[Agastya]

I'm currently 19, a rising college junior, and a History major at a fairly good school in Southern California. It's a field that I'm highly passionate about, and I might attempt to get a PhD after a couple years of working. I'm highly writing/reading/soft skills oriented; I've never liked STEM fields, nor have I been good at them. I understand that this reduces my chances at getting lucrative work, but I wanted to pick the brains of the forum on what I could do career wise. I especially want to hear from other members who majored or specialized in non-STEM fields.

I'm also curious about marketing/sales. I love talking to people and corporate sales jobs seem like a great avenue for me to pursue. I was wondering how many hard skills(programming etc.) would be necessary for such a job.

I'm coming to a point where I need to start thinking about my career, so some advice would be appreciated.

[captain_shane]

You didn't say what you were going to school for. How do you expect people to give you advice when we have no idea what you're studying?

[Agastya]

(08-02-2015 07:00 PM)captain_shane Wrote:  

You didn't say what you were going to school for. How do you expect people to give you advice when we have no idea what you're studying?

(08-02-2015 06:44 PM)Agastya Wrote:  

I'm currently 19, a rising college junior, and a History major at UCLA.

[captain_shane]

Didn't see that. I have no idea with a history degree. Sell weed?

[Peregrine]

First, if you're getting a PhD to enter academia, don't bother. And if not to enter academia, why get one?

Okay, I got that out of the way. If you want to go into marketing, know that modern day marketing is basically data science. It's analyzing customer data to glean insights. Necessary hard skills include an understanding of statistics and the ability to use Excel/SQL/SAS/R/SPSS/whatever the company likes to use for data analysis.

Sales is sales. It's no BS, you're either closing or you're shit. People experienced in sales on this forum have written plenty already, and I have nothing meaningful to add there.

You didn't provide enough information for me to give any specific advice. One point of encouragement: being good at reading and writing are very valuable skills because most people I have met absolutely suck at both. Other than that, I recommend you read The Startup of You by Reid Hoffman. Excellent career advice.

[LINUX]

You can take another year of classes and get a teaching certificate.
You can take another few years of science pre-reqs and apply for medical schoool.
You can apply for law school after the additional pre-reqs.
You can get an entry-level job that requires only a degree to get hired.

Here is the deal, I have a guy in my city that I've been friends with for about 8 years. He has a degree in history from NYU. He works at Staples making about 13 dollars an hour.

You're majoring in a worthless degree because it's an easy degree to obtain. I have a fairly easy degree similar to yours and I'm doing something completely different now that I didn't even need a degree for at all.

I think it comes down to this: Hopefully, someone else is paying for your college and you're not taking out loans. If you're taking out loans for a history degree, you are going to have one of the worst ROI's possible.

[scorpion]

Law school is the obvious first thing that comes to mind for a History major. If you're a good test taker and can do well on the LSAT (well enough to get into a top law school at lest) then that's something to consider. There are a lot of recent law school graduates who are underemployed, however, so I wouldn't necessarily recommend that route unless you're able to get into a good school, have family/friend connections with a law firm(s) (aka a job lined up when you graduate) or are just super passionate about law.

As for marketing/sales, that's an entirely different game. Very little in the way of hard skills (especially STEM) is required unless you get into specialty sales niches (which usually require a scientific or engineering background - this is not you). However, this is not the vast majority of sales jobs. Most corporate sales jobs are entirely about personality/soft skills (building relationships with clients) and how much you can hustle (generating new business).

If you want to be a lawyer, start getting involved in legal organizations on campus and start practicing for the LSAT. If you want to go into sales, honestly the best thing you can do is get a part time job doing sales/promotions that gives you a ton of practice interacting with people. Sales interviews are all about impressing with your personality and ideally showing some past sales success on your resume. They also like hiring people who were involved in a lot of social organizations in school (i.e. Greek life, student government, charity fundraisers, etc...) because this shows you know how to get along with people well.

Whatever you do, don't get a PhD in history. Complete waste of time and money. You like history? Read some books, and if you're really ambitious, write one in your spare time. Don't think you're going to make a career of it.

[Sonoma]

As a POLS major, do sales, get your fucking ass kicked. Do another corporate job, see if you like it.

I didn't. Teaching now, starting salary 50k in an inexpensive area with summers off. Major perks of public work. I'll get my masters next year and keep bumping up the pay scale and hopefully jump over to teaching college courses.

For employment I've worked in car sales, media in Santa Monica, education, nonprofit work, radio DJ and logistics. Plus some more. All in CA

[rungoodinc]

Pick up an Econ double major. If you have an econ degree from ucla and have good people skills, you can BS your way into a lot of good jobs. Think consulting finance marketing (although not super high end) etc. You can still get a history PHD later if you like.

It doesnt matter if you have to take an extra year to graduate, employers dont care about this for UC students since they know its hard to get the classes you need.

FYI i was a history major at top 10 undergrad school and at a good law school now. Fine with how things worked out but majoring in econ would have been a better play.

[Agastya]

(08-02-2015 07:20 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

Law school is the obvious first thing that comes to mind for a History major. If you're a good test taker and can do well on the LSAT (well enough to get into a top law school at lest) then that's something to consider. There are a lot of recent law school graduates who are underemployed, however, so I wouldn't necessarily recommend that route unless you're able to get into a good school, have family/friend connections with a law firm(s) (aka a job lined up when you graduate) or are just super passionate about law.

As for marketing/sales, that's an entirely different game. Very little in the way of hard skills (especially STEM) is required unless you get into specialty sales niches (which usually require a scientific or engineering background - this is not you). However, this is not the vast majority of sales jobs. Most corporate sales jobs are entirely about personality/soft skills (building relationships with clients) and how much you can hustle (generating new business).

If you want to be a lawyer, start getting involved in legal organizations on campus and start practicing for the LSAT. If you want to go into sales, honestly the best thing you can do is get a part time job doing sales/promotions that gives you a ton of practice interacting with people. Sales interviews are all about impressing with your personality and ideally showing some past sales success on your resume. They also like hiring people who were involved in a lot of social organizations in school (i.e. Greek life, student government, charity fundraisers, etc...) because this shows you know how to get along with people well.

Whatever you do, don't get a PhD in history. Complete waste of time and money. You like history? Read some books, and if you're really ambitious, write one in your spare time. Don't think you're going to make a career of it.

Thanks everyone for the responses. My parents are paying for my entire education, with the exception of a couple minor scholarships. They live in the Bay Area and have fairly good business connections. So far I've worked with a local political campaign and am currently interning at a charter school system in San Jose. One of my dad's friends has promised that he'll sponsor me for a marketing internship at Cisco next year. I also have pretty good grades, rowed in college for two years, and helped found a fraternity. I feel like my best shot is just building connections within the Bay and getting marketing/management/HR roles that entirely involve interpersonal skills. The elephant in the room is my utter lack of experience with STEM related knowledge; I can figure out how to monkey around with Excel, but I generally lack any aptitude for math or science.

Hope this gives you guys a better picture of my background and capabilities.

[Sonoma]

In that case, you'll be fine.

You sound social enough, perhaps read through job requirements and see if theres any courses you could take over summer to pad your resume.

I had a lot of friends who went to SSU, majored in bullshit and just networked into pretty good jobs at LinkedIn, Oracle, Yelp, Facebook etc

[lskdfjldsf]

Quote:

I'm also curious about marketing/sales. I love talking to people and corporate sales jobs seem like a great avenue for me to pursue.

To expand on Scorpion's post, sales is an easy fit, with little to no tech knowledge required. I entered international corporate sales (in Europe, from the U.S.) with a degree in German. Military experience only, no internships. Language is a plus if you're looking internationally, but the gates are wide open anywhere if you can impress during an interview.

Sales is "professional game", nothing more, nothing less. It's stressful work with high turnover and lots of travel (at least in my field) but hitting six-figure income is possible before you're 30.

Feel free to PM me if you'd like more specifics, I can help map out your options.

[Peregrine]

Do that marketing internship at Cisco. Internships go a long way towards papering over "worthless" degrees, because it shows employers that you at least know how to handle yourself in a corporate environment. Bonus points if you actually accomplish something.

[Gixxy]

(08-02-2015 06:44 PM)Agastya Wrote:  

....

You need skills. Tangible, marketable skills. A history degree will do nothing for you. Ever. You're going to need an MBA/PhD to make a history degree perform.

You are investing a lot of your time and money at a well known university. Wouldn't it make sense to leave there with something you can use vs something you need to go back to school for ANOTHER 2 to 4 years to make work for you?

My ex gf is the Sr. VP of Consulting for the largest healthcare provider in the US. The SINGLE largest complaint among execs is that the pool of talent coming out of universities is so shallow, with virtually no tangible assets or basic skills to use that corporations are looking elsewhere for those skills.

To be competitive in today's marketplace you need to have these things;

1. Social skills. You need to be able to communicate, like an adult, in a professional environment. The vast majority of kids coming out of school today are absolutely clueless when it comes to social skills, networking, and acting like an adult.

2. Effective user of tools; Email is the tool of communication. While on a conference call, there are emails swirling in the background. You need to be able to stay on pace with those emails and remain relevant to the conversation. Effectively using email means that you know how to write and construct professional sentences.

3. An idea of what you're good at. Simply, if you don't know what you're good at, neither do they. Companies don't have the resources to wait around for you to figure it out. Develop those skills now. This goes into having a tangible skill. When you know what you're good at, and you develop it now, you can walk into an interview being able to contribute immediately. Find your strengths and develop them.

Further, the internship at Cisco can be a launchpad for your career. Get as much info on the internship as possible. Understand what will be required of you and work to develop those skills. The more intel that you can do on that internship will be the best advantage that you have at this point. Coming into the team with a solid understanding of your role on the team and with the tangible skills to be an asset from Day 1 will impress everyone on the team. Internships DO lead to well paying offers. Frequently. It's a company's low risk, high reward method of finding the best talent.

Those things that you did in college (frat, row, volunteer) mean NOTHING if you lack the ability to contribute to your team in a significant way from the get go. The pool is too shallow and the stakes too high for a company to sit around and wait for a newly graduated hire to "get it" and come around when they can promote the 30 something from inside the company who has been sitting around waiting for an opportunity, but stuck in their career because they couldn't find anything better and the economy was stagnant.

Sorry to rant, but the number of college kids that I have seen that are simply unprepared for the corporate world is staggering. A university's goal is to get you as far into debt as possible and do everything possible to keep you in school for as long as possible. I'm sure that it completely contrary to anything that you had in mind. If you need an MBA, let your company pay for it, or at least subsidize it.

[travolta]

(08-02-2015 09:29 PM)Agastya Wrote:  

One of my dad's friends has promised that he'll sponsor me for a marketing internship at Cisco next year. I also have pretty good grades, rowed in college for two years, and helped found a fraternity.

Good grades, rowing and founding a frat are things that nobody cares about, especially if you want to get into sales. The only important thing is that you can make your boss money.

Working a marketing internship likely won't teach you much. I'm assuming they'd have you be a "social media manager" which is laughable.

If you want to make real money then you should start your own business. Take some of daddy's money and sign up for the forum at stackthatmoney.com and read everything you can. It's a way better use of time than a marketing internship.

[Peregrine]

Quote:

My ex gf is the...

If that's true, I'd edit out the rest of that if I were you. That's pretty specific personal information on a public forum.

Everything else is bang on though.

Quote:

Working a marketing internship likely won't teach you much. I'm assuming they'd have you be a "social media manager" which is laughable.

Marketing internship codes to me as cold calling. It could also be doing the routine shit work that none of the data analysts want to do. I'd have to read the job description to know which. Marketing is much more than just social media.

Plus, if you enter through a family friend, you already have a leg up. You're not just another random intern, you're so-and-so's friend's son. Anyone who likes/respects/fears/owes so-and-so will treat you well. (The reverse is also true, so watch out.)

You can always decide corporate life is not for you in five years and quit to start your own business. Or you can start your own business while working a corporate job. It is MUCH harder to decide entrepreneurship and small business is not for you and then try to get into an office job. Why shoot yourself in the foot right out of college, especially when you're not sure what you want to do? Telling him to ignore the marketing internship in favor of starting a business is downright irresponsible advice.

[Travesty]

If you gut is telling you history, that needs to be your main goal. It will eat at you that you are doing other things as a back drop.

Are there any government jobs involved in preserving historical documents? Or other publications about new historical findings?

I think interning for somewhere like that then going for the PhD is best. If you love the subject that much at the very worst you would be teaching community college or state university history courses and be writing history books on the side.

[Travesty]

(08-02-2015 07:09 PM)captain_shane Wrote:  

Didn't see that. I have no idea with a history degree. Sell weed?

Do you read what you post Neo?

[Peregrine]

(08-03-2015 11:00 AM)Travesty Wrote:  

If you gut is telling you history, that needs to be your main goal. It will eat at you that you are doing other things as a back drop.

Are there any government jobs involved in preserving historical documents? Or other publications about new historical findings?

I think interning for somewhere like that then going for the PhD is best. If you love the subject that much at the very worst you would be teaching community college or state university history courses and be writing history books on the side.

True. Alternatively, he could take a stress-free job and do what he loves (history) on the side. Einstein worked as a patent clerk during the day.

That reminds me of a phenomenal essay you should read titled "How to Do What You Love" by Paul Graham. http://www.paulgraham.com/love.html

I'm not in the tech space, but a lot of those guys have insights that are domain independent.

[Samseau]

If you want to do law, make sure you speak with at least a dozen successful lawyers in your state (or state you want to practice in). They will keep it real. All lawyers I spoke with told me to stay the hell away from the profession.

[captain_shane]

(08-03-2015 11:04 AM)Travesty Wrote:  

(08-02-2015 07:09 PM)captain_shane Wrote:  

Didn't see that. I have no idea with a history degree. Sell weed?

Do you read what you post Neo?

Yeah, and most history majors I've met are also the biggest smokers I've met. I honestly couldn't tell you what to do with a history degree outside teaching.

[Engineer]

Here's a different approach that may be more in line with the passion for history: national security e.g. CIA or NSA. Depending on your ability to integrate and synthesize, you could be a great analyst. Your description of yourself reminded me of a couple people I know in the field.

[The Beast1]

Being a lawyer is brutal work. I'm assuming you're based in California.

To start, you have to take the LSAT. If you're good with logic puzzles then you might do well here. A history degree won't prep you for the test.

Next, you'll need to attend law school which costs a lot of money. I wouldn't try to go to law school unless you get into one of the top 15 schools. Anything below that and you run the risk of racking up a lot of debt for a job that will most likely pay very little in the first 10-15 years. If you get a scholarship for a free degree from a no-name tier 3 school consider it. It's a free law degree and you can easily make 30-40 grand saving Lions from rampaging dentists. A tier 1 law school will obviously get you into higher paying jobs.

Finally, you will also need to take the bar for the state you want to practice in. From friends who took the LSAT, NY and California are two of the hardest states to pass the bar. If you don't take the bar, then you have a semi useless graduate degree.

Honestly, advice wise there isn't much we can give you. I didn't know where I was going to end up my junior year as well.

[Huey]

Learn web development. You don't need math beyond high school algebra and it's a lot less technical than software engineering. Job prospects and growth is also higher than average.

[NFallin]

I graduated with a BA in World History mainly because it was easy and interesting. A few of my professors lamented the fact that if they had just got a job at a bank after university they'd be making more money and not lecturing to kids who really didn't give a shit.

Took a job in B2B sales straight out the gate and hated it. Then went the trades route in the oil sands. Work is starting to become tiresome but money and freedom is on point. But I also want to start developing a different skillset.

You can really do anything you want with the history degree but highly recommend the meyers briggs personality test (if you haven't taken it already) to see where your true skills and interests lie. It really is important to see what you're well suited for.