Quote: (06-24-2015 09:56 PM)Tytalus Wrote:It was published at ROK a few days later - http://www.returnofkings.com/4658/dont-b...ign-brides
I forgot that this is a couple years old. I'd recommend this be an RoK article
Foreign Brides and Divorce
Quote: (06-26-2015 11:58 AM)whoishe Wrote:
Quote: (06-24-2015 09:56 PM)Tytalus Wrote:It was published at ROK a few days later - http://www.returnofkings.com/4658/dont-b...ign-brides
I forgot that this is a couple years old. I'd recommend this be an RoK article
Thanks for the link!
There's a site for guys looking for "FSU" brides at russianwomendiscussion.com (or something close to that) and there was a survey done 3 years ago with as many guys they could find.... So not scientific, but out of 240 responses the, overall divorce rate was 40%, 10% lower than the US average. Not too shabby.
Do mail order bride really exist?
The answer is Yes, and No, it really depends on your definition of mail order brides.
The historical roots of the mail-order bride industry that emerged in the 1800s in the American frontier: European American men found financial success in the migration West, but the one thing that was missing was the company of a wife. Very few women lived there at this time, so it was hard for these men to settle down and start a family. They attempted to attract women living back East; the men wrote letters to churches and published personal advertisements in magazines and newspapers. In return, the women would write to the men and send them photographs of themselves. Courtship was conducted by letter, until a woman agreed to marry a man she had never met.[9] Many women wanted to escape their present way of living, gain financial security and see what life on the frontier could offer them. Most of these women were single, but some were widows, divorcees or runaways.
During most of the 20 century, the mail order bride continued with the main method of women putting themselves in catalogs. Then men would view the women's profile, then for a fee order the women address. These became the main order bride companies business method in the 20 the century, with the fall of the Soviet union and cheap airfares, these companies spread from Asian to Eastern Europe, mainly now the Ukraine
Today most women do not leave their countries to escape poverty but to seek a man they believe will be a good husband and provider, that is family orientated and that looks at women with more respect than in many countries around the world.
With the advent of the intent, the mail order bride industry boomed into a billion dollar industry, Now with a few pictures and website, anyone could be in the mail order bride business. With hundreds of ma and pop shops opening over the last two decade, Most who were clients of one of the three original mail order bride companies, A Foreign Affair (AFA), Anastasia and EC, The owner of ForeignLadies.com met his wife while working on a tour from loveme.com, A Foreign affair still today in the largest in the industry, each week they offer tours to one of a dozen countries China to Peru and everywhere in between. The industry grew so fast in 1998, Senator Cantwell of Washington state introduces legislation to regulate the mail order bride industry. and a new law Called: "International Marriage Brokers Act" or IMBRA was born. With stiff regulations, many companies like Anastasia moved from Bride business to Fantasy Chat.
Although the industry strongly objects to the term mail order brides, saying there is no difference if man in New York courting a woman from California through match.com, then courting a woman from Russia. Critics like the Terra Justice Center has a different out look, saying these men take advantage of women oversea. But studies have contradicted these statement and show abuse is actually lower in these marriages. See "International Marriages - A Report to Congress"
So why do thousands of women join these site: Elena Kosalova of the Ukraine says, "Men here are not serious about family, they expect women to stay home while they go out each night with their friends and drink. I want a man who s serious, mature and who wants to be with his wife and family. I have met Americans in the past and they seem more reliable and mature." Elena rejects the idea she is a "Mail Order Bride"
Why do men seek a mail order bride: James Goodwin, 43 of South Carolina says, " I meet women here all the time, but I just can not find the values I am looking for.. I have dated here for more than 20 years, After three days in Kiev, I was shock at how many beautiful women I met that I would consider marrying, now I am just trying to reduce my options and pick the right one. It truly is the fastest way to find a beautiful sincere women.
So what is the cost, the cost can range greatly from site to site and from type of service, AFA or loveme.com offers everything from letter writing, tours and executive services for the rich and famous. As little as $12 to as much as $25,000. The owner John Adams say's the best way is just go over and meet then women, avoid letters and never waste money on expensive chat. You can meet up to 1000 beautiful women in just 10 days, it will be the greatest vacation of your life. Joe Nail of ForeignLadies.com, has stayed with the traditional Letter Writing, Each letter is $7.50 and but say they do plan on offer some limited chat option.
Many sites like,foreignwomen.com, PhilippineSinges.com, and UkraineSsingles.com, that offer simple unlimited membership for $29 per month. These type of site also target pacific regions, like Asia, Latin America or Eastern Europe.
There is also a site for mail order grooms; SingleMenOnline.com, that caters to men publishing their photos in hopes to meet an American Bride.
James Dunn, who is a ghost writer for review sites says "You get what you pay for. Membership sites to do not screen the members at all. so you never know who you really are writing, The big boys require the women to apply in person in one of their local offices. The companies that offer group tours will introduce you to hundreds of beautiful women, for the cost of $1000 to $3000 depending on location, about the same you would pay for any vacation. Several companies also do individual tours these can range from $750 to $1500, But only arrange one to one introductions, Always make sure they are biased in the USA or EU, Most of the complaints come from small agencies that are desperate and need to make as much as they can from you. Just a note, if the company is based in an a foreign country you will have no recourse if they do not follow through.
So do mail order brides exist, If you belive a if a woman is a mail order bride if she lives in another county then Yes, But if you believe it just another dating option like any on-line dating site, matchmaker or dating service, than No. . It really seems like a doubled standard in the world, If a women meets a man in Italy or France, then oh that is so romantic, but if a man meets a women in Philippines, than ....
The answer is Yes, and No, it really depends on your definition of mail order brides.
The historical roots of the mail-order bride industry that emerged in the 1800s in the American frontier: European American men found financial success in the migration West, but the one thing that was missing was the company of a wife. Very few women lived there at this time, so it was hard for these men to settle down and start a family. They attempted to attract women living back East; the men wrote letters to churches and published personal advertisements in magazines and newspapers. In return, the women would write to the men and send them photographs of themselves. Courtship was conducted by letter, until a woman agreed to marry a man she had never met.[9] Many women wanted to escape their present way of living, gain financial security and see what life on the frontier could offer them. Most of these women were single, but some were widows, divorcees or runaways.
During most of the 20 century, the mail order bride continued with the main method of women putting themselves in catalogs. Then men would view the women's profile, then for a fee order the women address. These became the main order bride companies business method in the 20 the century, with the fall of the Soviet union and cheap airfares, these companies spread from Asian to Eastern Europe, mainly now the Ukraine
Today most women do not leave their countries to escape poverty but to seek a man they believe will be a good husband and provider, that is family orientated and that looks at women with more respect than in many countries around the world.
With the advent of the intent, the mail order bride industry boomed into a billion dollar industry, Now with a few pictures and website, anyone could be in the mail order bride business. With hundreds of ma and pop shops opening over the last two decade, Most who were clients of one of the three original mail order bride companies, A Foreign Affair (AFA), Anastasia and EC, The owner of ForeignLadies.com met his wife while working on a tour from loveme.com, A Foreign affair still today in the largest in the industry, each week they offer tours to one of a dozen countries China to Peru and everywhere in between. The industry grew so fast in 1998, Senator Cantwell of Washington state introduces legislation to regulate the mail order bride industry. and a new law Called: "International Marriage Brokers Act" or IMBRA was born. With stiff regulations, many companies like Anastasia moved from Bride business to Fantasy Chat.
Although the industry strongly objects to the term mail order brides, saying there is no difference if man in New York courting a woman from California through match.com, then courting a woman from Russia. Critics like the Terra Justice Center has a different out look, saying these men take advantage of women oversea. But studies have contradicted these statement and show abuse is actually lower in these marriages. See "International Marriages - A Report to Congress"
So why do thousands of women join these site: Elena Kosalova of the Ukraine says, "Men here are not serious about family, they expect women to stay home while they go out each night with their friends and drink. I want a man who s serious, mature and who wants to be with his wife and family. I have met Americans in the past and they seem more reliable and mature." Elena rejects the idea she is a "Mail Order Bride"
Why do men seek a mail order bride: James Goodwin, 43 of South Carolina says, " I meet women here all the time, but I just can not find the values I am looking for.. I have dated here for more than 20 years, After three days in Kiev, I was shock at how many beautiful women I met that I would consider marrying, now I am just trying to reduce my options and pick the right one. It truly is the fastest way to find a beautiful sincere women.
So what is the cost, the cost can range greatly from site to site and from type of service, AFA or loveme.com offers everything from letter writing, tours and executive services for the rich and famous. As little as $12 to as much as $25,000. The owner John Adams say's the best way is just go over and meet then women, avoid letters and never waste money on expensive chat. You can meet up to 1000 beautiful women in just 10 days, it will be the greatest vacation of your life. Joe Nail of ForeignLadies.com, has stayed with the traditional Letter Writing, Each letter is $7.50 and but say they do plan on offer some limited chat option.
Many sites like,foreignwomen.com, PhilippineSinges.com, and UkraineSsingles.com, that offer simple unlimited membership for $29 per month. These type of site also target pacific regions, like Asia, Latin America or Eastern Europe.
There is also a site for mail order grooms; SingleMenOnline.com, that caters to men publishing their photos in hopes to meet an American Bride.
James Dunn, who is a ghost writer for review sites says "You get what you pay for. Membership sites to do not screen the members at all. so you never know who you really are writing, The big boys require the women to apply in person in one of their local offices. The companies that offer group tours will introduce you to hundreds of beautiful women, for the cost of $1000 to $3000 depending on location, about the same you would pay for any vacation. Several companies also do individual tours these can range from $750 to $1500, But only arrange one to one introductions, Always make sure they are biased in the USA or EU, Most of the complaints come from small agencies that are desperate and need to make as much as they can from you. Just a note, if the company is based in an a foreign country you will have no recourse if they do not follow through.
So do mail order brides exist, If you belive a if a woman is a mail order bride if she lives in another county then Yes, But if you believe it just another dating option like any on-line dating site, matchmaker or dating service, than No. . It really seems like a doubled standard in the world, If a women meets a man in Italy or France, then oh that is so romantic, but if a man meets a women in Philippines, than ....
^^^
That AFA site is pretty interesting. I think it took me two minutes of lurking there to see three girls who I got ONS from in the past.
That AFA site is pretty interesting. I think it took me two minutes of lurking there to see three girls who I got ONS from in the past.
Quote: (06-23-2015 03:36 PM)Blaxxo Wrote:This is true in many ways, but still think there is a thing to be said about shy western guys who are kind of awkward with girls having far better chances with foreign women. Part of this may be for cultural reasons. I know some white dudes with East Asian wives or girlfriends who simply are not the type to get into relationships in the western world, and not because they are unclean, ugly, have bad character or are lazy workers. They just never caught on to western cultural references, the things that click with western girls, and have no social network here to meet anybody. But this is exactly the kind of person that a Chinese or Japanese woman feels that she can depend on to be taller than her average countrymen, make money for her, make her parents happy, and give her pale-skinned babies.
I think you are falling into the stereotype trap yourself. Are there socially awkward, introverted unattractive men seeking women overseas? Absolutely. You know what though, many if not most of them fail to marry a girl from overseas because the things that make them undesirable at home make them undesirable anywhere.
Having done this, currently married to a wonderful woman from Ukraine, I've can speak to what my experience was and what I saw from the men I met pursuing the same thing I was.
I am frankly, a fairly good looking guy with a very high paying job. I NEVER had problems getting dates. My problem is that women in the US are f****d up. Feminism has poison them. Roles have been so blurred that women find them selves fighting their natural instincts because the Feminazi's tell them what they want biologically is wrong.
With EE girls, you're probably more correct there. They seem to value a man for his brute strength and force of character, so guys who act soft or betray passivity probably won't get far.
Recently I went on a dinner date with a Ukrainian women. According to her years ago she paid an American guy $15K to marry her for gaining USA citizenship. I could have heard it wrong, but she paid him the money.
Then she never had sex with him at all for years. She divorced the guy took half his money and moved down to Florida and bought a house. She was totally Americanized but I only understood half of whatever she talked about.
I asked her if she had friends back in the Ukraine who wanted to marry me. I said I will do it, but I want 50K, and a contract. To be honest Icould really use the money.
Anyways she proceeded to order all this mediocre wine and sushi and ran up a bill over $300 and I had to pay 1/3rd. Oh also she brought a girlfriend from Eastern Europe, so it was me with these two weird scheming women.
Never heard back after that dinner date
Then she never had sex with him at all for years. She divorced the guy took half his money and moved down to Florida and bought a house. She was totally Americanized but I only understood half of whatever she talked about.
I asked her if she had friends back in the Ukraine who wanted to marry me. I said I will do it, but I want 50K, and a contract. To be honest Icould really use the money.
Anyways she proceeded to order all this mediocre wine and sushi and ran up a bill over $300 and I had to pay 1/3rd. Oh also she brought a girlfriend from Eastern Europe, so it was me with these two weird scheming women.
Never heard back after that dinner date
Quote: (11-05-2016 08:43 PM)Kinko Wrote:
Recently I went on a dinner date with a Ukrainian women. According to her years ago she paid an American guy $15K to marry her for gaining USA citizenship. I could have heard it wrong, but she paid him the money.
He was already dealing with a scheming woman, albeit more 'upfront'. Sadly, even if you make an "arrangement" with such a woman, the legal laws leave you too open to be freely abused.
G
Another story I heard... So back in 2005-07, I can't give a more specific date; when the mail order bride thing from Russia was relatively new, I was talking to a guy about this.
Apparently his buddy went online, found a woman in Russia. They hit it off, want to get married. A small, but nice cermony was arranged with his family and friends who were supportive. They have a great wedding, apparently amazing sex, a fair amount of liquor...
Then this guy's buddy wakes up the next day at 2pm - his whole house was cleaned out of anything moveable and valuable.
So, there are risks. I suspect now that I know a lot more that this guy's "buddy" ignored a lot of warning signs.
Apparently his buddy went online, found a woman in Russia. They hit it off, want to get married. A small, but nice cermony was arranged with his family and friends who were supportive. They have a great wedding, apparently amazing sex, a fair amount of liquor...
Then this guy's buddy wakes up the next day at 2pm - his whole house was cleaned out of anything moveable and valuable.
So, there are risks. I suspect now that I know a lot more that this guy's "buddy" ignored a lot of warning signs.
Quote: (11-05-2016 10:07 PM)Geomann180 Wrote:
Quote: (11-05-2016 08:43 PM)Kinko Wrote:
Recently I went on a dinner date with a Ukrainian women. According to her years ago she paid an American guy $15K to marry her for gaining USA citizenship. I could have heard it wrong, but she paid him the money.
He was already dealing with a scheming woman, albeit more 'upfront'. Sadly, even if you make an "arrangement" with such a woman, the legal laws leave you too open to be freely abused.
G
I had a completely different reaction to his post. I would have gotten the hell out of there as soon as she mentioned having paid a guy to marry her. Nothing good was going on there.
Mail order brides services DO exist, however they sell the contact details of the girls, not the girl herself. Once you initiate contact, it's up to her whether she wants to come. I checked some sites quickly a few years ago but most of them were scraping the leftovers from the dirty buffet plates and selling them on those sites. Full of fatties, post-wall women, single moms, uglies, and so on. I almost wanted to ask the site owner whether the price was paid TO me, or BY me. Hell, some sites offer "runaway insurance" where you have a one-time right to get a second one if the first one runs away before X amount of time.
There was a documentary about the Eastern European mail order bride business. That "A Foreign Affair" company mentioned above is covered extensively in it with the president of the company being featured prominently.
This season of 90 day fiance has a Ukranian mail order bride. The guy who is in the process of wifing her up decided on the the single mother with tattoos package. In the latest episode she tells him straight his face that she doesn't love him in front of his friends and he defends her. No amount of foreign brides are going save this guys simping ways,
Great post! Some thoughts from myself:
I acquired a strong taste for EE girls when I was younger (my background is from there myself, so that was one of my game niches), and after dating a bunch here and abroad, I eventually gamed and married one I met locally in the states.
Some things I've learned - if you have a strong masculine energy, or some other masculine traits (strong character, work a menial job, or are very successful in your career) EE girls, especially FOBs, are the sweetest softest little kittens when you first break their ice-barrier and get them to develop romantic feelings for you. They act sweeter and softer than any other girls I've been with (although I've never been with FOB asians, so can't judge here). However, the second that your frame breaks, out comes this crazy/scandalous fire breathing dragon. I've seen it many times personally and through friends. You would never expect such a soft little creature to have such claws. They need a very strong male to support them physically and emotionally - Heartise's 10 commandments of poon should be read daily, but the rewards can be great.
Paying for the greencard is very standard in the community (from guys and girls). The going rate paid is 10-15k for women, and 25-30k for men (note that this is not what I did). A lot of girls are considering doing a lesbian marriage in California with their friends, but are scared about failing the immigration interview because it seems more difficult to fake with USCIS officers. Typically the arrangement is that a bonus is paid upfront, and then the rest is paid monthly or annually over the three years it takes to get a greencard. To prepare for the immigration interview, the couple takes pictures together and signs an apartment lease, but all-in-all live separate lives. After three years, the couple files a no-contest divorce. This sounds kind of like a sweet deal, right? The problem is that you don't really want the hassle in your life. Most of the guys I know in these arrangements are losers - think about it, is it worth 5k a year for you to deal with her crap, attend the marriage interviews, put your personal life on hold etc. for 5k a year? It usually is not. There is also a lot of liability - I believe in California a woman that is on greencard track via marriage can file a domestic abuse order, separate from the man, get a restraining order, but maintain her visa application - I have heard stories of some guys getting screwed this way, but don't know personally.
Girls looking for GC visas often search for sailors / marines to marry (for cash) - apparently service gives you some kind of benefit if you marry (I can't speak personally), and obviously guys arent arround for three years if they are on active duty, so its seen as an easy win/win from both sides.
One final thing - EE girls that you meet here in the states are not EE girls that you meet abroad in Kiev and Novosibirsk. The girls that come here to marry for GC are typically here on a mission - they are motivated and want to improve their lives and have a very strict screening procedure in place - they are also looking for LTR. However, if you meet a girl in Kiev, her "immigrant motivation bitch shield" is down, and she won't be screening you for the traits that a fob in the US would screen for. Most of my friends that have the best EE girls picked them up abroad and brought them here - they simply wouldn't have access to these type of girls in the US because their screens are set too high.
I acquired a strong taste for EE girls when I was younger (my background is from there myself, so that was one of my game niches), and after dating a bunch here and abroad, I eventually gamed and married one I met locally in the states.
Some things I've learned - if you have a strong masculine energy, or some other masculine traits (strong character, work a menial job, or are very successful in your career) EE girls, especially FOBs, are the sweetest softest little kittens when you first break their ice-barrier and get them to develop romantic feelings for you. They act sweeter and softer than any other girls I've been with (although I've never been with FOB asians, so can't judge here). However, the second that your frame breaks, out comes this crazy/scandalous fire breathing dragon. I've seen it many times personally and through friends. You would never expect such a soft little creature to have such claws. They need a very strong male to support them physically and emotionally - Heartise's 10 commandments of poon should be read daily, but the rewards can be great.
Paying for the greencard is very standard in the community (from guys and girls). The going rate paid is 10-15k for women, and 25-30k for men (note that this is not what I did). A lot of girls are considering doing a lesbian marriage in California with their friends, but are scared about failing the immigration interview because it seems more difficult to fake with USCIS officers. Typically the arrangement is that a bonus is paid upfront, and then the rest is paid monthly or annually over the three years it takes to get a greencard. To prepare for the immigration interview, the couple takes pictures together and signs an apartment lease, but all-in-all live separate lives. After three years, the couple files a no-contest divorce. This sounds kind of like a sweet deal, right? The problem is that you don't really want the hassle in your life. Most of the guys I know in these arrangements are losers - think about it, is it worth 5k a year for you to deal with her crap, attend the marriage interviews, put your personal life on hold etc. for 5k a year? It usually is not. There is also a lot of liability - I believe in California a woman that is on greencard track via marriage can file a domestic abuse order, separate from the man, get a restraining order, but maintain her visa application - I have heard stories of some guys getting screwed this way, but don't know personally.
Girls looking for GC visas often search for sailors / marines to marry (for cash) - apparently service gives you some kind of benefit if you marry (I can't speak personally), and obviously guys arent arround for three years if they are on active duty, so its seen as an easy win/win from both sides.
One final thing - EE girls that you meet here in the states are not EE girls that you meet abroad in Kiev and Novosibirsk. The girls that come here to marry for GC are typically here on a mission - they are motivated and want to improve their lives and have a very strict screening procedure in place - they are also looking for LTR. However, if you meet a girl in Kiev, her "immigrant motivation bitch shield" is down, and she won't be screening you for the traits that a fob in the US would screen for. Most of my friends that have the best EE girls picked them up abroad and brought them here - they simply wouldn't have access to these type of girls in the US because their screens are set too high.
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