[Syberpunk]

(04-26-2019 06:25 PM)Donfitz007 Wrote:  

It pisses me off because Casino Royal is the ULTIMATE feminist bond movie. It features very strong/intelligent women, actual romance, a man getting his manhood destroyed (figuratively and literally) A man losing hope, women being the saviors (as in giving the correct knowledge) and lastly it shows a man being a weapon, a protector, a tool down to the coldest point. AND I LOVE THE MOVIE because they did all this very well, it didn't seem like a feminist movie because they made it a bond movie first.

Spectre came off rapey to me, maybe that's the reason they went this way.

I'm a bit of a fanboy of Casino Royale and I thought I had gone mad when everyone was praising Skyfall, when the film that actually deserved was released 6 years prior, it was like CR didn't exist and Craig was introduced in Skyfall to most people.

I grew up like most here watching an assortment of Connery, Moore and Brosnan films, they always seemed to play the Moore ones (perhaps because he did so many and when I think of Bond, I think of the sheer daftness of him ), but despite always liking them, I never watched them for the storytelling, it was always the gadgets or hot girls....so Casino Royale was a revelation in that it was the first time I actually felt for the character and could follow the story. It was a bit like what I imagine seeing Star Wars or 2001 for the first time was, I didn't KNOW they could do a Bond film that action packed and yet emotional and grounded. They made poker look captivating. It doesn't feel like a rote entry in a numbered franchise. I can watch it as a singular classic film over and over, it flows so well. Lightning in a bottle it was and like most great films the side characters make it too, that cast, the Hannibal actor. Its one of the only films that could be stood outside the series as a classic, in the realms of Die Hard 1, the first Matrix etc. I think its nigh on impossible the series will ever see a films as well done as this again because you can't manufacture real creativity twice...it just happens by the grace of god if you cover enough bases.

It felt like the series at the moment was boldly going to strike out and do its own and continue to be reinvention, but it went right back to cliches. People talk about the Star Wars sequel trilogy being a disappointment, but this series (Bond) looked like it was going do the miracle of actually better than the preceding series (old films) and do it just like the source material always intended.....and its amounted to a load of well shot tripe.


Martin Campbell has a masculine sense of directing as opposed to Mendes. He made everything visceral yet also classical. Craig wasn't acting and wrote like he was 500 years old and over the hill, they aged the characters for the sequels despite being new! He's moping too!

Reboot films are not meant to this good. And yet Eva Green was scorching sensual, legitmately missed in the sequels as a character or actress just to have around.

That rocking theme:

That delivery:

That casino:

[Sidney Crosby]

Casino Royale is easily the best Craig Bond movie, not even close.

[Solitaire]

"Casino Royale" is one of those films that I'll watch from start to finish every time it comes on. The scenes with Caterina Murino - wow, she's mesmerizing.

[rudebwoy]

I liked Skyfall, it just went on too long.

[Guriko]

(04-27-2019 06:14 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

I liked Skyfall, it just went on too long.

As always Javier Berdam put on an eloquent performance as the villain.

It was someone I loved to hate but I have to say that I chuckled the way he died...

I mean out of all the possible ways he goes out like that? Seemed like a gag the first time I saw it.

And when she died shortly afterwards I felt as if an opportunity was missed to make this scene much more impactful - such with a gunshot that would have penetrated both.

Anyhow... when I compare the pictures between Craig and Moore I can almost feel the nervous tension riding around Craig and utter relaxation when it comes to Moore.

[Rorogue]

goldeneye best bond of last 25 years

I would let Onatop bite my ass

Craig too faggy to be bond but Casino Royal was very good

[Zevs]

That moment that Daniel Craig walked out of the water, with no top on and those tight faggot looking bathers. I stopped the movie and never watched it. The man is a faggot, James Bond is a faggot and always was. Well I think Sean Connery did a pretty good job. Maybe? When will men realise these movies are made for faggots and men that are dreamers.

[Bienvenuto]

I'll give it my 2 cents on Skyfall. May dupe this in Star Wars thread.

All artists are thieves.

Its a question of whether they are good thieves or bad ones.

A case in point of a good thief is Michael Mann and Heat, his masterpiece.

He was working on that for decades. He wrote alot of the screenplay for 70's movie Straight Time with Dustin Hoffman in it. That was a great film and an adaptation of No Beast So Fierce by ex-con Edward Bunker who decades later worked as consultant on Heat.

In the book Bunker describes leaving prison after decades as being like a time traveller into a science fiction future, the language, the music, the customs of this vaguely recognisable world are all different. Crucially, he says this as his character descends into a pedestrian underpass.

In his later film Thief Jame Caan is almost a time traveller emerging from decades in prison and trying to negotiate a hostile world.
Mann describes how he wanted to describe the city as a system, as a series of tunnels and networks that the mind of his titular character is increasingly melded with.
The motif of car following roads under bridges and underpasses is frequent. The Thief is negotiating the alien system that is undermining him at every turn.
"If somebody asked me, 'What's "Thief" to you?': To me, it's a left-extensionalist critique of corporate capitalism. That's what "Thief" is. What is interesting is that no critics in the U.S. got that, no critics in the U.K. got it."

The evil man that the Thief is working for sourced him an infant, (his wife is barren) delivered to his door at midnight. then he takes away his patronage and threatens wife and newly adopted child "People'll be eating 'em for lunch tomorrow in their hamburgers and not know it."

An opaque system that chews you up (jail) and spits you out.

The opaque windows of the office buildings that the Thief scopes out. Just like the opaque glass canyons of downtown LA in Heat's climactic shoot out.

In the film are John Santucci (ex-Chicago thief) and Chuck Adamson (ex-Chicago cop) who told him the story of the real life Neil McAuley and their real life coffee meeting that Heat immortalised. Mann's grandfather had been a taxi driver in Chicago and had known alot of the high line thieves in Chicago.

Line in Heat screenplay, Jon Voight: (on Pacino's character Hanna) "he blew away Frankie Yonder in Chicago.. and he was a fucking maniac."

Mann spent years and years from when he was an arts student in Chicago bussing tables (diner scene in Thief/ Breedon short order cook in Heat) steeping himself in the world of the Underworld City and the story of Heat.

He directed a shit dry run of it in the 80's (LA Takedown).

He has never fully admitted to the influence of French Director Melville and his 1960s film "Un Flic" on his work but the borrowing is obvious. The blue filter, the abstract expressionist style, the symmetry of the cop and villain who share the same problems and existential angst and who are inexorably drawn to a final climactic confrontation a la Heat.

But most critics don't know where his real theft came from.

Thats a good thief. Shakespeare (No. 1 all time English bard) is the one poet in the English Language that one can't find his source lyrics for. You can find Milton's (No. 3 All time) source lyrics in some of Chaucer (No. 2). But Shakespeares lyrical influences are to an extent a mystery.

THAT is a good thief. Because no doubt he had many influences.

Mann's biggest influence was Kubrick.

"I wasn't really interested in cinema until I saw Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb (1964), alongside a set of films by F.W. Murnau and Georg Wilhelm Pabst for a college course. These were a revelation. I'd already seen some of the French New Wave and some Russian films, but the idea of directing, of shooting a film myself? Never. Prior to "Strangelove", it simply had not seemed possible that you could work in the mainstream film industry and make very ambitious films for a big mainstream audience. .. as a young man I found that intensity very exciting"

So sure.. we see the abstract expressionist style or Dr Strangelove and the basic plot of Kubrick's "the Killing" that he borrowed from.

But the real homage was to 2001. The ambient, constantly expanding soundtrack and the almost futuristic abstract world of the high line thieves in their hockey masks, the radio masts and data that Tom Noonan's character could just reach out and scoop up.

A tension between the sense of space and anomie in the movie, and the confined choices, limited options of the cast of ex-cons and the cops pursuing them in cat and mouse fashion.

THAT is a Thief.

Because Hollywood has lifted every aspect of Heat for the last two decades trying to bottle Lightning.
Every Ben Affleck Heist movie is a desperate attempt to create another Heat.
The last few Fast and the Furious movies have had so many obvious borrows from Heat.
When it came out it caused quite a stir amongst actors and film people.

People have often said that Mann would direct a great Bond movie.

And if you watch Skyfall the thieving is apparent.
Mendes said in press releases that he had to strip out all the architecture of a Bond Movie and 'imagine' something completely new and fresh before putting the Bond paraphernalia back in.
What a lying piece of shit.

The whole back from Turkey sequence:

Bond stares at a reflection of a TV screen (Manhunter/ Michael Mann) The camera follows M up the steps to her apartment (Manhunter). Bond goes to China and tails the guy on the Freeway (Pacino chases down De Niro on the Freeway in Heat) Takes the elevator which flies up away from the camera (iconic shot from Manhunter) Takes sniper shot whilst confused by different moving shadows and reflections (Pacino and De Niro LAX airport shootout) the list goes on..

What a dirty dirty fucking cheat.

He would call it a homage but I just think that they have the access media in the palm of their hand and before they even set foot on the set they are writing their own pretentious reviews.

Whats interesting about it is that I haven't seen much of an original for the Scottish Estate scene which .. whilst being incredibly lavish.. felt like eating too many chocolates and bored the shit out of me.

Interesting because Villeneuve ripped off the Haze and Wind and use of red and made a far far better version in the Las Vegas scenes of Blade Runner 2049.

It goes to show what a genius Villeneuve is and a direct successor to Mann (who is used up/ rejected by Hollywood and ancient by now) and by comparison what a hack Mendes is.

Mendes goes on about this and that. he just looks at some films that are 'trending' and copies them.

Contrast that with Mann who spent decades building up to Heat and experimenting successfully with everything, soundtrack, visuals, non-actors, filming in prisons, along the way.

Even when he obviously ripped off screenwriter Richard Price from the Wire fame and his Al Pacino film Sea of Love he did it well; no one complained.

If you were around the blizzard of PR for Mendes' film he actually wanted it treated as some kind of iconic movie. Javier Bardem is always good value but the script and some of the characters were a joke.

Those media fuckers have forgotten the work required.

Richard Price wrote of the creator of Homicide and The Wire, journalist David Simon. "He 'hung out'. He was willing to go places and just 'hang out'. Wait for the story to make itself real" Thats commitment,

In the words of Mann:

"You find out things when you're with a real-life thief, things you could never make up just sitting in a room."

Real Life. Something the cosseted likes of Sam Mendes and the 'diversity!' Hollywood crowd are actually scared of.

[Donfitz007]

(04-28-2019 11:21 PM)Zevs Wrote:  

That moment that Daniel Craig walked out of the water, with no top on and those tight faggot looking bathers. I stopped the movie and never watched it. The man is a faggot, James Bond is a faggot and always was. Well I think Sean Connery did a pretty good job. Maybe? When will men realise these movies are made for faggots and men that are dreamers.

G8 B8 M8 I R8 8/8

[Zevs]

(04-29-2019 03:13 AM)Donfitz007 Wrote:  

(04-28-2019 11:21 PM)Zevs Wrote:  

That moment that Daniel Craig walked out of the water, with no top on and those tight faggot looking bathers. I stopped the movie and never watched it. The man is a faggot, James Bond is a faggot and always was. Well I think Sean Connery did a pretty good job. Maybe? When will men realise these movies are made for faggots and men that are dreamers.

G8 B8 M8 I R8 8/8

Speak English, not gibberish.

[Aurini]

(04-28-2019 11:21 PM)Zevs Wrote:  

That moment that Daniel Craig walked out of the water, with no top on and those tight faggot looking bathers. I stopped the movie and never watched it. The man is a faggot, James Bond is a faggot and always was. Well I think Sean Connery did a pretty good job. Maybe? When will men realise these movies are made for faggots and men that are dreamers.

James Bond (in the films - the books are a different story) treats women the way that homosexuals treat one another; as disposable objects to be used and then discarded. He was the role model for Baby Boomer fathers, who expected women to treat sex with the same cavalier attitude, and wound up causing innumerate damage.

This damage led to the need for feminism; when the men are no longer fulfilling their duty of providing and protecting, women have to step up and do it for themselves.

Meanwhile, the children were neglected. Gen X became the latchy-key kids, while Millenials were institutionalized by the government, because the parents were divorced and working.

The James Bond franchise was a crucial point of culture for destroying the West.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

^^

[Donfitz007]

^^^ That would make perfect sense if EVERY GUY was as succesful as James Bond. For every 10 guys who have a james bond womanizing fantasy only about 1 or 2 actually have success and even less carry on that success.

I would say women like Coco Chanel had a greater impact on feminism than James Bond.

[kbell]

Quote:

G8 B8 M8 I R8 8/8s

Is that a British version of a computer 1's and 0's?

[911]

(04-29-2019 04:32 PM)Donfitz007 Wrote:  

^^^ That would make perfect sense if EVERY GUY was as succesful as James Bond. For every 10 guys who have a james bond womanizing fantasy only about 1 or 2 actually have success and even less carry on that success.

I would say women like Coco Chanel had a greater impact on feminism than James Bond.

No one knows what Coco Chanel looks like, or who she was. Even in France, she has had little impact over the culture. If anything, her brand and look embodied the most socially conservative ethos, as it was a look and spirit frozen in the 1930s, the "tailleur" wool suit with knee-length skirt or longer.

It's only recently in the 00s bling era that the average american or chinese woman discovered Chanel, along with LV or Gucci as an aspirational consumer good. Chanel used to be an upper class french woman's couture house before LVMH and their ilk blew up as global consumer brands.


The Bond series was the first major movie franchise to push the envelope in sexually charged content, not just in terms of skin scenes, but as Aurini mentioned, in the portrayal of women as pure sexual ornaments and the main character as the picture-perfect playboy who accumulates notches with virtually no emotional attachment to his conquests.

The fact that the character was unrealistic is not an issue, the point here is that he was elevated as the new male ideal, which as Aurini pointed out above is an ideal that is the hetero equivalent of the gay lifestyle, where degenerates accumulate hundreds of random sexual partners in completely hedonistic, purely physical sterile pursuits. This is also the male equivalent of women riding the carousel.

We've covered this and other deeper elements of the Bond franchise in this thread:

thread-16921...pid1669085

[questor70]

(04-29-2019 07:18 PM)911 Wrote:  

...the new male ideal, which as Aurini pointed out above is an ideal that is the hetero equivalent of the gay lifestyle, where degenerates accumulate hundreds of random sexual partners in completely hedonistic, purely physical sterile pursuits. This is also the male equivalent of women riding the carousel.

That lifestyle is now considered a bad thing? Boy, the tone here has changed. Should we get rid of the notch thread next for encouraging degeneracy? Encourage all men to enter into the seminary?

[Aurini]

Incidentally, the reason he's a womanizer in the books - something only somewhat covered in the films - is because his wife was murdered in front of him on route to their Honeymoon.

James Bond is a broken man.

The women he meets want to fix him - and he wants to believe that he's still capable of falling in love - but every single time it fails. The trauma put him into a permanent adolescent state, and it just so happens to make him a perfect, psychotically fearless secret agent.

James Bond is a tragic - not an aspirational - figure.

Edit - just noticed you covered that in depth with your link, 911!

Another equivalent of the Bond figure (which explains our messed-up mating patterns): Bateman from American Psycho. As I wrote in another post, the author was a homosexual, and the character he was describing was a homosexual who sleeps with women. So now we have men trying to live up to the standard of a homosexual, while women simultaneously fear and lust after Bateman/Christian Grey, and write yaoi fan fiction in their spare time.