[Graft]

(02-21-2019 05:17 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

You couldnt pay me enough money to work in an office environment in the USSA. CANADA UK etc. Its suicide.

Because I have experience in many verticals I am adaptable, resilient and robust. Well prepared for navigating this rapidly changing world. I would definitely not reccomend putting all your eggs in one basket.

I work from home, as does my team. I have lived and worked all over the world. Especially as it pertains to this forum. Ill share that my career path has allowed me to live as a perpetual traveler following my passions like Gaming women, Bowhunting, Spearfishing, Sailing, Martial Arts, motorcycles, windsurfing etc.. Ive lived in Colombia, Mexico, Namibia, Ukraine, Estonia, im headed to Spain soon. Im married to a beautiful blue eyed blonde that is submissive and feminine. I have 2 beautiful children.... None of that would have likely happened living in a shithole city selling medical devices. .

Those VP of sales guys at established firms make big bucks but they are all fucking miserable from exchanging their freedom and passions for money.

I place more value on my freedom and location independance than the size of my income. That said, i make enough to live my own personal dream.

I live my life with alot of the concepts that Tim Ferris talks about in his book 4 hour work week.

Be very careful taking any advice from a guy like Graft, although your likely to make some money. It will likely be at the expense of your dreams, passions... In short it will crush your soul.

Just food for thaught.

I wasn't taking a shot at you personally or your career choice. obviously yours is much better for full remote work, digital nomad, and your lifestyle. I get that.

I'm giving advice on how to get to the top of a high paying sales industry in America, particularly tech. Nothing more.

[Iconoclast007]

Graft.

Yeah I wouldnt know anything about climbing corporate ladders other than its not something I would pursue. Its soul crushing to work in those environments.

I think what I say will strike a chord with members of this forum who are looking for a way out of the western rat race, feminist women, boring life etc.

I say when your in your 20s to sell as many different things as you can so that you have broad experiences to draw from and networks to reach back to. Remote work is done over the phone, email, conferencing. Learning the logistics of telesales, managing sales people at various levels, and call centers and sophisticated systems and processes that bring various products to market is an extremely valuable skill.

In a nutshell what I have done is find semi succsessfull startups that have hit a critical mass to scale-up. I plug in cloud based, virtual call center oriented B2B sales protocols and technology and stirr...

[ChicagoFire]

Re: MSC/medical device

I got off of the conference call hours ago where the presenter talked about how the college finds jobs for graduates. They emphasize the job isn't for everyone and I definitely get the vibe once I give them my money they will run just like how my alma mater did to me (BTW fuck you xyz University). I'm still iffy about the opportunity not so much that I can't comprehend the material or afford it. I need to do more research and weigh my other options. I might actually be able to leave Illinois altogether and do this in another state. I will echo what EE and Graft have posted before this field is growing and there's large margins. This is a highly techical job that combines salesmanship not your standard used car dealership lot.

Since my sales skills are minimal I'm almost certainly ending up as an ASR making 50K per year with no pressure to sell. Eventually they promote and at that point you collect that commission. There comes the 6 digits $$$ Graft is talking about.

Funny enough one of the callers was a Canadian and raised concerns about how some US companies don't want to go through the trouble of visas.

[Zeroblack]

Salesforce interview was exactly like Graft had said. Collecting basic information to pass on and I'll know in the next few days whether or not there's an in person. The other interview was ok, startup was very early stage, also collecting basic info.

Tomorrow I have a second round interview with a promising tech company.

[Libertas]

Right on about residential real estate having high failure. I'm thinking about trying to break into commercial real estate this year though. Who has more experience in this field? What would you have to say?

[Graft]

(02-24-2019 07:02 PM)Libertas Wrote:  

Right on about residential real estate having high failure. I'm thinking about trying to break into commercial real estate this year though. Who has more experience in this field? What would you have to say?

Would avoid.

Commercial real estate is high ticket sales (large dollar amounts). So young guys are making an absolute killing in the field.

However, it's a commission only position (usually). They bring you in, ask who you know, you bang the phones all day for a year or two while getting paid almost nothing. Apparently if you can stick it out to year 3 you can start seeing some regular income. Very high failure rate. Expect to make tens of thousands of phone calls before you start seeing good money.

I hate commission only jobs because it shows the company doesn't expect you to succeed and won't invest anything with you. Commercial real estate is an industry with a lot of nepotism, getting in and killing it has a lot to do if you have family in the business and utilizing their connections. Like everything else, it helps to have rich parents or a safety net to supplement while you work 60 hours a week without income.

In New York City, I'd say residential has a lower fail rate. If you join one of the decent shops you will always have $2,000/mo apartments to rent. Small time shit, but still an okay income if you can move a few a month.

[EndsExpect]

(02-19-2019 08:40 PM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

Here's another idea:
I've found sales internships on the medreps site. Yay or nay? Even at just 36K that's much more than what I've made in the food industry. I'm specifically referring to Medical Sales College. I hate settling for singles and would rather shoot for 80K but if the opportunity comes along I might just take it for the experience.
Edit:
Oh shit just 8 weeks of training at a "measly" 6-8K (college can cost 20K per year) and you can potentially make approximately 150K???? This is a bit too good to be true. Would love to hear from the RooshV community about this.
http://medicalsalescollege.com/
https://www.reddit.com/r/sales/comments/...ont_shoot/
I'm getting the read of it isn't a scam but you will have to put in insane hours even after you get hired...FUCKING WOW!!!!

I would not choose to go this route. What they teach you will be invaluable, but you can learn it for free if you get an entry level position.

(02-20-2019 09:59 AM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

Just got off the phone with a recruiter from MSC:
They offer internships which are very competitive and next openings are for the Florida location in May. Pay is 36K and after 1 year of working they give you free tuition into their program.
If you don't want to go that route they do have their 8 or 12 week program. 12 weeks is for a dual study 8 is for one subject. There's also an online program.
Like OP and countless others have said in sales employers want to see if you have drive. If you do go through this program very important word of advice is to be prepared for the interview. I was told point blank they will correlate being clueless with being clueless in the surgical room. The recruiter emphasized that it would help to have B2B experience but if you don't there's potential to "settle" for a role as an ASR. You make 50K supporting the sales rep but don't have to sell. Once you get a year of experience you can move up.
I'm on the fence about this and I'll research for 2 hours and fill out an application later today. Even at just 50K I will make more than middle management at my deadend food industry jobs (some with 10+ years of experience). With higher education program they always say there's people that will help you out with placement which is a total lie. My alma mater pretty much threw me under the bus when I graduated and took my money. Bottom line is this isn't a scam but don't expect to half ass everyday in class and get a job. To get the most out of this program you have to excel at your classes and network like crazy as a student.

So, this internship... what do you sell? Will you spend that year convincing people to drop their money on this school?

I've never seen anyone come up through this program, but then I rarely see anyone new in my end because I'm not a DSR anymore. If you are interested I can ask a DSR or a Surg Rep if they have seen anyone successful with this program.

[EndsExpect]

(02-21-2019 08:34 PM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

Re: MSC/medical device
I got off of the conference call hours ago where the presenter talked about how the college finds jobs for graduates. They emphasize the job isn't for everyone and I definitely get the vibe once I give them my money they will run just like how my alma mater did to me (BTW fuck you xyz University). I'm still iffy about the opportunity not so much that I can't comprehend the material or afford it. I need to do more research and weigh my other options. I might actually be able to leave Illinois altogether and do this in another state. I will echo what EE and Graft have posted before this field is growing and there's large margins. This is a highly techical job that combines salesmanship not your standard used car dealership lot.
Since my sales skills are minimal I'm almost certainly ending up as an ASR making 50K per year with no pressure to sell. Eventually they promote and at that point you collect that commission. There comes the 6 digits $$$ Graft is talking about.
Funny enough one of the callers was a Canadian and raised concerns about how some US companies don't want to go through the trouble of visas.

I think they are wasting your time. The training course will likely be helpful in learning the industry, but I really doubt they will help you get a job at all.

Why don't you find an ASR job and send me the job number and the company. I will see if I know someone who works there that can get you straight to the hiring manager. However, you have to be willing to do a phonecall with me first.

Last week I found a Corporate Accounts Manager position. I sent an email to my friend Ashley... who I have known for 5 years now. She sent my resume straight to the VP of sales who makes hiring decisions and I have an interview scheduled for March 12th. This job pays 200k.

[Zeroblack]

I think I'm back to square one.

The tech company will get back to me next week, but I think they're looking for the perfect candidate since they want to "see what's out there in the market".
One of the other companies I had a second interview with followed up with me today because we ran out of time. She didn't seem as positive as the last time we talked.

Here are some hard stats for you guys:
Started sending out resumes on January 20th.
First interview on February 1st.
14 potential companies got in touch. Dropped down to 9 for external reasons; filled up, not looking anymore, too far, etc.
9 first round interviews.
3 second round interviews.

There's a big drop off from the first to second rounds. I've followed EndsExpects interviewing tips to the T. Either the market has become saturated with sdrs or there's something missing from my interviewing skills.

[Zeroblack]

As a way to give back to the people in this thread who have given me advice, here's a book I'd like to share with you guys:

Triangle Selling: Sales Fundamentals to Fuel Growth by Hilmon Sorey, Cory Bray



It's written by a salesman who has used Sandler Sales for 20 years, from the book "You Can't Teach A Kid To Ride A Bike At A Seminar" mentioned by a poster on the second page of this thread. He's modified it to the Saas tech space for a modern take on the Sandler Sales process.
It's been referred to me by a highly credible source, so I think you guys will get some nuggets out of it.

Cheers gentlemen!

[Zeroblack]

(02-25-2019 06:16 PM)Zeroblack Wrote:  

I think I'm back to square one.

The tech company will get back to me next week, but I think they're looking for the perfect candidate since they want to "see what's out there in the market".
One of the other companies I had a second interview with followed up with me today because we ran out of time. She didn't seem as positive as the last time we talked.

Here are some hard stats for you guys:
Started sending out resumes on January 20th.
First interview on February 1st.
14 potential companies got in touch. Dropped down to 9 for external reasons; filled up, not looking anymore, too far, etc.
9 first round interviews.
3 second round interviews.

There's a big drop off from the first to second rounds. I've followed EndsExpects interviewing tips to the T. Either the market has become saturated with sdrs or there's something missing from my interviewing skills.

Just had 3 interviews today. I think what's going on is that Startups have done all their hiring from summer to December. But March might mean a new season in hiring.

In addition, I found out that the best responses are just to google top 10 common interview questions and answers and model your response in similar fashion. At this level, anything else is just too aggressive or weird.

Next two days 2 more!

[ChicagoFire]

(02-25-2019 02:33 AM)EndsExpect Wrote:  

Why don't you find an ASR job and send me the job number and the company. I will see if I know someone who works there that can get you straight to the hiring manager. However, you have to be willing to do a phonecall with me first.

Last week I found a Corporate Accounts Manager position. I sent an email to my friend Ashley... who I have known for 5 years now. She sent my resume straight to the VP of sales who makes hiring decisions and I have an interview scheduled for March 12th. This job pays 200k.

Duhhhh!!!! Man I should have shot for the ASR job, here I am wasting time hitting up recruiters that want me to swing for the fences by applying for rep roles. PM sent. Even just 40K would be a game changer. Thank you EE.

The seriously great news today is an oil company called me up and I just have to drive out to their facility for an informal interview. I need to do more reading on the company but off the top of my head they train people for rig work.

@ZeroBlack
That sucks. Have you ever thought about expanding your job search into other high paying fields? I don't know your background but that's what I've been doing. At worst it gives you practice and more power in your interviews because you know you can get hired for xyz position instead of your current role.

One trick you can do that nobody here has stated on this thread is bring in donuts for the office. You're failing at either being qualified or likeable.

[Graft]

https://www.linkedin.com/groups/8671209/

This group is for entry level med reps opportunities, ran by a med reps recruiter for entry level.

[Zeroblack]

(02-26-2019 11:02 PM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

(02-25-2019 02:33 AM)EndsExpect Wrote:  

Why don't you find an ASR job and send me the job number and the company. I will see if I know someone who works there that can get you straight to the hiring manager. However, you have to be willing to do a phonecall with me first.

Last week I found a Corporate Accounts Manager position. I sent an email to my friend Ashley... who I have known for 5 years now. She sent my resume straight to the VP of sales who makes hiring decisions and I have an interview scheduled for March 12th. This job pays 200k.

Duhhhh!!!! Man I should have shot for the ASR job, here I am wasting time hitting up recruiters that want me to swing for the fences by applying for rep roles. PM sent. Even just 40K would be a game changer. Thank you EE.

The seriously great news today is an oil company called me up and I just have to drive out to their facility for an informal interview. I need to do more reading on the company but off the top of my head they train people for rig work.

@ZeroBlack
That sucks. Have you ever thought about expanding your job search into other high paying fields? I don't know your background but that's what I've been doing. At worst it gives you practice and more power in your interviews because you know you can get hired for xyz position instead of your current role.

One trick you can do that nobody here has stated on this thread is bring in donuts for the office. You're failing at either being qualified or likeable.

I haven't done that yet because new companies are reaching out for first round calls. In addition, there's still a chance March will bring changes. I'll pm you my qualifications so you can judge for yourself.

There's a thread on here that touched on that idea. I'll look into it.

[Thrill Jackson]

(02-20-2019 10:35 PM)Graft Wrote:  

Zero Black.

Its called the 80/20 rule. 20 % of the sales people make 80% of the money. Being thick skinned enough to handle rejection. Overcoming objections that most sales guys cower to. And having a tenacious work ethis are essential atributes. When you add in the remote aspect which requires self starting and saying no to distractions an aditional 80% of sales guys that can sell in a structured environment, fail when working remotely.

Sales is alot like game. Infact before I learned and started practicing gaming women I was a succsessfull sales proffesional and usually outperformed sales teams of 30+ closers. I just never transferred the skillset to women. Once I made the connection wvwrything was downhill from there and my life got a hell of alot better!


I wouldn't take this post too seriously.

He's right about the 80/20 rule. 20% of salespeople that take the right steps, choose the right industry and a company with a game changing product, make 80% of the money.

If you dick around in B2C, door to door sales, startups, etc then yeah, most guys won't make shit except the top performers.

Selling shouldn't be incredibly difficult. It's picking a company that people want to talk to, with good marketing, inbound leads, brand name, being persistent, and applying some pressure for the close.

I don't even look at companies where more than 10-20% of reps are making less than 200k. It's setting myself up for failure.

Being a good salesperson is important. What's more important is choosing the right industry (tech or medical device) and the right product.

I can take the top 20 salespeople from enterprise tech with seven figure W2s and put them in a 1099 gig selling life insurance and they won't break 50k. Those 20 salespeople got to where they are because of solid skills, but mostly because of applying their talent in the right place at the right time.

"You'll make the most money in sales" is potentially the worst career advice of all time because it doesn't differentiate between the guy selling you your cell phone plan or your Nissan and the guy who sold $300 million of IBM mainframes to one of the largest companies in the world.

Everyone should consider themselves fortunate that I'm here telling you the difference, because early in my career I didn't have that guidance and spent too much time in low paying shit thinking that I'd be the 1% making a killing.

I don't even look at companies where more than 10-20% of reps are making less than 200k. It's setting myself up for failure.

How do you identify these companies? Do you just ask around or do you look through Linkedin/Glassdoor?

[Graft]

(02-27-2019 10:06 PM)Thrill Jackson Wrote:  

(02-20-2019 10:35 PM)Graft Wrote:  

Zero Black.

Its called the 80/20 rule. 20 % of the sales people make 80% of the money. Being thick skinned enough to handle rejection. Overcoming objections that most sales guys cower to. And having a tenacious work ethis are essential atributes. When you add in the remote aspect which requires self starting and saying no to distractions an aditional 80% of sales guys that can sell in a structured environment, fail when working remotely.

Sales is alot like game. Infact before I learned and started practicing gaming women I was a succsessfull sales proffesional and usually outperformed sales teams of 30+ closers. I just never transferred the skillset to women. Once I made the connection wvwrything was downhill from there and my life got a hell of alot better!


I wouldn't take this post too seriously.

He's right about the 80/20 rule. 20% of salespeople that take the right steps, choose the right industry and a company with a game changing product, make 80% of the money.

If you dick around in B2C, door to door sales, startups, etc then yeah, most guys won't make shit except the top performers.

Selling shouldn't be incredibly difficult. It's picking a company that people want to talk to, with good marketing, inbound leads, brand name, being persistent, and applying some pressure for the close.

I don't even look at companies where more than 10-20% of reps are making less than 200k. It's setting myself up for failure.

Being a good salesperson is important. What's more important is choosing the right industry (tech or medical device) and the right product.

I can take the top 20 salespeople from enterprise tech with seven figure W2s and put them in a 1099 gig selling life insurance and they won't break 50k. Those 20 salespeople got to where they are because of solid skills, but mostly because of applying their talent in the right place at the right time.

"You'll make the most money in sales" is potentially the worst career advice of all time because it doesn't differentiate between the guy selling you your cell phone plan or your Nissan and the guy who sold $300 million of IBM mainframes to one of the largest companies in the world.

Everyone should consider themselves fortunate that I'm here telling you the difference, because early in my career I didn't have that guidance and spent too much time in low paying shit thinking that I'd be the 1% making a killing.

I don't even look at companies where more than 10-20% of reps are making less than 200k. It's setting myself up for failure.

How do you identify these companies? Do you just ask around or do you look through Linkedin/Glassdoor?

Industry knowledge. For most field reps at top tech companies, target earnings are in the 200's. So if a rep has a 220k plan then he'll make at least 110k guaranteed and will still break 200k if he misses his plan by 10%.

Top enterprise tech companies in my opinion are:

First tier:
-Oracle
-Cisco
-Salesforce
-SAP
-Microsoft
-Amazon Web Services
-Vmware
-IBM
-Symantec
-Dell EMC
-HPE

2nd Tier (not necessarily worse, just smaller/more specialized)
-SAS
-Google (Cloud)
-Citrix
-Red Hat
-Adobe
-Netsuite
-Informatica
-TIBCO
-Workday
-Splunk
-Cloudera
-Infor
-Box
-Dropbox

If any division in any of these companies has less than half the reps hitting quota then there is going to be some major restructuring/changing quotas/major layoffs.

Always look through Glassdoor.

Always ask the manager/interviewer/recruiter what percent of reps are hitting quota.

The smaller the company the less you can trust. If its not one of the above companies ask for an actual stack ranking.

[ChicagoFire]

^^

I wish I could rep you again. If I were to go the tech sales route I wouldn't be filling out applications or dealing with HR nonsense. All I would do is message the hiring manager, recruiter, etc to meet up and seal the deal from there. The trick is to know what the hiring manager wants in his/her personal or professional life.

I got quite a handful of job searching work for the next few days. You all probably already know I have offers from oil companies that are willing to train me and other recruiters that want to see me. I'm like a hot girl now lol instead of the ugly chick passing food out at the cafeteria. Thanks once again Graft.

[ChicagoFire]

EE just called me a couple minutes ago, I really want to publicly thank him for that.

[Zeroblack]

^^
Let me also say thanks for everyone who's given advice to me.
Graft has taken the time to do a phone call as well yesterday and it means a lot.

I really love this forum.

[Thrill Jackson]

With everything going to the cloud would selling Data Center Hardware (HPE, Dell EMC, Cisco storage, etc.) be hustling backwards? Or would be selling for those companies still be great experience?

[Graft]

(03-02-2019 10:07 PM)Thrill Jackson Wrote:  

With everything going to the cloud would selling Data Center Hardware (HPE, Dell EMC, Cisco storage, etc.) be hustling backwards? Or would be selling for those companies still be great experience?

Good question and I will try to comment based on my knowledge of the data center industry.

The cloud is definitely a threat but a good amount of it is hype. Some applications are perfect for the cloud, others are terrible and companies are finding out that cloud costs can spiral out of control very quickly.

There's no way that any of those big three hardware providers are going away and most likely they will continue to develop their own cloud solutions that compete with the traditional cloud vendors. Pretty much every major company uses traditional hardware from one or more of those vendors so I wouldn't worry about them not having a presence.

As for hustling backwards-only if you work for a top cloud company like AWS or VMware. Getting a field job at Cisco/HPE/Dell is a home run for your sales career if you haven't made it to a top 10 tech company yet. I'd much rather work for one of those three than a second tier cloud company like Google or Rackspace.

That being said, I've noticed that getting jobs at hardware companies like Dell/HP/Cisco is less competitive than top cloud companies like AWS and Microsoft. Hardware companies will often hire top performers from industries like medical device or office supplies while AWS or Microsoft rarely does that.

I look at industry trends for a hobby as it is fun to pretend to be a CEO but it really isn't important for my career. If I have an offer from both AWS and HPE, i'm not looking at the trends of cloud vs on premise hardware. I'm looking at my comp plan and territory and how long it will take me to hit VP. All of the companies that you mentioned are too big to fail. Dell was a shitty PC company and then bought the #1 enterprise hardware company and the #1 enterprise software company and became an absolute powerhouse.

[Alpha_Ambitionz]

I'm currently getting paid $17 an hour to make phone calls for a real estate company. The commission structure is shit: I only get paid a small amount of money if the appointment I set converts.

In the past, I've done many other "crappy" sales jobs, such as selling knives, selling anti-aging skin creams, and trying to get people to donate to charities.

I'm hoping that I can use all this experience to get one of these SDR roles you guys have been talking about.

So, I googled "SDR jobs" in my city and most of them start about about 20$ an hour (so 40k base salary) + commission.

However, some of them require at least 1 year of B2B and SaaS experience, which I don't have.

Also, graduating with a useless bachelor's degree in psychology means I don't have a background in tech or medicine.

These missing qualifications are what discourages me the most.

At the same time, there are some SDR jobs that just require you to have some sales/telephone experience, which I do have.

So hopefully in the future, I'll be able to land one of these jobs.

[ChicagoFire]

If you don't like your job then job search. Or set aside time on your off days and learn a new skill and transition into something else. I just talked to a buddy of mine yesterday and he lucked out when he got fired and got a higher paying job within a week. Or you can be like me and spend years on and off and something eventually hits.

Your best bet is to go on Angel's list and get a phone interview with a startup. Some companies will hire you based on your experience. Good luck!

[Zeroblack]

You can use your experience from the current job to make a great resume. The bachelor's degree doesn't really matter, I have an Associate's degree and no one said that's bad they just ask why the change.

The 1 year b2b and Saas experience is usually waived if you can show some kind of accomplishment in your sales job, all it means is they want to see you're successful.

However, there's usually only one technical requirement that comes up often and that's CRM experience. I suggest you go to Hubspot or Salesforce for their free CRM certification. I'm getting mine from Hubspot because I couldn't find the course from Salesforce. It takes at most 2 hours.

From there, you have a reasonable chance of breaking in. But that's assuming you try to break in now, not waiting until a year later. I'm almost certain it will be many times harder later.

I'm also breaking in to b2b from a b2c background, and I know for sure that I'm almost there. If you want some suggestions about who to target and how, and what I've found successful, pm me.

(03-05-2019 05:06 PM)Alpha_Ambitionz Wrote:  

I'm currently getting paid $17 an hour to make phone calls for a real estate company. The commission structure is shit: I only get paid a small amount of money if the appointment I set converts.

In the past, I've done many other "crappy" sales jobs, such as selling knives, selling anti-aging skin creams, and trying to get people to donate to charities.

I'm hoping that I can use all this experience to get one of these SDR roles you guys have been talking about.

So, I googled "SDR jobs" in my city and most of them start about about 20$ an hour (so 40k base salary) + commission.

However, some of them require at least 1 year of B2B and SaaS experience, which I don't have.

Also, graduating with a useless bachelor's degree in psychology means I don't have a background in tech or medicine.

These missing qualifications are what discourages me the most.

At the same time, there are some SDR jobs that just require you to have some sales/telephone experience, which I do have.

So hopefully in the future, I'll be able to land one of these jobs.

[Zeroblack]

(03-05-2019 05:42 PM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

If you don't like your job then job search. Or set aside time on your off days and learn a new skill and transition into something else. I just talked to a buddy of mine yesterday and he lucked out when he got fired and got a higher paying job within a week. Or you can be like me and spend years on and off and something eventually hits.

Your best bet is to go on Angel's list and get a phone interview with a startup. Some companies will hire you based on your experience. Good luck!

I second the Angel's list for a phone interview. And I found more success bypassing Angel's list and going straight to emailing the vp directly. If anything it cuts your wait time by a lot.