[tanner]

I often read in Men articles that men must become confident if they are too attract women bc that is what women are attracted to.

For example:

Part 1: Become an attractive man

The Tao of Badass introduces you to the term ‘badass’ to create a clear picture of what makes the ideal ladies man. With this you’ll learn exactly what women are attracted to so that you can model yourself . The next chapter is dedicated to boosting your confidence levels. Women love men who are oozing with confidence. So you learn some vital tips to become more confident around women. This is accomplished by revealing some brilliant self belief techniques to help raise your self esteem and ultimately become more attractive.
-------------------------------------------------

Now just what is this confidence that one needs to have all these fancy techniques to develop?

The fact is confidence is mostly a natural state for any male or female - and even animals. One loses confidence when they are no longer in their natural self.

Feminism has destroyed masculine identity, hence most men are disconnected with it and themselves. This leads to an unnatural state of mind.

No amount of confidence building techniques is going to build a natural state of confidence. It will only be superficial.

Building natural and normal confidence in theory should take no effort as it is a natural state.

One simply needs real knowledge about what their real nature is - whether it is masculine or feminine identity.

Women who are attracted to men who are oozing with confidence are usually mentally fucked up. They are usually insecure of their own feminine identity and they find a temporary sense of security in men who are artificially confident. They are the one's who become very needy, start nagging, and eventually become psychotic.

Hence anyone offering techniques to help men develop confidence so to attract women is starting off from the wrong paradigm.

just my humble opinion.

[Phoenix]

Almost all of the confidence stuff out there, including the above post, is pure blather.

Confidence is not something that is done. It is not something that can come from tips. It is not something that comes naturally.

Confidence comes from experience. The man starting out riding a motorbike does so very gingerly, very fearfully, very slowly and carefully. The man who has been riding for 5 years feels the motorbike as an extension of his body. It is no different with women. The man who has no prior success with women is less confident than the man who just pulled a lay two days ago. The only bridge between those two states is putting in the time, in the face of uncertainty.

Confidence building comes only from work. Asserting yourself and taking action in spite of your lack of confidence (and thus anxiety), so that you can build your experience and understanding that creates that confidence. When I first started going on dates I would write out an actual list of questions in preparation. Now I can effortlessly maintain a conversation for hours even with a boring girl. The first time I went into a bar by myself, I felt as uncomfortable and awkward as shit. Now I feel equally confident as I do walking in with some friends. The first time I went out alone just to try and get laid, it wasn't very pleasant and there was no chance of success in sight. Now I know there is a decent chance it can end in a lay. Things like that add up. Confidence is earned.

Masculinity and femininity, 'natural states', feminism, or whatever else, have nothing to do with it, and there is nothing abnormal about women being attracted to confidence. I'd stay away from any of the 'theory' stuff floating around, and just stick to practical activity.

[WestIndianArchie]

To me, talk of confidence is up there with "just be yourself".

Useless platitudes from people who don't actively try to bang women

WIA

[ksbms]

(03-29-2016 10:58 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

Almost all of the confidence stuff out there, including the above post, is pure blather.

Confidence is not something that is done. It is not something that can come from tips. It is not something that comes naturally.

Confidence comes from experience. The man starting out riding a motorbike does so very gingerly, very fearfully, very slowly and carefully. The man who has been riding for 5 years feels the motorbike as an extension of his body. It is no different with women. The man who has no prior success with women is less confident than the man who just pulled a lay two days ago. The only bridge between those two states is putting in the time, in the face of uncertainty.

Confidence building comes only from work. Asserting yourself and taking action in spite of your lack of confidence (and thus anxiety), so that you can build your experience and understanding that creates that confidence. When I first started going on dates I would write out an actual list of questions in preparation. Now I can effortlessly maintain a conversation for hours even with a boring girl. The first time I went into a bar by myself, I felt as uncomfortable and awkward as shit. Now I feel equally confident as I do walking in with some friends. The first time I went out alone just to try and get laid, it wasn't very pleasant and there was no chance of success in sight. Now I know there is a decent chance it can end in a lay. Things like that add up. Confidence is earned.

Masculinity and femininity, 'natural states', feminism, or whatever else, have nothing to do with it, and there is nothing abnormal about women being attracted to confidence. I'd stay away from any of the 'theory' stuff floating around, and just stick to practical activity.

This.

Confidence comes from a boring, old-fashioned work. Other way to put this, for example, is a metaphor of a linear progress of becoming experienced represented by the so-called Four Stages of Competence, from left to right:

Unconscious incompetence > conscious incompetence > conscious competence > unconscious competence.

It's just a model, a crude simplification but I think it does reflect the 'experienced' progress of becoming experienced in doing/being something.

[Rhyme or Reason]

1. Be attractive

2. Don't be unattractive



That's what all this "be confident" talk amounts to. Is it true? Yes. Does that help anyone? Hell fucking no.

It's like someone asking how to play guitar and the response is "get good".

It's interesting how mainstream "acceptable" advice for men on how to attract women is often vague, or outright misguided. Optimizing male sexual strategy just isn't on the mainstream agenda.

[IntBM]

Confidence is belief. It cannot be measured. Competence is practice. It can be measured. Just my opinion.

[tanner]

This is specifically about confidence with women. In prior generations when gender roles were more defined, masculinity was not even an issue. Men were more focused on building their careers and being productive. Confidence with women was barely an issue. Today however, with masculinity being undefined, there are a host of workshops for men to build their confidence which often cost money. No such workshops for women as femininity is now looked upon as superior. These confidence building workshops only create artificial and short term confidence. The whole paradigm is wrong. Without knowledge of what masculinity is, then confidence with women will not be normal but artificial.

[stpete]

It's still the same as Phoenix said. It is earned through work in the same way. It's the only way. There is no shortcut or course or anything. It's actually simple.

Get yourself around a lot of women. Date a lot of women. In time you will have success. The success that you have with those women will carry over to the new women you meet.

All of a sudden your interactions with women will start changing. You don't realize it but this is confidence without trying.

It's not even really some boasting of confidence or cockiness that you are conscious of. It's merely success.

If you approach women or date women and you are single women can sense it. If you have success they can sense that also. They want to be with the men that have success.

You have to put the time in though. Because it is all the little pieces that eventually come together that you have to work through.

I think men get hung up on the term confidence. As if it is something you can be. Like be confident. Instead it is something that is acquired over time without even thinking about it.

[kaotic]

Well yeah....but actions speak louder than words.

If "confidence" isn't getting you laid, maybe there are a few things you need to work on.

[birthday cat]

(03-29-2016 12:18 PM)tanner Wrote:  

This is specifically about confidence with women. In prior generations when gender roles were more defined, masculinity was not even an issue. Men were more focused on building their careers and being productive. Confidence with women was barely an issue. Today however, with masculinity being undefined, there are a host of workshops for men to build their confidence which often cost money. No such workshops for women as femininity is now looked upon as superior. These confidence building workshops only create artificial and short term confidence. The whole paradigm is wrong. Without knowledge of what masculinity is, then confidence with women will not be normal but artificial.

You aren't necessarily wrong but your comments are all theory and no action. You don't really need to define masculinity or define anything at all.

All you need to do is take action, improve yourself, and get more experience with women.

[XXL]

You can be confident because you're competent/experienced OR you can be confident because you're simply brave. The former is solid, the latter is more shaky but all in all it looks pretty much the same. Pure bravery/enthusiasm is very underestimated in general which is weird cause this is how we get to do things we're completely incompetent at.

[cosine]

the title of this thread is too obvious.