[The Lizard of Oz]

(09-18-2014 10:46 PM)Chaos Wrote:  

Sure. What model can you recommend, suited for European sockets?

Chaos, I think that the light boxes made by Lumie are probably the most reliable you can get in Europe.

You have the Lumie Brazil:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lumie-Brazil-SAD...=drugstore

And the Lumie Arabica:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lumie-Arabica-SA...ie+arabica

Or here:

http://www.lumie.com/products/arabica

The Arabica is smaller, cheaper and more portable. Its only downside is that you have to place it pretty close (10'' or about 25cm) to get 10,000 Lux. But I don't think that's really a problem.

[The Lizard of Oz]

kbell, have you been using the light box? Any comments about the effects you've observed?

If anyone else has started bright light therapy with a 10,000 Lux full spectrum light box recently, I'd be interested in their impressions as well.

[kbell]

Yeah, been using it for 5 days. Skipped this weekend since I woke up too late (9:30 am so good possibility I wouldn't fall asleep until 12:00). The days I was using it, my mood was consistent sort of like taking prozac, but I did have access to more emotion. Sleep is better as well. The hard part is I haven't been using a clock with a timer to wake up at a set time. I probably should to make it sure I wake up at that time. As soon the light hits you, its like your hit with a jolt of adrenaline so you wake up.

I felt depressed today toward the end of the day, I didn't use the light. Also I went to a funeral, under ate and I tend to get nervous when I'm around a lot of people in a small area. So those would be confounding variables in the test of no light.

[The Lizard of Oz]

(09-28-2014 08:06 PM)kbell Wrote:  

Yeah, been using it for 5 days. Skipped this weekend since I woke up too late (9:30 am so good possibility I wouldn't fall asleep until 12:00). The days I was using it, my mood was consistent sort of like taking prozac, but I did have access to more emotion. Sleep is better as well. The hard part is I haven't been using a clock with a timer to wake up at a set time. I probably should to make it sure I wake up at that time. As soon the light hits you, its like your hit with a jolt of adrenaline so you wake up.

Good. Consistent mood and better sleep really add up over time; they're pretty much the difference between a life that is basically enjoyable and one that is more or less miserable.

Yes, the ideal is to keep entrainment so you always get up and light box at the same time. You should start off by using an alarm, but if you keep using the light box consistently you will soon not need the alarm, because your brain will be entrained to wake you up at that time. So the unpleasantness of being woken up by alarm will only be for a very limited period.

[Duke Castile]

I bought the sunlight Jr as per Liz's rx.

I have been using it for the past 4 days.

My sleep has been more uninterrupted than it usually is and being up in the early morning is much easier.

The light is not harsh or unpleasant for me to sit beside and that was a worry.

[Mr. Cameltoe]

Let me propel this thread into the year 2014 by introducing the Philips EnergyUp which I just bought a few days ago in light of (or lack thereof) the current season in Switzerland:



It has a very sleek design and cranks out 10'000 Lux of natural white light using efficient and quiet LEDs. It appears that it's not yet available in the United States, but it's readily available in Europe. I bought mine on Amazon.

Although I've only been using it for two days, I think (Placebo effect aside) that it really helps with the alertness and mood. The best money I spent this fall.

[oilbreh]

so is philips energy up a replacement for their blue light portable stuff? Is it full spectrum? what about the wake up alarm clocks, are the any use?

[oilbreh]

Thinking of just getting some philips HUE lamps, seems like you can make them work as a natural light alarm clock plus blue light therapy

[Yeti]

Lizard, or anyone else:

Do you know if it's possible to double the bright light therapy with a regular light source?

I'm thinking of something that I would use to read at night, before sleeping, that would be the only source of light in the room, and that would also provide bright light therapy. Two birds with one stone.

[RexImperator]

At night you should minimize your exposure to blue wavelengths.

[Yeti]

(11-11-2014 08:41 AM)RexImperator Wrote:  

At night you should minimize your exposure to blue wavelengths.

That's what I was thinking. So it might be better to use it in the morning. I couldn't find any lamps on Amazon that double as bright light therapy sources.

[The Lizard of Oz]

(11-10-2014 09:56 AM)Mr. Cameltoe Wrote:  

Let me propel this thread into the year 2014 by introducing the Philips EnergyUp which I just bought a few days ago in light of (or lack thereof) the current season in Switzerland:



It has a very sleek design and cranks out 10'000 Lux of natural white light using efficient and quiet LEDs. It appears that it's not yet available in the United States, but it's readily available in Europe. I bought mine on Amazon.

Although I've only been using it for two days, I think (Placebo effect aside) that it really helps with the alertness and mood. The best money I spent this fall.

I've looked at the specs for this and it seems to be a legitimate 10,000 Lux full spectrum light box. I don't know if the manufacturing is up to the same standards as Sunbox products, for example, but it's probably good enough. So this is another option.

(11-11-2014 01:49 AM)oilbreh Wrote:  

Thinking of just getting some philips HUE lamps, seems like you can make them work as a natural light alarm clock plus blue light therapy

As explained earlier in the thread, there are many reasons to prefer full spectrum boxes to blue light ones. So if you're going to do this, you might as well go for a full spectrum 10,000 Lux box.

(11-11-2014 07:45 AM)Yeti Wrote:  

Lizard, or anyone else:

Do you know if it's possible to double the bright light therapy with a regular light source?

I'm thinking of something that I would use to read at night, before sleeping, that would be the only source of light in the room, and that would also provide bright light therapy. Two birds with one stone.

As RexImperator pointed out, the last thing you want to do is use a light like this in the evening. Again, the right time to use bright light therapy is in the morning, shortly after you wake up, same time every day. This is what gives the best results.

Why look for gimmicks like a lamp that doubles as a light box? If you want to try bright light therapy, just get a full spectrum 10,000 Lux light box and use it correctly and consistently. There is no need or reason to also use it as a lamp at other times of day, and it's much better not to.

[The Lizard of Oz]

I thought I'd bump this on the winter solstice -- the most light-deprived day of the year for those of us in the Northern hemisphere.

Have any guys used a light box consistently through the fall and winter so far? If so, do you feel that it has been helpful to you?

[kbell]

Its helpful. Doesn't fix all of my mood problems since they are somewhat complex. However it seems to work like caffeine without the side effects. I tend to be more sluggish without it.

[The Lizard of Oz]

(12-21-2014 08:24 PM)kbell Wrote:  

Its helpful. Doesn't fix all of my mood problems since they are somewhat complex. However it seems to work like caffeine without the side effects. I tend to be more sluggish without it.

Thanks kbell. Have you used it consistently (around the same time every morning) or more sporadically?

Beyond the effects on mood, have you noticed any effect on sleep -- regularity of sleep onset, quality, duration etc?

[kbell]

I generally go to bed around 11 and its not super hard to fall asleep. I use a sleep mask to block out all light in the room which help with falling asleep along with f.lux on the computer to make the screens block blue. If I watched a lot of TV I might start using a blue blocking sunglasses as well, which help promote the circadian rhythm that your setting up with the light in the morning.

I'm consistent with usage (generally around 7:10-7:30 for 25 minutes sessions) with maybe a few times a week where I wake up too late for its usage due to having a day off.

[Hannibal]

I work shitty hours (6 pm to 6 am) and I was wondering if I could use this device to wake up at 2:15 every morning, and then on my off days wake up at noon. Would that be too stressful on my circadian rhythm or is that exactly what the light box is made for? My ability to be productive on my off days has been severely compromised by the job hours and I have always had a shitty sleep schedule.

I ordered one yesterday, figured it was worth a shot.

[The Lizard of Oz]

Hannibal,

That's a terrible schedule to be on if you can help it at all -- very destructive to your health over time. If there is any way you can dump it and work a job with normal hours, please strongly consider it. There are good studies of how shift workers do over time and it's not a pretty picture, unfortunately.

You can indeed use bright light therapy to cue you to a night schedule (and this has been done with shift workers), but it's not a good idea to run one schedule on weekdays and another on weekends. If you're going to get up at 2:15pm, then get up at 2:15pm every day, and use bright light therapy shortly after you wake up to entrain that schedule. Otherwise it is a tough transition back and forth every week.

In short, yes, you can use the light box to support your shift work -- but entrain a consistent everyday schedule and stick to it. Best of all would be to find a way to work normal hours as soon as that is feasible.

[Hannibal]

Yeah I know. It's nothing long term, maybe 6 months at the most.

The light box looks like a winner to me, I'll be going back to school next fall and I wanted to get in the habit of being an early riser. Getting a consistent sleep schedule now would be great, too. I have blackout curtains and such, but I always get fucked on my off days because the guys I hang out with are on a more normal schedule. This time of year was especially bad because all the family evens were in the morning or early afternoon.

Once I get it in the mail I'll write up a little testimonial and see how it goes.

[tallandblonde]

Bought this on Amazon about a year ago: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004JF3...UTF8&psc=1

Used it for a while last year then stopped for whatever reason. I'm naturally a night owl and a little bit of an insomniac. So not the best combination for when you have to get up at 7am for work.

I've been using melatonin to get to sleep for about the past year (I know I've been overusing it) and noticed it's not working as well recently. So I discontinued melatonin, and tried the light box again. Results have been good. I just set the light box near the TV I'm watching for 45 minutes or so in the morning, and I've fallen asleep both of the past two nights within 30 minutes and have slept well. Seems to be doing a good job of letting my body know when awake and sleep time is, especially during these winter months where I'm not out in the sun very much. So now I'm more awake in the mornings and I'm falling asleep faster at night.

[The Lizard of Oz]

tallandblonde, sounds good but keep in mind that if this light box is near your TV it is probably too far away to get 10,000 Lux which is what you need for optimum effect. Their specs for this box are 12'' - 24'' distance and I would imagine that for something this small it's closer to 12'' to get 10,000 Lux (you may want to check the detailed specs that should have come with it). This image shows the kind of distance they have in mind:



If what you are doing now keeps working well for you then there is no need to change anything, but it's just something to keep in mind if you feel you are not getting all you can from it. Also remember that to get the best results the key of keys is consistency: you want to use the box in the same way for the same duration at approximately the same time every morning. That is what achieves the best entrainment.

[tallandblonde]

^^ interesting point I will move it much closer tomorrow

[The Lizard of Oz]

(01-20-2015 11:24 PM)tallandblonde Wrote:  

^^ interesting point I will move it much closer tomorrow

Alright -- also, once it's at the right distance for 10,000 Lux, you don't need 45 minutes. 30 minutes at 10,000 Lux is optimal.

[komatiite]

Ordered! Should be here on Tues. I go to bed at 1030 and toss and turn til 2 most nights. I have been very lethargic and unmotivated lately and need my brain functioning well, just started a masters degree. Desperation set in and found this thread. Will report back in a week or two with initial impressions. Thanks again Lizard

[The Lizard of Oz]

(01-25-2015 01:39 PM)komatiite Wrote:  

Ordered! Should be here on Tues. I go to bed at 1030 and toss and turn til 2 most nights. I have been very lethargic and unmotivated lately and need my brain functioning well, just started a masters degree. Desperation set in and found this thread. Will report back in a week or two with initial impressions. Thanks again Lizard

You're welcome komatiite. Follow the instructions in the OP as closely as possible (timing, consistency, correct setting & distance) and you should start sleeping much better very soon and feeling more energy throughout the day. Definitely do a follow up post here after a little while.