[thegmanifesto]

There has been this often said myth on the forum lately that phone numbers are "worthless".

I just thought about my swoops from the summer till now, and I would say I am at about 50% first night swoop, 50% phone number-call-set up date-then swoop (not always first date). (Possibly 40-60.)

If you think they are worthless, you are doing it wrong.

Just wanted to shatter another myth.

Carry on.

[j r]

What's the typical scenario for you getting a number? I'm guessing that is where the difference is.

[BishesMyron]

I would say it also depends on the location. Reading from experiences of guys, I reckon a phone number in US will have much less value than an European. I have had more success with German phone numbers than Polish (which I find weird lol)

[Lights]

Havent we already talked about this...

[thegmanifesto]

(11-25-2013 02:24 PM)Lights Wrote:  

Havent we already talked about this...

Well, we have already talked about Okstupid and Plenty of Shrimp and that hasn't stopped people from talking about it non-stop, right?

(11-25-2013 02:18 PM)j r Wrote:  

What's the typical scenario for you getting a number? I'm guessing that is where the difference is.

Scenario:

Me Gaming a girl. Putting her number in my phone.

Wait, I think I finally put 2 and 2 together.

The guys saying phone numbers are worthless are getting them online probably.

Now this sh*t is starting to make sense.

Just had an Epiphany (and I don't mean that Exotic Dancer from Rick's Cabaret in New Orleans either, or maybe I do).

[MrXY]

Not worthless but a last resort

Only pan out to a date for me maybe 25% of the time

[Albertron]

(11-25-2013 02:18 PM)j r Wrote:  

What's the typical scenario for you getting a number? I'm guessing that is where the difference is.

True, it's a matter of her liking to you, and how much rapport you've built, prior to getting those digits. I've seen instances (my own experience and others) where the girl will give her number out of politeness.

[thegmanifesto]

(11-25-2013 02:30 PM)MrXY Wrote:  

Not worthless but a last resort

Only pan out to a date for me maybe 25% of the time

Sounds a little stronger than a "last resort", right?

100 numbers in a month, 25 dates.

Mediocre 50% closing ratio on dates.

12 swoops per month.

144 swoops per year.

I would say you are doing pretty well for yourself.

---

If a first night swoop is the "first resort".

And a number is a "last resort".

What are the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th etc "resorts"?

[Mon]

(11-25-2013 02:16 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

There has been this often said myth on the forum lately that phone numbers are "worthless".

I just thought about my swoops from the summer till now, and I would say I am at about 50% first night swoop, 50% phone number-call-set up date-then swoop (not always first date). (Possibly 40-60.)

If you think they are worthless, you are doing it wrong.

Just wanted to shatter another myth.

Carry on.

AGREED!!!

[thegmanifesto]

(11-25-2013 02:31 PM)Albertron Wrote:  

(11-25-2013 02:18 PM)j r Wrote:  

What's the typical scenario for you getting a number? I'm guessing that is where the difference is.

True, it's a matter of her liking to you, and how much rapport you've built, prior to getting those digits. I've seen instances (my own experience and others) where the girl will give her number out of politeness.

Yes.

And the "polite" ones should be pretty easy to read from energy, body language, non-verbals and conversation.

[Statsi]

My issue with numbers is that I can never be bothered messaging them compared to just heading out again. However I wouldn't say they were worthless, I think a lot of guys are getting numbers without having pushed the interaction to the limit. It's easy to get a number from any girl within maybe 15 mins of chat. Getting the number and then pushing the rejection makes a big difference.

Day game is a different beast of course, then text like you would a friend and arrange a one on one face to face meeting. I tend not to sexualize heavily by text for girls I've met in the day, better to meet up and see how things are. Normally during the date I'll say 'I have no female friends, you don't count either, as I have romantic intent.'

[soup]

Who said numbers are worthless?

[Hotwheels]

Too many guys seem to think getting a number is a "close", so they tailor their approaches in such a way to promote getting the number versus going for the lay.

They may not even realize they are doing this, but in essence they don't go for it, instead playing it safe and bouncing with the digits. Thing is when they go with this mentality, they don't get enough tingles going in the broad leading to a flake when they get the nerve to contact them. Oftentimes the broad won't even know who they are.

Saying that, I think that is why a lot of guys are against getting numbers when giving advice in an attempt to get guys out of this rut.

I know that's why I say I'm against numbers.

If and when I do take a number it's well into an interaction that simply cannot go farther at that point.

The number is not the goal by any means.

[thegmanifesto]

(11-25-2013 04:41 PM)Hotwheels Wrote:  

Too many guys seem to think getting a number is a "close", so they tailor their approaches in such a way to promote getting the number versus going for the lay.

They may not even realize they are doing this, but in essence they don't go for it, instead playing it safe and bouncing with the digits. Thing is when they go with this mentality, they don't get enough tingles going in the broad leading to a flake when they get the nerve to contact them. Oftentimes the broad won't even know who they are.

Saying that, I think that is why a lot of guys are against getting numbers when giving advice in an attempt to get guys out of this rut.

I know that's why I say I'm against numbers.

If and when I do take a number it's well into an interaction that simply cannot go farther at that point.

The number is not the goal by any means.

That is not a "Phone Numbers are Worthless" problem.

That is a "Bad Game is Worthless" problem.

[Giovonny]

Money is "worthless" to a baby. They don't have the ability to use it correctly.

If you get 100 numbers and don't turn any of the numbers into bangs. You need to improve your game.

My numbers to bang ratio used to be 1/100

I kept practicing and it became 1/75

I kept working it became 1/50

Today, its around 1/25 or better.

I still remember the days of 1/100. It was only about 1500 days ago.

I approached thousands of girls to get better.

[soup]

(11-25-2013 05:54 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

Money is "worthless" to a baby. They don't have the ability to use it correctly.

If you get 100 numbers and don't turn any of the numbers into bangs. You need to improve your game.

My numbers to bang ratio used to be 1/100

I kept practicing and it became 1/75

I kept working it became 1/50

Today, its around 1/25 or better.

I still remember the days of 1/100. It was only about 1500 days ago.

I approached thousands of girls to get better.

I have a theory of quantum game.

In it, girls can sense your vibe even if you are typing online via chat. The idea is that there is a game/pussy continuum that is composed of quantum strings that we cannot see, but they connect all men and women.

When you pull on one of these quantum game strings, girls all over will feel it.

They can feel it in your IMs, and they can feel it in your texts and in your phone calls (very directly).

Your goal is to become the Eddie Van Halen of this.

[OGNorCal707]

(11-25-2013 05:54 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

Money is "worthless" to a baby. They don't have the ability to use it correctly.

If you get 100 numbers and don't turn any of the numbers into bangs. You need to improve your game.

My numbers to bang ratio used to be 1/100

I kept practicing and it became 1/75

I kept working it became 1/50

Today, its around 1/25 or better.

I still remember the days of 1/100. It was only about 1500 days ago.

I approached thousands of girls to get better.

This sounds very realistic, you can always count on Gio for being honest and humble. I don't doubt gmanifesto, but he must be a "unicorn" in the game at least in this current era, if he's converting 50% of his numbers to bangs. I'm not even sure what my ratio is, I'd say I get maybe 1 out of every 4 girls that will even reply and from the ones that do reply 1 out of 3 will go on a date, and from that date 1/2 will end up banging. Not the best ratio, but that's roughly what I'm working with.

I've never met a guy in person that was converting 50% of his numbers to dates, that is off the charts IMHO. I do have a bro I've written about, who's 6 ft. 5 in., naturally buff, and male model looks, he's currently in a LTR, but his conversion ratio was probably close to being that good, although most of the time it was girls who would approach and actively game him.

If you're converting that much you probably in the top 10% of guys in the game, ofcourse some may say that's what everyone should strive for and it is, but sometimes reality doesn't always meet are work, investment, hopes, desires, etc. Now I guess I got to keep on hustling and grinding so I can retire by 40, wear $5,000 custom suits, and tip $10 on $20 cocktails in SoBe like the Gmanifesto. Anyone got a magic bullet for me, maybe flip some beans down south?

[worldwidetraveler]

I keep getting a lot of numbers, but I don't have a phone of my own.

Am I doing this wrong?

[OGNorCal707]

Shit, I just realized that gmanifesto wasn't saying he's got 50% conversion rate on numbers, my apologies for the mistake, that said out of curiosity what is your conversion rate? Conversion rate ofcourse meaning number to bang ratio.

[DVY]

G's #s are totally believable. McQ told me he gets something ridiculous like 85% # to bang (over summer-time).

My # conversion rate hovers around 40%.

[OGNorCal707]

(11-25-2013 06:23 PM)DVY Wrote:  

G's #s are totally believable. McQ told me he gets something ridiculous like 85% # to bang (over summer-time).

That's believable, but that's top 5% of guys out there, I tip my hat to the player, because those numbers are off the chart.

[thegmanifesto]

(11-25-2013 06:05 PM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  

(11-25-2013 05:54 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

Money is "worthless" to a baby. They don't have the ability to use it correctly.

If you get 100 numbers and don't turn any of the numbers into bangs. You need to improve your game.

My numbers to bang ratio used to be 1/100

I kept practicing and it became 1/75

I kept working it became 1/50

Today, its around 1/25 or better.

I still remember the days of 1/100. It was only about 1500 days ago.

I approached thousands of girls to get better.

This sounds very realistic, you can always count on Gio for being honest and humble. I don't doubt gmanifesto, but he must be a "unicorn" in the game at least in this current era, if he's converting 50% of his numbers to bangs. I'm not even sure what my ratio is, I'd say I get maybe 1 out of every 4 girls that will even reply and from the ones that do reply 1 out of 3 will go on a date, and from that date 1/2 will end up banging. Not the best ratio, but that's roughly what I'm working with.

I've never met a guy in person that was converting 50% of his numbers to dates, that is off the charts IMHO. I do have a bro I've written about, who's 6 ft. 5 in., naturally buff, and male model looks, he's currently in a LTR, but his conversion ratio was probably close to being that good, although most of the time it was girls who would approach and actively game him.

If you're converting that much you probably in the top 10% of guys in the game, ofcourse some may say that's what everyone should strive for and it is, but sometimes reality doesn't always meet are work, investment, hopes, desires, etc. Now I guess I got to keep on hustling and grinding so I can retire by 40, wear $5,000 custom suits, and tip $10 on $20 cocktails in SoBe like the Gmanifesto. Anyone got a magic bullet for me, maybe flip some beans down south?

Reading comprehension.

Let's all settle down a little bit.

In my hypothetical that you can see clearly above, I said:

(11-25-2013 02:34 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

Mediocre 50% closing ratio on dates.

Not on phone numbers. Big difference.

In this example of my life: Two Months In The Life Of The G Manifesto: Approach-Number-Conversion Rates

I converted phone numbers at 15%.

(11-25-2013 02:30 PM)MrXY Wrote:  

Not worthless but a last resort

Only pan out to a date for me maybe 25% of the time

MrXY said he converted at 25%.

Far greater than my conversion.

(11-25-2013 06:05 PM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  

I'm not even sure what my ratio is, I'd say I get maybe 1 out of every 4 girls that will even reply and from the ones that do reply 1 out of 3 will go on a date, and from that date 1/2 will end up banging. Not the best ratio, but that's roughly what I'm working with.

Hell, OG, that is a complicated equation, but your numbers are probably the same as mine.

[babelfish669]

(11-25-2013 06:05 PM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  

I don't doubt gmanifesto, but he must be a "unicorn" in the game at least in this current era, if he's converting 50% of his numbers to bangs. I'm not even sure what my ratio is, I'd say I get maybe 1 out of every 4 girls that will even reply and from the ones that do reply 1 out of 3 will go on a date, and from that date 1/2 will end up banging. Not the best ratio, but that's roughly what I'm working with.

Its just a sales funnel. A tight well qualified funnel will convert very high. Other times its better to have one giant funnel that people just fall in to.

(11-25-2013 02:30 PM)MrXY Wrote:  

Not worthless but a last resort

Only pan out to a date for me maybe 25% of the time

If 25% is bad, I assume its because those dates convert as poorly or worse. Be more direct about getting laid.

[Christian McQueen]

Let's not forget it depends on how much a player approaches.

I don't approach that much at all, but when I do, I almost always will get the number, because I have tight Game.

From the point I get the number, I know she's more than likely interested.

I then go for the ONS.

I do have a ridiculous approach to close rate, and that's something I should break down in a Data sheet, but sometimes it's hard to write down what I do, because it's become automatic for me after years of doing this.

If I don't hit it the first night and I put out concerted effort to go on a date, then I do have an incredible conversion rate on that first date.

Lastly, I spit serious game when getting the number and make myself MEMORABLE in those moments.

Girls give their numbers out like an old lady giving candy out on Halloween.

Make a mark and that helps your conversion.

[WestIndianArchie]

I usually invest heavy, so the # is solid. 50% seems mad low to me.

Flake rate is dependent on a lot of factors.
- your outer game
- target selection
- # of approached
- time in set
- how much you hit her switches with your words and actions
- Overall value

But I aint doing 3 new broads a week, so maybe I'm off.

WIA