[cardguy]

Sorry to be philosophical here...

But.

I consider myself a spiritual person. But I don't believe in God.

I have a romantic idealistic side. But I no longer believe in romantic love.

Now - I fell in love with movies and music in my teens. And back then - in my 'blue pill' days. I was open-minded about God - and I certainly believed in romantic love.

As such - when being touched by an amazing movie - or an incredible piece of music. I could attach those feelings to the possibility of something in my future. Which would - in some mystical way - be a self-actualisation of such feelings that I was having then.

But - now. When I experience amazing music and cinema. I feel a bit like Dorothy at the end of The Wizard Of Oz. Behind the wizard's curtain - is nothing...

Which is cool. But - it does make my relationship with Art a bit weird. Since I now sense - on some deeper level - that the experience is all there is.

And that the Art is not hinting at something deeper in the world...

I can live with this. It is no big deal. But - it is one of the side effects of questioning commonly held belief systems.

By thinking deeply about your beliefs. It can ironically make your experiences of life feel shallower...

I only mention this. Not because I am bummed out (I have never being happier). But because it is something I have never seen addressed before.

I post this because listening to some favourite songs - which I haven't heard in ten years - makes me realise how differently I now relate to music.

It no longer holds the same promise of something that it once did.

Maybe it is just me getting old...

[Giovonny]

How do you achieve transcendence?

Listening to music, banging your woman, playing ball, dancing, drinking wine, getting high, playing music, singing, cooking, yoga, nature, prayer, swimming, fishing, hunting, creating art, etc.

Anything that causes your mind to enter the timeless state.

Is that what you were asking?

[cardguy]

Thanks. But - not quite.

I guess I am talking about an existential void. Which most people fill with the nebulous concepts of God and Love.

I am not unhappy. And I never get bored. I am just trying to analyse how things feel on a philosophical level.

[Giovonny]

Do you have a specific question?

[cardguy]

Geez - I don't think I did ask a question.

Sorry. It is annoying when people use a forum like it is a blog. I'm in full retard mode today...

Thanks anyway!

[Fitzgerald]

(04-26-2013 01:06 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

Thanks. But - not quite.

I guess I am talking about an existential void. Which most people fill with the nebulous concepts of God and Love.

I am not unhappy. And I never get bored. I am just trying to analyse how things feel on a philosophical level.

It's a misconception that "the void" is pure emptiness. It's empty, but at the same time is full of everything, the void is also chaos. Everything that ever can be comes from it. Derive whatever you wish from the void.
Ever trip boomers?

[speakeasy]

(04-26-2013 12:36 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

I consider myself a spiritual person. But I don't believe in God.

What do you mean by spiritual person? If you don't believe in God, why would you believe in a spirit? Spirit as in a consciousness that outlast your physical life. If that's what you mean. I know the word is a bit nebulous in its usage.

Quote:

I have a romantic idealistic side. But I no longer believe in romantic love.

Do you believe in any other kind of love? Family love? Friendship love? If so, why would romantic love not be just another type of love? Just curious where you are coming from with this.

Quote:

As such - when being touched by an amazing movie - or an incredible piece of music. I could attach those feelings to the possibility of something in my future. Which would - in some mystical way - be a self-actualisation of such feelings that I was having then.

But - now. When I experience amazing music and cinema. I feel a bit like Dorothy at the end of The Wizard Of Oz. Behind the wizard's curtain - is nothing...

Which is cool. But - it does make my relationship with Art a bit weird. Since I now sense - on some deeper level - that the experience is all there is.

And that the Art is not hinting at something deeper in the world...

I can live with this. It is no big deal. But - it is one of the side effects of questioning commonly held belief systems.

By thinking deeply about your beliefs. It can ironically make your experiences of life feel shallower...

I only mention this. Not because I am bummed out (I have never being happier). But because it is something I have never seen addressed before.

I post this because listening to some favourite songs - which I haven't heard in ten years - makes me realise how differently I now relate to music.

It no longer holds the same promise of something that it once did.

Maybe it is just me getting old...

Sounds this could be an interesting topic for discussion but I'm just not sure what you're asking.

As for transcendence, what that means to me is feeling like you are part of something far larger and greater than yourself. Getting to that place where you are just above it all, but not in any narcissistic way. Some people get that feeling from religion or some type of worship. Some get it from the raw power and scale of nature. Looking up at the cosmos in the desert for example. It's humbling and puts life in perspective. Joe Rogan posted this on his FB page and I found it intriguing:



We might actually be the very consciousness of the universe experiencing itself.

[Frost]

Drugs bro.

[Giovonny]

(04-26-2013 01:38 PM)Fitzgerald Wrote:  

It's a misconception that "the void" is pure emptiness. It's empty, but at the same time is full of everything, the void is also chaos. Everything that ever can be comes from it.

I agree.

But, I don't know what this void is???

What the hell is the void???

(04-26-2013 01:38 PM)Fitzgerald Wrote:  

Derive whatever you wish from the void.

This is how I feel.

Life is what you make it.

(04-26-2013 01:38 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

If you don't believe in God, why would you believe in a spirit?

lol

I like that!

[thebassist]

Get seriously into meditation or yoga.

Get out in nature.

Try out DMT. Combine it with option 2.

[cardguy]

This great song by Moby - reminds me of the Joe Rogan post above:

I was asked what I mean by spiritual? Particularly since I don't believe in God.

Well - I dunno' really. Except the most powerful feelings I have had. And the most enjoyable experiences I have are somehow distant and unrelated to the stuff that takes place in day to day life.

I am nothing special. And I know we all have similar feelings.

It is just that - for most people. Those feelings are tied into some relationship they have with God. Or perhaps - memories of lost love. Or loves that may be to come in the future.

Whereas - on a logical level. I can no longer frame those feelings in that way. Since I have thrown off that cultural conditioning. Although - in light of this post - perhaps not fully...

Now - I do believe in love in terms of friends and family. But - I am just talking about romantic love here - since that (along with God) seems to be the driving force that seems to underlay alot of people's peak experiences...

[speakeasy]

Cool song and good message. I remember being blown away when I first found out that we literally come from the leftover material of ancient supernovas. The universe is trippy as hell, it's hard to even believe it sometimes. That some stars exploded and blew raw elements into the cosmos, which congealed, formed solar systems, planets and little organisms started to grow on them and eventually develop into intelligent life that is self-aware. When you step back and think about that process it is just...

[Giovonny]

(04-26-2013 02:02 PM)thebassist Wrote:  

Try out DMT.

This will be my next "spiritual experience"

(04-26-2013 02:03 PM)cardguy Wrote:  

I am just talking about romantic love here - since that (along with God) seems to be the driving force that seems to underlay alot of people's peak experiences...

Romantic love? god?

These things are not the driving force behind my peak experiences.

The driving force behind my peak experiences is me and my love for myself. I create these peak experiences because I honor myself.

Maybe, there is a god that created me but if I want peak experiences, I have to make it happen.

Romantic love is a great drug. The come-down can be rough.

(04-26-2013 02:14 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

That some stars exploded and blew raw elements into the cosmos, which congealed, formed solar systems, planets and little organisms started to grow on them and eventually develop into intelligent life that is self-aware. When you step back and think about that process it is just...

This is all theory right?

We don't actually know how we got here?

[cardguy]

Yeah - I know. I once came up with a 'line' which worked nicely for me.

You ask a chick if you can hold her hand. You then say you have waited 8.4 billion years to touch her again.

Cheesy as hell. But some of the smarter girls seemed to enjoy it.

I later found that the brilliant comedic novelist Richard Brautigan used the same line in one of his books.

I guess we all luck out on being smart from time to time...

[cardguy]

I think you are right, Giovanny.

Inner mastery is when you start to 'worship' yourself and your own experiences. As opposed to trying to find love and acceptance in others.

It is something I learned off Patrice O'Neal.

I guess I am just mixing up 'taking the red pill' with no longer being a teenager. The feelings you have as a teen can be crazy intense.

[cardguy]

I just remembered - that when I was a teen I had delusions that I might wake up one day and be a genius. And make a great film. Or discover the Grand Unified Theory of physics.

It never happened. But - along with god and love. I guess such delusions of grandeur used to lie behind the intense artistic hit I would get from movies and music.

The funny thing about being a teen - is you genuinely cannot be sure if you are a genius or not. Since - alot of geniuses go undiscovered as teens...

God - I'm such a loser. :-)

[Roosh]

Check RVF twenty times a day.

[le prince perdu]

trying to achieve mastery at anything is usually the way to achieve transcendence, you have a mind, a body and a spirit.

Have you reach the best abilities your body can offer? ancient martial master have shown that your body is capable of many things

You can try to master your body

An instrument

Mind and spirit

[cardguy]

I'm an expert in sleight-of-hand magic (hence my username).

So - I do have an enjoyable hobby. Indeed - I feel sorry for those who don't. It is a great way to switch off from the world.

[Fitzgerald]

(04-26-2013 01:58 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(04-26-2013 01:38 PM)Fitzgerald Wrote:  

It's a misconception that "the void" is pure emptiness. It's empty, but at the same time is full of everything, the void is also chaos. Everything that ever can be comes from it.

I agree.

But, I don't know what this void is???

What the hell is the void???

(04-26-2013 01:38 PM)Fitzgerald Wrote:  

Derive whatever you wish from the void.

This is how I feel.

Life is what you make it.

(04-26-2013 01:38 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

If you don't believe in God, why would you believe in a spirit?

lol

I like that!

You can't explain the void, maaaaan. You can only experience it.

[guerrilla]

Damn this thread is psychedelic man

[Veloce]

To answer the OP:

Detachment.

Apologies to Roosh, I've been meaning to write a ROK article about Buddhism and game for some time. I'm a terrible procrastinator.

I've done a lot of drugs, especially hallucinogens. Those are just a taste of "transcendence" as you put it. Meditation is really the only true way. You can get in this state through other means but meditation is the most reliable. I've semi-mastered an instrument (guitar) and that's different.

When you say transcendence, and mention "the void", that can only come through the complete detachment that meditation provides. Now, meditation while high on hallucinogens, that's some powerful shit. It's so intense I can't do it for very long. (I once went to the garden at the Getty Museum and meditated on a plant while high on mushrooms. It's almost scary how far out you get) But drugs are still medicine and you want to be able to practice detachment while completely sober.

Buddhism, at its core, is a discipline in detachment. You detach yourself from your desires, thoughts, cravings, habits. During this process you might experience some deeper bliss, and you have to detach yourself from that too. After enough time practicing all this you one day reach a depth of meditation where there's nothing: no noise in your brain, your heartbeat slows, and you become as insignificant and still as the rock sitting next to you. Time stops and you connect with the eternal moment. You might think that I sound like some hokey bullshitter but I've experienced these things.

So people get far out with this shit. They get really detached from their lives, the "real world" so to speak. Some of them join a retreat or drop off the face of the Earth. I've got friends that chose this path.

Many Buddhists condemn this as it restricts your karma. Karma is your involvement in the world. Zen Buddhists preach that "the path" involves one foot in the "real world" and one foot connected to "the void". This is what I personally strive for. Life becomes a dance that you're a part of, but your inner world is peaceful and doesn't take any outside disturbance too seriously.

Does that help with the orignal post or am I just blathering away?

[Veloce]

As far as "the void", many spiritual scripts have struggled to identify it. There's a name for it in almost every religion. It is that thing that cannot be named. It's a feeling of oneness and nothingness. Life becomes heartbreakingly beautiful in its utter insignificance.

It's the spiritual experience. The experience that all life in this very moment is eternal and holy.

For those that have had this experience, no explanation is necessary. For those that have not, no explanation is possible.

Post script: Some people read about detaching from your desires and immediately throw up some sort of defense or reaction. Life is too short to not desire! What, never fuck another hot girl or eat a great meal?! I like fulfilling my desires!

Buddhism addresses all that. Buddhism is not the SUPPRESSION of your desires, it is the DETACHMENT. There is a difference. Also: You cannot force someone into it. If you are 100% content in your life you will not change. Change comes from discontent. When 300 women and the fanciest meals cease to make you feel the way they once did, that is discontent. You can move to the next thrill, and then that too will cease to satisfy. At some point it is worth learning how to find inner bliss that is independent from sensory gratification.

[JimNortonFan]

To OP:

You are describing me over the last two years, especially the shallow-deep paradox.

No movies, I've lost taste in music, even novels don't excite me.

I think you've been on a journey to improve yourself and you've reached a point of diminishing returns.

I'm starting my own business soon so I can go out and make a mark on the world. You need to do something in the world rather than inside yourself (IMO).

[tiggaling]

---->smoke 80mg of DMT<----

http://www.dmt-nexus.me