[Excelsior]

(06-16-2011 12:58 PM)Sh0t Wrote:  

Ah you guys have no romance in you. Some girls ARE worth the extra effort. The best girls aren't just going to arrive out of thin air for you. Not saying that applies to this chick, but don't be so cynical.

Well, I can't stop you or anything. It was just some advice. Then again, I would actually contend that this type of reasoning is part of why we are seeing so many bad attitudes with women.
The girls aren't worth it at all, and yet men still insist that they are, and when pressed can't give much of a good reason why except "I dunno man, its romantic!".

This guy has had one solid night of banging this girl, far too short a time to deem her "worth" anything more than a good fuck.

Then add the other factors(flaky, slutty, feelings for other guys, etc), and I really can't see the point.

I'm a VERY cynical bastard, I openly admit that. But to be honest, I really think a lot of American men can use a healthy does of cynicism when it comes to the modern American dating scene because, to be honest, this "romance" you are talking about will not get you very far here. Chivalry and classic romanticism are dead in this society, and women killed them. They are all playing by the new rules(which they created) now. Any man who tries to go old school on them is putting himself at unnecessary risk.

I mean seriously, how romantic is she being right now? "I just fucked you, but I sort of have feelings for another guy", "I don't really want to commit right now", "I've fucked 8 guys(multiply that by 2)", etc, etc. And the guy in question is certain she'd fuck the other dude before him if given the choice. Yeah man, she seems smitten. Its a real love story in the making.

And you want to return this behavior by being romantic? C'mon, son.

You owe her nothing she doesn't also show you.

Quote:

Another thing to keep in mind is that even if this girl isn't worth it, for the PRACTICE alone, it would be a good exercise to try and win her over. eventually you may run into a girl that is worth it, and being practiced is always better than not. After I seduce girls, I always practice getting them to fall in love with me. One day you may need it. Plus, it's fun.

Well, fine, as long as the effort doesn't take enough energy to prevent him from pursuing more worthwhile women(which I suspect it will given the obstacles he is facing).

Quote:

All that stuff Mcginnis wrote is fine and good, but that's boring man. Of course there are more girls in the world. So what? Right now, he wants this one. It might just be his ego more than anything else, but why not exercise it.

Oh, I dunno...

Oneitis
Pedestalization(she's not as special as you think)
Blowing up her ego(she hasn't earned it)
Wasting opportunity(other hot fish in the sea you could have)

Heck, I could think of several more reasons "why not". Outcome dependence and singular focus are the death knells of successful game, ESPECIALLY with a modern, young American woman who has options.

It would be one thing if this girl had truly proven herself to be worthy(shown strong interest in him, committed, etc). Instead, she's proven nothing but a slutty, flaky, cheating girl with a nice body.
What a prize!

Quote:

Go for it OP, but just be prepared to fail. Chances are it won't turn out too well.

You know he is going to fail...and you suggest that he proceed with this huge energy and emotional investment?

[Sh0t]

Romance as in a romantic view of life. Not candles and chocolates romance with this girl. And she did make up homie's bed. I would be mildly impressed if a chick did that for me.

Flaky is a function of the guy calling. Once a girl loves you, they don't flake.

Singular focus would be bad, but I think he would be doing himself a favor practicing expanding his relationship with this girl.

One-itis fear way overblown as well. he already fucked her. Most dudes with one-itis haven't even gotten a kiss yet. We also have no idea if he's blowing up her ego, or wasting other opportunities. Seems likely he isn't. She had sex with him, that's her showing plenty of interest. And she made his bed. Perhaps to show him her domestic skills?

Yes, it is likely he will fail. And he should indeed proceed on. Just like learning the first few minutes of game, failure is expected. But just by going through it, you improve. Same with this. If low likelyhood of failure was required, nobody would ever practicing approaching girls, since most sets will not 'succeed'.

She already had sex with dude, I would say he can wipe his brow now and put his bid in. Most girls that are worth having are going to have some other dude in the picture, until the right guy comes along. It doesn't mean she's worthless or worth just a fuck. Only the OP knows how worthwhile she is, based on what he likes.

[artichoke]

This post immediately got me to sign up to the forum. Mainly because I've gone through what you guys are going through. ulysses and sh0t, I admire your "romanticism", but men are not romantic-ly driven. ie, we don't use only our emotions to drive our actions, we use logic guided by our feelings and emotions. Here is where your logic breaks down:

Quote:

"chasing her flaky ass down for the last month",

you don't do the chasing, you are a valuable rare comodity, let them chase you. otherwise you'll be chasing her for the rest of your life.

Quote:

" When I came back, I saw that she made my bed before she left. GF potential."

She does your bed and that's gf potential? that's your marker for a good gf? what about she fucks you when you want to fuck? what about cooking you a meal? giving you road head because you love it? she waits for you butt naked with her ass in the air when you come home? Now those are signs of love.

Quote:

"...choose him over me. I want to change that."

Here's a lesson that's been really hard for me to learn and the most important in all this. You can't change anything but yourself. You can't change how she feels about you, you can't change how she feels about him. All you can do is change your attitude and realize you can't change the world, no matter how hard you try. Girls will respect you more when you don't play to them.

Try banging 3 girls throughout the week, forget they are or aren't 9's. That would be better than chasing this girl. Just my 2 cents.

[Thorne]

Yes, and oh! beware ye faithfull about the "cute" gestures like making the bed, or very eloquent words from a creature who has trained for years to be an actress and strategically obtain what she wants with ice cold precision since she started asking daddy for toys. I've run accross women that make you believe they have invested in you by being apparently honest and personal about themselves, when those tiny gestures are at no cost for them (they have no pride, so it's not like us men that opening up is very hard and really meaningful) and give them a very high return, because they make you believe you are the armed one and they are vulnerable. That apparent trust they give you, is to make you feel like you have the upper hand. That and flattery from a woman are only means to disarm you and soften you up.

so never, ever, ever, ever believe in a word that comes out from a woman's mouth, just believe in her actions.

If she senses the tiniest bit of power she will abuse it and flake and abuse it, and will want to pathologically make you feel miserable to feed their voids, since hot women (don't know this one, but know a lot of them) are wounded spirits with a black hole inside that can't be filled with anything.

So, I'm all for the practice and shit you were mentioning, but be ready to suck it up, it'll be a war, mostly with your ego, pride and male brain.

Ulysses, like you should know already, be wary of the sirens and no matter what you hear, tell your men to never let you go.

[iknowexactly]

(06-16-2011 11:11 AM)MiXX Wrote:  

Guys, remember: WOMEN DO NOT COUNT A ONS!!

They train their minds to forget any quick fuck in a car, camping trip, ex boyfriends best friend, and any other guy that was not officially a "boyfriend".

+1 here Mixx.

This really highlights something that is hard to grasp for me,
that women absolutely do not take responsibility for their actions.
"It just happened, " I just felt like it."

They're not even lying, they actually do not feel like they have a fucking identity, they are just sheeplike reflections who barely have minds of their own.

THAT'S why you're 100% right when she doesn't count ONS, because she didn't actively go back looking for that particular cock again, in which case even a woman can't deny that she actually performed an independent, conscious action.

[Thorne]

(07-01-2011 12:29 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

(06-16-2011 11:11 AM)MiXX Wrote:  

Guys, remember: WOMEN DO NOT COUNT A ONS!!

They train their minds to forget any quick fuck in a car, camping trip, ex boyfriends best friend, and any other guy that was not officially a "boyfriend".

+1 here Mixx.

This really highlights something that is hard to grasp for me,
that women absolutely do not take responsibility for their actions.
"It just happened, " I just felt like it."

They're not even lying, they actually do not feel like they have a fucking identity, they are just sheeplike reflections who barely have minds of their own.

THAT'S why you're 100% right when she doesn't count ONS, because she didn't actively go back looking for that particular cock again, in which case even a woman can't deny that she actually performed an independent, conscious action.

Yeah I tooootally feel ya. I'm even thinking lately that it's a like a glitch they have in their brain. As smart, cunning and perceptive as women can be, they also have a huge capacity for self-denial and to change their perceptions to feel accordingly. Does it make them more evolved? they certainly can adapt and create their realities far better than us... it's like they create their own Matrix. They fall in or out of love way easier, they don't have as much pride as us (so honor, values, word keeping are not something they waste time on, they will always get of the hook for being "women"). They just adapt to the environment, their only life principle is their comfort and to indulge their feelings, and they will always be open to a better option that comes along (they're never happy, men included). Quasi said brilliantly in another post, that "a woman is only as loyal as her options". We men are supposed to be more practical ones, but it doesn't get any more practical than them!!

Men feel they need to DO stuff (conquer lands, climb mountains, build bridges) but women are just happy admiring the feats and choosing accordingly after the man has done the hard work. That's why they don't have to bother wasting time seeing things as they really are (their ONS count in this example) and will rather worry about creating illusions (makeup, hair, push-up bra's, endless hours of choosing the clothes that make them look slimmer, etc), specially in creating their own reality and men's ("I really loved you, I meant it at the time").
So, they don't need to really accomplish anything in the long term because they will still be getting half of the stuff of the men that do, by just pairing up with him and just being women (although the luck of the draw in the looks department is much more crucial and cruel on them).

But still, I'm so amazed by their denial, they will never admit all the stuff we talk about them openly and which are such facts for us guys no matter the countries and cultures we're from. It's like feminism has the world by the balls in a new version of the dark ages and anything we say against it is worse than blasphemy. We have been emasculated nowadays by not being able to use our natural strength (physical) because it's not "civilised" but women can use their strengths (manipulation) and it's not seen as wrong but "clever".

It's all been researched and explained through science, but still, damn if it's annoying!! they have too much power and it's hard for them not to get corrupted by it (which is in itself, another thing they won't realise, off course)

[OGNorCal707]

(07-01-2011 12:16 AM)Thorne Wrote:  

Yes, and oh! beware ye faithfull about the "cute" gestures like making the bed, or very eloquent words from a creature who has trained for years to be an actress and strategically obtain what she wants with ice cold precision since she started asking daddy for toys. I've run accross women that make you believe they have invested in you by being apparently honest and personal about themselves, when those tiny gestures are at no cost for them (they have no pride, so it's not like us men that opening up is very hard and really meaningful) and give them a very high return, because they make you believe you are the armed one and they are vulnerable. That apparent trust they give you, is to make you feel like you have the upper hand. That and flattery from a woman are only means to disarm you and soften you up.

so never, ever, ever, ever believe in a word that comes out from a woman's mouth, just believe in her actions.

If she senses the tiniest bit of power she will abuse it and flake and abuse it, and will want to pathologically make you feel miserable to feed their voids, since hot women (don't know this one, but know a lot of them) are wounded spirits with a black hole inside that can't be filled with anything.

So, I'm all for the practice and shit you were mentioning, but be ready to suck it up, it'll be a war, mostly with your ego, pride and male brain.

Ulysses, like you should know already, be wary of the sirens and no matter what you hear, tell your men to never let you go.

Damn man, good post, you dropped a lot of insight, and I got to agree with you 100%. With this and your last post, I feel like you almost dated my psycho bitch ex-girlfriend, or women very similar to her.

She was a total pathological liar, but was so good at it, and thoroughly had me convinced that "she loved me more than anyone in the world", I meant "everything to her", and that she "would do anything for me." Meanwhile, as she's spoon feeding me bullshit, I am believing all of it and falling "in love" with her, and at the same time she was cheating on me, using me, and manipulating me, all for her own ends. Basically, because she's a fucked up person, who only cares about herself and getting what she wants and is totally self-centered, narcisstic, superficial, while totally lacking remorse, and any shred of concious.

I think you just about summed it up with this line: "If she senses the tiniest bit of power she will abuse it and flake and abuse it, and will want to pathologically make you feel miserable to feed their voids, since hot women (don't know this one, but know a lot of them) are wounded spirits with a black hole inside that can't be filled with anything."

She was an emotional vampire that sucked me dry. After I figured everything out and pieced together how sick and fucked up she really was, when I tried to confront her and seek some shred of truth and honesty from her, to step up and admit what she had done, all I could get was absolute denial, and then the attempts of manipulation, to make me out to be the bad one, and she the victim.

In the end her way of conceding that she had wronged me, was offering to let me "piss on her, if it would make me feel better." As much as I may have enjoyed that, I declined. I decided to take the high road, and not add to her fucked up psyche.

[hypesession]

(07-02-2011 01:31 AM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  

(07-01-2011 12:16 AM)Thorne Wrote:  

Yes, and oh! beware ye faithfull about the "cute" gestures like making the bed, or very eloquent words from a creature who has trained for years to be an actress and strategically obtain what she wants with ice cold precision since she started asking daddy for toys. I've run accross women that make you believe they have invested in you by being apparently honest and personal about themselves, when those tiny gestures are at no cost for them (they have no pride, so it's not like us men that opening up is very hard and really meaningful) and give them a very high return, because they make you believe you are the armed one and they are vulnerable. That apparent trust they give you, is to make you feel like you have the upper hand. That and flattery from a woman are only means to disarm you and soften you up.

so never, ever, ever, ever believe in a word that comes out from a woman's mouth, just believe in her actions.

If she senses the tiniest bit of power she will abuse it and flake and abuse it, and will want to pathologically make you feel miserable to feed their voids, since hot women (don't know this one, but know a lot of them) are wounded spirits with a black hole inside that can't be filled with anything.

So, I'm all for the practice and shit you were mentioning, but be ready to suck it up, it'll be a war, mostly with your ego, pride and male brain.

Ulysses, like you should know already, be wary of the sirens and no matter what you hear, tell your men to never let you go.

Damn man, good post, you dropped a lot of insight, and I got to agree with you 100%. With this and your last post, I feel like you almost dated my psycho bitch ex-girlfriend, or women very similar to her.

She was a total pathological liar, but was so good at it, and thoroughly had me convinced that "she loved me more than anyone in the world", I meant "everything to her", and that she "would do anything for me." Meanwhile, as she's spoon feeding me bullshit, I am believing all of it and falling "in love" with her, and at the same time she was cheating on me, using me, and manipulating me, all for her own ends. Basically, because she's a fucked up person, who only cares about herself and getting what she wants and is totally self-centered, narcisstic, superficial, while totally lacking remorse, and any shred of concious.

I think you just about summed it up with this line: "If she senses the tiniest bit of power she will abuse it and flake and abuse it, and will want to pathologically make you feel miserable to feed their voids, since hot women (don't know this one, but know a lot of them) are wounded spirits with a black hole inside that can't be filled with anything."

She was an emotional vampire that sucked me dry. After I figured everything out and pieced together how sick and fucked up she really was, when I tried to confront her and seek some shred of truth and honesty from her, to step up and admit what she had done, all I could get was absolute denial, and then the attempts of manipulation, to make me out to be the bad one, and she the victim.

In the end her way of conceding that she had wronged me, was offering to let me "piss on her, if it would make me feel better." As much as I may have enjoyed that, I declined. I decided to take the high road, and not add to her fucked up psyche.

wow that is a truly fucked up tale of lies and LIES and denial. :/ sweet offer on her part though

[Thorne]

yah dude, been there... it's more of a twisted Frankenstein of chicks like that for me (though my last one was the worst), and for me I've noticed it's like a pattern because chicks like that are usually fun, razor sharp witty, smart, eloquent, complex, cultured, beautiful rebels but selfishly heartless when it comes to satisfying their emotions and needs. They're experts at playing the damsel in distress and they will look to trigger the superhero complex in all men.

here's a good read,

http://thoughtcatalog.com/2011/dont-date...who-reads/

now, that guy REALLY nailed it....

So moral of the story is to be wary of women that make you feel really close and intimate very early on, it's a great way for them to control your feelings of comfort, the dynamics of the chemistry and flatter you for having "confided" in you. She will be seemingly brutally honest by telling the "raw" truth, and that's how you will start believing her (but in reality like it was mentioned above, multiply by 3 anything she's saying).

Flattery, as they learn very early on, is very cheap kriptonite for them to give us men. So you even gotta take flattering words suspiciously like it's a shit test. Only let yourself be flattered by actions.

[OGNorCal707]

Thorne, once again you are on the $$, I will make sure to read the article that you linked, when I have more free time this afternoon. I just wanted to add that a lot of the things you mention are tell-tale signs of borderline personality disorder, which you may know about according to the experience you seem to have with psychotic females.

Not to hijack this thread any more and turn it into a personal rant. But women with boderline personality disorder are just about the last people on earth you want to get involved with, they are pathological liars, vindictive, manipulative, prone to fits of extreme anger, jealousy, obcessiveness, and delusion. After hours of reading/research, I am convinced my psychotic ex-girlfriend was "border-line", like you said she was "fun, razor sharp witty, smart, eloquent, complex, cultured, beautiful rebels but selfishly heartless when it [came] to satisfying [her] emotions and needs." She masterfully worked this angle: "they're experts at playing the damsel in distress and they will look to trigger the superhero complex in all men."

@hypesession, man if you think that's bad, you should search for my old threads, I posted my experience with her, "psycho chick experience", it was about 100 X worse. The girl basically ruined my life. It's been 2 months and I still feel like my mind, heart, and soul are tortured by the experience.

Every guy should take 10 mins. to google "borderline personality disorder", so you will have a template of warning signs, and know to avoid women with these characteristics like the black plague.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/20...d-sex.html

[Roosh]

Falling head over heels after one fuck... I think most guys here know how this will turn out.

It's ironic that the more likely you want to get in a relationship with a girl, the less likely she'll want to get in one with you.

[Feo]

I can see your point Ulyss. There is nothing like seeing a girl change her body language and reaction as she falls for you. In my experience, the only way to turn things around is solid jealousy game. Not hurt beta jealousy game, but solid i don't give a fuck jealousy game. Which is exactly what everyone else is saying in different words.

[Adventure21c]

Athlone McGinnis Wrote:

this type of reasoning is part of why we are seeing so many bad attitudes with women.

The girls aren't worth it at all, and yet men still insist that they are, and when pressed can't give much of a good reason why except "I dunno man, its romantic!".

+1 from me for that, and other contributions.

[jariel]

I'm waiting for the "just banged a 5" thread, because lots of people on here are likely doing that shit on the regular.

[Diablo]

(06-15-2011 07:15 PM)ulysses28 Wrote:  

I ran textbook game on a smoking hot 21 year old. 5'6, long blond hair, blue eyes, perky little tits, probably the best ass I've spanked, thin, and a sexual maniac.

We met up last night after I'd been chasing her flaky ass down for the last month, and I swooped her back to my place, where we fucked 3 times, then talked for a couple hours. She slept over. In the morning I had to leave early, told her to take her time, and left. When I came back, I saw that she made my bed before she left. GF potential.

This alone tells me how the story is gonna end.

Quote:

Reading this one would think I'm in, but here's the thing.... this is a girl at the peak of her sexual market value, she has expressed slight ambivalence to being in a committed relationship, and she has tons guys trying to bang her and ask her out all the time. She really blunt, and admitted she's slept with 8 guys total, 5 in the last year or so, including me, and that she was currently in a fuck buddy relationship with another guy that started 6 months ago. Now she's starting to develop some feelings for him. He has not reciprocated at this point, but seems like he may be starting to. It's safe to say that she will continue to fuck him, and given the choice would choose him over me. I want to change that. She also goes on dates with a guy who she has no intention of fucking, "but he's really nice" and all of her male friends continually ask her to be their girlfriend. But I'm not concerned about these betas.

Again this should tell you something. any decent girl wouldnt have 8 guys total at 21 years old. Max should be 2.

Quote:

According to her the guy is 29, not very attractive, VP of a small beverage distributor company, and a cool guy. But you can tell she's starting to develop feelings after banging the guy for 6 months, and him acting aloof and detached. classic.

I'm also 29, last year in law school, probably better looking, better educated, and probably equal game skills, but I don't have the time invested that this guy does, and I want to overcome his advantage.

I want her, and I'm not sure how to approach this problem.... thoughts?

dude seriously just lose this chick....

Its a mistake waiting to happen. She is not GF shes a whore. I have decided myself to stop dating American and African women (Worse than Americans if you don't know).

[metalhaze]

"It's ironic that the more likely you want to get in a relationship with a girl, the less likely she'll want to get in one with you."

Exactly...

women usually desire men who are hard to get into relationships or monogamous commitments.
there is some truth to that.

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

Any girl who has fucked 5 men in the past year isn't worthy of being anyone's girlfriend. Learn your lesson. If you want to keep fucking her, then treat her like shit while hinting that she should be with this other man.

[pobreinvestidor]

Why do you care so much about the other guy, did she suggest that he should join you 2 next time?
This girl is fucking 2 guys, and feeding hopes to a 3rd and maybe a 4th or 5th and you still think she is gf material? Do like watching those cockold porns, and have friends make fun of you?

[Vicious]

(07-03-2011 04:45 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

Any girl who has fucked 5 men in the past year isn't worthy of being anyone's girlfriend. Learn your lesson. If you want to keep fucking her, then treat her like shit while hinting that she should be with this other man.

I'm with the crowd for most of this thread, but the above I simply do not understand. If she's not in a committed relationship I don't she how anyone can judge this, do you not like the girls that are DTF?

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

(07-05-2011 06:57 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

(07-03-2011 04:45 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

Any girl who has fucked 5 men in the past year isn't worthy of being anyone's girlfriend. Learn your lesson. If you want to keep fucking her, then treat her like shit while hinting that she should be with this other man.

I'm with the crowd for most of this thread, but the above I simply do not understand. If she's not in a committed relationship I don't she how anyone can judge this, do you not like the girls that are DTF?

Promiscuous girls are more likely to cheat. I assume a man doesn't want his girlfriend to cheat, so a girl who has fucked 5 guys in the past year is too promiscuous to be girlfriend material.
You can't equate not wanting a slut for a girlfriend with not liking girls who are DTF. I wouldn't be here if I didn't like girls who are DTF, but being DTF and being girlfriend material are two very different things.

[Vicious]

(07-05-2011 10:00 AM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

Promiscuous girls are more likely to cheat.

I've heard this countless times but I have yet to see anything other than anecdotes to back it up. I'm not defending girls than jump on a different dick every night but there is zero scientific evidence for the above statement.

Quote:

You can't equate not wanting a slut for a girlfriend with not liking girls who are DTF. I wouldn't be here if I didn't like girls who are DTF, but being DTF and being girlfriend material are two very different things.

Classic madonna/whore complex.

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

(07-05-2011 10:41 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

(07-05-2011 10:00 AM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

Promiscuous girls are more likely to cheat.

I've heard this countless times but I have yet to see anything other than anecdotes to back it up. I'm not defending girls than jump on a different dick every night but there is zero scientific evidence for the above statement.

Quote:

You can't equate not wanting a slut for a girlfriend with not liking girls who are DTF. I wouldn't be here if I didn't like girls who are DTF, but being DTF and being girlfriend material are two very different things.

Classic madonna/whore complex.

There's a reason men evolved to avoid commitment with sluts. But like many things that evolved naturally in humans, we can find scientific evidence. You just haven't looked for scientific evidence. http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2010/12/wo...rried.html

You also don't understand what the madonna/whore complex is. A man with that complex can't have love and good sex with the same woman. A man who avoids LTRs with whores is just being smart.

There's also a term for men who don't avoid LTRs with sluts, cuckold.

[Vicious]

(07-05-2011 12:36 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

There's a reason men evolved to avoid commitment with sluts.

We have? Pardon me for sounding like a broken record but where's the support for that?

Sure we might have chosen this route for cultural and religious reasons, but to say "evolved" implies a biological/genetic connection.

Quote:

But like many things that evolved naturally in humans, we can find scientific evidence. You just haven't looked for scientific evidence. http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2010/12/wo...rried.html

I can't make heads or tails of that GSS site. From the chart the blog produces however the data can't be considered to represent anything.
Surveys to begin with are not considered scientific evidence anyhow so it's a moot point.

You'd think that such a loaded assertion would have far more credible scientific backing than a simple blog if there was any merit to it, no?

Quote:

You also don't understand what the madonna/whore complex is. A man with that complex can't have love and good sex with the same woman. A man who avoids LTRs with whores is just being smart.

Exactly, a woman that doesn't enjoy sex will not produce good sex. Good sex is of course subjective, but for me we're talking about A grade porn star performance. Regarding relationships with "whores" (to which you definition seems to be women who sleep with many men) I won't argue, but the claim was that many sex partners = unfaithful which is another bowl of corn flakes entirely.

---

What I'm getting at is the hypocrisy many men have with regard toward female sexuality. They want to sleep with women but the women that they sleep with they view as whores. This paradox creates incongruence that will limit men immensely in their game. I see this in particular in America where there's a lot of talk about how you will respect her or not the morning after. Nowhere else have I had that discussion.

I don't think I've ever meet a true super scorer that did not truly love all women (some of them were sex addicts and ironically enough hated themselves). Calling women that are DTF whores and sluts will only cement suspicion against men when it comes to sex. Since I'm interested in as much sex with as many (high quality) women as possible - anyone that puts those stamps on women are working against my best interests.

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

(07-05-2011 01:29 PM)Vicious Wrote:  

(07-05-2011 12:36 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

There's a reason men evolved to avoid commitment with sluts.

We have? Pardon me for sounding like a broken record but where's the support for that?

Sure we might have chosen this route for cultural and religious reasons, but to say "evolved" implies a biological/genetic connection.

Quote:

But like many things that evolved naturally in humans, we can find scientific evidence. You just haven't looked for scientific evidence. http://anepigone.blogspot.com/2010/12/wo...rried.html

I can't make heads or tails of that GSS site. From the chart the blog produces however the data can't be considered to represent anything.
Surveys to begin with are not considered scientific evidence anyhow so it's a moot point.

You'd think that such a loaded assertion would have far more credible scientific backing than a simple blog if there was any merit to it, no?

Quote:

You also don't understand what the madonna/whore complex is. A man with that complex can't have love and good sex with the same woman. A man who avoids LTRs with whores is just being smart.

Exactly, a woman that doesn't enjoy sex will not produce good sex. Good sex is of course subjective, but for me we're talking about A grade porn star performance. Regarding relationships with "whores" (to which you definition seems to be women who sleep with many men) I won't argue, but the claim was that many sex partners = unfaithful which is another bowl of corn flakes entirely.

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What I'm getting at is the hypocrisy many men have with regard toward female sexuality. They want to sleep with women but the women that they sleep with they view as whores. This paradox creates incongruence that will limit men immensely in their game. I see this in particular in America where there's a lot of talk about how you will respect her or not the morning after. Nowhere else have I had that discussion.

I don't think I've ever meet a true super scorer that did not truly love all women (some of them were sex addicts and ironically enough hated themselves). Calling women that are DTF whores and sluts will only cement suspicion against men when it comes to sex. Since I'm interested in as much sex with as many (high quality) women as possible - anyone that puts those stamps on women are working against my best interests.

You think this is something the NSF is funding? You're not going to get much more scientific than that. It shows that promiscuous women are more likely to admit to cheating, in anonymous surveys. We can argue about the rigor of the study, but I'm going with Occam's razor and believing that sluts do indeed cheat more.

Any assertion that X is cultural requires as much evidence as the assertion that X is biological.

If you don't want to use the words slut or whore because it ultimately limits the number of girls who are willing to put out, that is a defensible argument. If you want to believe that promiscuous women are no more likely to cheat than chaste women, well then I have a beautiful bridge for sale in Brooklyn, and I'm hoping you have money to invest.

Listen, I don't think a slut/whore/DTF girl is a bad person, I just recognize that she is not LTR material. I have friends whom are sluts, whom I would knock another motherfucker out for if he tried to hurt her. At the same time, I would warn any of my younger cousins from marrying a girl like that.

Just because I say she's not good enough to be a girlfriend doesn't mean she's not a good person, friend, lover etc.

[Vicious]

(07-05-2011 01:53 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

You think this is something the NSF is funding? You're not going to get much more scientific than that. It shows that promiscuous women are more likely to admit to cheating, in anonymous surveys. We can argue about the rigor of the study, but I'm going with Occam's razor and believing that sluts do indeed cheat more.

If you consider surveys to be scientific then we have reduced this to a philosophical discussion since you and I obviously have different standards for what "scientific" entails.

Quote:

Any assertion that X is cultural requires as much evidence as the assertion that X is biological.

Try the bible, which has been the cultural, moral and religious compass of the western world for most of the last 2000 years. It has a couple of guiding passages on women's place in the world.

Your turn.

Quote:

If you don't want to use the words slut or whore because it ultimately limits the number of girls who are willing to put out, that is a defensible argument. If you want to believe that promiscuous women are no more likely to cheat than chaste women, well then I have a beautiful bridge for sale in Brooklyn, and I'm hoping you have money to invest.

The comparison between chaste and promiscuous women was never the topic. Unless you're implying that chaste women are what you originally referred to as "girlfriend material".

(07-05-2011 01:53 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

Listen, I don't think a slut/whore/DTF girl is a bad person, I just recognize that she is not LTR material. I have friends whom are sluts, whom I would knock another motherfucker out for if he tried to hurt her. At the same time, I would warn any of my younger cousins from marrying a girl like that.

Just because I say she's not good enough to be a girlfriend doesn't mean she's not a good person, friend, lover etc.

I respect that.