[Dulceácido]

I was reading through another member's data sheet on Dom Rep and saw that recently lots of members who are learning Spanish began asking about the regionally appropriate translations of certain words which could be useful in chatting up chicks.

I have a bachelors degree in Spanish and have lived in and travelled throughout South America for more than fifteen years. I cannot begin to describe the dynamic problems that someone (anyone) faces when trying to speak in multiple regional dialects. This is a cultural thing. There are words that mean many, many different things depending simply on the region in which the word(s) is(are) spoken, not to mention the context in which it is used. At first glance, a native English speaker is likely to say, "Damn. Spanish is all fucked up" and some of it is, but the fact of the matter is we do the exact same thing in English.

Take, for example, a simple question in English which, depending on several contextual situations could be interpreted several ways: "Hey, Man, do you wanna roll?" How can this be interpreted?
A preparation for a change of venue: We're about to roll out of here.
Doing drugs at a rave: Do you want to do some X?
At the fight gym: You've just been challenged to a jiu-jitsu match.
Lunch or dinner time: Would you like some bread?
...Anyway, you get my point. It could mean several things. In Spanish it's similar although it can really get crazy from region to region. Native Spanish speakers have a problem with this as you will see if you check out the video here. A lot of times, they don't even know to what someone's referring. Most of the time, you can figure it out in context, but often it just boils down to being familiar with local use of certain words. Only time and experience in that culture will teach you how the word is used, unless you have someone to explain it to you on every occasion the word arises... There is no substitute for living in an area, understanding the language very well to begin with, and paying close attention to the idiosyncrasies around you in casual conversation. Like I said, these things are difficult for native speakers, so for novices it can become very frustrating and embarrassing, especially if the word is considered vulgar in one culture as opposed to another.

From the DR thread I immediately saw potential problems with some of the translations being kicked around, most of which were grammatically correct. For example, when talking about a girls ass... In most places, trasero would be a pretty safe option. That's the spanish equivalent of referring to someone's behind or heiny. In many places the word culo would be considered very vulgar--the English equivalent of asshole. Nalgas is another word that is pretty safe, it being the English equivalent of buttcheeks. When you're talking about a girls tits... Ugh... Lots of regional variation here... Pretty safe: senos would be the Spanish equivalent of breasts or bosom. Pretty safe, right? Tetas on the other hand, while it does mean "tits," it's more often (almost exclusively, especially in Argentina) used in reference to livestock, the Spanish equivalent of udders. So, unless you're going for a neg, you probably don't want to tell a chick she has nice udders. So, don't do that. Unless of course the chick is metaphorically bovine, then tell the fat bitch she has some nice udders. Okay? Of course you could always safely go the non-gender specific and say pecho which, of course, means chest.
Gotta take a wiz? You could go with the safe, necesito orinar or I need to urinate. If you're trying to be cute and childish and you're in Colombia you could say necesito hacer chi-chi or I need to wee-wee. But if you said necesito hacer chi-chi in Montevideo, people are going to look at you like you have a dick growing from your forehead and you are one chromosome away from a babbling idiot. In English, if you say, "I have to take a piss" it could be considered a bit vulgar or at least very common and inappropriate if you were speaking to someone's grandmother... In Buenos Aires, even little children will say necesito hacer pis and it's like saying I need to pee pee, but the child just said he/she needs to take a piss. If you're having a piss in England it's something else entirely...

In closing, I thought it would be cool to have the native and advanced Spanish speakers to drop some of the colloquial expressions that they are familiar with and describe the different nuisances across the regions. And I leave you with this video which is absolutely genius so you can see how these expressions frustrate every single person in the Spanish speaking world. So don't give up. Try to stay positive and study hard. Learning a foreign language is a wonderful thing. Feel free to drop some specific questions in the thread and I will try to answer them the best I can. Enjoy:

[germanico]

That video is plain genius.

[InternationPlayboy]

I hear you. You have to be careful sometimes. When I was bouncing country to country I would have to make sure "cojer" meant grab instead of fuck. I said it in Peru and tried judging the people expression. I finally asked, "Cojer means grab in Peru right?

On a side note, isn't "chi-chi" what girls say and guys say "pi pi?" That's what I was told in Colombia. It's similar in Portuguese where "xi-xi" (same sound as chi-chi in spanish) means pee for women and "mijo" is pee for men.

[Dulceácido]

(04-17-2013 03:19 PM)InternationPlayboy Wrote:  

I hear you. You have to be careful sometimes. When I was bouncing country to country I would have to make sure "cojer" meant grab instead of fuck. I said it in Peru and tried judging the people expression. I finally asked, "Cojer means grab in Peru right?

On a side note, isn't "chi-chi" what girls say and guys say "pi pi?" That's what I was told in Colombia. It's similar in Portuguese where "xi-xi" (same sound as chi-chi in spanish) means pee for women and "mijo" is pee for men.

I've heard either used interchangeably, but only by children, as it's not a real word. Like wee-wee or whatever. You are correct that little boys will say pi-pi and girls chi-chi. But being a full grown adult male, if you want to get a smile from a chick, when you excuse yourself and say, necesito hacer chi-chi she's gonna crack up 9 times out of 10. One tenth of the time, she'll just think you're an immature idiot.

[Citlalli]

que difícil es que hablar español

[Kickb]

Qué? El título es incorrecto!.. Tal vez..

[Pete]

(04-17-2013 01:30 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  

I was reading through another member's data sheet on Dom Rep and saw that recently lots of members who are learning Spanish began asking about the regionally appropriate translations of certain words which could be useful in chatting up chicks.

I have a bachelors degree in Spanish and have lived in and travelled throughout South America for more than fifteen years. I cannot begin to describe the dynamic problems that someone (anyone) faces when trying to speak in multiple regional dialects. This is a cultural thing. There are words that mean many, many different things depending simply on the region in which the word(s) is(are) spoken, not to mention the context in which it is used. At first glance, a native English speaker is likely to say, "Damn. Spanish is all fucked up" and some of it is, but the fact of the matter is we do the exact same thing in English.

Take, for example, a simple question in English which, depending on several contextual situations could be interpreted several ways: "Hey, Man, do you wanna roll?" How can this be interpreted?
A preparation for a change of venue: We're about to roll out of here.
Doing drugs at a rave: Do you want to do some X?
At the fight gym: You've just been challenged to a jiu-jitsu match.
Lunch or dinner time: Would you like some bread?
...Anyway, you get my point. It could mean several things. In Spanish it's similar although it can really get crazy from region to region. Native Spanish speakers have a problem with this as you will see if you check out the video here. A lot of times, they don't even know to what someone's referring. Most of the time, you can figure it out in context, but often it just boils down to being familiar with local use of certain words. Only time and experience in that culture will teach you how the word is used, unless you have someone to explain it to you on every occasion the word arises... There is no substitute for living in an area, understanding the language very well to begin with, and paying close attention to the idiosyncrasies around you in casual conversation. Like I said, these things are difficult for native speakers, so for novices it can become very frustrating and embarrassing, especially if the word is considered vulgar in one culture as opposed to another.

From the DR thread I immediately saw potential problems with some of the translations being kicked around, most of which were grammatically correct. For example, when talking about a girls ass... In most places, trasero would be a pretty safe option. That's the spanish equivalent of referring to someone's behind or heiny. In many places the word culo would be considered very vulgar--the English equivalent of asshole. Nalgas is another word that is pretty safe, it being the English equivalent of buttcheeks. When you're talking about a girls tits... Ugh... Lots of regional variation here... Pretty safe: senos would be the Spanish equivalent of breasts or bosom. Pretty safe, right? Tetas on the other hand, while it does mean "tits," it's more often (almost exclusively, especially in Argentina) used in reference to livestock, the Spanish equivalent of udders. So, unless you're going for a neg, you probably don't want to tell a chick she has nice udders. So, don't do that. Unless of course the chick is metaphorically bovine, then tell the fat bitch she has some nice udders. Okay? Of course you could always safely go the non-gender specific and say pecho which, of course, means chest.
Gotta take a wiz? You could go with the safe, necesito orinar or I need to urinate. If you're trying to be cute and childish and you're in Colombia you could say necesito hacer chi-chi or I need to wee-wee. But if you said necesito hacer chi-chi in Montevideo, people are going to look at you like you have a dick growing from your forehead and you are one chromosome away from a babbling idiot. In English, if you say, "I have to take a piss" it could be considered a bit vulgar or at least very common and inappropriate if you were speaking to someone's grandmother... In Buenos Aires, even little children will say necesito hacer pis and it's like saying I need to pee pee, but the child just said he/she needs to take a piss. If you're having a piss in England it's something else entirely...

In closing, I thought it would be cool to have the native and advanced Spanish speakers to drop some of the colloquial expressions that they are familiar with and describe the different nuisances across the regions. And I leave you with this video which is absolutely genius so you can see how these expressions frustrate every single person in the Spanish speaking world. So don't give up. Try to stay positive and study hard. Learning a foreign language is a wonderful thing. Feel free to drop some specific questions in the thread and I will try to answer them the best I can. Enjoy:

Never say trasero. I've been in a few countries (spanish is my native language) and it just sounds stupid when someone says trasero.

Also, the title should be "Que Dificil es Hablar Espanol" without the "el". It's okay as you wrote it, but nobody talks like that.

Alguien aqui habla espanol? Seria chevere tener un "thread" en el que podamos conversar los que hablamos espanol e intercambiar experiencias.

[Dulceácido]

Alright... Firstly, the title of the thread is not incorrect. The title of the thread is the name of the song the guys are singing in the video which also happens to be the chorus, which is said dozens of times throughout the song.

Que sorpresa, eh. ¿Quién sabía que hay tantos profesores de español acá? Pero bueno como sea, podemos pasar todo el tiempo intentando corregir errores que no existen o podemos platicar sobre la tema del post. ¿Verdad?

[pitt]

(04-17-2013 04:21 PM)Citlalli Wrote:  

que difícil es que hablar español

You were trying to correct him and your attempt was even worse, not cool.

[texas]

Hahahahahaha...nice idea for a thread. There are also a ton of online resources that break down some regional slang too. I'll try to find some of them.

Yo también hablo español. No soy hablante nativo pero igual lo hablo. Aprender otro idioma ha sido la mejor cosa q me ha pasado en toda mi vida.

[Pete]

(04-17-2013 05:19 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  

Alright... Firstly, the title of the thread is not incorrect. The title of the thread is the name of the song the guys are singing in the video which also happens to be the chorus, which is said dozens of times throughout the song.

Que sorpresa, eh. ¿Quién sabía que hay tantos profesores de español acá? Pero bueno como sea, podemos pasar todo el tiempo intentando corregir errores que no existen o podemos platicar sobre la tema del post. ¿Verdad?

no esta mal escrito.. pero nadie habla espanol asi mano!

[EisenBarde]

It makes it harder, too, when the majority of Spanish speakers in the U.S aren't exactly speaking about las obras de Neruda.

I know a guy who is a second grade teacher. He gets super intense in listening to conversations because he doesn't speak with many adults on a regular basis. I imagine it is similar to Spanish speakers that in the context understand everything but find it difficult to add to the discussion.

[Numa]

Yo hablo espanol, de hecho es mi lengua materna, asi que si hay alguna duda sobre como hablar correctamente la lengua de Cervantes, no duden en preguntar.

[EisenBarde]

Cervantes e como Shakespeare. Nadie habla como Cervantes hoy.

[Dulceácido]

(04-17-2013 10:13 PM)Pete Wrote:  

no esta mal escrito.. pero nadie habla espanol asi mano!

¡Perfecto! Nunca he escuchado nadie refiere a otra persona como "mano."
¿Qué querés decir? La Mano es una organización criminal, pero nadie dice "nadie habla así mano."
This is the point of the thread. People use words in a regional/contextual manner which may not be apparently clear.

So, albeit in a roundabout and condescending way, a couple of dudes have contributed something valuable to the thread. One dude, completely and incorrectly wants to throw in the use of the article que. In the improper way he is implying que should be used, it absolutely does not work and should be completely avoided. Other dude, a native speaker, who may not have much formal education in his native tongue, but speaks Spanish nonetheless, has pointed out something that gives English speakers a very difficult problem when translating from one language to the other... He brings up an interesting dilemma. Let's look at the use and omission of articles and see if we can't establish some easy ground rules, without trying to dig too deeply into fluency. Here's one of the best examples I could find on the net, which I think explains this quite well (this is taken from about.com):

Quote:

¿Hablas español? El español es la lengua de la Argentina. (Do you speak Spanish? Spanish is the language of Argentina.)
If you're paying attention or are particularly analytical about words, you may have noticed something about the words el and la — words usually translated as "the" — in the above sentences. In the first sentence, español is used to translate "Spanish," but in the second sentence it's el español. And Argentina, a country name that stands alone in English, is preceded by la in the Spanish sentence.

These differences typify just a couple of the differences in how the definite article ("the" in English and usually el, la, los or las in Spanish) is used in the two languages. Using the definite article when you shouldn't or the other way around won't make you misunderstood very often, but using it correctly will make you sound like less of a foreigner.

The easy rule: Fortunately, although the rules of using the definite article can be complex, you have a head start if you speak English. That's because nearly any time you use "the" in English you can use the definite article in Spanish. Of course, there are exceptions. Here are the cases where Spanish doesn't use the definite article while English does:

Before ordinal numbers for names of rulers and similar people. Luis octavo (Luis the Eighth), Carlos quinto (Carlos the Fifth).
Some proverbs (or statements made in a proverbial fashion) omit the article. Camarón que se duerme, se lo lleva la corriente. (The shrimp that falls asleep gets carried away by the current.) Perro que ladra no muerde. (The dog that barks doesn't bite.)
When used in nonrestrictive apposition, the article is often omitted. This usage can best be explained by example. Vivo en Las Vegas, ciudad que no duerme. (I live in Las Vegas, the city that doesn't sleep.) In this case, ciudad que no duerme is in apposition to Las Vegas. The clause is said to be nonrestrictive because it doesn't define which Las Vegas; it only provides additional information. The article isn't used. But Vivo en Washington, el estado. Here, el estado is in apposition to Washington, and it defines which Washington (it "restricts" Washington), so the article is used. Conozco a Julio Iglesias, cantante famoso. (I know Julio Iglesias, the famous singer.) In this sentence, presumably both the person speaking and any listeners know who Iglesias is, so the phrase in apposition (cantante famoso) doesn't tell who he is (it doesn't "restrict"), it merely provides additional information. The definite article isn't needed. But Escogí a Bob Smith, el médico. (I chose Bob Smith, the doctor.) The listener doesn't know who Bob Smith is, and el médico serves to define him ("restrict" him). The definite article would be used.
In certain set phrases that don't follow any particular pattern. Examples: A largo plazo (in the long run), en alta mar (on the high seas).

Far more common are cases where you don't use the article in English but you need it in Spanish. Following are the most common such uses. Keep in mind that there are some regional variations and exceptions. But this list should include most of the instances you will come across.
Days of the week: Days of the week typically are preceded by either el or los, depending on whether the day is singular or plural (the names of the weekdays don't change in the plural form). Voy a la tienda el jueves. (I'm going to the store on Thursday.) Voy a la tienda los jueves. (I go to the store on Thursdays.) The article isn't used following a form of the verb ser to indicate which day of the week it is. Hoy es lunes. (Today is Monday.)

Seasons of the year: Seasons normally need the definite article, although it is optional after de, en or a form of ser. Prefiero los inviernos. (I prefer winters.) No quiero asistir a la escuela de verano. (I don't want to go to the summer school.)

With more than one noun: In English, we can often omit the "the" when using two or more nouns joined by "and" or "or," as the article is understood to apply to both. That's not so in Spanish. El hermano y la hermana están tristes. (The brother and sister are sad.) Vendemos la casa y la silla. (We're selling the house and chair.)

With generic nouns: These are nouns that refer to a concept or to a substance in general or a member of a class in general, rather than a specific one (where the article would be required in both languages). No preferiría el despotismo. (I wouldn't prefer despotism.) Esto es la realidad de la vida. (This is the reality of life.) El trigo es nutritivo. (Wheat is nutritious.) Los americanos son ricos. (Americans are rich.) Los derechistas no deben votar. (Right-wingers ought not to vote.) Escogí la cristianidad. (I chose Christianity.) Exception: The article is often omitted after the preposition de, especially when the noun following de serves to describe the first noun and doesn't refer to a specific person or thing. Los zapatos de hombres (men's shoes), but los zapatos de los hombres (the shoes of the men). Dolor de muela (toothache in general), but dolor de la muela (a toothache in a particular tooth).

With names of languages: Names of languages require the article except when they immediately follow en or a verb that is often used of languages (particularly saber, aprender, and hablar, and sometimes entender, escribir or estudiar). The article also is required after an adverb or a preposition other than en. Hablo español. (I speak Spanish.) Hablo bien el español. (I speak Spanish well.) Prefiero el inglés. (I prefer English.) Aprendemos inglés. (We are learning English.)

With clothing, body parts and other personal items: It is very common to use the definite article in Spanish in cases where a possessive adjective (such as "your") would be used in English. Examples: ¡Abre los ojos! (Open your eyes!) Perdió los zapatos. (He lost his shoes.)

With infinitives used as subjects: El entender es difícil. (Understanding is difficult.) El fumar está prohibido. (Smoking is prohibited.)

Before the names of some countries: The names of some countries, and a few cities, are preceded by the definite article. In some cases it's mandatory or nearly so (el Reino Unido, la India), while in other cases it's optional but common (el Canadá, la China). Even if a country isn't on the list, the article is used if the country is modified by an adjective. Voy a México. (I'm going to Mexico.) But, voy al México bello. (I'm going to beautiful Mexico.) The article is also commonly used before the names of mountains: el Everest, el Fuji.

Before names of streets: Streets, avenues, plazas and similar places are usually preceded by the article. La Casa Blanca está en la avenida Pennsylvania. (The White House is on Pennsylvania Avenue.)

With personal titles: The article is used before most personal titles when talking about people, but not when talking to them. El señor Smith está en casa. (Mr. Smith is at home.) But, hola, señor Smith (hello, Mr. Smith). La doctora Jones asistió a la escuela. (Dr. Jones attended the school.) But, doctora Jones, ¿como está? (Dr. Jones, how are you?) La is also often used when speaking about a famous woman using her last name only. La Spacek durmió aquí. (Spacek slept here.)

In certain set phrases: Many of these involve places. En el espacio (in space), en la televisión (on television).

I make mistakes in Spanish nearly every time I open my mouth. I am still learning and learn something new almost every day. This example is a valuable lesson to students learning the language. Some people who may or may not have any formal training in the language or "native speakers" who may not speak grammatically correct are often the first people to throw out some unqualified, unsolicited, and ultimately incorrect revisions to what you are intending to say. This is a human thing. For whatever reason, it seems to mostly happen with American-born Spanish speakers who have some form of Caribbean descent (Puerto Ricans, Cubans, Dominicans, etc.) who grew up speaking Spanish in the States because of their parents or their neighborhoods, but could not pass Spanish in High School. Take it with a grain salt, but try to filter out the unqualified (poor) advice. You want to be a sponge when you're learning but people can throw a wrench into your shit if you're not careful... Try to familiarize yourself thoroughly with the basics!

[Gallego2006]

(04-17-2013 10:13 PM)Pete Wrote:  

(04-17-2013 05:19 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  

Alright... Firstly, the title of the thread is not incorrect. The title of the thread is the name of the song the guys are singing in the video which also happens to be the chorus, which is said dozens of times throughout the song.

Que sorpresa, eh. ¿Quién sabía que hay tantos profesores de español acá? Pero bueno como sea, podemos pasar todo el tiempo intentando corregir errores que no existen o podemos platicar sobre la tema del post. ¿Verdad?

no esta mal escrito.. pero nadie habla espanol asi mano!

If I'm not mistaken, the dudes that made the video live in Barcelona. They're probably joking around with the "el español"... you know how the Catalonians do...

[Aliblahba]

I figured this shit out. Google slang for that country, then write down what you think you'll use. Then show the list to a cool local, and they'll tell you what is correct or not, currently in use, and hip.

I mean, I'm sure you'll find web pages for American slang, but they may have words like gay, hip, knarley, grody, shizzles my nizzles, ect. Using outdated/stupid slang won't help you get ahead wherever you go.

[Dulceácido]

(04-18-2013 06:37 AM)Gallego2006 Wrote:  

If I'm not mistaken, the dudes that made the video live in Barcelona. They're probably joking around with the "el español"... you know how the Catalonians do...

I suppose you could make that proposition... Or, you could go up one post and read about the proper use and omission of articles in Spanish and then you would learn that it is exactly correct, as illustrated in the very first sentence of the lesson. Up to you, I guess.

[Volk]

Did any of you visitors get surprised when locals said "Gonorrea" quite frequently as part of the slang in Medellin?

[Nudge]

Pienso que es: Es muy dificil para hablar español. Pero me da igual

Im learning Spanish in Spain at the moment and I know as soon as I go to Latino America a lot of stuff changes. But I also think its too easy to get caught up in all those differences. Just get one version down and learn the rest if your in another country. Its a great topic of conversation with a chica anyway if you speak different Spanish. She will be curios where you learnt it, you can get her to teach you slang from her country etc etc

[Dulceácido]

(04-18-2013 08:56 AM)Volk Wrote:  

Did any of you visitors get surprised when locals said "Gonorrea" quite frequently as part of the slang in Medellin?

I've never noticed it, Volk. Could you explain how it is used and give an example in a sentence with surrounding context?

[Gallego2006]

(04-18-2013 09:01 AM)Nudge Wrote:  

Pienso que es: Es muy dificil para hablar español. Pero me da igual

Im learning Spanish in Spain at the moment and I know as soon as I go to Latino America a lot of stuff changes. But I also think its too easy to get caught up in all those differences. Just get one version down and learn the rest if your in another country. Its a great topic of conversation with a chica anyway if you speak different Spanish. She will be curios where you learnt it, you can get her to teach you slang from her country etc etc

This. When I moved to Japan back in 2004 to study at university, I had to learn Kansai dialect, which is the hardest Japanese dialect. When I later lived in Tokyo and was fluent in Japanese, speaking in Kansai dialect to people in Tokyo was hilarious. They couldn't believe a foreigner would have a grasp of it like I did, so it always led to really interesting conversations. The girls loved it too.

[Mekorig]

Jejejejeje, the "coger" problem is very funny, i love to see the people´s faces when some foreign trying to speak in spanish say that. Yeah, slang for each country is hard to learn, specially when you have diferent regional slangs in each country (eck, and that is not counting the accents).

And finally, yes, i would love to see a spanish-speaking thread in the forum.

PD: BTW, "Mano", or "manito", is mexican slang for "dude" or "bro".

[Dulceácido]

(04-18-2013 03:00 PM)Mekorig Wrote:  

Jejejejeje, the "coger" problem is very funny, i love to see the people´s faces when some foreign trying to speak in spanish say that. Yeah, slang for each country is hard to learn, specially when you have diferent regional slangs in each country (eck, and that is not counting the accents).

And finally, yes, i would love to see a spanish-speaking thread in the forum.

PD: BTW, "Mano", or "manito", is mexican slang for "dude" or "bro".

Yeah, I kind of figured that was what he was getting at with the mano. For those interested, la mano is the hand. Here we find it used colloquially meaning "dude" or "bro." The diminutive -íto just means "small" or "little." So, maníto would be a "tiny hand." I would imagine, that the colloquial use of mano o maníto would probably stem from the shortening of the words hermano and hermaníto, meaning "brother" and "little brother." You shouldn't assume people will know that and if you say mano to someone not familiar with the word used in that form of expression, they will probably assume you mean "hand" and think you made an error as an up and coming Spanish-speaking pimp! Good to know! Noted! That goes into my bag of tricks...

The other thing Mekorig has alluded to (as well as International Playboy) is the use of the Spanish verb coger, which means "to grab or seize." In many, many Spanish speaking cultures, the word coger has evolved to, almost exclusively, mean "to fuck." So, you can see where this could be embarrassing.
This can be avoided by substituting the Spanish verbs asir or agarrar. The verb tomar can sometimes be used, but it has several meanings as well, so until you get the lingo down, stick with the other two words. Both words mean what we would say in English as "grab." Asir las maletas. "To grab the luggage." The word agarrar implies to grab something with force... Like you would a fleeing crime suspect (or some lizard you're trying to drag from the club caveman game style).

Sooo, watch what you coger becuase you may just want to asir it. You don't want to tell the doorman to go fuck your luggage.

[Nudge]

Hey Mekorig do you use follar at all in Argentina for "to fuck"? Or is this purely a Spain thing?