[Iconoclast007]

Its ok if you dont understand. It doesnt bother me. Enjoy your steak and the women in the blue dress.

For those who do get it. Is there any constructive thaughts to be added.

[SamuelBRoberts]

Ooh, a matrix reference!

That's how you know you're dealing with a first rate mind. They think in movies.

[Vincent Chase]

If you want to be "bullish" long term on crypto buy Bitcoin and maybe Monero and come back in five years. Nearly everything else is shit and will likely die off (as it has done historically). It's very simple. You're basically welcoming somehere here coming in and saying something like buy Shitchain and you'll be rich in five years. You won't.

[Iconoclast007]

What is it that makes you feel threatened? Just leave it. Really justlooking forward to constructive input. Perhaps you would like to add some of that to this discussion.

[Swordfish1010]

(01-27-2019 12:57 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

In 5 years we will have accelerated through the parabolic net energy cliff. EROI will have collapsed and with it economic growth. Without economic growth puting aside economic contratraction, countries currencies Fiat will hyperinflate as world depression/deflation takes hold.

Either way fiat is a bad play.

Either way gold is a store of wealth

Crypto is the only robust answer im aware of. Gold is difficult to conduct business internationally with. A smart contract is a great solution amd replacement for international settlement.

This is a thermodynamic problem of net energy available to conduct work. You can not utilize economic theory to fix the laws of nature. Debt is money and money is debt. Dollars are a lien with interest against future enegy stores that are declining in net value.

Cryptocurrency can survive and thrive in a hyperdeflationary environment unlike fiat. In that respect it is inversly correlated to fiat. Now is the time to buy while there is blood in the streets of crypto.

Unfortunately I do not know which crypto is the best play. Or even if the current crypto options are any good. Time will tell. Its risky... But i think less so than dollars stocks or property 2019 forward.

Im hoping someone can chime in on best plays with the above in mind.

Bitcoin is the only crypto worth buying.

[Iconoclast007]

You could be right. It seems that bitcoin is the gold standard of the crypto world. It has the least risk.

I agree 99 percent of the others are conplete junk. That said, there is likely another play to be had that offers real world value in the chaos to come.

Also. I think a guy could play the volatility either up or down to his advantage in the short term as a sort of sweat equity way to accumulate bitcoin etc.. In the process learning the market, which could prove prudent when a bull market returns.

[SamuelBRoberts]

(01-27-2019 02:03 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

What is it that makes you feel threatened? Just leave it. Really justlooking forward to constructive input. Perhaps you would like to add some of that to this discussion.

We were very fortunate in the last run that this forum had a lot of insightful, well-connected, and helpful people, and very few doomsday prepper types who based their investment decisions on silly fantasies about "net energy cliffs". As a result, the forum as a whole made a tremendous amount of money.
My hope is that we can maintain this when/if we get a next bullrun.

We'll see if it happens, forum quality's declined a lot since mid-2017.
In the meantime, it's best to treat your silly ideas with contempt, so that the smart people don't get driven off.

[Swordfish1010]

(01-27-2019 02:14 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

You could be right. It seems that bitcoin is the gold standard of the crypto world. It has the least risk.

I agree 99 percent of the others are conplete junk. That said, there is likely another play to be had that offers real world value in the chaos to come.

Also. I think a guy could play the volatility either up or down to his advantage in the short term as a sort of sweat equity way to accumulate bitcoin etc.. In the process learning the market, which could prove prudent when a bull market returns.

Alts are basically just a way for their creators to print up money. Lightning network and other layer 2 technologies will address any issues as well.

[SamuelBRoberts]

The lightning network has a lot of oddball difficulties and it remains to be seen if it'll work out.
An alt with a fundamentally different design may very well end up proving to be superior.

Too hard to say yet though.

[Iconoclast007]

You make alot of asumtions and alpear to have very little understanding of what I wrote.

You are just making a fool of yourself and trying to cover it up with childish name calling.

Again. Why do you feel threatened by what I wrote?

[SamuelBRoberts]

(01-27-2019 03:03 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

Again. Why do you feel threatened by what I wrote?

Your words threaten me because they have the potential to puncture my happy fiat-induced delusions. You offer the cold stark truth in a world of comforting lies, and the truth is a scary thing. You are Cassandra, an unheeded prophet prophesying doom to Troy. You are Morpheus, offering the real red pull that will change the way I see the world forever. I only mock you because deep down, I'm afraid that you're right. On some level I know that the end of my way of life is coming, but I prefer to look away rather than face it. Your words threaten to grab me by the head and force me to look at a harsh reality, and it's easier to laugh at you than it is to wake up.

Either that or you're another dull-as-fuck doomsayer, spouting the same stuff I've heard since I was in elementary school, and interrupting an otherwise interesting conversation to tell me the same banal shit I've heard a million times before. One of the two.

[Iconoclast007]

I appreciate your candor.

I am not a doom sayer. I dont prep and I dont think that this is the end of the world.

My point is that a paradigm shift is upon us driven by thermodynamic limits of usable energy available to power modern industrial civilization and our economic system driven by growth. Growth is not possible without expanding net energy.

Have you ever looked into EROEI? Perhaps a pointed discussion on what I wrote is in order. It is relevant to crypto.

[355]

(01-27-2019 10:18 AM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

4. Mass default will lead to deflation and eventually hyperinflation.. Ultimately sovereighn debt crisis.

If you believe this (and I think there is a decent chance that it will play out that way), why do you say that fiat currencies are "shit"? In a deflationary environment fiat would be king. Of course you would need to find a way not to be affected by bank defaults (e.g. by holding physical cash) and not be greedy (invest the cash b4 hyperinflation hits).

[Iconoclast007]

Very good question and good point.

Deflation is first and in some respects it is allready hapenning and thats why crypto is a good buy. It will get worse soon and cash will go up and thats prime time to exit cash.

I think NOW is the time to sell property stocks and gp to cash.

The deflation will trigger bank default and non performing debt. Governments will be faced with 2008 all over again but amplified. Zirp and quantitative easing will follow.

At this point hyperinflation sets in. Gold and silver go thru the roof. Crypto soars. Stocks and property crash.

It will be very difficult to earn hard currency and what you can earn will buy very little goods or service.

International trade will need a solution. Crypto and smart contracts fill this void nicely.

Deflation is kryptonite to a debt based economic system based on growth and interest. It will usher in the end of growth and the beginning of the new systems.

Now my question to the crypto gurus here is what coins will be best to buy with the above in mind?

[SamuelBRoberts]

(01-27-2019 03:31 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

My point is that a paradigm shift is upon us driven by thermodynamic limits of usable energy available to power modern industrial civilization and our economic system driven by growth. Growth is not possible without expanding net energy.

A paradigm shift, eh? Boy, that's way worse than a regular shift.

Quote:

Have you ever looked into EROEI? Perhaps a pointed discussion on what I wrote is in order. It is relevant to crypto.

Nah.

[Iconoclast007]

What do you guys have to say about LODE?

https://www.lode.one

[SamuelBRoberts]

Looks shit.

Physical-backed cryptos are terrible performers. They have a hard cap on their price related to the underlying asset, they have trouble getting on exchanges because they're obviously securities, and the whole sector has traditionally had an air of scamminess about it. If you really want silver without having to take possession of it you'd do better to buy yourself some SLV etf.

[Iconoclast007]

You make good points.

Does anyone else have an opinion on asset backed crypto?

[Iconoclast007]

How about Apollo?

https://apollocurrency.com/en/

[Iconoclast007]

Also BEAM?

https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/beam/

[Vincent Chase]

(01-28-2019 04:02 AM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

How about Apollo?

https://apollocurrency.com/en/

Appollo Currency is a scam.

Beam is a miner’s jizzfest.

[Giacomo Casanova]

Beam and Grin should be avoided since the high inflation rate will make rich the miners that will drop the minted coins on the market. Look the price dynamics of another coin with an high inflation like Z-Cash.

[[email protected]]

Stay away from PoW unless you want to be dumped on by miners. Newer ones never end well unless you want to trade it in the short term. There's no niche left for PoW coins anymore with all that's out there. Why not just buy ones that are guaranteed to be around in 2 years?

You have to be a sucker to hold on to fiat for the next 2-3 years, especially when you hold non-USD. You are just asking for your savings to lose purchasing power. When I work and earn income in Australia I just use that to pay for things locally and any excess is thrown into Bitcoin. I just hold enough fiat for 12 months of living.

If alts are on their knees in terms of sats it's not a bad idea to get them but you have to be almost certain they will be around in 2020/21. ETH, XMR, XRP, XLM?, LINK?, HOT?, ADA?, LTC. The ones with "?" are higher risk but potentially higher reward. You also trade the waves in the bear market and accumulate BTC.

Any crypto pegged to anything is the kiss of death.
Icono, check your pm

[semibaron]

This is a winner-takes-it-all-market as nobody needs 2000+ different protocols to handle. Most of DLT (permissioned) use cases will be covered by free solutions such as HyperLedger or the Ethereum Enterprise Alliance.

Public DLT projects are much more difficult to scale than permissioned ones. Every single public DLT project is still in prototype state and will likely be so for the next couple of years. So it's hard to say which are going to be the few surviving projects in 5-10 years. Maybe something totally new not even on the market right now?

I think, however, it is safe to say that all projects that aren't currently in at least the top30 on coinmarketcap have a 95%+ chance to die off. Everything outside the current top200 is most likely to be dead already. And it's very likely these coins will never recover.

So, if you want to invest in DLT, then look into the current top30 and really try to understand the technologies and markets the respective protocol is aiming to go into. Then take a minute and think critically if the project can realistically achieve some real world integration or not.

[HD668B]

Who is in the new crypto hotstuff called mimble wimble?

Beam + Grin at super low marketcap right now for a brand new technology.