[Oblivion77]

This post is about frame control and inevitably power.
I need some input on this one: a chick I really mismanaged not applying the good old two strikes rule when she proved to be flaky and playing hard to get. I think I am done with her, but I want feedback to get perspective on the whole experience.

FYI She is one of 5 that I am gaming right now. Probably the hottest (8,5) but I have no qualms about moving on.

About a month ago this chick suggested to go out for dinner out of nowhere (I dont know her well at all and we basically are just friends on facebook as I gamed her last year). Quite a surprise how out of a totally random facebook comment on her wall she basically asked me out. Anyway turns out she broke up with her bfriend a few weeks earlier. Everything started to make sense. Obviously I didnt agree on dinner but brought her out to get drinks. Drinks went well, kiss closed her and had a good time - she gave me all the right sexual inputs (blatantly admitting she loves sex).

However, my red flags were up as she has a fucked up and not existent relationship with her parents (divorced parents and not in touch with either one of them). She is fun but scattered.
Most importantly, she plays games: she responds to every text message or phone call I send/make....BUT every single time it takes her between 6 hours (rarely) to 1 day (often). Seriously, she never responds promptly, ever.

I felt things started to fizzle when she went out of town 3 times in the following 3 weeks making impossible to see her. Still, I kept her on my radar and surprisingly she kept being slow but consistent in returning calls/texts. In the end when she called back we agreed to a 2nd date, even though we had zero momentum.

Not surprisingly though, she rescheduled the 2nd date with one day notice using some (legit) work excuse. We rescheduled for the following week.
Then last week she rescheduled again when I texted her to confirm. And this time the excuse was so lame (work stuff to catch up with and being exhausted after being out of town so often in the last 3 weeks. LOL. Also she made no attempt to reschedule). In other words it was a clear indicator of disinterest and, most importantly, of lack of respect for my time. So I decided to cut my losses and move on.

I texted her back "I am surprised you arent coming out tonight, but that's ok ;-). Either way it was great meeting you. You have a refreshing spontaneous way about you. Remember to hit that restaurant we spoke about. You wont regret it! Take care. Me". Not harsh, but definite. A text I use often when I walk away. It makes me be consistent to my frame of being friendly, confident but not willing to waste my time. And it leaves the door open if the girl in question wants to put some efforts into restarting things (it worked in the past).

Surprisingly, what never happened before happened, she texts back in 1 sec! She asks why I said so, as it sounded like I wasnt going to see her again (she is clever, right? ;-)) She suggested to reschedule drinks.

That was 5 days ago. I havent responded to her. Was I too quick to call it off as - despite being dysfunctional - she might still be interested?
or do you approve cutting her off, as she will probably just restart her late response/cancellation game to get validation in the post-boyfriend aftermath?

Facts: Last time I have seen her and kissed was a month ago. An eternity.
My priority: I dont want to waste time on flaky girls.
I just dont care about the lay if the girl in question is high maintenance/drama. I got enough alternatives and prefer focus on other chicks. Plus, the combo fucked-up family+self absorbed flaky never led anywhere according to my previous experiences. I usually just put a smile on my face and politely disengage focusing on my other targets.

I want to hear your thoughts though. Legit to move on?
Or should I re-open the case, circle back and ping her to see if she corrects her behavior now that she saw I was ready to walk?

[CJ]

So, you got a flake to respond to a text in one second, and you didn't respond? Oh boy...

I mean, at this point it's over, but had you responded, even a couple hours later (doing her trick) she might've been in the right mood to hang out. You could've texted her back "Ok, what are you doing right now/tonight?" If she had "plans" (again) then proceed with moving on. The problem here is she's got so many other guys texting her that unfortunately losing you isn't going to mean a lot to her at this point, as you haven't banged her yet.

I do like your use of a polite "call out/goodbye" text though.

[Oblivion77]

(05-02-2011 02:11 PM)CJ Wrote:  

So, you got a flake to respond to a text in one second, and you didn't respond? Oh boy...

I mean, at this point it's over, but had you responded, even a couple hours later (doing her trick) she might've been in the right mood to hang out. You could've texted her back "Ok, what are you doing right now/tonight?" If she had "plans" (again) then proceed with moving on. The problem here is she's got so many other guys texting her that unfortunately losing you isn't going to mean a lot to her at this point, as you haven't banged her yet.

I do like your use of a polite "call out/goodbye" text though.

Thanks for the input. Very much appreciated. You are probably right on all accounts and will keep it in mind.

Still, my mindset is I dont want to hang out with her if she were to restart this slow response/flakey behavior - even if she is interested in me and is hot.

In fact if there is one lesson I learned in the past is that my self-esteem and my good mood is more important than any lay. It gives you balance.
The self-esteem stays with you, the girl, very often, doesnt ;-)

[Gmac]

Quote:

she responds to every text message or phone call I send/make....BUT every single time it takes her between 6 hours (rarely) to 1 day (often). Seriously, she never responds promptly, ever.

This is your red flag. You aren't her #1, you're her back up. I've got two of these girls right now where I'm pretty sure it's the same situation. Just keep playing the game on the side until you bang her (pump & dump) while you work on your other girls. If she suspects you're too needy she might stop responding altogether. Increase your lag time too. You waited 5 days though, might need to restart text. All you are doing is text game, not that much of an investment of time.

[Oblivion77]

(05-02-2011 04:49 PM)Gmac Wrote:  

Quote:

she responds to every text message or phone call I send/make....BUT every single time it takes her between 6 hours (rarely) to 1 day (often). Seriously, she never responds promptly, ever.

Increase your lag time too. You waited 5 days though, might need to restart text. All you are doing is text game, not that much of an investment of time.

I did, since the beginning I was texting her back few hours later (often), like she did, or relatively fast, within 30 min (at times) just to keep being unpredictable, as advocated by Roosh.

But I agree with your hypothesis, I was probably her back up and I'm glad I didnt invest in her. I'll probably throw in a restart text while focusing on other targets. Just to experiment

[Duke Castile]

Yeah this is an annoying situation. I met this girl a week ago, gorgeous 8.5. Totally my type. Takes her hours or a day to respond to a txt. We finally got some momentum going and she disappeared again. I'm obviously not her number 1. But she also hasn't flaked since there's been no opportunity.

In any event, you should schedule her to meet with you during a happy hr time where, if she doesn't show up, you're able to game other girls anyway, or schedule one of your 5 girls as a backup that you flake on if she goes.

[alphawolf]

I was investigating "flaky chicks" and came across this thread.

You have to find your own truth. I realized something this week.

If the girl is that flaky, she's
1) probably not that interested in me
2) has a ton of options
3) is a disorganized, forgetful, irresponsible person

In regards to my personal beliefs about these:
1) I want to create so much value that she wants to see me. Only this is worth it. Fuck the in-betweens. That's her loss.
2) I should get to a point where I have a ton of options in my lifestyle as well
3) Would you really want to date a girl like that, Assuming you already get pussy as a PUA?

-AW

[iknowexactly]

a litle off-topic, but something strikes me--

You BELIEVE her excuses when she says she's "out of town" etc?

I find women's excuses are almost always either extreme distortions or flat out lies.

They're more astute socially and know if they tell you they'd:

1) Rather stay home alone than hang out with you-
2) Got things going that night with a higher value guy-

You'd be humiliated and wouldn't be available any more.

Bad relationship with both parents almost certainly means inability
to sustain any kind of mutually rewarding relationship.

She not only had the training in non-attachment, she probably has the personality genetics for it also. Pass except as booty-call material.

She cannot sustain internal images of others well enough to become entranced as you are hoping.
Everyone always fades away, and therefore are not worth investing in consistently.

[Oblivion77]

(07-17-2011 12:02 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

a litle off-topic, but something strikes me--

You BELIEVE her excuses when she says she's "out of town" etc?

I find women's excuses are almost always either extreme distortions or flat out lies.

They're more astute socially and know if they tell you they'd:

1) Rather stay home alone than hang out with you-
2) Got things going that night with a higher value guy-

You'd be humiliated and wouldn't be available any more.

Bad relationship with both parents almost certainly means inability
to sustain any kind of mutually rewarding relationship.

She not only had the training in non-attachment, she probably has the personality genetics for it also. Pass except as booty-call material.

She cannot sustain internal images of others well enough to become entranced as you are hoping.
Everyone always fades away, and therefore are not worth investing in consistently.

Thanks for the feedback Iknowexactly and Alphawolf.
I agree with your conclusions. That chick was very scattered and definitely had other options.

Re: her excuses to be out of town, I'll be frank, I expected those to be excuses as well (I'm a skeptical by nature). However I have her on the accursed facebook and saw the pics and wall posts related to those 3 week-ends away where she went to visit some old girlfriends of her. So, no, in that regards she didnt lie. That was the main reason why I stuck around despite her erratic behavior. A mistake, evidently, but I didnt have much to lose.

Still, the fact she did go out of town for real doesnt change the validity of your analysis. I agree with you guys, with 20/20 hindsight there is no doubt she was very self-absorbed and not someone worth investing. I just always wonder what is the right time to walk away in cases like these. By nature I walk away and move on relatively early and often - as I cant be bothered with flakes - however I cant deny that plenty of lays have been direct consequence of my persistence.

I need to learn to better calibrate my judgment and trust my instincts more, to avoid wasting time with flakes but at the same time not to pass on good opportunities that just require some basic change of tactic.

[esperar]

I've gotten to the point where I have zero tolerance for flaking. If a woman I like flakes, that's it, she's out. I don't even need to make myself stay away either, it naturally makes me stay away.

[jacknap]

I have a few girls that did this to me but one in particular. I have some girls as fuck buddies for a while I've had this one as a fuck buddy for two years about. She suddenly basically said 'I don't want to hang out anymore'. Removed me of facebook / instagram. Started stalking me again and re-added me on instagram liking my photos and following me.

Should I hit her up again? She's an 18 year colombian 8.5. Really fun to fuck. I can't help but feel like a bit of a bitch though that whenever she just decides she's down again I'm there you know? Not sure if I should maintain my pride or try again.

This one asian girl that I was seeing for about a year did the same thing. Stopped seeing her for a year than started blowing up my instagram. I hit her up and we had another great fuck buddy relationship for another year. So might be worth a shot right?

There was also this really really hot Canadian girl doing it to me but I only had her as a one night stand and she's far too erratic. She's totally my type but her behaviour makes it a turn off. She'll text me drunk to hangout at 1am and she lives like an hour away though frequently changes her mind and gets boyfriends. The life of an 18 year old white beauty god damn.

[griffinmill]

I was dealing with a Ukranian girl recently who initiated the first text after the first date, and who I sensed decent attraction, but would literally take 3-4 days to answer a text. I've never experienced anything like that before. Either a girl completely ignores you, or responds (semi-)promptly. I think she was gaming me. Either way, I only put up with this frustrating behaviour for about 3 weeks before deleting her number. She was a hard 6, and not worth it. The hotter the girl the more perseverance, of course.