[peacepeace65]

hey guys,
I'm a 24 year old. Been going out consistently 3-4 times a week in NYC for the past 8 months. I have gotten pretty good with my game, and every time i go out, i usually find some sets that hook, I escalate and the girls seem DTF but i just have trouble taking the set further (i.e venue changing/pulling). I'm trying to go for a one night stand.

very rarely, but sometimes girls make it super easy for me (i.e they tell me they wanna fuck). But most of them, don't (slut defense) and if i hesitate a little with the pull, they give me excuses. I follow RSD, and they usually teach to be persistent, and really try to pull the girl. Some of the stuff they teach with pulling, seems a little creepy, like going home with the girl, so I'm just looking for general advice on how pull/close.

I have run into many scenarios, and i just have no idea what works and what doesn't. I always hesitate when closing (but I think I can get better by practicing), I also need some help with all these random scenarios I run into.

1- Sometimes I see a single girl waiting on the side of the road, i clearly can tell from her eyes and from escalating, and the way she's giving me eye contact that she's horny. They usually say they were about to go home. and that point I have no idea what to do. Do I make an excuse to get into the uber with her and go home? do I try to pull? I usually feel like a creep trying to do anything, and if i suggest she hang out with me, they usually say, they wanna go home (but not a strong no).

2- I've had girls that I have 20-30 minutes conversations at the club, I escalate and it's going well. then they say, they have to go meet up with some friends, and at that point it's too late to pull. I try, but they say they have to go. and they end up leaving the club/bar. Do I try to pull earlier in that case?

3- my wingman and I, find a set with more than 2 girls, sometimes 3, sometimes 4 or 5. they all hook, we talk for like 10-15 minutes. Sometimes the women are all standing together on the street, and we have no idea how to pull. I can clearly tell by escalating that they're horny. Do we just try to bring all of them back to our place, do we bounce them somewhere and try to escalate on the ones we like?

3- sometimes my wingman and I find two girls that are dtf, and i just don't know how to close. I try to bring them back to our apartment, by making up an excuse to watch a movie, drink alcohol or something, but that doesn't work.

For the guys that are getting one night stands, how do you baby step the close and bring them back to your place?

[juicebox]

I can try to speak from comparative experience. I lived in London for little over a year after graduate school (1st time around). Wow is London tough for dating - **** Survivor, London is a jungle man. NY is even richer and compact which means the competition is even tougher as there is a greater density of triers chasing the same strange.

I moved to a smaller city.

[Samseau]

I think you're ruling out going over to their place for no reason.

1. If you have a hail mary chance such as a woman getting into an uber by herself you've got nothing to lose by asking her if she'd like some company. Tell her you give great massages or excellent music taste, etc. Some bullshit reason why you'd be fun for the evening.

2. If she says she needs to meet with her friends, ask her if she wants to hang later and get her number.

If you've hooked a set, try to bounce outta there asap and get her away from her friends. Having an interesting series of places to go to before you get back to your apartment helps.

3. If you hit a large group of girls you need to figure out their logistics. See if they are heading back home together (as roommates) or separately. If you know when your target will be isolated, make sure you're with her somehow. If the night is young and they aren't going home soon, just invite them all back to your place and get them wasted.

4. You find two dtf but they won't come back? Sounds like they aren't dtf at all! My go to line to get a girl back to my place is, "chill and listen to music," and then ask if they like weed. Either they like you or they don't at this stage.

[peacepeace65]

(10-29-2017 11:54 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

I think you're ruling out going over to their place for no reason.

1. If you have a hail mary chance such as a woman getting into an uber by herself you've got nothing to lose by asking her if she'd like some company. Tell her you give great massages or excellent music taste, etc. Some bullshit reason why you'd be fun for the evening.

2. If she says she needs to meet with her friends, ask her if she wants to hang later and get her number.

If you've hooked a set, try to bounce outta there asap and get her away from her friends. Having an interesting series of places to go to before you get back to your apartment helps.

3. If you hit a large group of girls you need to figure out their logistics. See if they are heading back home together (as roommates) or separately. If you know when your target will be isolated, make sure you're with her somehow. If the night is young and they aren't going home soon, just invite them all back to your place and get them wasted.

4. You find two dtf but they won't come back? Sounds like they aren't dtf at all! My go to line to get a girl back to my place is, "chill and listen to music," and then ask if they like weed. Either they like you or they don't at this stage.

general question, what is a good way to close, if i meet a girl on the street or club/bar and it's on. Do I try to venue change her to some other low key bar and then back home, usually the girls give excuses like "that's too far" "we're meeting a friend soon" etc., and I'm not very pushy. I feel a little weird being persistent with the close.

Also, do I need to seed the pull, are there steps to do this, or do I just come out and say "come with me, i know a bar, i'd like to get to know you more" and keep pushing it until she comes or gives a strong no.

Also stupid question, can I pull with I have weed, even if I don't? (yes I'm an idiot when it comes to closing)

[Eddie Winslow]

It's hard man. You need a vibe thats equal parts fun and safe, a very DTF girl who is willing to leave her beloved friends, smooth escalation, airtight logistics, and dare I say looser than average morals.

My approaches are received warmly more often than not, I can ramble with the best of them, I can let my target girl know that I'm attracted to her, mutual flirting is obvious. But since I've cut back dramatically on my drinking I really struggle to pull a girl or even get a makeout. I just can't force myself to remain super persistent when I get a soft "no".

I went to a big DC club till it closed on Saturday. Met a very cute girl outside, approached, showed intent, strong eye contact, great vibe and a big smile from her, but she needs to get a cab with friends. We part ways and she walks down the street to the cab/uber line.

5 minutes later, I wander down to the same area looking for my own friends and ride home. She says "Hey Eddie!" Calls me over, I introduce myself to her friends (one guy and one girl). They weren't drunk, and at this point I'm pretty sure they were all slightly loved up on Molly. It ends up that they are cabbing to a place that is literally across the street from my hotel, and when I let them know, they enthusiastically invite me to join them on their ride home. Sweet. I see my friends, but I bail on them to join my girl.

I get stuck sitting in the passenger seat and the three friends are in the back for a 15 minute cab ride. My girl is sitting right behind me, I alternate trying to talk to her one-on-one vs participating in the group convo. Everyone in the group talking about how its hard to find people to go out with when you are single after college, so now I know my girl doesn't have a bf she needs to cheat on. I feel like this should be a layup.

We arrive at the destination. The other girl goes to McDonald's to get drunk food. I pull her to the side and continue the flirty conversation, but she is not responding to my eye contact anymore and seems way colder. I ask her if she wants to hang out more and she is clearly not sure what to do, and unconfidently says she is supposed to go stay at her girlfriend's apartment <200 feet from my hotel. I very, very gently try to get her to reconsider, but she is still apprehensive.

The guy comes over to say bye to her and senses the awkwardness in the air. He says 'uhh...I'm going home........are you ok (with me leaving you with this guy we met at 3am just 25 minutes ago?" She pauses and then apprehensively says "yea I'm ok." No one really moves, so after a long moment of silence, I decide to give up. I give the guy a handshake bro hug, give my girl a hug, say bye, and walk to my hotel.

I think she got out of the cab, realized she was about to have a close-to-sober one night stand with someone she met 30 minutes ago, and freaked out. The guy didn't directly cockblock me (which I appreciated) but understandably gave his friend a way out if she wanted one. Did I fuck this up?

[peacepeace65]

(10-30-2017 02:45 PM)Eddie Winslow Wrote:  

It's hard man. You need a vibe thats equal parts fun and safe, a very DTF girl who is willing to leave her beloved friends, smooth escalation, airtight logistics, and dare I say looser than average morals.

My approaches are received warmly more often than not, I can ramble with the best of them, I can let my target girl know that I'm attracted to her, mutual flirting is obvious. But since I've cut back dramatically on my drinking I really struggle to pull a girl or even get a makeout. I just can't force myself to remain super persistent when I get a soft "no".

I went to a big DC club till it closed on Saturday. Met a very cute girl outside, approached, showed intent, strong eye contact, great vibe and a big smile from her, but she needs to get a cab with friends. We part ways and she walks down the street to the cab/uber line.

5 minutes later, I wander down to the same area looking for my own friends and ride home. She says "Hey Eddie!" Calls me over, I introduce myself to her friends (one guy and one girl). They weren't drunk, and at this point I'm pretty sure they were all slightly loved up on Molly. It ends up that they are cabbing to a place that is literally across the street from my hotel, and when I let them know, they enthusiastically invite me to join them on their ride home. Sweet. I see my friends, but I bail on them to join my girl.

I get stuck sitting in the passenger seat and the three friends are in the back for a 15 minute cab ride. My girl is sitting right behind me, I alternate trying to talk to her one-on-one vs participating in the group convo. Everyone in the group talking about how its hard to find people to go out with when you are single after college, so now I know my girl doesn't have a bf she needs to cheat on. I feel like this should be a layup.

We arrive at the destination. The other girl goes to McDonald's to get drunk food. I pull her to the side and continue the flirty conversation, but she is not responding to my eye contact anymore and seems way colder. I ask her if she wants to hang out more and she is clearly not sure what to do, and unconfidently says she is supposed to go stay at her girlfriend's apartment <200 feet from my hotel. I very, very gently try to get her to reconsider, but she is still apprehensive.

The guy comes over to say bye to her and senses the awkwardness in the air. He says 'uhh...I'm going home........are you ok (with me leaving you with this guy we met at 3am just 25 minutes ago?" She pauses and then apprehensively says "yea I'm ok." No one really moves, so after a long moment of silence, I decide to give up. I give the guy a handshake bro hug, give my girl a hug, say bye, and walk to my hotel.

I think she got out of the cab, realized she was about to have a close-to-sober one night stand with someone she met 30 minutes ago, and freaked out. The guy didn't directly cockblock me (which I appreciated) but understandably gave his friend a way out if she wanted one. Did I fuck this up?

I think our skill in game is pretty similar. I have very similar issues. I just haven't considered going with a girl for a one night stand. Anyways, I think you fucked it up, when you didn't sit next to her in the cab. You need to continue to escalate and occupy the mind while you're pulling. I've had girls change their minds because they go to the bathroom and logically think about me, or if there's some silence while I'm pulling and she starts to think about the situation logically.

Also, with my limited experience in travelling europe, I believe each city requires a slightly different style in game. I'm not sure how DC compares to NY.

[MaceTyrell]

I too am in NYC, and I too struggle with the nightgame ONS.

The closest thing I’ve gotten from a ONS is from a social circle constructed party. Won’t bore with the escalation details, but the way I isolated was when she said she was taking a cab to go to her sister’s apartment, and I went “oh, I’m heading into the city to meet up with a friend - let’s split a cab.”

Escalated in cab, got into sister’s apartment, got the notch. Never once did girl mention “but what about your friend.”

Plausible deniability is a real thing.

Let’s keep this thread going - an NYC nightgame notch has still eluded me, despite having 20 notches at 25.

[Samseau]

(10-30-2017 02:11 PM)peacepeace65 Wrote:  

(10-29-2017 11:54 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

I think you're ruling out going over to their place for no reason.

general question, what is a good way to close, if i meet a girl on the street or club/bar and it's on. Do I try to venue change her to some other low key bar and then back home, usually the girls give excuses like "that's too far" "we're meeting a friend soon" etc., and I'm not very pushy. I feel a little weird being persistent with the close.

Also, do I need to seed the pull, are there steps to do this, or do I just come out and say "come with me, i know a bar, i'd like to get to know you more" and keep pushing it until she comes or gives a strong no.

Also stupid question, can I pull with I have weed, even if I don't? (yes I'm an idiot when it comes to closing)

Bouncing a girl is just a way to test for compliance, you don't try to bounce until she's vibing with you. She needs to be enjoying your company, or be physically drawn to you. It can be tough as fuck to get this down in loud bars/clubs. I prefer dancing but if you rely on talking then you gotta figure out a way to get them hooked just through the banter.

If you can't vibe, then asking them to bounce is almost pointless. You're better off approaching new girls until you find a girl you vibe with. Most Guys Do Not Get This.

Do not waste time on a girl if she seems bored or disinterested. Just tell her, "I wanna go have fun somewhere else, wanna come with me?" and if she doesn't respond or says no just walk away and hit up a new chick. NYC game is 80% numbers, don't even worry about saying the right things. That comes after thousands of approaches, you'll figure that out then.

If all you want is sex (and that's all NYC is good for) then you need to find a girl you have a strong vibe with right off the bat. If she's giggly and smilies then you know you're golden. Or if she likes to dance with you that's also a very good sign. Just bounce outta there to another bar or your place (depending on how strong the vibe is).

Of course, getting a girl back to your place is just the start of a whole new set of problems... but one step at a time yes?

[Eddie Winslow]

Plausible deniability is indeed real - although for me, sometimes it feels morally wrong to truly take advantage of it. I tend to feel unwarranted guilt all the time, so I'm going to re-evaluate how I think about this stuff. If a man is OK with it, it is incredibly powerful - there is no doubt I'm leaving a ton of pussy on the table when I go out.

Plausible deniability has been touched upon in Bang with the "can I use your bathroom?" line, but it can be used to the extreme. Check out this excerpt from a nightgame field report over Halloween weekend. This is a diabolical-level example of using plausible deniability. I bolded the especially good parts.

Quote:

Pulling:

Still had Kathy, so whatever. She was talking to some guy in a unicorn costume. He was actually pretty handsome and I could tell she liked him. Who gives a shit, hand-of-god and I'm back in. It was funny, I could see her kind of eyeing unicorn dude even while talking to me. This shit will happen guys, never take it personally (spoiler alert – I fuck the girl, he doesn't). Conversation didn't spark, so we made out a bit, and then I number closed for logistical convenience. Chat a little bit more (always good to do after number closing to “scramble” RAS), and I take pressure off and start approaching with my wing while keeping an eye on her so I don't lose her. Probably got a little value boost since I'm sure she saw me approaching and shit.

I see her go outside – this was my cue. Same old pretending-to-be-on-the phone trick, and I reopen outside the venue “oh hi Kathy!” She's with a friend, to whom I introduce myself and we chit chat some. Turns out friend is giving Kathy a ride home, and I say “oh could I actually ride with you guys, too? Staying at my buddy in that area”. Friend says sure. Friend can kind of tell I'm tryna get laid and doesn't trust me, so I chat her up to show her I'm normal and ignore Kathy. We had a lot in common so this wasn't too difficult.

We put Kathy's bike in the trunk, and she says “well I could just ride my bike home I guess”, her friend responds with some shit but I just pretend I didn't hear it and shut the bike in the trunk to eliminate that alternative. Sure enough we pile into the car and drive off. This was important and actually a small act of compliance (or non-non-compliance) on the girls' part – if she was sure she wasn't open to having me around she would have insisted on biking home.

At this point I've kinda cashed out the “emotional bank account”, so I take pressure off Kathy and just chat her friend to build general comfort. Kathy isn't actively showing any interest at this point, but that's okay. I just need time. Time = investment.

They ask where my buddy lives, I say I'm waiting for him to text me the address. I say I'll call him, slip my phone into airplane mode, and say “fuck he's not picking up”, make a bit of a show out of it. Friend drops us off near Kathy's place and I say “well do you mind if I walk with you while waiting for my friend to call back? It's really cold outside and I don't want to freeze”. She says “sure we can walk around the block a little bit”, indicating that we're not going to her place. That's fine – what I need at this point is time anyway to remind her that I'm the shit.

We walk and casually chat. Here I treat her almost like a newly opened set – banter, qualification, push-pulls, etc. Sure as shit, after a block or two her tonality relaxes and she has that “anime” look in her eyes again. Conversation is more natural and slowly but surely, “emotional bank account” builds back up. I say I'm going to try calling my friend again, and she says “okay yeah my apartment was a block back”. Excellent – now I know the general direction to lead to.

She asks what I'm gonna do if he doesn't pick up, I say I'll just get an Uber to my car, it's parked in a different part of town, and would probably just sleep in my car.

My friend obviously doesn't pick up the phone, so we start walking towards her place. I know where to turn towards her apartment so I cut the corner to gently lead.

We're now in front of her place and as she chains her bike up, I “call” my friend again. I say “I'll give him a few more minutes before I Uber. Do you mind if I come in and use your bathroom? Also don't want to freeze to death”. I drop in somewhere in the banter “man I would be so cold sleeping in my car tonight haha”.

We walk into the apartment, I drop a time constraint to keep the pressure low, saying if my buddy doesn't call back I'll get an Uber in a few minutes. Cashed out some emotional cash again, so more chatting to rebuild. In no time the tension that we had in the bar is back. Light physical escalation, make out a bit, then pressure off again. I ask about the art in the house, if she has any art in her room (seeding the next step), and then I ask if I can see her room.

Common objection – “noooo my room is such a mess though”. I just laugh, say I work for a moving company and have seen much worse. I like to elaborate, “what so you have dead cockroaches and dog hair all over? Can't be that bad...” to incline her to agree that no, it's not that bad, and get her to verbally make a decision in my favor. I jokingly promise I won't judge her. Once again, emotional bank account dips, so I lower pressure once again to rebuild, banter banter banter. Sit on her bed, mild physicality, and I take a chance by saying that I'm gonna order the Uber – she says “whatever, honestly you can stay the night, it's too cold to sleep in your car”. Sweet, all I needed to hear and that sealed the deal.

Sidenote, this was the first time a girl asked me how intoxicated I was to make sure that the sex is consensual. I was surprised but appreciated the gesture lol

(I don't drink)

Could you picture yourself doing this? Could you picture yourself doing this sober or close to sober?

My initial reaction to reading this was that the amount lying and deceit to a girl was just too much for me, especially to someone who had been out partying for Halloween. But after thinking about it...did this guy really cause any harm? He certainly didn't push anything too far physical escalation. And clearly the girl wanted to fuck - and she even asked for HIS consent first

If I was just willing to make up some bullshit I know I could have fucked that girl in my post above, and plenty of others recently that I knew were down. Seriously - a hot girl likes me, proactively invites me to cab home with her, and I don't close??

I've pulled only one girl from night game in the past 15 months or so. I'm somewhere around 40-50 lifetime notches, so I'm no scrub either. I think it's just time to adjust my game if I'm going to keep the nightlife worthwhile.

Recently my strategy has been to be completely transparent and straightforward with my intentions with the plan to invite her to my house after the club. This weekend I am going out with the intention of getting back to HER place because it seems infinitely easier. Asking for small "favors" and even guilt-tripping seems far more effective than trying to convince her to leave her friends and come back with me, where one "no thanks" shuts me down right away.

I am going to quickly screen all potential candidates in this order:

1. Proximity of her place to the club
2. Whether she lives with her parents or on her own
3. How she is getting home

If all three answers are favorable and I can tell she likes me, I am going to say whatever I need to in order to get in that cab or Uber, and then again to get into her place.

I'll report back to see how it works.