[Moto]

What tends to work- though I often break this rule (whether out of principle or emotions I am not sure) and regret it- is to play the waiting game. While being truly unpredictable may come across as high value, I can't help but think that waiting just a little bit longer to reply than she does- and replying quickly only when she does- is allowing her to dictate the pace. It does not seem high-value to me to let the woman control the pace of the conversation. Playing the waiting game in correspondence does not generally demonstrate high value in business or the professional world (with exceptions of course I am sure). It seems to me that a high-value man knows what he wants and when he wants it. He does not have time to wait. I think that the highest value behavior would be to generally respond quickly- when you can and want to progress things- but would also be quick to next her if she plays the waiting game.

Some questions for you all to consider- do you play the waiting game, and furthermore, do you control the pace or base your response time based on her previous response time?

For game in general, can the best game be no game (as in no games, no bullshit, no disingenuity)?

[TheWastelander]

You act as if taking your time to respond is also not dictating the pace. It takes two to tango here. There's a give and take dynamic going on in a text conversation unless you're just constantly texting her without waiting for responses (which you should know is a terrible strategy).

When she's sent something to you and you're deciding when to respond, you're dictating the pace. When you've sent something and she's deciding when to respond, she's dictating the pace.

I don't think the comparison with the business/professional world works here because it's a lot different. Getting back to a business partner or client in a hurry is seen as polite, thoughtful and considerate. Getting back to a woman you're running game on in a hurry is often seen as needy and clingy.

My advice is that if she's playing waiting games with you, run game on another girl in the mean time and just don't care.

[Moto]

Thanks for your thoughts. Of course I minimize the double texting, and wait for a response. I'm talking more of the macro or overall pace, of course the time between individual texts is determined by one or the other. But, if you are basing your response time on her previous response time and waiting just a bit longer (something I've read from numerous PUA sources) she is ultimately setting the pace.

The thing for me to do is not text when I have a lot of time on my hands. A high value dude is indeed often too busy to respond right away. Even if I'm too busy reading this forum and sitting on my ass, that is a fine reason to be too busy to respond right away- it need not be considered disingenuous to wait.

I am curious to know what some more people think of my last quote, still. I am thinking along similar lines to Bruce Lee- "The best style is no style." Has anyone come 'full circle' and abandoned the particular systems and transcended the rules of the game? There are times when I literally can do no wrong, but I'm a long way from that being a permanent state of being.

[game_ethic]

Playing the waiting game depends on the context of the situation. If I truly am busy, I won't reply; time is valuable. If I want to hook up, I'll reply as quickly as I can because there can be an unexpected turn in events that may prevent said hook up from occurring. If it's a girl I have been seeing and banging regularly, I'll intentionally play the waiting game to get her hamster going.

[CarCrashKid]

I think it's important to note that in the end all the rules are simply guidelines.
Nobody in game has ever said "THESE ARE THE RULES, YOU MUST FOLLOW THEM!"

The pros are the ones who have learned through experience and they sometimes offer advice.
Roosh says in Bang that you could text around the half hour mark. i.e She texts you at 14:11, text back at 14:33, never at the 14:30 or 15:00.
She texts at 4:31, text back at 4:56

[eradicator]

I think it's better to concentrate on the content than the timing.

[Noir]

(04-19-2014 09:53 AM)eradicator Wrote:  

I think it's better to concentrate on the content than the timing.

I think timing is key. It demonstrates you are actually doing something and cannot reply at the moment. The most powerful response is radio silence. I am sure when a girl went silent on you it had a more profound effect on you when she replied than immediately.

My timing is done in bursts. Usually if I cannot answer, it is because I actually am busy. I am working, gymming, with friends and can't engage in discussion. Before this I would see the msg and not respind for a given amount of time. I apply a push/pull tactic (if you wanna get gamespeak on me) and for every 3 long responses I will actively 'realtime' respond to 1 in which I will let a conversation blossom.

This is a rule of thumb but on weekends if I have more free time or I am setting up a date I will be more available.

[Moto]

Interesting responses guys, they are appreciated. Lately I've caught myself making mistakes along a similar pattern- texting back to fast and coming across as over-eager or needy; giving away too much information (a girl asks me where I learned Kung Fu and I give a multi-sentence reply more than answering her question); going for date logistics early because I lack the Spanish to have much of text conversation, and relying much on google translator has more-often confused girls (some guys on here only text for logistics and that is the frame I'm going for but haven't quite got it right yet). Not to troll my own thread, but analyzing our individual mistakes and mistake patterns is what sets us apart from the non-gaming population, and this relates to the importance of content.

But timing is important. It indeed had an effect on me, and not a positive one, a few hours ago when the girl left 'radio silence' in the middle of setting up date logistics in real-time. I guess not such a negative impact that I'll next her, but I will be searching for others tonight. This was after she postponed our plans for today. Maybe I made a mistake of supplication by dropping the plans for today for the movie date tomorrow, which is not even set. This is a girl who did not even kiss on the first date, but still seemed very interested- a very rare experience for me. Usually it is first date lay (or BJ) or nothing in my experience. But not to make this a personal 'what should I text next' thread..

I think, unless I'm setting same-day logistics and she's highly responsive, I'll take up that ~30 min guideline. Thanks for that.

Also, I need to 'get that hamster going' more through text timing. It's ironic that by being nice and considerate I'm depriving her of the emotions she most wants.

[robreke]

How about the first text after you got the number....timing for that? I usually text them something right then and there like "Hey it's Rob...the handsome guy from bookstore.".....credit C. McQueen. But...then, the first "real" text if you will within the next day or two or three....etc? The one to set up the first date? I know there's no hard and fast rule....but do yall like to do it the Next day? Two days? Be interested in hearing feedback on that.

[General Mayhem]

I pretty much just text back when I want to, and don't text back when I don't want to.

The last time I was worrying about how to time my texts was when I wasn't busy building lifestyle.

I forget about my phone for hours at a time even if it is right next to me. Sometimes I look at a new text, and forget to answer it.

[From Vegas to Tokyo]

Going off what General Mayhem is saying, you have to look at what the timing of your texts means from a broader picture. By responding immediately every time, you are communicating through your actions "I have literally nothing better to do than sit here and respond to your texts". If this is the case, go hang out in person with her and just have a conversation. Much better use of your time.

By staggering your texts, leaving a lot of time in between, you are giving off the sense that 'while I still might be interested in you, I've got stuff going on and I'm not at my phone waiting for your text all day'. Now, what's the easiest way to do this, exactly? It's simple. If you have things going on that are more important than her, you won't be immediately responding to her text messages. All of this timing stuff doesn't really matter if you have lots of other things going on, because it will happen naturally. You will be preoccupied with your life and neglect to check your phone for a few hours. Sometimes you read your messages and then get preoccupied and never respond. It just sort of happens when you're out building your life and not attached to your smartphone.

By not responding to her immediately and being out building your life, you are signalling to her through your actions that 'you are not the most important thing in my life. Not even close. I've got so much stuff going on, sometimes I forget you even exist'. This will make her more attracted to you and want to qualify herself to you, which is a great thing to have happen. She will be vying for your attention and attraction, not the other way around. This is the foundation of frame.

All of these things are interconnected. You need to have a mission, have frame, and have game. Looking at something as granular as text message timing I find can often be counterproductive. When you're a true high value man, it'll probably just come naturally.

Try to be less dependent on your smartphone. Use it as a tool. To look something up when you're on the go. To call a taxi, buy a plane ticket, or order pizza. Do not be a slave to your smartphone. People will say 'I'm not addicted to my smartphone, I'm addicted to the people on the other side of the phone'. Bullshit. If you really like them so much, go out and have a drink with them and actually talk to them. Most texting thats not setting up logistics is counterproductive. 99% if you don't know exactly what you're doing, you're going to end up getting in your own way and fucking it up.

[Mister X]

Edit: Delete

[robreke]

How many guys here have experimented with texting the same day you get a number.....say within 1 hour as opposed to a few days later?

I usually have been doing it within 30 or 45 minutes to "cement" in her brain while I'm still new and that seemed to work for a while. Then, the past few numbers I've gotten, I've done that and no response. I know it's a small sample size, but I don't like this new trend.

Curious if some forum members have noticed if one, that is texting the same day with a 'good to meet you' message is more effective than the other, texting a day or two later, after the initial number grab.

[WestIndianArchie]

(10-22-2014 03:36 PM)robreke Wrote:  

How many guys here have experimented with texting the same day you get a number.....say within 1 hour as opposed to a few days later?

I have, sooner is better.

Rationale

Level 1 - Dude with no game skills, but believes the Old Wive's tails about calling at a time when the chick is most receptive to his advances.

What time is that?
No one knows.

Level 2 - Dude with no strategy, he just gets the # and then calls/texts immediately.

Level 3 - Guy with game
- tries to avoid the # and goes for the kill
- builds up attraction and rapport before the #
- paints a picture, creates a bubble, gives her a pet name, starts an inside joke before the #
- gets the # with those things in place
- pings the chick soon,
- gets her on the phone, gets her out, gets her home.

Level 4 - The intermediate level
- has a roster of women already
- gets the a phone # with no urgency
- doesn't purposefully create anything on the first meeting
- contacts the woman at his leisure/pleasure
- is emotionally independent of the outcome.

WIA

[OnlyMarryInTajikistan]

I only text a girl one time per day. That sets a pace and she knows she won't get a text until the next day, but she doesn't know when she will get it exactly, or if she will get it at all.

What you are trying to do by waiting is not necessarily have her impatiently waiting by the phone, but conveying that you don't really care. You are busy doing other things and you will text her when there is a little space in your day. She is just an afterthought.

[hoopsy]

It's pretty simple, if you're successful, you will text a girl when you feel like it and usually things will work out.

[draketton]

I never text. I call and speak with my voice in order to arrange meetings.

There's no timing tricks that I use. I call whenever I feel like it.

[robreke]

(10-22-2014 07:32 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

(10-22-2014 03:36 PM)robreke Wrote:  

How many guys here have experimented with texting the same day you get a number.....say within 1 hour as opposed to a few days later?

I have, sooner is better.

Rationale

Level 1 - Dude with no game skills, but believes the Old Wive's tails about calling at a time when the chick is most receptive to his advances.

What time is that?
No one knows.

Level 2 - Dude with no strategy, he just gets the # and then calls/texts immediately.

Level 3 - Guy with game
- tries to avoid the # and goes for the kill
- builds up attraction and rapport before the #
- paints a picture, creates a bubble, gives her a pet name, starts an inside joke before the #
- gets the # with those things in place
- pings the chick soon,
- gets her on the phone, gets her out, gets her home.

Level 4 - The intermediate level
- has a roster of women already
- gets the a phone # with no urgency
- doesn't purposefully create anything on the first meeting
- contacts the woman at his leisure/pleasure
- is emotionally independent of the outcome.

WIA

WIA,

when you say "paint a picture" Do you mean something like " Hey you're cool, we should grab drinks one night." then proceed to tell her about a "classy place you know that serves great hordereves and drinks?" That kind of painting the picture?

As far as attraction, I'm trying to get better at eye contact, speaking slowly, and kino. What are your 'go to' methods for building attraction?

I'm 44 and get the numbers of a lot of 23 - 27ish women. Get a good bit of numbers though not all, of course, pan out. Would like to increase my response ratio.

[WestIndianArchie]

(10-23-2014 11:05 AM)robreke Wrote:  

WIA,

when you say "paint a picture" Do you mean something like " Hey you're cool, we should grab drinks one night." then proceed to tell her about a "classy place you know that serves great hordereves and drinks?" That kind of painting the picture?

As far as attraction, I'm trying to get better at eye contact, speaking slowly, and kino. What are your 'go to' methods for building attraction?

I'm 44 and get the numbers of a lot of 23 - 27ish women. Get a good bit of numbers though not all, of course, pan out. Would like to increase my response ratio.

A fast # pull with game
- see
- 1st words to get her attention
- open her with something
- get her logistics (where she's going, what she's doing)
- get her #

After you get her logistics but before you get her #, you have to make some sort of impression, or say something that you can refer back to when you text her.

I was watching one of the RSD guys do 2 hours of getting #'s.

He said, "Seems like a Romeo and Juliet situation"

1 line.

But it's not a line she's going to hear from anyone else.

If that 3-5 minutes was good, I'd ping her later that day, "Hey Juliet, it's Romeo..."

Paint a picture.

WIA

[Giovonny]

(04-18-2014 02:57 PM)Moto Wrote:  

For game in general, can the best game be no game (as in no games, no bullshit, no disingenuity)?

In almost all social interactions, people who are perceived well are people who appear authentic, genuine, and congruent.

Bullshit is for bullshitters.

Be real. It will help you as a man in many ways.

(10-22-2014 03:36 PM)robreke Wrote:  

How many guys here have experimented with texting the same day you get a number

I almost always text the same day.

But, not because I am convinced that this is the best strategy, I do it because I enjoy being aggressive and quickly identifying and filtering "yes" girls from "maybe" girls and "no" girls.

I just like to work quickly.

Working slowly is fine too, if you have the game to pull it off.

There is no "right" or "wrong". Use your judgement, try various strategies, and do what works for you.

(10-22-2014 03:36 PM)robreke Wrote:  

I usually have been doing it within 30 or 45 minutes to "cement" in her brain

Texting her on the same day you met her is a strategy that can work.. But, texting her in 48 or 72 hours can also work well. Texting her a week later can also work well.

The key thing is not just to send A text. The key factor is to engage her in a text exchange or dialogue that is stimulating, curious, exciting and/or sexy to her.

The timing of the text is less important than the content of the text. Does it excite her? Does it make her feel flirty? Does it engage one her interests and emotions? This is what is important!

Same day, next day, next week.. Timing is not as important as content!

[robreke]

Gio,

Good stuff. I needed to hear this because I've been sending kind of generic milque toast follow up texts instead of engaging them.

I assume you base the text on something you spoke about with the girl in the conversation like her studies or work or what you two talked about. Is that about right?

Do you have any posts or threads or examples for that matter that show what kind of texts you send?

[Giovonny]

(10-23-2014 06:24 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Gio,


Do you have any posts or threads or examples for that matter that show what kind of texts you send?

Here a few examples from girls that I have banged:

Quote:

10 minutes after meeting her, I send this text:

"Mucho Gusto Nayeli, you look nice today. - Gio"

She replied immediately..

"Thank you so much. Pleasure was mine.."

I replied..

"Lol! I will show you the best local spots for tacos"

She replied..

"sounds good"

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-14257-...#pid523166

Quote:

"wanna hang out"
"wanna come over and hang out"
"wanna come over and watch tv or something"
"wanna smoke and get something to eat"
"lets grab a beer and some tacos or something"
"lets go get something to eat" (I usually suggest her favorite food)

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28924-...#pid717163

Quote:

After getting her number.. I texted her a few hours later, around 8:30pm..

"hey karen, nice meeting you today, my aunt is a member of that museum and I think she can get us in free, let me know if you wanna go next week -- gio"

"nice meeting you too gio, next week sounds great!", she replied.

"ok, text you early next week, have a good weekend", I said.

I waited a few days and then texted her again on Saturday, just to stay on her "radar", she mentioned that she was going out of town to visit family so I made a comment about that..

"hey karen, stay cool up in sac!" (a reference to Sacramento)

She responded -- "hey! I'm trying to stay indoors! air conditioning!"

"good idea. have fun with the fam!", I replied.

On Wednesday of the following week, I texted her..

"hey karen, wanna go to the Legion on Honor on friday afternoon?"

"sounds good but it has to be after 2pm", she replied.

"ok, i can meet u on campus around 2:15, this place is gonna blow your mind!", I said.

"im looking forward to it"

k, text u friday"

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28924-...#pid724709

Quote:

me:"hey kaylay, nice meeting you, you look great today, have a good weekend - Gio"

her:"nice meeting you as well mr gio!"

me: "did i spell your name right?"

her: "you got it"

I texed her 45 minutes after meeting her and then again two days later to see if she wanted to hang out:

me: "Hey kayley hope school is going well, i just got some new plum flavored weed wax if you wanna hang out and smoke later, i might go to the beach around 7 --Gio"

her: "I wish i could but i have plans already lets hang out soon tho"

I waited about 5 days to contact her again, Saturday afternoon at 330pm:

I send her this text:

me: "Kayley how was your first week of college?, i wanna get burgers and go to the beach later,let me know if your around"

her: "It was a lot of drama, that sounds good but i don't drive"

me: "No worries i can pick you up, im thinking around 730"

After a few minutes, I also sent her this text:

"Or, we can just hang out on campus, maybe go to the lake"

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28924-...#pid829406

Hope this helps!

[robreke]

(10-28-2014 02:25 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(10-23-2014 06:24 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Gio,


Do you have any posts or threads or examples for that matter that show what kind of texts you send?

Here a few examples from girls that I have banged:

Quote:

10 minutes after meeting her, I send this text:

"Mucho Gusto Nayeli, you look nice today. - Gio"

She replied immediately..

"Thank you so much. Pleasure was mine.."

I replied..

"Lol! I will show you the best local spots for tacos"

She replied..

"sounds good"

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-14257-...#pid523166

Quote:

"wanna hang out"
"wanna come over and hang out"
"wanna come over and watch tv or something"
"wanna smoke and get something to eat"
"lets grab a beer and some tacos or something"
"lets go get something to eat" (I usually suggest her favorite food)

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28924-...#pid717163

Quote:

After getting her number.. I texted her a few hours later, around 8:30pm..

"hey karen, nice meeting you today, my aunt is a member of that museum and I think she can get us in free, let me know if you wanna go next week -- gio"

"nice meeting you too gio, next week sounds great!", she replied.

"ok, text you early next week, have a good weekend", I said.

I waited a few days and then texted her again on Saturday, just to stay on her "radar", she mentioned that she was going out of town to visit family so I made a comment about that..

"hey karen, stay cool up in sac!" (a reference to Sacramento)

She responded -- "hey! I'm trying to stay indoors! air conditioning!"

"good idea. have fun with the fam!", I replied.

On Wednesday of the following week, I texted her..

"hey karen, wanna go to the Legion on Honor on friday afternoon?"

"sounds good but it has to be after 2pm", she replied.

"ok, i can meet u on campus around 2:15, this place is gonna blow your mind!", I said.

"im looking forward to it"

k, text u friday"

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28924-...#pid724709

Quote:

me:"hey kaylay, nice meeting you, you look great today, have a good weekend - Gio"

her:"nice meeting you as well mr gio!"

me: "did i spell your name right?"

her: "you got it"

I texed her 45 minutes after meeting her and then again two days later to see if she wanted to hang out:

me: "Hey kayley hope school is going well, i just got some new plum flavored weed wax if you wanna hang out and smoke later, i might go to the beach around 7 --Gio"

her: "I wish i could but i have plans already lets hang out soon tho"

I waited about 5 days to contact her again, Saturday afternoon at 330pm:

I send her this text:

me: "Kayley how was your first week of college?, i wanna get burgers and go to the beach later,let me know if your around"

her: "It was a lot of drama, that sounds good but i don't drive"

me: "No worries i can pick you up, im thinking around 730"

After a few minutes, I also sent her this text:

"Or, we can just hang out on campus, maybe go to the lake"

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-28924-...#pid829406

Hope this helps!

Thanks Gio,

Interesting, you seem to be more colorful in your texts. Use their name and question marks.

Kind of 'goes against' the other school of thought that says use as few words as possible, be ultra aloof in texts and don't use question marks.

[Giovonny]

(10-28-2014 03:11 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Thanks Gio,

Interesting, you seem to be more colorful in your texts. Use their name and question marks.

I like to use their name, I think it helps to personalize things.

Question marks? I've never heard anyone recommend not using them! I seriously doubt that using or not using question marks will be the deciding factor in whether or not a girls has sex with you. What you say before the question mark is what matters!

(10-28-2014 03:11 PM)robreke Wrote:  

Kind of goes against' the other school of thought that says use as few words as possible, be ultra aloof in texts

I don't believe in any "school of thought".

I believe that Game is alive. Its morphs and evolves continuously due to societal and cultural pressures. What didn't work today may work tomorrow.

It's important that we don't limit ourselves with strict rules. The only rule is do what works.

The female will often lead herself into the bedroom. She will make herself available to us in certain ways, we just have to read her cues and "lead" her accordingly. We can also observe emotional pathways that she seems to be respond to. If texting allows us access to a girls heart and mind, we would be foolish not to pursue that opportunity.

Texting is now an emotional medium.

I used to avoid text conversations. Now, that concept seems boring. If she is opening up to me over text, why would I stop that momentum? I will take that momentum as far as I can and while I'm doing it, in the back of my mind, I am always guiding the interaction towards a physical meet up.

There are no rules.

The only rule is use whatever tool will get the job done!

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-24502-...#pid756380

***

Your text game is a reflection of your personality.

If your text game is dry and boring, she will often assume that your personality is dry and boring.

If you are pushy, aggressive, and lacking in social awareness, she will often assume that your personality is pushy, aggressive, and lacking in social awareness.

Trying to set up a date before establishing a certain degree of comfort and rapport shows a lack of social awareness. Just because a girl gives you her number does not mean that she is ready to go on a date with you. You first have to display a bit a value to her by making her laugh, texting her something interesting, teaching her something, engaging her emotions, etc. Doing this lets her know that you have some value to offer and it also builds comfort and rapport.

I recommend that guys have at least one text dialogue with a girl after getting her number and BEFORE trying to set up the logistics for a date.

Don't ask for a date before building a bit of comfort!

Simply getting a girls number does not establish enough comfort.

Setting up logistics is logical. Vaginas do not often operate on logic, they operate on emotions and feelings.. Thus, building comfort and establishing an emotional connection is essential to setting the date. Without comfort and some sort of emotional bond, it's hard to get a date.

Don't be in a rush to set the date, be in a rush to make her laugh and tickle her emotions. Once you've done that, setting the date will be much easier.

***

It was 2007 (I think) when Roosh wrote-- "texting should be used for logistics only".

I believe that times had changed since then. Texting has literally replaced talking, in many cases. Texting and all other forms of electronic communication have become more personal and emotionally expressive.. If we are boring over social media and text, people will assume that we are boring in person.

I think it is to our advantage try and have an entertaining, fun, emotionally engaging text chat before trying to set a date.

***

This thread was started by Roosh last year:

(06-03-2013 01:13 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

You already know mine. I keep it simple and mostly about logistics. No jokes, stories, and sparing use of smiley faces.

I'm curious what you guys do.

It seems that he was exploring other strategies.

I believe that text game has evolved. it's now necessary and helpful to use text for more than just logistical set up. Send pictures, video, memes, etc. Anything that will help you create rapport with the girl.

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-24502-...#pid854011