[WannaBang]

I think you all know what I mean when I say the United Kingdom is most likely finished. Maybe it will be 20 years from now before the shit really hits the fan. Maybe less than 5 years. I think it is better to spend more time thinking and acting now rather than paying the price by leaving it too late and not being able to act at all.

Actually, in my bones I think that what we are facing is more than just the cultural suicide of just one country from which yours truly happens to originate. Not necessarily a nuclear holocaust. I think that if a nuclear war starts (which I never really think about for this reason) at least our deaths will be quick and all our problems will be gone in a mushroom shaped cloud.

What I worry about is a global catastrophic economic collapse (likely when the US dollar collapses). Whether that happens before the UK morphs into a complete 1984 totalitarian state I cannot say.

I work at sea in oil and gas and while I work for a UK company now I think rather soon I am going to work as a contractor with my own (potentially limited) company
which I suppose could be based anywhere (it has no bearing on where the work itself is). Working in this fashion allows me to spend time in whatever country I want (assuming visa-free etc.) but when it comes to moving my permanent residency, this is where I think I need help. Help in choosing the best overall option taking everything into consideration.

The first few places that spring to mind are: The United States, Australia, New Zealand and Canada. This is obviously due to fact English is the official language which keeps language barriers to a minimum. The economies of all these countries are also (currently) strong so that your purchasing power would be en par with the UK (depending of course on taxes and how much you are paying for renting an apartment to call your residency).

I think my ostensible plan is simple. Set up my personal company in the country of choice and work towards getting the passport to ensure 100% rights as a citizen. During my ‘time off’ when I am not working at sea’ I may still continue to spend most of my time in Central/Eastern Europe as I am doing now, saving as much money as possible but within the next few years I would bend my efforts toward building a ‘safe house’ stocked full of supplies and self-sustainment possibly in a rural area reasonably far from a city where there is a real chance of surviving a potential collapse. I would rather do that than piss down a lot of money every month on some shitty apartment which constitutes a negative return on investment. I am hoping I will make enough money with regular work in the next decade or so to cover all the costs of my theoretical ‘safe-house’ when it comes down to actually constructing it. I am not deadly serious about this whole 'safe house' thing of course. The real priority is simply shifting residency to a more 'successful' and likely to prosper country.

If you can believe it there was actually a point in time recently where I was contemplating buying a mortgage for a property in the UK. What a massive joke and one that I believe I was wise to have dispensed with. A bit like the sexual marketplace the UK property market is OVER-SATURATED! This is due to the extreme mass immigration of course. You have to bid 10+% more than the home report value of a property just to secure it. And who knows what state the country will be in 20-35 years from now???

Anyway.

If anyone from these countries has any advice or resources for a Brit considering permanently relocating i.e. changing residence and working toward getting the local passport please let me know whether here or by pm.

With my very limited knowledge I am going to try and pontificate about each of these countries to try and ascertain whether moving to these places is a worthwhile endeavour given how we can all agree with a high degree of certainty, that the UK is fucked.

USA. I am not sure how the process works to become a citizen but getting the green card is probably the way to go. I am not sure what the equivalent of opening a limited company in the UK, is in the US but I imagine it must be similar and I am not sure whether the tax situation is better or worse (In the UK you pay 19% corporation tax on dividends you pay yourself. There is also a 11.85k tax free allowance - you might not think that matters but if for example you have a wife and pay her with your company this becomes beneficial at least in the UK). I guess really this is the less important issue - especially compared with the overall future of the country. The real important issue, is how does the future of the USA look in comparison?

Will the dollar collapse and as a result lead to a biblical economic collapse similar to what Pierro san Giorgio writes about in ‘Survive the Economic Collapse?’ I think unless you are a fully-fledged US citizen (which I probably would not be eligible for at least for many years) you cannot own arms with which to defend yourself. This apparently is an advantage none of the other countries have. And who knows, the second amendment might be scrapped in the near future regardless! Also, there is the risk of being drafted (in the US I don’t know if this just applies to fully-fledged citizens?). That could probably happen in the UK as well eventually. Probably America will not become a sharia law country the way Western Europe is potentially headed so no need to worry about that at least.

Canada. I am not sure about Canada at all, especially with the current presidency. I think the extreme climate could be troublesome as well. However, there is so much land and mountainous areas that finding a location for a ‘safe-house.’

Australia. From what I can see this may be one of the better choices. Lots of poisonous animals but I think that is the smallest problem. I am not really savvy with current affairs but I get the overall impression the country has a brighter future than the UK. I heard the taxes are higher but the wages also so it kind of evens out. Seems they have a tax free allowance en par with the UK’s. Potential conflict with China but if they are trading partners depending on each other I wouldn’t imagine any time soon. My overall impression is that it is the best option.

New Zealand. I know basically nothing so far but I guess not too different from Australia. Seems like a pretty safe bet during tough times.

As for non ‘anglosphere’ countries, I have to admit I am a bit apprehensive.

So far, I have considered the following countries:

Poland. I have been visiting pretty regularly over the past few years and while my Polish is around the B1 level (on a good day) it is still no-where near enough to integrate into the local culture which you need to do in order to build up a network which would be essential during tough times. From what I can see there is no benefit to setting up a company there and you don’t really know how stable the zloty will be (or the rights of foreigners who are not yet citizens). It is also sandwiched between 2 potentially dangerous giants (Germany and Russia) which would make it a less desirable place to be in the event the immigration crisis shit hit the fan from the west or invasion by Russia from the east. At the moment I am only really spending time there for ‘love’ purposes but even that noble agenda is seeming almost pointless due to the complete degradation of the global sexual marketplace and destruction of foreigner value. So, I think my days of visiting there are numbered unless I truly get lucky within the next few years. You do have to love Poland’s stubborn will to hold onto her conservative culture however no matter how much she is bullied by the EU. That alone makes it a far better place to spend time - none of this feminist saturated leftist dominated sjw media nonsense.

Ukraine. I could definitely see potential here due to the high quality arable land and the potential of starting a family with a local lady should it turn out that way. But being realistic it would take 3 years of hard core effort to master Russian (I am on it but not hard core). Then you have the threat of invasion by Russia, civil war and corruption. When I was there I never felt particularly safe and truth be told if some sort of shit did hit the fan I would be fucked. I have not ruled this fascinating country out however.

Brazil. Somewhere like Gramado in Rio Grande do Sul. While the big cities like Porto Alegre might be the last place you would want to go for security I really loved those small little towns which seemed so European and civilised compared to the rest of the country. I could imagine owning my own land there with a safe house and a hot Brazilian wife. Of course given the crazy bureaucracy and corruption in this country (from what I have heard from local Brazilians) it might just be a fantasy. I also loved Florianopolis a lot.

Other options I haven’t really looked into but have heard that quite a few Brits have relocated to include: Japan, China and Switzerland. I have as of yet never visited the Far East (probably due to having no interest in Oriental women). One guy in his 60s I met got a spouse visa in Japan and actually can-do business tax free for 10 years and has nothing but great things to say about the country, its technology and culture. China I would be a lot more worried about just because of her reputation but to be fair I simply do not know enough about it to make an informed decision. Switzerland, I think could be a potential prospect as citizens can own their own firearms and you have a topographic geography amenable to survival. And if life gets too much for me there is Dignitas. Issue would be I would need to know German though.

As far as feasibility of starting up my business in these countries, I have no idea at all. From what I have read by skimming over the internet it looks like there are no real tax benefits compared to the UK (probably worse overall). The language barrier and costs associated with financial advisers in order to ensure everything is spot on legal wise would also be a burden not to mention translation etc.

I think a wise idea might be to split your savings between different currencies more likely to remain strong during tough times e.g. the Yuan. Perhaps gold also. However, you would want to make sure you buy gold in the country you decide to move your residence to, in order to avoid losing 10%+ of it to customs officers when you are moving country with it. I’m still researching all of this.

I would be very very interested to know the thoughts and reflections of you guys regarding all this.

[ProGambler]

I think a total financial system collapse happens in about 20 years (triggered by technological unemployment) and basically everywhere will be a totalitarian state. The UK seems to be ahead of the curve at the moment but it is more white, is protected by the sea and has more history in the soil than most places which means it will hold up better than most. If you want an actual safe haven - look at islands off New Zealand and Polynesia. New Zealand is the safe play but the Brazil vibe can't really be beaten imo if you're a black piller/embrace risk.

[jbkunt2]

While I think your assessment regarding the UK is literally ludicrous, I can offer some advice.

I am a Brit living in the US.

Tax-wise, you will pay a lot less if you are a business owner in the US than the UK - assuming you live in a state wih a decent tax rate (not NY or CA).

There is now a juicy 20% tax-free deduction for small business owners as well.

If you have a successful company and/or money to invest, you could get an E2 visa. If the figure is at least $500k and you can employ a few Americans, a green card may be an option.

If this is not the case, it’s not happening. Try somewhere else.

Sure... Birmingham and Slough are dump. But Have you been to Bath, England? Chester? The Cotswolds? These places offer a quality of life on a par with anywhere in the world IMO.

[gework]

There's obviously a lot of factors to weigh. But IMO the benefits of leaving far outweigh staying.

A few other options:

Isle of Man - Lower taxes, Manxism not Marxism

Channel Islands - Negligible taxes, problem is the cheapest you can get a house as an interloper is £250K and that's basic; property is expensive there. But UK citizens have the right to remain indefinitely. English speaking.

British Caribbean - You can get some places in the Caribbean for $250,000 or less. I think you can get a $250K property on St Kitts and get their passport. English speaking, low tax and low reachin government. Issue is the culture and higher crime levels. BVI is the best option. Avoid The Bahamas.

French Polynesia - One of the few places in the world without mosquitoes

Serbia-Hungary-Bosnia - You can get decent houses in these countries for £35K. Entry level luxury can be had for less than £100K in some cases.

Croatia + Malta - No property tax; Malta is English-speaking.

Puerto Rico and other US dependencies - often good levels of English and some very lox taxes too. Northern Mariana Islands is an interesting one.

NMI:



* I seem to remember you can only get a 99 year lease on property on NMI as a foreigner, but there's probably a way round it.

Costa Rica - Least violent Latin American country, lots of foreigners, high rental yields, likely a good future for the property market

Crimea - Was meant to have some low tax thing going on

On tax. You only have to pay tax (I think) in most European countries if you're resident - in the country for 183 or more days in a year. So one option is to live between countries. Possible example:

1) £100K for a nice house in the Canary Islands, with lots of expats and year round sun, easy language to learn
2) £35K house in Serbia and/or Hungary

Maybe throw in a $100 condo on BVI at which point you can "run "your business from and then there's no tax.

Another option:

1) $300K rental property in Costa Rica
2) $100K condo in BVI

Deluxe:

1) $1M apartment in Hong Kong, with Hong Kong business (no tax of foreign income)
2) $500K holiday home on the North Mariana Islands (£100-200 flight from HK)

As for getting to residency or whatever you want. The easiest way to get to that is start a 1 year language course and get a visa. After that it becomes easy.

[Gótico]

I strongly suspect European freedom of movement will remain in place despite Brexit, and it seems to me that European nations, coupled with Ibero-American ones, would be the easiest; in Europe, you have the right to come and go as you please, whilst those south of the Río Grande aren’t the most discriminatinh with regard to incoming foreigners. Of course, the Crown dependencies would be the easiest short of remaining in Britain, but you’ll find that certain tax advantages evaporate in light of higher expense. Also, survivalism is difficult on small, dependent islands.

I won’t repeat what was mentioned above, but of the European options, Malta is my favourite; Croatian real estate is relatively accessible, but any attempt at hiring Croats will result in elevated social security contributions. I’d further encourage you to have a look at Hungary and the Czech Republic. You’ll find property comes with considerable fiscal concessions and is reasonably priced, with the Czech Republic granting farmers an ultra-low tax rate. Portugal, too, is good; if you structure your business correctly, you’ll be able to claim a ten-year exemption as a non-habitual resident whilst nonetheless starting the clock towards citizenship. Switzerland is the deluxe option; taxes are moderate for Continental standards, but it all varies by canton, with the jet-setters amongst us being able to negotiate lump-sum, rather than rate-based, taxation in Zug. I’ve heard good things about Russia and Georgia. I won’t pretend to know much about them — or indeed, about anything.

Across the pond, Chile and Panama have excellent passports and lax residence requirements. Argentina, although it may seemed cursed and subject to particularly harsh boom-and-bust cycles, also has plenty of land, easy visas and an excellent passport. Brazil is crime-ridden and bureaucratic (so is the entire region, albeit on varying scales), but its passport is also good and theoretically comes after a year’s stay in the country, provided you’re married to a Brazilian. Naturalisation, needless to say, is bound to take longer. It is a massive country with plenty of taxes to be paid, so I wouldn’t recommend it.

The trouble with Canada, Australia and New Zealand is that their predicament is similar, if not worse, to the UK’s. High taxes and visas are also something to consider because the former will inevitably be quite high, whilst the latter can be difficult to procure, particularly without a job offer. New Zealand, however, grants new residents a four-year tax exemption on foreign-sourced income, and you only need five years to apply for citizenship. After that, in view of the Trans-Tasman Arrangement, you could move freely between Australia and NZ.

[Bikal]

(06-02-2018 05:00 PM)WannaBang Wrote:  

I think you all know what I mean when I say the United Kingdom is most likely finished. Maybe it will be 20 years from now before the shit really hits the fan. Maybe less than 5 years.

Where do you live for the UK to be finished as that's not the case at all, unless you're poor but you work in O&G while planning a move overseas so you can't be poor, right?

The UK is only a shitfest for the poorest in society, down South we've got it pretty good in London, Bristol, Oxford and Cambridge, Birmingham is also pretty good overall for quality of live compared to cost of living of London and then you've got the Northern powerhouses of Manchester and Newcastle where £25k you can live like a king, fly to a different pussy paradise each weekend and still have enough money left over to buy a 4 bedroom house.