[soup]

Gio great breakdown. I'm similarly relentless although I would have pushed to get it going that day or sooner. I'm pushing the pedal to the metal with girls because I'm going through possible bangs in left and right. The pace in NYC is such that if you don't bang the girl soon after getting the number she will think it's creepy that you are still texting her one or two weeks later.

[XPQ22]

I posted the following exchange I had via text from a number I grabbed from night game in the "Approach" thread, but I thought it would be appropriate to post it here as well.

After pitching the date:

"I''m not sure I understand...But I have to ask you...what are your intentions??"

"My mom asks me the same question a lot. I can't say I ever have a good answer for her either."

"Haha but I have a boyfriend sooo..."

Go for the tried and true.

"Tell me more about your problems."

"??? my problems? I don't get it"

"Because it sounds like it might be one of those complex situations."

"huh? Why are you trying to confuse me"

Then I deleted her number as I became too frustrated. I apparently am having some trouble gaming ditzy early 20s girls, at least via text. What should I have done differently? Caveman grunts? Say "You have boyfriend! Me no care!" Put birth control in her vodka tonic?

[whiteknightrises]

^ Trying way too hard to be witty.

Here is the reality:

Most people on this forum are probably going to be more of the introverted, "thinking" type.

Most people (especially random sloots in nightlife) are gonna be more of the extroverted, "in the moment" type.

One isn't necessarily better or worse than the other. It's just two different types of people with two different ways of interacting with the world.

More info (no promo, no affiliate):

https://www.16personalities.com/articles...-observant

Excerpts:

Quote:

Individuals with the Intuitive trait prefer to rely on their imagination, ideas and possibilities. They dream, fantasize and question why things happen the way they do, always feeling slightly detached from the actual, concrete world. One could even say that these individuals never actually feel as if they truly belong to this world. They may observe other people and events, but their mind remains directed both inwards and somewhere beyond – always questioning, wondering and making connections. When all is said and done, Intuitive types believe in novelty, in the open mind, and in never-ending improvement.

One of the best examples of such thinking that we can give is the results of a study of ours where we asked people whether they wish to have been born in the Age of Discovery. It quickly became clear that the Intuitive types would be much more willing to give up the convenience, comfort and predictability of the modern age in return for excitement brought by exploration, distant civilizations, and undiscovered mysteries of the New World.

In contrast, individuals with the Observant trait focus on the actual world and things happening around them. They enjoy seeing, touching, feeling and experiencing – and leave theories and possibilities to others. They want to keep their feet on the ground and focus on the present, instead of wondering why or when something might happen. Consequently, people with this trait tend to be better at dealing with facts, tools and concrete objects as opposed to brainstorming about possibilities or future events, handling abstract theories, or exploring fantasy scenarios. Observant types are also significantly better at focusing on just one thing at a time instead of bursting with energy and juggling multiple activities.

Quote:

These traits determine communication style as well – Intuitive individuals talk about ideas and have no difficulties with allusions or reading between the lines, while Observant types focus on clarity, facts and practical matters. This is why Intuitive types are likely to find it quite challenging to understand someone with the Observant trait, and vice versa. The former may even think that the latter is materialistic, unimaginative and simplistic, and the latter may see their Intuitive conversation partner as impractical, naïve and absent-minded. Both sets of assumptions can be quite damaging and it takes a mature person to get past them – but statements like these are fairly common.

I know some people might think of the Myers-Briggs thing as psychological broscience, but I got a lot out of it. Obviously it's not 100% definitive but it provides a decent framework for understanding why some people are a certain way.

I remember when I was younger and trying to figure out girls/socializing in general, I lamented the lack of "real conversation," "real people," "intelligent conversation," etc. Fact of the matter is though, not everyone is interested in that kind of thing. I think something like 75% of the population is "Observant" 25% Intuitive. You gotta learn how to "speak their language" so to speak. Your average PUA type will continue to have no success in nightlife type of environments because a) he has all the wrong information (another point entirely) but also b) he is just on a different wavelength from the average ditz who doesn't really do much with her life other than go out and get drunk. I couldn't tell you what I even talk about with girls when I go out but it's all very surface level, lots of random teasing, playing around, being physical/screening (key for actually getting laid vs. "hooking sets" "being in state" or whatever PUA garbage is out there). I've banged girls without knowing their name or age or anything. I assume I'm more or less just a fun emotion to them but that's what I'm going for to bang these girls. "Intelligent conversation" is really a pussy-desiccating formula since most people won't be able to relate. Just the nature of the game unless you are looking for a different audience (but like you said, most hot girls are "dumb")

[Kid Twist]

This is the sad truth, learned over the years and confirmed here. It even reminds me of the intellectual whores website (Remember ladder theory?) whose name was taken from the girls Woody Allen paid to have an interesting conversation with.

One thing I'm realizing here and I've known, but maybe didn't want to believe for a long time, is that the whole intelligence thing for a woman is overrated. Totally. As long as she's not stupid, she takes care of you ... that mental stimulation crap must have been acculturated garbage by the girls who might be able to give it, but you clearly don't want to fuck.

Sad, but true. What's worse is that the few bitches that I know that were hot and actually very smart were careerists who because of the modern option age, had skewed priorities and slept with too many men. Incidentally, one had divorced parents and the other was abused.

Summary:

Look for what's feminine and loyal. Leave the intelligent conversation bullshit to you and the [male] friends you respect.

[RatInTheWoods]

Props to Gio for persistence and patience

I got to learn not to next them at the disinterest and keep fishing and trying....

[XPQ22]

(05-26-2016 01:41 PM)whiteknightrises Wrote:  

I know some people might think of the Myers-Briggs thing as psychological broscience, but I got a lot out of it. Obviously it's not 100% definitive but it provides a decent framework for understanding why some people are a certain way.

I remember when I was younger and trying to figure out girls/socializing in general, I lamented the lack of "real conversation," "real people," "intelligent conversation," etc. Fact of the matter is though, not everyone is interested in that kind of thing. I think something like 75% of the population is "Observant" 25% Intuitive. You gotta learn how to "speak their language" so to speak. Your average PUA type will continue to have no success in nightlife type of environments because a) he has all the wrong information (another point entirely) but also b) he is just on a different wavelength from the average ditz who doesn't really do much with her life other than go out and get drunk. I couldn't tell you what I even talk about with girls when I go out but it's all very surface level, lots of random teasing, playing around, being physical/screening (key for actually getting laid vs. "hooking sets" "being in state" or whatever PUA garbage is out there). I've banged girls without knowing their name or age or anything. I assume I'm more or less just a fun emotion to them but that's what I'm going for to bang these girls. "Intelligent conversation" is really a pussy-desiccating formula since most people won't be able to relate. Just the nature of the game unless you are looking for a different audience (but like you said, most hot girls are "dumb")

Strangely enough, I've taken that test several times and I always get either "ENFP" or "ENTP."

"The ENTP personality type is the ultimate devil's advocate, thriving on the process of shredding arguments and beliefs and letting the ribbons drift in the wind for all to see. Unlike their more determined Judging (J) counterparts, ENTPs don't do this because they are trying to achieve some deeper purpose or strategic goal, but for the simple reason that it's fun. No one loves the process of mental sparring more than ENTPs, as it gives them a chance to exercise their effortlessly quick wit, broad accumulated knowledge base, and capacity for connecting disparate ideas to prove their points."

The irony is I do really well gaming introverted "nerd girls." I just yank them out of their cat holes and show them the world. A couple of the girls I gamed successfully knew their types (seems to be popular with online girls) and it's all "INTJ", "INFP", "INFJ" and so on.

Extroverted club sluts I have a lot more trouble with.

[XPQ22]

The comment about "trying to be too witty" certainly makes sense. My online game usually revolves around humor, and I do a lot of "clown game" there. It works okay on a certain type of girl, the free-spirited type, and those types are usually DTF and great lays as well. But there's something that I've found:

Most wit will go over the heads of "dumb girls"; they'll just think you're a "weirdo", and

"Smart girls" often can appreciate certain forms of humor, but as they were raised in the liberal university system, all sorts of things have been declared to be taboo, off limits, a slur, offensive to this person or that, and so forth. Unfortunately the best humor is generally of the "graveyard" type, which an overwhelming majority of girls simply do not like. Issues of mortality make them uncomfortable, like so many other things.

They really can only appreciate a certain narrow range of wit, at least when it's coming from an "ordinary guy." They might like Louis CK, but it's okay for him to say the things he does because he's famous and they've been told to like him.

Which is why so many girls "love sarcasm." It's tame, generally inoffensive, low effort. It really is the lowest form of wit - and as becoming skilled at any more sophisticated humor involves effort which they have no reason to expend, as they get all the attention they want anyway simply by existing, they don't bother.

So I'm thinking I need to tone the humor way down and maybe get better results. But I also don't want to play into their frame too much by coming off too much as a chode-y provider. Question is how to accomplish this.

I'd much rather play the "strong, silent" type than compromise my comedic integrity.

[whiteknightrises]

Just don't waste your time with girls who aren't dtf. Unless your goal is something other than the f

I don't really do online or anything but if I get a number I just ask them to come over or get a drink somewhere

In real life, I figure out within ~ 5-10 minutes if it's going anywhere and either go for it or leave

Obviously turns off a lot of girls but the ones who are down are down. I can't be fucked with "text game" or any monkey shit like that. I'm thirsty but not that thirsty

Just one way of going about it

[Pride male]

Beer and drugs.

[XPQ22]

(05-27-2016 02:32 PM)whiteknightrises Wrote:  

Just don't waste your time with girls who aren't dtf. Unless your goal is something other than the f

I don't really do online or anything but if I get a number I just ask them to come over or get a drink somewhere

In real life, I figure out within ~ 5-10 minutes if it's going anywhere and either go for it or leave

Obviously turns off a lot of girls but the ones who are down are down. I can't be fucked with "text game" or any monkey shit like that. I'm thirsty but not that thirsty

Just one way of going about it

It's not a bad plan. I've learned that in general, if a girl you meet via night game says "Well do you want my Facebook?", or an online girl says "well maybe I could find some time next week", it's an extremely weak lead.

The downside is that at least for me, using this approach means that I would have to grind through an enormous number of people. And in an area where if I get two phone numbers for an entire nights worth of work means I've done extremely well, sometimes I feel like I have to put some effort into working what I've got, instead of discarding every potential if she's not immediately good to go.

Sounds like girls are just more thirsty were you are - I seem to live in a much more cold, sex-negative and "game averse" environment, very similar to Washington DC or Toronto. Nearly all "leads" are cold, and most girls are definitely not DTF, unless you've worked hard for it first.

So if a dumb girl likes me enough to hand over her digits, I think I need to give it the college try.

[The_e_man]

In my experience, even really hot girls are generally somewhat intelligent.
They "dumb themselves down" when out and about due to what I think is subconscious conditioning.

I still spit witty lines with a somewhat advanced diction (but not tryhard, very fine line to cross). Think Hank Moody for Californication: he's a write and thus talks with a witty prose and it sounds great.

[whiteknightrises]

(05-27-2016 05:15 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  

(05-27-2016 02:32 PM)whiteknightrises Wrote:  

Just don't waste your time with girls who aren't dtf. Unless your goal is something other than the f

I don't really do online or anything but if I get a number I just ask them to come over or get a drink somewhere

In real life, I figure out within ~ 5-10 minutes if it's going anywhere and either go for it or leave

Obviously turns off a lot of girls but the ones who are down are down. I can't be fucked with "text game" or any monkey shit like that. I'm thirsty but not that thirsty

Just one way of going about it

It's not a bad plan. I've learned that in general, if a girl you meet via night game says "Well do you want my Facebook?", or an online girl says "well maybe I could find some time next week", it's an extremely weak lead.

The downside is that at least for me, using this approach means that I would have to grind through an enormous number of people. And in an area where if I get two phone numbers for an entire nights worth of work means I've done extremely well, sometimes I feel like I have to put some effort into working what I've got, instead of discarding every potential if she's not immediately good to go.

Sounds like girls are just more thirsty were you are - I seem to live in a much more cold, sex-negative and "game averse" environment, very similar to Washington DC or Toronto. Nearly all "leads" are cold, and most girls are definitely not DTF, unless you've worked hard for it first.

So if a dumb girl likes me enough to hand over her digits, I think I need to give it the college try.

Yea maybe bad if you don't live in a big city where shit's poppin

And nah, I live in probably one of the most conservative places on the planet (Korea)

My current logistical situation isn't good for anything other than ONS so that's what I go for

[Rang off the Pipe]

This thread has a slightly misleading title, but really the stuff being discussed is great for a lot of girls and not just "stupid" ones. If you're like me and have a tendency to speak too intelligently while running game, some of the tidbits offered in this thread can really help. They've certainly helped me to simplify my text game a bit and be more spontaneous in my conversations. Giovanny's last post is actually very useful and should be read by any newbie.

[Cr33pin]

What is the method to fuck stupid girls? Just be yourself

[torridon747]

I only modify my game if the girl a deviation or two above average intelligence. You can build a lot of attration by showing a smart girl that you're intelligent (or smarter than her by just a little bit, but she still has to follow along, don't lose her). Girls already almost uniformly think they are intelligent, capable and all that other bullshit that they definitely are not. A genuinely smart girl will feel alone in her intelligence, just as most men would but it's worse for them. Smart women aren't valued for their intelligence as much as men and chances are that they dumb themselves down to fit in a lot more than they want to. So the chance to build attraction/comfort with a girl that's actually smart is one you shouldn't pass up.

Inversely if you go above an average or stupid girls head it can make her uncomfortable which is counter-intuitive to what we're all trying to do here. Even if you're on a strong dominance kick and you constantly need to show your superiority and capability to hold the frame - making a girl feel dumb will dry them up and push them away.

All-in-all I think it's best to keep it simple and be low-key smart. Covertly drop hints that you might be a bit better off in the old noggin than most but don't wear it on your sleave - that's not attractive to most women.

[Hypno]

I really can't improve on Gio's approach, but if that is not congruent for you or you can't dumb it down try doing a cold reading or palm reading or some crap like that.

What happens is you say something like oh i see this little doo dad on your palm - "At times you are extroverted and sociable, while at others times you feel introverted and reserved." Then the typical chick will agree with you and use it as an opportunity to talk about herself, which is perfect, because the thing they want most, especially dumb chicks, is someone to listen to them. And talking about themselves is their favorite topic. You do that a few time and then you say something like, wow, I really feel a connection with you, you are so different from other girls, I think it was fate that I was supposed to meat you tonight, etc. etc. There are some cold reading threads on the forum already, but you don't need to be an expert.

The reason why I suggest it is with dumb chicks you just need to get them talking. Cold reading is a technique that facilitates a girl talking about herself, except the frame you create makes it feel to her like you are talking about her rather than she talking about herself; your frame gives her permission to talk about herself. So she easily carries the load of the conversation, and the sharing of personal information, compared to b.s. like the weather or mexican food, accelerates the perceived intimacy - she'll actually feel you know her better than anyone else she's met, and that will be exciting to her. Also, if your are very intelligent, this type of conversation doesn't require you to dumb down your approach much which is not congruent for a lot of smart guys. You do have to practice keeping your mouth shut and letting her ramble. The more she talks, the more you are in. One model for this is the classic psychoanalyst. You sit there talking, and he responds with very short sentences like, "and how did that make you feel" or "tell me more". Or if she divulges something interesting, like she's bisexual or shares a common interest, then you can steer the conversation in that direction and actually contribute to the conversation.

[questor70]

(05-26-2016 04:58 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  

A couple of the girls I gamed successfully knew their types (seems to be popular with online girls) and it's all "INTJ", "INFP", "INFJ" and so on.

Where are you finding INFP chicks and what do you think of them?