it SHOWS YOU that women aren't scary, even when you are being vulnerable. Once you realize that women like to be approached and that you don't need to be Superman to pull a chick, your fear will go away.

So try the super honest vulnerable approach and see for yourself that women aren't scary. Once your perception changes, then you will start to be more aggressive and confident.

If you still can't get yourself to walk up and say that, then another idea is to go out with a buddy and give him a hundred dollar bill. tell him he can only give it back to you if you approach x-amount of girls.

[CtrlAltElite]

(01-03-2012 10:46 PM)WesternCancer Wrote:  

You answered your own question there. Remind yourself that the current time is the only opportunity you'll ever have to talk to her, you will never see her again so why not see what can happen.

The problem is that I STILL don't approach, despite knowing these things.

I have a chance at going to a club later tonight. Unfortunately, the crowd will be older (think 25+).

[Iceinthewater]

(01-06-2012 05:04 PM)CtrlAltElite Wrote:  

(01-03-2012 10:46 PM)WesternCancer Wrote:  

You answered your own question there. Remind yourself that the current time is the only opportunity you'll ever have to talk to her, you will never see her again so why not see what can happen.

The problem is that I STILL don't approach, despite knowing these things.

I have a chance at going to a club later tonight. Unfortunately, the crowd will be older (think 25+).

Guys your age and younger stormed the beaches of Normandy knowing that at least 1 out of every 2 of them would die.

It's a choice ultimately.

[dice3510]

First, you might want to try hypnosis. You can find some for free on the internet (google Wendy Friesen Ultimate Confidence). It can help you achieve greater confidence. There are even some specifically designed to give you greater confidence approaching women. I have not tried this myself yet, but I've heard positive reviews from people I consider reliable.

Second, let go of the outcome. Trying to get yourself in the mindset that being rejected by stranger girls is as significant as losing in a video game. It is, but getting to that mindset is not easy. Write it down on paper, in your own words, and read it before you sleep, dozens of times, for a week or so. To drill it into your subconsciousness.

And, as Roosh suggests, for the first several dozen approaches, imagine a negative scenario, and approach. Imagine that a girl already thinks you're a worthless loser. Strongly enter that mindset. Play out the worst possible scenario in your head dozens of times, feel yourself present there, play out the worst possible emotions in your head. And then approach expecting the worst. It will almost never happen, but you will be prepared.

Do all this, and your AA should at the very least, lower significantly.

[MMM]

As Iceinthwater said, one way to get over this is tell girls that you're a little nervous approaching her. From the chick's point of view, this is a turn on, since she thinks "wow, I am such a special little snowflake that has this effect on men." If she is into you, she'll help you along. If not, she'll be inclined to let you down easy, out of the largess of her specialness. Hell, sometimes I'll feign nervousness when approaching a chick so I don't come across as a smooth player, which may trigger the bitch shield coming up. Now go forth and slay!

[dice3510]

(01-08-2012 09:52 AM)MMM Wrote:  

From the chick's point of view, this is a turn on, since she thinks "wow, I am such a special little snowflake that has this effect on men."

What? Not putting women on pedestals is one of the core game maxims. She might be nice out of empathy and pity, but she will not feel attracted to you if you admit that you are nervous... unless you have some redeeming quality like very good looks (which have to be at least equal to hers if you want to get away with textbook beta attitude)

[misterstir]

Stop making excuses. The way I View it to get beyond approach anxiety is this way.
-If you do not approach it is an automatic failure. You can never win if you do not put your skate on the ice and attempt to play.
-A rejection is neutral. Your not a reject, your learning. A girl cannot reject you, she doesn't know you. she can only reject your approach and if she does she is a cunt.
-Fucking is like winning. You cannot win if you do not approach and not approach always leads to jerking off.
-The more you approach the less AA you will have until you start doing it and not even think about AA.
-The worst thing that will happen is nothing. I've never been told to fuck off or even get lost, or been hit with a bottle, I never been beaten up by an angry jealous ex boyfriend hiding in the corner. There is nothing bad that can really happen, the worst thing that is possible is she stops responding to you, turns around or walks away. And if that happens you'll have a funny story to tell your male friends.

[CtrlAltElite]

Thanks for all your advice and help guys. I will report back when I have made at least some progress.

[MMM]

(01-08-2012 01:07 PM)dice3510 Wrote:  

(01-08-2012 09:52 AM)MMM Wrote:  

From the chick's point of view, this is a turn on, since she thinks "wow, I am such a special little snowflake that has this effect on men."

What? Not putting women on pedestals is one of the core game maxims. She might be nice out of empathy and pity, but she will not feel attracted to you if you admit that you are nervous... unless you have some redeeming quality like very good looks (which have to be at least equal to hers if you want to get away with textbook beta attitude)

What I'm trying to explain is what may be going through her mind. Once you've made the approach, it's your job to knock her off that pedestal.

[Amour Fou]

(01-08-2012 01:07 PM)dice3510 Wrote:  

(01-08-2012 09:52 AM)MMM Wrote:  

From the chick's point of view, this is a turn on, since she thinks "wow, I am such a special little snowflake that has this effect on men."

What? Not putting women on pedestals is one of the core game maxims. She might be nice out of empathy and pity, but she will not feel attracted to you if you admit that you are nervous... unless you have some redeeming quality like very good looks (which have to be at least equal to hers if you want to get away with textbook beta attitude)

I can totally see how an open, vulnerable and honest attitude like that can dissolve a girl's bitch shield, forcing her to connect with something more "down to earth" and human in her. Not every slut out there is a feral beast.

Don't be dogmatic, there are many ways to play the game, and being able to show some vulnerability can be a good component of your arsenal. Instead of spitting game dogma, go out and try it.

[Amour Fou]

(01-08-2012 03:37 PM)CtrlAltElite Wrote:  

Thanks for all your advice and help guys. I will report back when I have made at least some progress.

I remember myself as a late teen having so bad social anexiety that I could barely stay inside a club full of people for too long before I freaked out and left.

It might take time, but you will get over it, if that is your honest desire.

If things STILL feel too extreme for you, try a simpler approach. Go to a club, by yourself, go inside on a moment that it is full, see a girl you find cute, poke her gently, just say "hi!" and leave the place. That was your work for the day.

And every time you go out, you push a little further, untill you either can do this to many girls on a single night (increasing gradually in numbers of approach) or mantain a full conversation (increasing gradually in minutes of conversation). Ideally both.

[dice3510]

Some vulnerability is not the same as, as he said, making her feel as though she is a "special snowflake".

[Iceinthewater]

(01-08-2012 09:52 AM)MMM Wrote:  

Hell, sometimes I'll feign nervousness when approaching a chick so I don't come across as a smooth player, which may trigger the bitch shield coming up. Now go forth and slay!

I do this too, almost every time now. I don't believe in maxims they only limit your creativity.

Also, if you're the guy making her feel special, FROM POWER, her value comes from YOU. In other words, you become the source of her good feelings, which means you can take those feelings away if she acts up.

Being good with women means being good at making them feel special without supplicating IMO.

[CtrlAltElite]

Reporting back in.

I decided the club scene was not a good scene for a guy like me right now. I went with a simpler approach. I approached a cute blonde girl in my chemistry lab, we talked a bit. I found myself making some mistakes in hindsight, like speaking a bit too fast/being too interested at times. I had to continually remind myself to speak slower.

When we talked about some other crap, like her being in beauty school and her seeing a guy get a Brazilian. It was then she admitted openly that she likes to get them as well (WTF?), essentially revealing to me, a near-stranger her pubic situation. I made a joke of it, saying if she tells everyone about her situation including strangers. "I don't really mind/care." was her response. I'm probably overthinking this, but does that even mean anything?

Anyways, how should I proceed? I am fine with being friendzoned, after all, I am still learning. Keep in mind, I do not want to come off as a creeper, there are other guys that have stared at her, and given looks my way, even though it was a short conversation.

[WesternCancer]

you should NOT be fine with being friendzoned unless you voluntarily friendzone yourself because shes uggo but has hot friends or has mad connects or something.

From my labs the best way to "game girls":
- don't try to be their lab partner, have your work area kinda be by them and occasionally go over to talk

- be very confident in your lab skills, say its a chem lab. know when and why youre doing everything you'll make it look like youre doing it effortlessly, you'll have more time to talk to her and she'll probably "blonde out" and do stupid shit, when she does, neg or laugh at her, if shes interested she will do this in order to try and get you to help her, make her get to the point where she looks like a 5 year old making a nuclear reactor and then either step in or playfully ask of she needs help.

- be social in the whole lab, talk to other people too. flirt with your TAs and your teacher.

- usually labs have a course which it is based around or some kind of pre-req. assume shes in the class ask her to study (only a week before a midterm so you dont look like a fucking nerd). make sure you're the one doing the teaching in the study sesh, pick a quiet place on campus.

- DO NOT FOLLOW HER AFTER CLASS. every girl ive ever met thats had a guy who flirted with them in class follow them home was creeped out beyond belief. if you're skilled enough figure out when another hot girl is getting off class. walk with the girl you're gaming down a common pathway (be like oh im heading to building x). just so happen to run into your hot ass friend give her a big hug. tell the girl youre gaming you'll catch up with her later, dont introduce them.

labs are tricky because youre going to be seeing this girl all year so you want to have some kind of plausable deniability in your advances ie. "studying" for some other class, walking with her for only a minute or two because you were indeed just headed in the same direction.

I REPEAT, UNLESS SHE ASKS YOU OVER DO NOT WALK HER TO HER DORM/BUS OR WHATEVER HER 'GINA WILL SEAL UP.

who knows maybe i'm full of shit, but I did bang one girl i met in lab, but it was after the lab was over. attraction was built using these maneuvers though.

[herpaderpa]

Honestly dude, other than the advice of 'you have to approach, no matter what' I'd suggest popping a benzo if your anxeity is that bad. A low dose, maybe .25 - .5 of a benzo like Xanax will allow to not give a flying fuck about anything without compromising your ability to be witty. It also forces you to watch how much you drink since you don't want to blackout. That's how I got over my approach anxiety (it was so bad I used to sweat and shake and be horribly mean for no reason when I was talking to girls).

[Amour Fou]

(01-24-2012 01:46 AM)CtrlAltElite Wrote:  

Anyways, how should I proceed? I am fine with being friendzoned, after all, I am still learning. Keep in mind, I do not want to come off as a creeper, there are other guys that have stared at her, and given looks my way, even though it was a short conversation.

I don't think that it can be helped as of now "coming off" (rather: you feeling like) a creeper.

I am sure that a guy can stare head on to a girl (I stare at girls boobs as I talk to them straight on) without feeling/seeming like a creep. I think it comes more of as a friendly jerk than a creep.

This feeling of being a creep comes, the way I see, of deeply rooted feelings of guilt and repression over your natural impulses (ie> staring at a girl). As I always mention, if you feel it as wrong, she (and everyone else for that matter) will feel it as wrong, creepy.

I say this from my own personal experience, as I on the past felt (and I still feel on occasion when I'm not in the mood) as "creepy".

It comes from an overall feeling of "lack".

You can stare down a girl 100% confortable in your reality and fullness, and that might actually turn her on...

Or you can stare at her while you internally feel "wrong" about it, and your whole posture and vibe will be influenced by that, making you come off as creepy.

Accept it as unavoidable for the while, and keep on doing what you are doing. Accept that you will be "creepy", embrace, laugh at it, and still -act- as much as you can.