Hello...Russia
It was a pleasure to see Slubu and Courage work in Moscow, I also learned a lot from them in addition to appreciating having competent wings. Namely, that I've got to get my ass out to the club more, and out until 5AM regularly. By contrast I feel like I've devoted too much time to Tinder/online dating. It is easy to date girls here in Moscow on both, but you'll mostly catch 6s and 7s, and you'll tend to have to sit through a number of dates as well...
I feel like TINDER has been hyped up too much on these forums. As just an avg. looking white guy i matched up with very few girls on tinder while in Moscow, perhaps they don't like my Scandinavian looking pale a$$ photos. Honestly, club game (night-game) is where one should go looking for girls for if they are <40. There are always bound to be a few sluts if youre willing to put the grind in.
If >40 online game is best, especially Russian Cupid.
If >40 online game is best, especially Russian Cupid.
Related to Slubu's observation on PUA culture in Russia. I have seen at least 4 groups of Russian guys running Direct Daygame in St. Petersburg. It seems as though they were mostly approaching in Russian. All the guys seemed young, under 25. A few girls that I approached on Nevsky gave me the impression that they have been approached in a similar manner.
I'm honestly not sure if day-game is efficient for older guys. Many Russian girls who look in their mid 20's actually end up being 18 or 19. So as a 36 year old who is looking for a girl-friend/STR it creeps me out a bit. At least at clubs when I isolate a girl I always find out her background story and age, more often than not believe she does not have a boyfriend, and of course know that if she's in a club/bar she is down to be approached and if not there's another one a meter or two away. On the street over a 5 minute conversation it doesn't always work.
Online game is great for finding girls with whom you match up on paper but the problem frequently is that you're sometimes dealing with FSU "leftovers"...girls who may have some issues (mental issues, bad relationships in the past/abuse, some physical deformity/illness that they can hide in photo-shopped pics, divorcees, etc.) so if you dedicate dozens of hours chatting/skyping with them and then meet in person it can lead to disappointment. I had a nutcase like that my last trip and it took me months to get over the mental anguish she caused me.
If I were 21 again I would do 80% day-game and 20% night-game, and just hang out around universities however currently I am in a dilemma as an older dude. Social circle game is the best but near impossible to develop a social circle unless one is in a city for 1+ months. From my Moscow trip 2 months ago I think the best ROI is to perhaps hang out in fancy lounges/rooftop bars which attract more of the young professional crowd and approach "career women". In Russia a 28 year old who has an advanced degree yet still stays in shape and maintains her looks is quite common but unlike the West in Russia a 28 year old is considered "old". I saw a few of these at Golden Ring Hotel skybar without any company (perhaps they were pros but i'd still would have liked to approach if I was there alone) looking totally bored.
Online game is great for finding girls with whom you match up on paper but the problem frequently is that you're sometimes dealing with FSU "leftovers"...girls who may have some issues (mental issues, bad relationships in the past/abuse, some physical deformity/illness that they can hide in photo-shopped pics, divorcees, etc.) so if you dedicate dozens of hours chatting/skyping with them and then meet in person it can lead to disappointment. I had a nutcase like that my last trip and it took me months to get over the mental anguish she caused me.
If I were 21 again I would do 80% day-game and 20% night-game, and just hang out around universities however currently I am in a dilemma as an older dude. Social circle game is the best but near impossible to develop a social circle unless one is in a city for 1+ months. From my Moscow trip 2 months ago I think the best ROI is to perhaps hang out in fancy lounges/rooftop bars which attract more of the young professional crowd and approach "career women". In Russia a 28 year old who has an advanced degree yet still stays in shape and maintains her looks is quite common but unlike the West in Russia a 28 year old is considered "old". I saw a few of these at Golden Ring Hotel skybar without any company (perhaps they were pros but i'd still would have liked to approach if I was there alone) looking totally bored.
Quote: (07-14-2015 08:37 PM)TripleG Wrote:
If I were 21 again I would do 80% day-game and 20% night-game, and just hang out around universities however currently I am in a dilemma as an older dude. Social circle game is the best but near impossible to develop a social circle unless one is in a city for 1+ months. From my Moscow trip 2 months ago I think the best ROI is to perhaps hang out in fancy lounges/rooftop bars which attract more of the young professional crowd and approach "career women".
Do you find rolling solo for night game in Russia a issue ?
In Ukraine I found it more of a challenge due the sex tourist issue, so I stick 90% online but I tend to escalate quickly unless she is high value target.
I saw those PUA's too Dantes. They have a clumsy approach from what I saw, so should not be too hard to distinguish oneself.
The thing about Russian girls....is that they are often really high caliber girls. Even I, who have an almost exclusive preference for Asian girls, was losing the fever after just two days there. But. The quality girls are not easy. Progress is slow. It can take many dates. Ok, you say, so what? Well, how long are you staying? Because I find it somewhat dispiriting to just spend a week with a lovely girl, and then you're gone. I suspect that's because I'm older and I actually enjoy repeated (although obviously non-exclusive) contact with a girl. That's the bittersweet side of Russia, at least for me. I do not find it appealing to keep returning and repeating the process. Again, just me.
The thing about Russian girls....is that they are often really high caliber girls. Even I, who have an almost exclusive preference for Asian girls, was losing the fever after just two days there. But. The quality girls are not easy. Progress is slow. It can take many dates. Ok, you say, so what? Well, how long are you staying? Because I find it somewhat dispiriting to just spend a week with a lovely girl, and then you're gone. I suspect that's because I'm older and I actually enjoy repeated (although obviously non-exclusive) contact with a girl. That's the bittersweet side of Russia, at least for me. I do not find it appealing to keep returning and repeating the process. Again, just me.
Quote: (07-14-2015 09:10 PM)rishboy77 Wrote:
Quote: (07-14-2015 08:37 PM)TripleG Wrote:
If I were 21 again I would do 80% day-game and 20% night-game, and just hang out around universities however currently I am in a dilemma as an older dude. Social circle game is the best but near impossible to develop a social circle unless one is in a city for 1+ months. From my Moscow trip 2 months ago I think the best ROI is to perhaps hang out in fancy lounges/rooftop bars which attract more of the young professional crowd and approach "career women".
Do you find rolling solo for night game in Russia a issue ?
In Ukraine I found it more of a challenge due the sex tourist issue, so I stick 90% online but I tend to escalate quickly unless she is high value target.
Good question Rishboy. Yes, rolling solo in Moscow is not fun (at least for me). Out of all the night places I visited I rarely saw girls by themselves so you have to have nerves of steel to approach tables of 3+ girls who are all dolled up. There is a very low post forum member on these boards who absolutely kills it in Moscow rolling "solo dolo" (he has shown me foto evidence of same night lays) however he specializes in dance-game (specifically latin clubs) and lives there for 1+ month. When I visit Moscow next time (perhaps this fall) I will try to put my slightly improved dance skills to good use and repeat the same...sign up for dance lessons at Gorky Park.
Anyways wherever I went I tried to look out for sets of 2 in bars...they were easier to approach than a typical set in the west, however I attribute that to my unique Russian accent which makes the devushkas warm up quicker. There is no sex tourism stigma in Russia so online game is not necessary...though I did fall into a trap of short dating somebody I met off of tourbar.com
![[Image: dodgy.gif]](https://rooshvforum.network/images/smilies/dodgy.gif)
I still believe that online dating is a bit like cheating on a test...reminds me of taking a high school calculus test and entering a few formulas into the memory of the calculator instead of memorizing them.
My main issue with running solo is that it is hard to motivate yourself to sustain the high-energy that's required of night-game if you're drinking by yourself. Also, it is a bit dangerous to get carried away if you're without a wing-man.
Quote: (07-14-2015 09:54 PM)Menace Wrote:
The thing about Russian girls....is that they are often really high caliber girls. Even I, who have an almost exclusive preference for Asian girls, was losing the fever after just two days there. But. The quality girls are not easy. Progress is slow. It can take many dates. Ok, you say, so what? Well, how long are you staying? Because I find it somewhat dispiriting to just spend a week with a lovely girl, and then you're gone. I suspect that's because I'm older and I actually enjoy repeated (although obviously non-exclusive) contact with a girl. That's the bittersweet side of Russia, at least for me. I do not find it appealing to keep returning and repeating the process. Again, just me.
Good observation Menace and something that may have subconsciously been bothering me until you stated it here. The older I get, the less interested I am in "bang missions" or however you want to phrase it. The progress is slow with the better girls, and even if you do get to sex quickly you would want to enjoy it for longer.
Several times now that I think about it I left great/hot girls on trips I've been on. And it's not like I'm saying I want to wife one up, but it would be nice to enjoy a few months with a high quality girl.
^^^Well that is the thing with FSU gals, the sex is often like fucking a vulcan and so is the dating process. They actually get more emotional when you actually date them long term and can control them.
The fact that they can cook for me and sew my socks is actually more appealing than you think!
P.S- just had 13 yr anniversary last month! And I STILL rule the hen house like a Spartan King.
The fact that they can cook for me and sew my socks is actually more appealing than you think!
P.S- just had 13 yr anniversary last month! And I STILL rule the hen house like a Spartan King.
[quote='TripleG' pid='1065558' dateline='1436924227']
I'm honestly not sure if day-game is efficient for older guys. Many Russian girls who look in their mid 20's actually end up being 18 or 19. So as a 36 year old who is looking for a girl-friend/STR it creeps me out a bit. At least at clubs when I isolate a girl I always find out her background story and age, more often than not believe she does not have a boyfriend, and of course know that if she's in a club/bar she is down to be approached and if not there's another one a meter or two away. On the street over a 5 minute conversation it doesn't always work.
A five minute approach and conversation is little investment and certainly efficient. My approach is direct and more enjoyable than nightgame. The best girls I have meet have been from Daygame, in the US and abroad including my time now in Russia.
I'm honestly not sure if day-game is efficient for older guys. Many Russian girls who look in their mid 20's actually end up being 18 or 19. So as a 36 year old who is looking for a girl-friend/STR it creeps me out a bit. At least at clubs when I isolate a girl I always find out her background story and age, more often than not believe she does not have a boyfriend, and of course know that if she's in a club/bar she is down to be approached and if not there's another one a meter or two away. On the street over a 5 minute conversation it doesn't always work.
A five minute approach and conversation is little investment and certainly efficient. My approach is direct and more enjoyable than nightgame. The best girls I have meet have been from Daygame, in the US and abroad including my time now in Russia.
[quote] (07-15-2015 04:01 PM)Dantes Wrote:
[quote='TripleG' pid='1065558' dateline='1436924227']
I'm honestly not sure if day-game is efficient for older guys. Many Russian girls who look in their mid 20's actually end up being 18 or 19. So as a 36 year old who is looking for a girl-friend/STR it creeps me out a bit. At least at clubs when I isolate a girl I always find out her background story and age, more often than not believe she does not have a boyfriend, and of course know that if she's in a club/bar she is down to be approached and if not there's another one a meter or two away. On the street over a 5 minute conversation it doesn't always work.
A five minute approach and conversation is little investment and certainly efficient. My approach is direct and more enjoyable than nightgame. The best girls I have meet have been from Daygame, in the US and abroad including my time now in Russia.[/quote]
I am starting my second trip in Moscow. I will do a more detailed write-up on the comparison between SP and Moscow. I hit a bar last night in Moscow and the talent is for sure better in Moscow. Daygame Logistics for SP are great. Unless you are into Hipsters, Daygame is the way to go in SP. Girls take things slow. ONS are rare for local girls. If you have time, one month plus and looking for a LTR/marriage with a sweet nonsultty girl, SP is the way to go. Courting is still alive. Dates seemed like what the 1950's in the US would be like. Tea, desert and a long walk in the park. If you are of a Romantic nature, this is the place for you. If you are short on time, you will find yourself frustrated as the process is slow. English levels are better in Moscow and escalation is easier. Nightlife far superior.
[quote='TripleG' pid='1065558' dateline='1436924227']
I'm honestly not sure if day-game is efficient for older guys. Many Russian girls who look in their mid 20's actually end up being 18 or 19. So as a 36 year old who is looking for a girl-friend/STR it creeps me out a bit. At least at clubs when I isolate a girl I always find out her background story and age, more often than not believe she does not have a boyfriend, and of course know that if she's in a club/bar she is down to be approached and if not there's another one a meter or two away. On the street over a 5 minute conversation it doesn't always work.
A five minute approach and conversation is little investment and certainly efficient. My approach is direct and more enjoyable than nightgame. The best girls I have meet have been from Daygame, in the US and abroad including my time now in Russia.[/quote]
I am starting my second trip in Moscow. I will do a more detailed write-up on the comparison between SP and Moscow. I hit a bar last night in Moscow and the talent is for sure better in Moscow. Daygame Logistics for SP are great. Unless you are into Hipsters, Daygame is the way to go in SP. Girls take things slow. ONS are rare for local girls. If you have time, one month plus and looking for a LTR/marriage with a sweet nonsultty girl, SP is the way to go. Courting is still alive. Dates seemed like what the 1950's in the US would be like. Tea, desert and a long walk in the park. If you are of a Romantic nature, this is the place for you. If you are short on time, you will find yourself frustrated as the process is slow. English levels are better in Moscow and escalation is easier. Nightlife far superior.
Quote: (07-14-2015 08:37 PM)TripleG Wrote:
I'm honestly not sure if day-game is efficient for older guys. Many Russian girls who look in their mid 20's actually end up being 18 or 19. So as a 36 year old who is looking for a girl-friend/STR it creeps me out a bit. At least at clubs when I isolate a girl I always find out her background story and age, more often than not believe she does not have a boyfriend, and of course know that if she's in a club/bar she is down to be approached and if not there's another one a meter or two away. On the street over a 5 minute conversation it doesn't always work.
Online game is great for finding girls with whom you match up on paper but the problem frequently is that you're sometimes dealing with FSU "leftovers"...girls who may have some issues (mental issues, bad relationships in the past/abuse, some physical deformity/illness that they can hide in photo-shopped pics, divorcees, etc.) so if you dedicate dozens of hours chatting/skyping with them and then meet in person it can lead to disappointment. I had a nutcase like that my last trip and it took me months to get over the mental anguish she caused me.
If I were 21 again I would do 80% day-game and 20% night-game, and just hang out around universities however currently I am in a dilemma as an older dude. Social circle game is the best but near impossible to develop a social circle unless one is in a city for 1+ months. From my Moscow trip 2 months ago I think the best ROI is to perhaps hang out in fancy lounges/rooftop bars which attract more of the young professional crowd and approach "career women". In Russia a 28 year old who has an advanced degree yet still stays in shape and maintains her looks is quite common but unlike the West in Russia a 28 year old is considered "old". I saw a few of these at Golden Ring Hotel skybar without any company (perhaps they were pros but i'd still would have liked to approach if I was there alone) looking totally bored.
Co-sign +1000. Particularly on the difficulties of day game in FSU as an older guy, and on how online I really do feel that most of the time you're getting the "leftovers", even if they are 100x better than what you'd typically get back home. And all these emails and conversations before you meet set up unrealistic expectations from the girl, so after you bang many times they think you're "getting serious" with her and it's a real pain to extricate.
Day game is undoubtedly really tricky as you get older. Like you TripleG I have approached a lot of girls who just looked like they were mid-20s+ who ended up being 19-21. I still try to game them though (and don't feel bad about it)
![[Image: lol.gif]](https://rooshvforum.network/images/smilies/new/lol.gif)
But it's tough to discern age here sometimes, and I think I should be focusing more on the 25 and up crowd to not waste my time and/or maximize efficiencies. I guess I just have gotten caught up in lots of younger women in Kiev especially who have wasted my time at the end of the day.
2015 RVF fantasy football champion
![[Image: smile.gif]](https://rooshvforum.network/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Hey slubu,
I think you wrote in another thread that you were in Eastern Russia recently. Would you mind sharing some intel on this, escpecially concerning the differences to Moscow?
I think you wrote in another thread that you were in Eastern Russia recently. Would you mind sharing some intel on this, escpecially concerning the differences to Moscow?
Short musings on St Petersburg
I was only in St Petersburg from 48 hours before I had to fly back to the USA for a family emergency, so the intel I can provided isn't much, just general impressions.
1. SP reminded me a little of stockholm, with the water and everything. It feels European. However, Stockholm is 1000% nicer and the women in stockholm are equally prettier.
2. The women? Not impressed at all. When I travel, I always make an effort to look at EVERY girl around me, not just gravitate to the 8+. This gives me a better sense of the true overall value of the women. The average girl I saw was a 5. Even at night, around the clubs, it only rose to a 6. 8+ rarely go out at night, due to constant male assaults.
3. I managed to squeeze in an internet date with a 30 year old 7.5. Like most russian women I have met, she was as cold as a fish. She only loosened up after her 4 or 5th glass of wine (I was still nursing my first glass). At this point, I told her I had to leave the next morning to fly to the USA at 3 am. She was not happy, sounded more disappointed. She told me I should have told her earlier so that she could have brought her work clothes and she would have spent the night (i.e. SNL). Apparently she lived on the other side of the bridges. I think this was an anomaly and the reasons she would have done this are 1) she was 30, which is old in Russia, and 2) she desperately wanted me to fly her to USA for christmas (I am an older man of means). I suggested I would fly her of course - but only if we were "in a relationship" which is my code phrase to mean I already fucked her.
3. The Winter Palace was cool - I would definitely visit that if you are in SP.
4. Dumskaya Street is a shit hole. A sausage fest with ugly girls. Saw a couple of fights. Definitely would not recommend.
Conclusion: although I only spent 48 hours in SP - I saw enough that I would not venture back. I saw the tourist things i wanted and totally unimpressed with the women.
I was only in St Petersburg from 48 hours before I had to fly back to the USA for a family emergency, so the intel I can provided isn't much, just general impressions.
1. SP reminded me a little of stockholm, with the water and everything. It feels European. However, Stockholm is 1000% nicer and the women in stockholm are equally prettier.
2. The women? Not impressed at all. When I travel, I always make an effort to look at EVERY girl around me, not just gravitate to the 8+. This gives me a better sense of the true overall value of the women. The average girl I saw was a 5. Even at night, around the clubs, it only rose to a 6. 8+ rarely go out at night, due to constant male assaults.
3. I managed to squeeze in an internet date with a 30 year old 7.5. Like most russian women I have met, she was as cold as a fish. She only loosened up after her 4 or 5th glass of wine (I was still nursing my first glass). At this point, I told her I had to leave the next morning to fly to the USA at 3 am. She was not happy, sounded more disappointed. She told me I should have told her earlier so that she could have brought her work clothes and she would have spent the night (i.e. SNL). Apparently she lived on the other side of the bridges. I think this was an anomaly and the reasons she would have done this are 1) she was 30, which is old in Russia, and 2) she desperately wanted me to fly her to USA for christmas (I am an older man of means). I suggested I would fly her of course - but only if we were "in a relationship" which is my code phrase to mean I already fucked her.
3. The Winter Palace was cool - I would definitely visit that if you are in SP.
4. Dumskaya Street is a shit hole. A sausage fest with ugly girls. Saw a couple of fights. Definitely would not recommend.
Conclusion: although I only spent 48 hours in SP - I saw enough that I would not venture back. I saw the tourist things i wanted and totally unimpressed with the women.
Quote: (10-01-2015 06:24 AM)ohionukes Wrote:
Conclusion: although I only spent 48 hours in SP - I saw enough that I would not venture back. I saw the tourist things i wanted and totally unimpressed with the women.
Agree with the women in SP being low quality. I spent 4 days there this summer, and can say that even Warsaw, Poland compares favorably. Was extremely disappointed. I have not been to Moscow, but if the women in the capital are as hot as everyone says, it must be a huge difference, like NY vs SF.
I am in Moscow now - I will post my thoughts after I leave Saturday for Kiev. The fact that I am eager to get to Kiev says something, but I want Moscow to be fresh in my mind before I go back to my old hunting grounds.
Question: what look gets the most attention? How do you think a cinnamon skin Latino will do with Mother Russia? (According to Lothario I kinda look like Enrique Iglesias with a tan )
)
Life is good
Quote: (10-01-2015 08:15 AM)ohionukes Wrote:
I am in Moscow now - I will post my thoughts after I leave Saturday for Kiev. The fact that I am eager to get to Kiev says something, but I want Moscow to be fresh in my mind before I go back to my old hunting grounds.
Same here. Posted in the other Moscow datasheet thread. So far I am way more impressed by the city itself than the local girls.
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