[blck]

(11-23-2015 01:49 PM)keegs Wrote:  

A little confused based on the responses - on one hand it seems some are suggesting confident and clear eye contact, while on the other some say it's best to not let her know you're looking and rather position yourself so she notices you. Am I missing something?

Open thread on Basics principles of Eye Contact, find comments about avoiding Eye Contact.
Being confused

[GlobalMan]

(11-23-2015 01:49 PM)keegs Wrote:  

A little confused based on the responses - on one hand it seems some are suggesting confident and clear eye contact, while on the other some say it's best to not let her know you're looking and rather position yourself so she notices you. Am I missing something?

The reason is- Different things work for different guys with different girls in different scenarios.

A lot of guys are on an eternal search for the answer, whether it be eye contact in your case or any other aspect of game, and want to then go replicate the physical movements/instructions in hopes for the same results. It doesn't necessarily work like that.

The guy behind the eyes is what matters most. What he's thinking, what he believes, how confident is. If you don't have that part right, then your eyes will not send the message you want, nor will it ever be received.

It's not just your eyes making contact with her eyes, for X seconds with a smirk at X angle, it's the totality of the message your entire face/body language/confidence/mindset is sending. Those things culminate into your physical presence and the natural messages you send. When your inner game is on point, your outer self projects that for all to see. You can't fake those things.

Sending the message you desire to with eye contact, while a 'physical' action, stems from inner game.

[RaccoonFace]

Bill Clinton holding eye contact with a woman during a debate:

[duedue]

There are a lot of things that I don't understand about eye contact yet. I find I break eye contact with girls most of the time but the reason is that I'm afraid she'd be "creeped out" or even scared. My gaze can be like that of this guy



OK not exactly like that (not looking down or angry) but not too far either. So I usually break eye contact so that she wouldn't think I'm a serial killer!

Another thing is that quite often when I look at a girl first she looks down or away with an indignantion. I basically have a difficulty sampling the environment. I need to give the girl one hard look to see if I want to approach or not and most western women I encounter don't seem to like a "hard look".

One "funny" thing is about American women is that I sometimes notice a women (usually unattractive) is staring at me and when I look back she looks down faking an indignant expression!

[RexImperator]

I've had that same problem. You need to soften your gaze a bit with a slight smile/smirk. Also, stop worrying about being "creepy". You can avoid that by waiting until she breaks eye contact and then you are free to break eye contact. After that initial break of eye contact it's fine to look away from time to time. You don't need to stare at them the entire time you talk to them. That would be "creepy" and makes you seem like a psycho.

You'll find that girls enjoy this and some will test your eye contact for surprisingly long periods of time. Have fun with it. Just like guys I think girls have all kinds of different confidence levels which fluctuate.

I believe if they look down it means you should go open them, but others here can speak more to that.

[Irenicus]

I prefer to do it a little more differently. My main inspiration is 48 laws of Power (read it if you did not already, it will improve Game, if you apply the rules correctly).

I will use daygame, Eastern European style, as an example.



1. I tend to wear (usually) a red, well fitted shirt. Red attracts attention - from both men and women. And that is something you want - Rule no. 6 ( court attention at all cost).




2. I never, ever do daygame without sunglasses. Ever!. Why I am saying this? Due to two factors.


The first one is that your "target" has no idea that you are staring at her - in front of her eyes, you will not appear to be needy. And girls hate needy guys with a strength of 10 GigaTrumps.

In short - even if you have a severe case of Thirst, it will not be seen, which is essential to newbies.


That is Rule no. 3 - conceal your intentions



And finally, the second one is that the "target" will not be able to predict what you are going to do (especially if she throws an IOI at your ass). If you wink - she will. If you stare at her - she will. If you wear sunglasses, she can't know for sure. Chicks, for some reason I still do not understand, LOVE(!!!) when someone is unpredictable (mysterious). I tend to avoid smiling (easily done, I almost never smile) because it will ruin my mysterious factor. If she throws an IOI, and if she looks cool (I run a quick scan of her face and boobs), I approach out of the blue.

In short - being unpredictable is good.



And that is Rule no. 17 - Keep others in suspended terror: cultivate an air of unpredictability.

[Hazaer]

(05-30-2016 10:16 AM)RexImperator Wrote:  

I've had that same problem. You need to soften your gaze a bit with a slight smile/smirk. Also, stop worrying about being "creepy". You can avoid that by waiting until she breaks eye contact and then you are free to break eye contact. After that initial break of eye contact it's fine to look away from time to time. You don't need to stare at them the entire time you talk to them. That would be "creepy" and makes you seem like a psycho.

You'll find that girls enjoy this and some will test your eye contact for surprisingly long periods of time. Have fun with it. Just like guys I think girls have all kinds of different confidence levels which fluctuate.

I believe if they look down it means you should go open them, but others here can speak more to that.

I second this. A smile or smirk definitely helps. The longer a girl holds eye contact, the more the level of interest and connection she is feeling. It will be nerve wrecking but you cant look away first. But it all goes to waste if you dont approach shortly after. One good way to practice the confidence can be to look at a girl's eyes when she is talking to you in more mundane circumstances.

But like Rex mentioned, after the 1st time, scale back the contact after the initial one or you might then start coming needy/seeking her approval. That's something I am still struggling with though.

[senhorbot]

Man, and when a woman look at you like crazy eyes (meth head) and you now she want something with you like very very bad, is a strange and unnatural and vice versa, how about that ?

[Half Century]

(06-03-2013 12:53 AM)Giovonny Wrote:  

I've learned to avoid making eye contact with girls, in certain environments, at certain times..

Who Notices Who First?


P.S. Before I wrote this post, I wrote a rough draft. Here is the rough draft, I thought I should include it.

"First eye contact is important, value is displayed in that first eye contact, don't get caught peeking first, that first eye contact sets the tone for everything, if she sees you peeking at her -- she knows you like her and she takes on the power position right there, if you don't look at her but rather position yourself so that she will notice you, she is more likely to try to "get your attention". What you want to avoid is to look at her with desire/lust in your eyes because she will know she has you right at that moment, don't stare at her.

Also, besides her taking on the "power position", you scare that cat, the one that, nevertheless, soon transforms with feline grace and plays games with you.
Possibly, instead of the sneak- a -peek game, which happens to both with an age, status, confidence disparity, just smile at her and/or say Hi. Some girls get really nervous when the lightening bolt or brief flash of attraction occurs....

[panknows24]

Prolonged eye contact with a smirk usually works best.

Held it strong for a pretty long duration when locking eyes with a gogo dancer at a club the other day. Didnt approach or anything but I could see her face light up with that "game on" look.

[RexImperator]

What does it mean when girls maintain direct eye contact for a very long time in conversation and yet it's obvious from other clues that they are in no way interested? (For instance, conversations tend to be one-sided and they rarely ask you a question.) I assume such girls are probably just using you for some sort of validation.

[blck]

What does it mean for you ?
To use you for validation she need to know if you have value first so... She need to find incongruities, chinks in your armor, you know when she starts asking "How much women did you slept with?" and you proudly say "A lot..." and she replies "Oh that much ?" and BAM that priceless expression on your face when she let that out...

Maybe that's what she was looking for or maybe she was just appreciating the symmetry of your face

[heavy]

(12-08-2017 09:02 AM)RexImperator Wrote:  

What does it mean when girls maintain direct eye contact for a very long time in conversation and yet it's obvious from other clues that they are in no way interested? (For instance, conversations tend to be one-sided and they rarely ask you a question.) I assume such girls are probably just using you for some sort of validation.

That's a tough question for a specific instance, and I'm not sure it depends on whether they're interested or not, but...

These tend to be type-A women. I should say, women who are more explicit in control via sex, vs a woman who controls in more subtle ways.

Characteristics:
- More attractive (less attractive women can't pull this off)
- Tend to date down (more beta), but are friends with everyone
- Tend to be socialites, but might be a crazy loner who just enjoys controlling their man
- "Light up a room" types

Again, just generally what I've noticed.

Interesting question, and one I've thought about many times before, because my ex is this type, women who 'light up a room' with a vibrant personality. I've known others this type...none of them have children. Don't take my advice, since I don't believe in absolutes, but...not great for motherhood. Again, qualifier, I'm sure there are good mothers with this type of personality...probably married to a really alpha guy.

This aint rocket science. He who holds his gaze longest is alpha-est.

[questor70]

I don't think all eye contact is equal.

Despite battling shyness I've reached a place where I'm pretty calm meeting women on a first date and holding eye-contact. But the context of the conversation is a problem, as it falls into job inverview style data-dumps.

If the conversation doesn't get primal in some way, then the eye contact doesn't accomplish anything other than to prove that you're suitable for the friendzone. Listening to her rattle off all her jobs and travel destinations is not primal.

The eye-fucking thing is an art and I have trouble with it. I kind of sense she's already attracted and receptive before I turn it on.

[RexImperator]

Quote:

This aint rocket science. He who holds his gaze longest is alpha-est.

Yes, but that's for eye contact among men, not man-woman.

[ksbms]

(12-08-2017 12:46 PM)questor70 Wrote:  

[...] If the conversation doesn't get primal in some way, then the eye contact doesn't accomplish anything other than to prove that you're suitable for the friendzone.

It's your job to make it primal (whatever it means - very personal, somewhat sexual, very sexual?), you're a man, you're supposed to lead, not her.

You can talk about bullshit and still look lasciviously into her eyes. Long, steady, dominant and sexual eye-contact is worth 1000 words. Spoken language isn't strong alpha signalling because it can be faked quite easily - the real proof is in the pudding and the girls know it. As long as your body language is right, the language comes secondary (that is not to say it can immensely speed things up).

[DraperJ.hank]

One mistake I did, especially drunk is keeping my eyes to wide, a girl or two even commented on it.
Now ive been lightly squinting much more with the smirk that I had before. Great results - easy to change

[HankMoody]

I go from good eye contact to gazing up at the TV.

"I'm sort of interested in this conversation, but hockey is also on..."

[RexImperator]

I'm thinking when a girl stares into your eyes for a long time it's probably just to mess with you and see what happens. It doesn't necessarily mean they like what they see. And if you keep on looking back eventually they'll look away, although this can sometimes take a very long time. Then you win the little staring contest, but that's about it. At least, that's what happens with me, anyway.

[RexImperator]

Leonard Van Neubache Wrote:

Beta: Check out chicks, get caught, accidental eye contact, look away, experience shame, no pussy.
to
Alpha: Eye contact ASAP, when she looks away you check her out, dominance, no shame, get pussy.

The longer she tries to hold eye contact the better the outcome if you succeed in beating her(obviously you don't want to look like Samuel Jackson in the gif above. It has to be alpha, not psycho gamma).

Leonard, could you expand on the “psycho gamma” part?

[lonewolf1992]

Does anyone can give me some thoughts on why 70% girls on the street look down as they walk. As if they avoided holding eye contact as I walk. One optimistic guess of mine is they are intimidated which I suppose is good (?). Any info on this would help me out. Thanks!

[chvrches]

I want to bump this thread because recently i've picked up practicing eye contact with women. But i do have a little problem. There seems to be 3 types of girls, and i want to understand the difference.

Number 1) girl is warm and holds eye contact with you as long as you hold it, perhaps eye fucks you, sometimes even throws a smile at you. A lot of sexual tension going on.

Number 2) girl you catch eyes with her, but she looks down or looks quickly away being shy. Sometimes a little smile, then she looks down, or to the side.

Number 3) girl tries everything in her power to ignore your presence, and with that i mean, you will pass each other on the street and she will either pull up her phone and pretend she's texting, or she will look down the floor intentionally, or she will look somewhere completely else very obvious that she's trying to AVOID eye contact with you.

Why is that? Why does girl number 3 do this. I don't think it's because im ugly since i have been receiving good feedback with eye contact with girls lately. Is it because this one kind of girl is shy like girl number 2? Or is she simply insecure and scared of eye contact?

Obviously some places are more "open" and "friendly" towards eye contact and touching with strangers, and i feel like here in the city i currently reside in, people are so closed off. They barely look each other in the eye when talking to each other. Could it be a deciding factor?

In my old city, which was a smaller city everyone was so open and greeted each other, you'd get a lot of smiles from randoms on the street. But in this big city it's completely different. I can't seem to understand why that is.

Also how do you know the difference between a friendly smile and a hint? The line between girl 1 and girl 2. I don't want to mistake kindness for something more. A girl with a boyfriend could still just be kind and throw a smile at you when you lock eye contact. But doesn't mean she'd want to fuck you.

[Trent W.]

You mean, you expect every single girl in the world to give you eye contact?

Anyway, it doesn't matter. If you want to approach a girl you approach regardless of eye contact. Careful: I'm not saying not to force an IoI and not to use the eye contact to make the approach warm. I'm saying if it doesn't happen, it doesn't matter.