[RUGby1345]

Gentleman, I ask for your opinions on this situation in my LTR

My girl is great, we have so much love together. I will say up front that I don't cheat or lie to her. Honesty is a two way street with us. She is attracted to women and we have discussed bringing other women into bed since early on. We recently discussed me getting to have sex outside the relationship (with and without LTR) in exchange for some steps towards stability for her (moving in together and such). We had not gone into detail about rules or plans.

Not long before this, I exchanged information with a woman from my bank. I told my LTR about her when we met. Post having the conversation about sex with other women, I texted this new contact more frequently. The conversations were flirtatious and alluded to spanking etc, but were not outright sexual. I also met the contact for lunch but did not tell LTR at the time.

To make a long story short, LTR asked me if I was interested in this girl. I told her possibly. A few days later she sees the extent of the texts (we don't hide our phones) and learns about lunch. My LTR is now livid. She feels like i moved ahead without discussing how we were going to manage this. She also feels like I lied to her about my interest level.

My question is, did I fuck up? I'm worried that this upset her so much I won't get another chance to game for a long time, if ever. I'm not convinced that what a I did was totally wrong, but I have to handle this gently. I'm pretty new, but I felt my situation needed more seasoned opinions than other Newbies could offer. Your perspectives on how to handle this are appreciated.

[Steelex]

Not a huge fuck up. You hurt her comfort, but maybe increased her attraction to you a bit. Give things time to cool down.

Threesomes with an LTR are tricky. Even if she likes vagina, you talking to another girl puts her on the defense cause she feels betrayed. The key here is comfort. You have to make it seem like it's her idea you're the reluctant participant.

Last threesome I had, my gf never even knew that the other gal and I had been fucking for a while. I had the other gal chat her up at the bar, and things proceeded from there. It never seemed like I was scheming or eager for a threeway, even though it was all I could think about.

Don't despair, glory awaits. Nothing better than coming home from work and seeing two honeys on your bed stuffing each other with dildos, getting worked up for the main show.

[godzilla]

(07-02-2017 10:47 PM)RUGby1345 Wrote:  

Gentleman, I ask for your opinions on this situation in my LTR

My girl is great, we have so much love together. I will say up front that I don't cheat or lie to her. Honesty is a two way street with us. She is attracted to women and we have discussed bringing other women into bed since early on. We recently discussed me getting to have sex outside the relationship (with and without LTR) in exchange for some steps towards stability for her (moving in together and such). We had not gone into detail about rules or plans.

Not long before this, I exchanged information with a woman from my bank. I told my LTR about her when we met. Post having the conversation about sex with other women, I texted this new contact more frequently. The conversations were flirtatious and alluded to spanking etc, but were not outright sexual. I also met the contact for lunch but did not tell LTR at the time.

To make a long story short, LTR asked me if I was interested in this girl. I told her possibly. A few days later she sees the extent of the texts (we don't hide our phones) and learns about lunch. My LTR is now livid. She feels like i moved ahead without discussing how we were going to manage this. She also feels like I lied to her about my interest level.

My question is, did I fuck up? I'm worried that this upset her so much I won't get another chance to game for a long time, if ever. I'm not convinced that what a I did was totally wrong, but I have to handle this gently. I'm pretty new, but I felt my situation needed more seasoned opinions than other Newbies could offer. Your perspectives on how to handle this are appreciated.

I don't know your life situation but ill try to answer best I can.

Women come and go bro. If you have options like you say I wouldn't worry to much about another chance with her.

Once you try to introduce other women, your taking a big risk to the long term viability of your relationship. Even if your girl was for it, these things always have the potential to create jealousy and anger.

If some girl I was dating paid me $10,000 to fuck another guy. I'd probably not take this girl seriously long term

I'm sure some men have been in the same position and have gone to have a successful relationships but that doesn't mean it works most of the time.

That doesn't mean you should be monogamous either. I'm just saying people don't always say what they mean.

[Splord]

A third person never solidifies an LTR, in fact any kind of relationship. I mean would you still accept and respect her if she asked for a threesome with you and another guy? Yeah, yeah , in theory she's OK with it but she did react when she found out about the girl from the bank.
Pay attention to their actions, not their words.

Now, if you really wanted to go on with this, moral matters aside, you should have kept her completely in the dark, look at it this way, if you can't keep some things secret then you shouldn't try them.

(07-02-2017 10:47 PM)RUGby1345 Wrote:  

We recently discussed me getting to have sex outside the relationship (with and without LTR) in exchange for some steps towards stability for her (moving in together and such).

The fact that she even sees this as a transaction (you fuck around, she moves in) is a huge red flag.

[TornadoByProxy]

You fucked up because you're playing by her rules and don't even know it. Do you think she's asking her friends if she fucked up for getting livid? Or more likely, is she complaining to her friends about what YOU did?

You tried to be a playa when you weren't even in control of your LTR. The best course, if you haven't fucked up further, is to play it cool and never apologize. Women crave drama, but also use it as a shit test.

If you're apologizing and trying to "make up for it" you're losing her respect. Just tell the truth, you weren't moving forward. But don't act like you did anything wrong.

Longer term, 1) never live with a girl who wants to have 3somes. 2) There is NEVER any quid pro quo when it comes to relationships (I'll pay all the rent if I can cheat type of shit).

Best to drop any talk of 3somes, focus on getting control of your situation back, and in a couple months when she brings it back up, let her find the first girl you bring in.

[FTW, I already know OP's response. I will update with the results.]

[The Black Knight]

(07-02-2017 10:47 PM)RUGby1345 Wrote:  

Gentleman, I ask for your opinions on this situation in my LTR

My girl is great, we have so much love together. I will say up front that I don't cheat or lie to her. Honesty is a two way street with us. She is attracted to women and we have discussed bringing other women into bed since early on. We recently discussed me getting to have sex outside the relationship (with and without LTR) in exchange for some steps towards stability for her (moving in together and such). We had not gone into detail about rules or plans.

Not long before this, I exchanged information with a woman from my bank. I told my LTR about her when we met. Post having the conversation about sex with other women, I texted this new contact more frequently. The conversations were flirtatious and alluded to spanking etc, but were not outright sexual. I also met the contact for lunch but did not tell LTR at the time.

To make a long story short, LTR asked me if I was interested in this girl. I told her possibly. A few days later she sees the extent of the texts (we don't hide our phones) and learns about lunch. My LTR is now livid. She feels like i moved ahead without discussing how we were going to manage this. She also feels like I lied to her about my interest level.

Look at what I put in bold above.

Quote:

My question is, did I fuck up? I'm worried that this upset her so much I won't get another chance to game for a long time.

Yes, you fucked up. Big time.

You got into a LTR with a girl who wants to trade a potential open relationship for potential provisioning. Your entire frame is wrong.

1. You don't LTR chicks who are willing to negotiate/trade a one-sided (for now; doubt that will last) open relationship for stability (i.e your money) generally speaking. That's for when you're rich, old, powerful, and feel a need to keep up appearances. Just cut out the bullshit and go make an account on Seeking Arrangement if that's how you want to role.

2. "We don't hide our phones" - Dumb. For a thousand reasons.

3. Having a legit LTR and pulling off a threesome is a very delicate game for even experienced guys; with a real risk of it blowing up the LTR due to a variety of factors. This is real deal special operations warfare and your experience level right now is limited to playing Call of Duty on X-Box. Not trying to be a dick but you are way out of your depth when it comes to game and dealing with women.

What to do now and how to make the best of your situation?

1. Your LTR is already over. Ride it out with a "I don't give a fuck" attitude", get as many threesomes as you can and eject when the girl gets annoying and/or when you get bored.

2. Wrap it up. This girl is looking for "stability" and wanting to move in. The moment she realizes you are checking out, she might try to trap you.

3. Get a Google Voice number/another phone and start gaming other chicks. Do not LTR any of them until you actually know what you're doing when it comes to women.

4. Buy Bang. Day Bang. Read the forum top to bottom. Game more. When you realize and understand beyond a superficial level why sharing all of your phone correspondences with a woman is a bad idea, that's when you will know you have made some progress.

[RUGby1345]

Thanks for your replies guys. With your ideas and time to think I see some of my errors.

The idea for this was actually mine. I suggested taking next steps in our relationship. I thought that if I asserted my desire for 3rd party relationships and offered her that stability it would work for both of us. I see that linking the two was a mistake.

Also, call me lame, but I really don't Game. Just not my thing. I can be friendly and talkative when I want to be, but I'm introverted. I just don't feel like being bothered most of the time. I like being home with my girl. I enjoy that my woman comes home from work and cooks dinner for me. The excitement in having other women isn't the chase, I just wanna feel new pussy every once in a while. Steelex and TornadoByProxy both mentioned letting her select prospects and I think that would work

[Jetset]

(07-03-2017 12:53 PM)RUGby1345 Wrote:  

Thanks for your replies guys. With your ideas and time to think I see some of my errors.

The idea for this was actually mine. I suggested taking next steps in our relationship. I thought that if I asserted my desire for 3rd party relationships and offered her that stability it would work for both of us. I see that linking the two was a mistake.

Someday I will write a datasheet on my LTR and how I made related mistakes. Not quite the same problem, but similar thought process in an emergency.

Even if the two of you are partners in all things, as noted above, there is no quid pro pro. You must always mark out your territory of which things are in your domain and this cannot be conditional, or else she will feel entitled to fight about it and control it. You, because you love her, will feel bad and make concessions until you become resentful and contemptuous of each other.

It is a terrible uphill battle to reclaim this territory once lost, because it is literally your own life that you're trying to take back. Especially if you are the breadwinner, it has to be clear that you are building yourself an awesome life that makes you happy and she is invited along for the ride on the condition that she makes you happy and doesn't cause trouble.

Quote:

Also, call me lame, but I really don't Game. Just not my thing. I can be friendly and talkative when I want to be, but I'm introverted. I just don't feel like being bothered most of the time. I like being home with my girl. I enjoy that my woman comes home from work and cooks dinner for me. The excitement in having other women isn't the chase, I just wanna feel new pussy every once in a while. Steelex and TornadoByProxy both mentioned letting her select prospects and I think that would work

Game is more than being friendly and talkative to get numbers. People here are talking about maintaining frame and staying in a position of strength in your LTR, and that's game, too.

I would also strongly warn you that she is likely to sabotage this process, since, as mentioned before, there is no quid pro quo. It is imaginary, lip service only. She has what she wants and clearly perceives other women as a threat - as women do. Letting her choose may help to put her mind at ease, but it won't turn it into the fantasy you have in your imagination where she enthuses about watching you bang another woman. She does not want to do this, she just wants to move in (and probably does not value it as highly as you think she should, since it was your idea). Literally inviting her to exercise direct control over where you put your cock will invite conflict. In her mind, the results will be entirely your fault because you "made" her let you sleep with other women, holding the advancement of the relationship hostage.

Also, lock your damn phone. Are you kidding with that?

[McCarthy]

Cannot Americans have normal, adult lives?

Please, don't bring kids to the World. Thanks.

[Steelex]

(07-03-2017 03:55 PM)McCarthy Wrote:  

Cannot Americans have normal, adult lives?

Please, don't bring kids to the World. Thanks.

There is nothing wrong with pursuing your goals, even if society says it's wrong.

There is no right or wrong, only what you want and how you're going to get it.

[McCarthy]

(07-03-2017 04:32 PM)Steelex Wrote:  

(07-03-2017 03:55 PM)McCarthy Wrote:  

Cannot Americans have normal, adult lives?

Please, don't bring kids to the World. Thanks.

There is nothing wrong with pursuing your goals, even if society says it's wrong.

There is no right or wrong, only what you want and how you're going to get it.

#yougogirl

[Jetset]

(07-03-2017 04:44 PM)McCarthy Wrote:  

#yougogirl

On the list of things that "are my problem", the relative moral merits of OP's sexual choices are strangely absent.

If he wants to organize biker gangbangs for his girl and it makes him happy, I'm not about to stand in his way. Whatever it is that fulfills his life, he's going about it wrong if he tries to trade relationship promises for it.

The ultimate culmination of this broken thinking is "if we have a baby, they'll HAVE to fall in line"! The perceived shortcoming the thinking is addressed to is irrelevant.

[Steelex]

Fuckin White Knight.

(07-03-2017 04:44 PM)McCarthy Wrote:  

(07-03-2017 04:32 PM)Steelex Wrote:  

(07-03-2017 03:55 PM)McCarthy Wrote:  

Cannot Americans have normal, adult lives?

Please, don't bring kids to the World. Thanks.

There is nothing wrong with pursuing your goals, even if society says it's wrong.

There is no right or wrong, only what you want and how you're going to get it.

#yougogirl

[Leonard D Neubache]

Comes to RVF.

Quote:

Cannot Americans have normal, adult lives?

U lost bro?

As for the OP the other members have done a good job.I will summarise my concerns.

Quote:

My girl is great, we have so much love together. Honesty is a two way street with us. She is attracted to women and we have discussed bringing other women into bed since early on. We recently discussed me getting to have sex outside the relationship (with and without LTR) in exchange for some steps towards stability for her (moving in together and such).

You're riding first class in an aircraft that doesn't have enough fuel to clear the ocean. Start looking for a fucking parachute, mate. It's not "if" this becomes a catastrophe. It's "when".

[Steelex]

I missed the part about her trading your infidelity for monetary value. Or something like that.

Gotta cosign Leonard on this one. She's a ho.

[RatInTheWoods]

Isn't it just like "if I let you threesome now and again, can we get hitched?"

Probably in her logic, the thing holding him back from commitment is missing out on stray, so shes leaving the door open.

But saying what she will do, then actually doing it are two different things, as evidenced by her reaction to the OP moving on her idea...

OP - just turn it around, and say "it was your suggestion to go for threesomes, I was just setting the table" and then counter attack "its obvious you are saying one thing and acting another, this kind of dishonesty is a concern for me" - then ghost off and put some distance. She will come back to you.

[Leonard D Neubache]

Dude loves her, unless there's some sort of ESL language issue in play.

Giving advice about what he should tell her is like trying to convince a dog to bite it's master with just the right amount of force.

He needs to lock down her bullshit, demand his end game and let her walk away if that's her response. The problem is that he's walked into a metaphorical knife fight here and he's only just realised it. The decisions he makes will have long lasting and potentially catastrophic consequences, financially and emotionally.

Likely the first thing he needs to do is honestly ask himself whether he's going to submit to this girl and her whims if she threatens to leave him. Generally speaking that's the first and only relevant question in a situation like this.

[blck]

LND is on point.
Dude got psy ops hard to the point of thinking he is part of what SHE is deciding.

First she is with him but prefer girls then she want a 3some but you know that girls inviting you in a 3some is more about them rubing themselves and you wanking your wiener on the side watching the action taking place.

He show some alphaness by finding a prospect but been shutdown (worrying that she didn't like the fact that he took the initiative, even for her own good).

This won't end well...

[Jetset]

(07-04-2017 02:19 AM)RatInTheWoods Wrote:  

Isn't it just like "if I let you threesome now and again, can we get hitched?"

Probably in her logic, the thing holding him back from commitment is missing out on stray, so shes leaving the door open.

But saying what she will do, then actually doing it are two different things, as evidenced by her reaction to the OP moving on her idea...

OP - just turn it around, and say "it was your suggestion to go for threesomes, I was just setting the table" and then counter attack "its obvious you are saying one thing and acting another, this kind of dishonesty is a concern for me" - then ghost off and put some distance. She will come back to you.

Calling out the duplicity is a pretty good idea.

My read is that she thinks she'll "fix" this situation with time. The only way I can imagine this being at all sustainable is if she's actually the type of woman who proactively wants to play with other women, and OP hasn't indicated that at all.

[Dalaran1991]

What continues to baffle me is the amount of new guys opening threads with "hey guys I got a great LTR we do threesomes all the time. Now I fucked up / she wants me to buy her a house / she wants to fuck another guy, what to?"

As if "letting you have 3somes" is a great LTR quality, while in fact it is the blaring klaxon call to jump ship.
Learn to fucking sort bitches. 3somes are awesome harem materials, but you'd better damn well have your ass (and dick) covered.

Most LTRs are dead on arrivals because guys keep thinking with their dicks.

[Steelex]

(07-04-2017 09:55 AM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

Most LTRs are dead on arrivals because guys keep thinking with their dicks.

Most relationships are dead on arrival no matter what.

For the most part people stay in relationships out of convenience and apathy, not out of enjoyment.

How happy can another person really make you?

[Leonard D Neubache]

Dalaran is right but I wanted a non-married dick-swinger to say it first because it sounds like old-man talk coming from me.

I never loved a girl and simultaneously wanted to fuck other girls. I could appreciate how it might be pleasurable but it was never something I pursued.

Dudes saying they "love" a girl while they're sticking their dick in someone else? Issues.

[Jetset]

(07-05-2017 03:42 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

Dalaran is right but I wanted a non-married dick-swinger to say it first because it sounds like old-man talk coming from me.

I never loved a girl and simultaneously wanted to fuck other girls. I could appreciate how it might be pleasurable but it was never something I pursued.

Dudes saying they "love" a girl while they're sticking their dick in someone else? Issues.

[RUGby1345]

Thanks again everyone for giving me more to think about. Shout out to Leonard, I've read your posts all over the forum and appreciate your knowledge.

As far as me and my girl go, I've never had any inclination to end our relationship. I've found the closest thing to a unicorn I can imagine finding. I love and enjoy her, thus she stays. She's a woman, so she comes with the pros and cons. She got angry, we all do. I won't blame her for the things I did wrong in setting this up. And I don't think either of us are wrong for wanting to explore the threesome. But you guys are right that if she can't be consistent and can't handle it moving forward it will be an issue. I pegged her with that, and we sat down and discuss what we needed to do. It was my fault for not setting the frame for this in the first place. I'm going to give it some time before we try again just for her sake. The smartest thing might be to leave it alone, but where's the fun in that?

[dknightbro]

The main problem is you act like some "honest" good boy BF who can talk to her about anything and then dip your toes elsewhere.

You don't own being a player. It would have been better if you had outright had her thinking of you as a straight out player and she still chose to be with you.

Watch how the dynamics of the relationship change with this subtle, but important point. Your indecisiveness is unattractive.

I did this before and I held the power in the relationship. I conditioned myself to walk away at any moment and that moment did come when she chit test me with an ultimatum with "where is this going?" I straight out told her I like her and let's just be friends first. I said this could be our last moment together so let's enjoy it and see where it goes and you are free to leave whenever you want.

Needless to say, we had a great time that night.

From henceforth, she traveled a long way to see ME, not the other way around. Most guys would crush under the pressure and "compromise" and try to be the good boy.