[Avon Barksdale]

I finally checked out what stormfront is

[Quintus Curtius]

delete

[8ball]

(01-28-2015 11:50 AM)MidWest Wrote:  

If this really bothers you, then you clearly have a race problem. I saw the trailer and I didn't think nothing of it. Race didn't even cross my mind when watching that trailer. This is pure race-baiting.

So some of you guys are not going to watch it because the guy is black? Shows how narrow-minded some of you guys are. This is the type of thread you will find in Stormfront.

I don't think the word racist, or accusing someone of race baiting should be thrown around so easily. Did you read the comic books? are you a fan of the series? How vested are you in the franchise?

I personally like Michael B Jordan and will likely watch the film. But i never read comics as a kid, to me its just another movie. Couldn't care less what race anyone is since i don't associate the characters with any of the actors. However, for me to accuse someone here as a racist is absolutely ridiculous. They might have a more vested interest than me.

I am happen to be a Lord of the Rings fan and i am not sure how i would react if they change some of the characters to be black. I have read the books and watched the movies(own all the "specials" they have released) and thus have a more vested interest in how the next one will turn out. If that time comes in the next reboot, i will probably have some concern and wouldn't like being called a racist by people like you.

[BLarsen]

For those of you who have such a problem with this...I think you need some serious introspection. I see a lot of male hamstering going on here. I think that the historically white character should remain white...but tell me, what exactly is the big deal?

I think blaming this on SJW nonsense is just hamstering and covering up the real issue, which is that some of you have a very negative opinion of non-whites.

[TheWastelander]

(01-28-2015 01:02 PM)BLarsen Wrote:  

I think blaming this on SJW nonsense is just hamstering and covering up the real issue, which is that some of you have a very negative opinion of non-whites.

And I think that's a very convenient way for you to dismiss other people's opinions and rationalize to yourself that they must be racist, despite no evidence to support your absurd assumption, and therefore not worth engaging in discussion.

[kaotic]

Who gives a fuck ? It's a movie for fucks sake.

It's not like they're forcing anyone to watch it.

It's not like a gay woman is playing the human torch. (The ghostbusters thing is absurd)

The next james bonds is going to be black.

As long as they don't push any stupid PC agenda I see this as a non issue.

Also, how many damn times are they going to "reboot" a fucking movie. It's been beaten to death.

[Sonsowey]

Is the actor's race important ever?

Should historical figures always be played by people of the same race/ethnicity?

Should comic book characters always stay the same race as they have always been?

Is it different depicting fictional characters vs. historical personages?

Answer those questions, and apply your answer consistently.

I would say overall it's not important and a choice left up to those creating the movie. If a Chinese director wants to make a movie about the American Revolution and casts King George and Thomas Jefferson as Chinese, I wouldn't care.

Remember this version of Cinderella from the 1990s?

[R Smoov]

Thank god they didn't make the Human Torch Indian.

Half the thread would have gone on killing sprees they did.

[Yatagan]

This, along with Ghostbusters 3 will be on my boycott list.

[WalterBlack]

I grew up reading the Marvel Comics and know these character well. In my opinion the main issues are:

• Johnny and Susan Storm are siblings and their relationship is a big part of the team. I guess they can work around it if one of them is adopted.
• This also fucks with any merchandising and toys.
• This film was only made to stop Fox losing the rights, it appears it was made cheap.
  

The Fantasitc Four are major characters in the Marvel Universe. The race of Marvel characters has been changed before, but they were never one of the big players in the Marvel Universe.

This is the original Nick Fury:



He was changed from a white guy to a black guy in the Ultimate Marvel Universe (which is a modernised reboot) of the Marvel universe. The again, Nick Fury is based on and played by Samuel Muthafuckin' Jackson, and who's cooler than him?!



This isn't the first time the Human Torch has been changed. There was a cartoon where he was replaced by a Robot.

Quote:

The character of Human Torch does not appear on this series. Rumors stated that he was rejected out of fear that children would light themselves on fire to imitate him. Really, he was licensed for an unmade live-action project. He is replaced by the robot H.E.R.B.I.E., who was eventually adapted into the comics.

(01-28-2015 10:21 AM)TheWastelander Wrote:  

The biggest problem, in my opinion, is hypocrisy. Do you know what would happen if some moron in Hollywood tried to remake Blade with a white actor instead of a black one? That shit would not stand. The SJWs would freak the hell out and destroy anyone involved in that project. Meanwhile, they encourage people to change white characters into minorities and any pushback is "racist."

US movies have changed the race of minorities to white. An example from a few years ago was the movie 21, which is based on (mostly east-Asian) group of students who gambled in Vegas on behalf of their professor.

One of the real guys is on the left, and the guy who played him is on the right:

[turkishcandy]

(01-28-2015 12:47 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  

Where is Turkey?

(01-28-2015 09:03 AM)Daedmo Wrote:  

Maybe the OP would feel more at home over at Stormfront? They've got plenty of browns who think they're white.

(01-28-2015 05:45 AM)Brian Shima Wrote:  

you care a lot about race issues in the US for someone who is not even from the country

It's somewhere between Europe, Middle East and Central Asia, just like the race of its inhabitants.

Turkish race comes from Central Asia. Turks in overall are neither brown nor white. They are somewhere inbetween. We basically look like Spanish and Italian guys with a bit more hair. I myself pass as Spanish or Italian when I travel, I know because I play this lil game called ''Guess where I'm from''. Turkey is usually people's 3rd or 4th guess. If anyone is really curious about how brown my skin is, I'm open to disclose my photos, just PM me. Nobody called me brown before. Turks are just Turks, they don't have to fit in white or brown categories.

The majority of Turkish people look somewhere between Europeans and Arabs. There is also a minority, say 10%, who have pale skin, colored eyes and even blonde hair, or just pale skin and black hair, kind of like the French. There is also a minority who are as dark as Arabs, say 20%. All 3 actors below are Turkish.


It's very diverse because Turkish are descendants of Ottoman Empire with borders that stretched from Vienna to Africa to Red Sea. We are no longer pure blood. But our pure blood is not Middle Eastern, it's Central Asian, meaning it's slightly tanned, not brown.

I didn't start this thread because I consider myself white and therefore am insulted by a black person taking the role of a white. And I for sure am not race-baiting. I started because one of my favorite comic books is being spoiled by political correctness. I regret starting it, since this turned into a race discussion rather than a cultural discussion.

If I shouldn't bring it to your attention because I'm not white enough and outside of US, so be it.

I resent anyone telling me I belong to Stormfront.

[Sonsowey]

(01-28-2015 01:15 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

US movies have changed the race of minorities to white. An example from a few years ago was the movie 21, which is based on (mostly east-Asian) group of students who gambled in Vegas on behalf of their professor.

The real guy is one the left, and the guy who played him is on the right:

Notice the similarity in haircut. Outstanding.

[BLarsen]

(01-28-2015 01:07 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 01:02 PM)BLarsen Wrote:  

I think blaming this on SJW nonsense is just hamstering and covering up the real issue, which is that some of you have a very negative opinion of non-whites.

And I think that's a very convenient way for you to dismiss other people's opinions and rationalize to yourself that they must be racist, despite no evidence to support your absurd assumption, and therefore not worth engaging in discussion.

Who said anything about racist? And apparently since you felt compelled to respond you think my comment applies to you.

My opinion is based on statements made. There has been no attempt to place this in any historical context, just "GOD DAMN SJWS!"

The best reply was the one earlier in which a poster mentioned all the white actors cast as Asians/Latins, yet, nobody responds directly to that. Just, "Woe is me, I'm a victim too! America is against white men!"

Edit: As with all race threads, I don't even have to read the individual posts. You can tell by who likes which post who is white and who is black; the whites agree with the whites, the blacks agree with the blacks. There is no real exchange of ideas, just e-screaming at each other about who is racist, who "doesn't get it", and then people will get warnings and bans will be handed out.

[Avon Barksdale]

Quote:

I regret starting it, since this turned into a race discussion rather than a cultural discussion.

The title read

Johnny Storm (Human Torch) is Black in the new Fantastic Four Movie

How could you not think this was going to be about race OP?

[turkishcandy]

(01-28-2015 01:35 PM)Avon Barksdale Wrote:  

Quote:

I regret starting it, since this turned into a race discussion rather than a cultural discussion.

The title read

Johnny Storm (Human Torch) is Black in the new Fantastic Four Movie

How could you not think this was going to be about race OP?

You realize the title is supposed to summarize the event, it's forum rule. That's what I did. If you read beyond the title, in the original post I clearly stated where the emphasis should lie, which is PC.

Quote:

Nothing against a black superhero, but they are fucking yet another comic book in the ass just to appeal to the PC audience and the Hollywood PC standards. Isn't this actually insulting for black guys? That makes them just an instrument to appeal to SJWs, an accessory to make a movie politically correct. Take out the character with the whitest personality (for those of you who are familiar with Johnny Storm and his lines, style, his charming narcissist wild-card role in the team) and place a black guy instead. Political correctness, check. Diversity, check. Millions of dollars of profit by nerds who're gonna watch this movie no matter how hard it sucks, check.

Anyone who thinks I'm trying to race-bait has his own problems about race.

A black guy should object to this movie too. I wouldn't want to see a Turkish guy in a role he doesn't belong to, just to fill the minority quota.

[Tuthmosis]

Moderator Action:

7-day suspension for Daedmo for taking the thread ad hominem and escalating the race-baiting. As a newbie getting so involved in race discussions, his remarks also put him on troll watch.

(01-28-2015 09:03 AM)Daedmo Wrote:  

Maybe the OP would feel more at home over at Stormfront? They've got plenty of browns who think they're white.

(01-28-2015 09:51 AM)Daedmo Wrote:  

Time to remake Schindler's List, but this time have the Germans played by Israelis and the Jews played by Palestinians.

Even though turkishcandy claims he didn't want this to be a race thread, he clearly lit the fire only to backpeddle later. His kindling wasn't just about the character in the movie, in other words. Given that his intentions might not have been bad, 20% warning.

(01-28-2015 05:38 AM)turkishcandy Wrote:  

I'm surprised Thing is not Mexican.

If you guys can have this conversation without sending each other to Stormfront--or sounding like you actually belong there--I'll leave it open. Otherwise I'll have to close it.

For what it's worth, I think you guys are falling into the trap of the movie's producers. They're race-trolling you and it's working. People who like to see ethnic people in roles will gain interest because of that element, people who get pissed will complain about it online and get all the people on the sidelines to notice the movie. It's the new type of advertisement.

[Enigma]

(01-28-2015 08:35 AM)bojangles Wrote:  

I think using Ancient Egyptians as an example won't help you argument. The Pharaoah during Moses time had red hair and fair skin.

No, he didn't. Regardless, "white" refers to an ancestry, not a skin color. There are peer reviewed medical journals which have established with DNA testing that the Ramses lineage originated in Sub Saharan Africa.

Is an Asian girl who's stark white in complexion, of which there are many, "white"? If a Swedish girl gets a tan, does she cease to be white? Is an albino African white?

And if you don't like the Moses example, how about Katniss from The Hunger Games, who is described in the book as having dark, olive skin, straight black hair, and grey eyes being cast by a pale white girl with brown hair and deep blue eyes? Or Johnny Depp as the Comanche Native American Tonto in 2013's Lone Ranger?

[Ronald Reagan]

Green lantern was made black in the 2000 justice league and justice league unlimited animation despite being a historically white comic book character. The character was one of the coolest on the show and the show was great.

[Enigma]

(01-28-2015 03:01 PM)Ronald Reagan Wrote:  

Green lantern was made black in the 2000 justice league and justice league unlimited animation despite being a historically white comic book character. The character was one of the coolest on the show and the show was great.

John Stewart, the black Green Lantern, actually first appeared in comics in the early 70s and starred in books throughout the 80s and 90s.

There is not one Green Lantern but a "Corp" composed of dozens (?), which is even shown in the recent movie. Green Lanterns are not even historically human, but I'm guessing we're not going to blame SJWs for marginalizing life forms from other planets.

EDIT: Tone

[TheSlayer]

Doesn't bother me that much because the movie is going to be crap anyway. The previous movies with Jessica Alba and the rest were crap also. It's not that big of a deal in my opinion but I can also understand the concerns of those who don't like this trend but then you have to acknowledge that Hollywood has been messing around with the roles and characters of non-whites by sometimes placing white actors in them.

Meh....Hollywood gonna Hollywood.

[youngblazer]

The fact is that blacks are huge consumers of entertainment like movies and TV. And they like to see characters that look like them.

[LaCobra]

(01-28-2015 01:15 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

The again, Nick Fury is based on and played by Samuel Muthafuckin' Jackson, and who's cooler than him?!

[Quintus Curtius]

Word is that actor Nicolas Cage took his name from the comic book hero Luke Cage (Power Man). I'm attaching a photo of him here.

I still remember nearly every panel of his epic fight with Crusher Creel...and that was, damn, like back in 1979 when I was a kid....!

Point is, people can identify with icons, even if the icon is of a different nationality than they.

Men see masculine qualities and leadership traits as more important than ethnicity.

   

[berserk]

Off Topic below:

(01-28-2015 02:45 PM)Enigma Wrote:  

(01-28-2015 08:35 AM)bojangles Wrote:  

I think using Ancient Egyptians as an example won't help you argument. The Pharaoah during Moses time had red hair and fair skin.

No, he didn't. Regardless, "white" refers to an ancestry, not a skin color. There are peer reviewed medical journals which have established with DNA testing that the Ramses lineage originated in Sub Saharan Africa.

Is an Asian girl who's stark white in complexion, of which there are many, "white"? If a Swedish girl gets a tan, does she cease to be white? Is an albino African white?

And if you don't like the Moses example, how about Katniss from The Hunger Games, who is described in the book as having dark, olive skin, straight black hair, and grey eyes being cast by a pale white girl with brown hair and deep blue eyes? Or Johnny Depp as the Comanche Native American Tonto in 2013's Lone Ranger?

Quote:

In 2013, Nature announced the publication of the first genetic study utilizing next-generation sequencing to ascertain the ancestral lineage of an Ancient Egyptian individual. The research was led by Carsten Pusch of the University of Tübingen in Germany and Rabab Khairat, who released their findings in the Journal of Applied Genetics. DNA was extracted from the heads of five Egyptian mummies that were housed at the institution. All the specimens were dated between 806 BC and 124 AD, a timeframe corresponding with the late Dynastic period. The researchers observed that one of the mummified individuals likely belonged to the mtDNA haplogroup I2, a maternal clade that is believed to have originated in Western Asia.[17]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNA_history...ncient_DNA

Quote:

Haplogroup I is largely found in Europe and West Asia, where it is believed to have originated.

West-Asian and European = Indo-European/Aryan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_I_%28mtDNA%29

Quote:

Average ancestry proportions in North African populations estimated by ADMIXTURE for k = 4 different ancestries (October 2012)
Population N Maghreb Europe Near East Sub-Saharan Africa
Tunisia 18 93% 4% 2% 1%
Saharawi 18 55% 17% 10% 18%
Morocco N 18 44% 31% 14% 11%
Morocco S16 44% 13% 10% 33%
Algeria 19 39% 27% 16% 18%
Libya 17 31% 28% 25% 16%
Egypt 19 19% 37% 30% 14%

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNA_history_of_Egypt

Quote:

(Reuters) - Up to 70 percent of British men and half of all Western European men are related to the Egyptian Pharaoh Tutankhamun, geneticists in Switzerland said.

Scientists at Zurich-based DNA genealogy centre, iGENEA, reconstructed the DNA profile of the boy Pharaoh, who ascended the throne at the age of nine, his father Akhenaten and grandfather Amenhotep III, based on a film that was made for the Discovery Channel.

The results showed that King Tut belonged to a genetic profile group, known as haplogroup R1b1a2, to which more than 50 percent of all men in Western Europe belong, indicating that they share a common ancestor.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2011/08/01...OR20110801

Egypt was multicultural and a melting pot and particularly later dynasties had Nubian and Sub-Sahara influence, maybe even pure Nubian rulers. The earlier dynasties however, were almost certainly not, they might - as King Tuts DNA suggests, even have been of Indo-European admixture at least.

[DjembaDjemba]

Ancient Egyptians were Nordic supermen from Northern Sweden.

Hollywood should have used the Swedish national hockey team as the main cast of Exodus. The current cast was surely not representative of the ancient Egyptian people as the proud Nordic stock that they truly were.