[Parlay44]

Is anyone on this forum married? I have a few questions I'd like to post and ask you guys to answer
as honestly as you can. Feel free to answer any or all that you like.

1. How did you meet your wife?
2. What was it about her that made you consider marrying her?
3. Have you ever cheated?
4. What's your secret to happiness and staying married?
5. How often do you have sex with her?
6. Does she still initiate sex or do you have to pester her for it?
7. Did having kids ruin everything between you two?
8. Does she work and share the bills?
9. How much of an influence have her friends and family had on your relationship with her?
10. Are you still the man of the house or have things balanced out over time?
11. Do you regret getting married?
12. Are you still with her out of convenience or obligation?
13. Why are you on this forum if you're happily married and committed?
14. Have you ever proposed to a woman and been turned down? Explain.

I've been with a few girls over the years that I thought were marriage material but they
always end up proving me wrong. I just don't feel like women have what it takes to be
on that level these days.

[el mechanico]

You know whoever answers those questions is screwed when wifey finds his forum handle..

[Parlay44]

(10-16-2012 04:22 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  

You know whoever answers those questions is screwed when wifey finds his forum handle..

Yeah probably. I just want to know if marriage is just a pipe dream from guys that are actually doing it.
I know a few married guys and their wives are all fat and bitches for the most part. I don't dare ask them questions like this.

[MidniteSpecial]

What mechanics said haha!

[Parlay44]

How about this? If you guys want to PM me your answers I'll repost them so your name is private.
Just try to leave personal information out of your responses.

[el mechanico]

(10-16-2012 04:38 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

How about this? If you guys want to PM me your answers I'll repost them so your name is private.
Just try to leave personal information out of your responses.

What kind of answers are you expecting and why?? The dudes you just asked are on a pick-up forum.

[Parlay44]

(10-16-2012 04:42 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  

(10-16-2012 04:38 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

How about this? If you guys want to PM me your answers I'll repost them so your name is private.
Just try to leave personal information out of your responses.

What kind of answers are you expecting and why?? The dudes you just asked are on a pick-up forum.

Answer any way you like. Just looking for some insight from guys that have been in the trenches. Lol

[el mechanico]

(10-16-2012 04:46 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

(10-16-2012 04:42 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  

(10-16-2012 04:38 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

How about this? If you guys want to PM me your answers I'll repost them so your name is private.
Just try to leave personal information out of your responses.

What kind of answers are you expecting and why?? The dudes you just asked are on a pick-up forum.

Answer any way you like. Just looking for some insight from guys that have been in the trenches. Lol

It's like going on to the BMW forum and asking if anyone has had luck with a Ford Focus. But I'll talk about my LTR's of the past on your thread if you like

[MidniteSpecial]

The only way you should get married is if its to A foreign woman who is a professional ironer, cleaner, cook, cocksucking three some loving millionaire. And even then don't do it. Or if she's cool with you doing whatever you like and you love her.

[Sabra]

I'll bite. Been married about half a year, after we lived together more than a year and dated a few more years.

1. How did you meet your wife?
Mutual friends.

2. What was it about her that made you consider marrying her?
My most important goal in life was always starting a family and being a good dad. That comes from the strong family i grew up in. It was clear that she would be a good mom - feminine, nurturing, intelligent, loyal, caring, great chef.

3. Have you ever cheated?
No, and I don't plan on it. Can't say the temptation isn't there, but I don't think it's worth it.

4. What's your secret to happiness and staying married?
I won't pretend to have the answer to that after 6 months, but so far we're both happy. We both know what we want, and we're open with each other. You gotta both want to please the other person. Also, I need to keep her in check sometimes, I think some of the game concepts people write about here also work in relationships.

5. How often do you have sex with her?
Not as much as we used to, but enough. You don't get married for sex, unless you can't get girls regularly. I was getting more during hot streaks as a single guy, but I get enough.

6. Does she still initiate sex or do you have to pester her for it?
Both.

7. Did having kids ruin everything between you two?
First one coming soon, G-d willing, so I'll have to get back to you on that. But because it's something we both want and have planned, I don't think it will ruin things.

8. Does she work and share the bills?
Yes, but we both want her to take time off to raise the kids. Was never a fan of hiring an outsider to raise your kids. I make enough to support the family.

9. How much of an influence have her friends and family had on your relationship with her?
They're quality people, I get along well with them.

10. Are you still the man of the house or have things balanced out over time?
Like I said, it's important to check them from time to time, or you get soft and they take over. And remember, deep down they want to be checked like that. But I won't bs you, it's a give and take, and sometimes you gotta do stuff you don't feel like doing.

11. Do you regret getting married?
No. I did enough fun stuff and had enough girls before my wife that I don't have to regret missing out on something. I could see someone who married one of his first gf's feeling regret, but I was ready to move on.

12. Are you still with her out of convenience or obligation?
If this was true after 6 months I'd be worried, haha. But it seems to happen a lot, especially where couples are just together for the kids.

13. Why are you on this forum if you're happily married and committed?
Found the travel forum when setting up a friends' bachelor party. I liked the articles and like contributing, and most guys on here seem cool and like-minded. Get some good info on fitness and other stuff. And who doesn't like looking back on those past conquests, haha. It's just painful not having known about places like DR and the Philippines back when I was single, and reading about them on here!

Basically, I can understand why guys on here want to stay single, especially the Americans, and i'm not the type to give my single friends shit. I'll still tell wifey i'm going out with the boys and play wingman all night. But I was ready to start a family, and found the woman I wanted to do it with.

14. Have you ever proposed to a woman and been turned down? Explain.
No, first time was a charm.

[Timoteo]

I imagine these questions can also be directed at guys that WERE married at one time also, so they can answer these questions and also add why they AREN'T still married...

[Parlay44]

Thanks Sabra. I'll give you a rep bump for being first responder on the scene.

It's interesting though. I always suspected having a good social circle was the key to finding a mate. I'm curious to see how many others respond with that answer on how they met. The problem with my social circle is that everyone is fucking or has fucked everyone else at some point. Kinda turns me off to the girls. It's all hush hush though.

[K-man]

I met my wife randomly - picked her up in a club.
Married 3 1/2 years now, 1 kid. Things are pretty smooth, we are both reasonably happy. Can't say it's all bliss, but it isn't for any of the people I know anyway - including single and married.
It's true I at times catch myself thinking I might be happier as a still single guy, but I thought the same thing (that I might be happier the other way) when I was single and that's why I got married, so I guess it is just that property of the human mind to always imagine and dream of something better out there, grass is greener on the other side, that sort of thing.

[Stitch]

I'll bite; though it ended a year or so ago, some of it may be revealing.

1. How did you meet your wife?

High school. Dated on and off (long distance mostly) through college. Used to think of this as an asset since we communicated very well in writing and it forced us to communicate instead of getting by on proximity and attraction, but in retrospect probably a bad idea and CERTAINLY a bad idea to get married that early (right after graduation).

2. What was it about her that made you consider marrying her?

Again, worst possible reason: just felt like the right next step with a stable relationship. She was reasonably attractive, intelligent, and seemed like she wanted to contribute financially.

3. Have you ever cheated?

Never did. 19 years and never even considered it. Not that I wouldn't be tempted, but... hey, I gave my word, and I value my word more than sex. This is why I'm not planning on marrying again any time soon.

4. What's your secret to happiness and staying married?

Well, I THOUGHT it was communication and balance. In retrospect I spent too much time trying to make her comfortable--a relationship KILLER (backed up by research). If you're interested in lasting marriage, read books by John Gottman, in particular "The Science of Trust", and read research on what ACTUALLY seems to make relationships last (5 to 1 ratio of good to bad interactions, excitement is more important than comfort, etc).

5. How often do you have sex with her?

In the last few years, maybe once every month or so. I was becoming a sexual camel. In the year since she left, I may have had more sex than in the ten years preceding.

6. Does she still initiate sex or do you have to pester her for it?

Pester, but that was iffy too. She never had much interest in sex.

7. Did having kids ruin everything between you two?

Never had kids.

8. Does she work and share the bills?

Ha ha. She always SAID she was going to, and never did despite me funding several advanced degrees that should have made her more marketable (evidently worked, since within 8 months of leaving me she found a job).

9. How much of an influence have her friends and family had on your relationship with her?

All of it, particularly her "facebook friends" who convinced her that if she wasn't happy it must have been my fault. I have heard this pattern echoed many many times by friends.

10. Are you still the man of the house or have things balanced out over time?

Not sure I ever was.

11. Do you regret getting married?

By now, yes.

12. Are you still with her out of convenience or obligation?

By the end of it, same reason I never cheated: I had given my word, and that was important to me.

13. Why are you on this forum if you're happily married and committed?

Obvious, since I'm no longer.

14. Have you ever proposed to a woman and been turned down? Explain.

No.


I found the whole experience long-term scarring. I *don't* think that needs to be the case; my current girlfriend is wanting to marry and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't tempted. And if it was just emotional loss when your wife left, that'd be one thing--the financial vortex that it draws you into is horrific.

The problem is most people view marriage as a romantic engagement--this is what the movies promise, after all. But never forget this--never forget this--marriage is an economic agreement, a business arrangement. And you had better damn well be sure of the equality of your agreement ahead of time.

[Belgrano]

(10-17-2012 03:26 AM)Stitch Wrote:  

Not that I wouldn't be tempted, but... hey, I gave my word, and I value my word more than sex.
(...)
By the end of it, same reason I never cheated: I had given my word, and that was important to me.

Call me old-fashioned or naive, but I have great respect for your decision to honour your word!
It´s a quality that for some reason is becoming rarer and rarer to find, while I consider it to be one of the virtues a real man should possess. I think that among the many reasons our society seems to go downhill, not being able to take a man at his word as part of a general lack of trust (which unfortunately is justified) and lack of courage to stand by one´s past decisions, plays an important part. It´s a symptom of people denying their own obligations and responsibility for actions they commited out of their own free will, only to later realize that these actions, which may be beneficial in the present, may also have some inconvenient consequences in the future. Then trying to twist reality hoping to find a way which allows you to get rid of all responsibility and maybe even try to put the blame on someone else (financial-, and debtcrisis; the whole western generation of baby boomers), is just utterly weak, irrational, miserable, some would say female, behaviour. The question I´m often asking myself is: When did it become acceptable for men to act like that too?

Back to topic, I´ve come to the conclusion that it would be impossible for me to stay faithful and be happy at the same time. That´s why marriage isn´t, and will never be, an option for me. No woman will ever persuade me to give her my word for something I´m not able to do. Simple as that.

[Stitch]

Thanks, Celtic. My attitude was in sharp contrast to my ex-wife's ("I don't think I should be held responsible for some vow I gave when I was only 21!"; "I don't believe in duty!" etc), and doesn't make things easy in some respects, but I think it pays off in the long run (and I think it's better to tell someone "I won't promise X" outright than to break your word). This attitude will doubtless cost you approaches, but I think it's worth it overall. Others will disagree, and that's fine.

I think marriage actually can work pretty well; I've seen lots of examples. So remarriage is not off the table for me entirely. But I'd take a lot of convincing and as close to an ironclad prenup as I could get. A wife that would allow dalliances wouldn't hurt either, but I honestly can't see any way that would work out nicely.

[Gaston]

Was married for dozen years to my "soulmate" who I first met at random cultural institution which we both attended that day (I "day gamed" her instinctivelly).

I ended it because I wanted to evolve and move on, all which is impossible when you are married. Also, I desire other flesh (and yes, due to my impulses and beneficial situation I cheated numerous times with girls 10-15 years younger than me. And all, but one or two, didn't know I was married).

Am afraid can't say much bad about my wife. She knew her role well, was loyal, devoted and family-oriented. However, that is not to say she was perfect. There were times where she was a handful to deal with. And things have gotten ugly. Also, I have no idea if she ever did anything behind my back even though her logistics for that were much more unfavorable than mine.

My beef was never with my wife, but with the marriage roles and expectations. And the difference between the genders. You can be doing everything right all the time, but the moment you do something "wrong" rest assured it will be noted, and you will hear about it sooner or later.

Although I ultimately take responsibility for dismantling the marriage, I do have to say a few things about the notion of long-term relationship. It just doesn't work, sexually. And even worse, real life responsibilities as well as problems get piled up sky high with time that people eventually start bursting at the seams. So you either soldier on and get your physical and mental health in ruins, or you realize how foolish that is and you cut your losses. When all is said and done, your responsibilities rest not toward your wife (she's just a random stranger you tangled with), but primarily to you, then with your child(ren) (and you can't take care of your child(ren) if you are a mess.) I've seen too many men dutifully serving other parties selfish interests (following the ideology of "manning up") that in the process they eventually become either a "roadkill", or at best a streak of shadow of their former selves. It's too sad. Yet preventable.

What I have learned during my dozen years being married?

Two things:

1. I've learned math.

When you are a single guy you are yourself to you 100% of the time. When you get married, instantly half of you gets tied to another person. That is, by default you have to give in to that person half of the time* (*individual differences apply.) Then when you get a kid, overnight, your entire life is not about you, but about others, if for no other reason than because you have now one vote in the family unit against their two. Not to mention the rest of your wider family and hers. The loss of sociocultural "individuality" is enormous. You are now not an individual with your ways, hopes and dreams, wishes, wants and desires any longer, but a useful provider for others (family and society). You are a workhorse that carries other peoples' expectations. And they put blinders on you. The moment you try to steal a sideways glimpse of some other world, of some other possibility, you will feel "their" whip on your back, painfully reminding you to stay on course and keep straight forward. The funny thing about this is that many men find nothing wrong with that. They say that's part of being a "man". Well, I don't know if that is what it means to be a man, but I do know THAT is what it means to be married.

2. I also learned that the TRUE LOVE indeed exists, but that it can only be the one radiating from you toward your child(ren). Everything else is bullshit.

What would have I done differently knowing what I know now?

I would have never married my "soul mate" (what a silly concept). The moment a man gets emotionally invested in a woman is the moment he signs his own demise. In the long enough term the things simply aren't sustainable. Nothing is. So the key is to get married to someone you are emotionally dis-invested in. For example, someone who you have a strong physical attraction for, but little else (say someone hot or beautiful, and dumb, or simply not to your intellectual level or life experience, someone who can't be an equal partner except in bed). That way when the things don't work out anymore between the two of you there would be no feeling of loss for you. And interesting thing about life is that the less invested you are in something, the more things work out for you. So paradoxically it seems that longer and less stressful marriages are between the people who aren't exactly "soul mates". So I would have been totally fine in marrying just a "body". And I would have been totally fine with a challenge of keeping that body in "place".

So, yes, in principle I'm not against marrying again, particularly if that is the only way I can keep my "dream woman", pardon me my dream body. But I will do my best to avoid it if possible, and if not possible I'd do it only under carefully designed set of rules and principles she'd had to agree prior to it, as well as in location that isn't as unfavorable against men not only in divorce, but during the marriage itself (that is a patriarchal society).

But hell, I'm not even thinking about that. My only concern as a free man and healthy man is to have a regular and exciting sex life. And for that I either have to "hunt" for new supplies of fresh pussy on a steady basis, or engage in serial monogamy (in succession of relatively closely spaced out relationships that each lasts for months, but are then terminated when I get bored, or the things start going in directions I don't want them to go.) I recently entered into one such relationship (details of which I may expose in another thread), and that direction is already getting red-flagged by me.

Finally, although I am against the married expectations for the long term relationships, I have nothing against making babies in certain arrangements (she has to be young and hot, and at least an 8). And I don't even have to be married for that, in fact it is better if I am not.

[Timoteo]

(10-17-2012 11:01 AM)Stitch Wrote:  

Thanks, Celtic. My attitude was in sharp contrast to my ex-wife's ("I don't think I should be held responsible for some vow I gave when I was only 21!"; "I don't believe in duty!" etc), and doesn't make things easy in some respects, but I think it pays off in the long run (and I think it's better to tell someone "I won't promise X" outright than to break your word). This attitude will doubtless cost you approaches, but I think it's worth it overall. Others will disagree, and that's fine.

I think marriage actually can work pretty well; I've seen lots of examples. So remarriage is not off the table for me entirely. But I'd take a lot of convincing and as close to an ironclad prenup as I could get. A wife that would allow dalliances wouldn't hurt either, but I honestly can't see any way that would work out nicely.

This is true of most women. It's all about how I feel right now, regardless of what I said or promised a few years ago, or a few hours ago. They really don't have any concept of honor, and adhere to no real code.

[Timoteo]

Gaston, that word...EXPECTATIONS, is the key to it all. It's the thing that causes so many women to suddenly act differently once they get the ring. The belief that everything must change once you're married. For some women, it's "I don't have to give blowjobs anymore. We're married." For others, it's "We can't go to this or that place, or do this or that anymore because we're married." Some women expect things to feel differently between you, even if you've been together for a few years before you made it legal. For some, unreasonable expectations doom you from the beginning.

[Parlay44]

Ok I got an inbox reply to this thread from a forum member that wants to remain anonymous. So I'm reposting this for him.
Thank you for sharing brotha.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey just wanted to add to your marriage thread. It was good for me to read through it, and I hope that it can help bring some perspective for some of the other men out there.

1. How did you meet your wife?
At a club on an off night. Her and her two friends were the only attractive women in the place, and me and a buddy started dancing and talking with them. Her gay friend did most of the work actually.

2. What was it about her that made you consider marrying her?
Feminine, attractive, great cook, motherly, only been with one other guy before me, loves working out and staying fit.

3. Have you ever cheated?
Yes. More times than I care to admit. About 20 odd times before marriage, and about 15 times after. After our engagement I was monogamous for 21 months. I barely held it together though. My monogamy ended in a crazy night with two different women with one licking the others fluid from my thighs. I went home, showered and banged my wife. It was a strange feeling, almost like I was back and could finally relax.

4. What's your secret to happiness and staying married?
No secret. I am not totally happy, but only one or two people know this. I am a great actor. If I was a family oriented man, it would be paradise. This is the hardest thing I have ever had to do. On paper she is the perfect woman. In reality I am bored to tears. I have never pretended to be excited when she buys new silverware. Domesticity makes me lazy.

5. How often do you have sex with her?
About 3-5 times a week. Less now as it taps my energy and desire for meeting new women. I don’t cheat as much as I could though, as I am starting to feel bad about it. She never says no, wakes me with morning BJ’s, gives me the ass when on her rag, etc.

6. Does she still initiate sex or do you have to pester her for it?
She will initiate on weekend mornings or if I have not initiated for a week or so.

7. Did having kids ruin everything between you two?
No kids.

8. Does she work and share the bills?
Yes. Her family is also rich. Her godfather is private jet loaded.

9. How much of an influence have her friends and family had on your relationship with her?
A fair amount. Her mother loves me to pieces. Her dad loves having me for a son in law (my wife is an only child). Her best friend is like a little sister to me. We actually party together more than my wife and I do.

10. Are you still the man of the house or have things balanced out over time?
No question I am still the man of the house. Although I do cook once or twice a week (I like it) and I will wash up when she cooks.

11. Do you regret getting married?
Yes. Without kids, marriage makes no sense to me. I was following the path of tradition hoping that something would click. It never did. Never get married hoping that it will ignite a desire to have a family. Instead get married to wonderful woman in order to have a family.

12. Are you still with her out of convenience or obligation?
Both. Our families are respectable and frown upon divorce. It was this pressure that lead to the marriage in the first place. Make an honest woman out of her and all that. The convenience is obvious. Access to money, ski condos, high end vacations, flats in top tier cities in a few places in the world.

13. Why are you on this forum if you're happily married and committed?
Other than my 21 months of monogamy, I have always enjoyed chasing women. I am not marriage material.

14. Have you ever proposed to a woman and been turned down? Explain.
No. Although when I proposed to my wife, I told her that accepting this ring comes with responsibility. She cannot think that it will change who I am, and if she accepts it she accepts my hound dog ways. I was secretly hoping that she would not accept it. She did.

[Hades]

Quote:

I've seen too many men dutifully serving other parties selfish interests (following the ideology of "manning up") that in the process they eventually become either a "roadkill", or at best a streak of shadow of their former selves. It's too sad. Yet preventable.

Exactly this, no shit. I saw this happening to my dad for a period of many years where he worked himself near the breaking point, no vacations or anything for a long fucking time. It drove him to alcoholism and completely destroyed his life. My dad was basically a stranger to me until high school because I hardly ever saw him. Unless you have seen a family member push something like 60-100 hours a week of (basically) manual labor for upwards of fifteen or twenty years you'd probably not be sure what I'm talking about.

What was really sad was that he just figured that was his responsibility, basically to work to provide for the family at great expense to his health. To be honest I am not sure what was going on "behind the scenes" because I was a kid and did not want to know but I would not have blamed him if he divorced for the sake of his health. I don't understand that kind of sacrifice, even for your wife and kids. That's why I may have kids but will never marry.

[Vicious]

I don't understand this pathological limiting belief that family is something only possible inside the boundaries of marriage.

[Parlay44]

(10-22-2012 04:06 PM)Vicious Wrote:  

I don't understand this pathological limiting belief that family is something only possible inside the boundaries of marriage.

It's tradition. It's also a way of staking your claim to your woman. Problem is these days
women see male support and protection as a right instead of a privilege as it should be

[Sabra]

(10-22-2012 04:18 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

(10-22-2012 04:06 PM)Vicious Wrote:  

I don't understand this pathological limiting belief that family is something only possible inside the boundaries of marriage.

It's tradition. It's also a way of staking your claim to your woman. Problem is these days
women see male support and protection as a right instead of a privilege as it should be

I wouldn't call belief in a traditional family structure a 'pathological limiting belief', or a simple tradition. It's worked well enough for a few thousand years.

Despite the fact that many marriages are very screwed up or just fail, there are also many that work. And when it comes to raising kids, all things being equal, I believe it's better to raise a child with a mother and father together than separated.

That isn't to say that kids of divorced or unmarried parents are necessarily gonna end up screwed up, but a child should have both parents as a constant influence coming up. Not to mention the extended family of both parents. I wouldn't be comfortable with my kid being raised by his mom and only seeing him on weekends, for example.

You may say that a child may be better off with separated parents than in an unhappy home with married parents, or that a man doesn't have to sacrifice everything for his family, but there's still an element of shirking responsibility in all that. If you're not ready for sacrifice and responsibility, don't get married, and for damn sure don't have kids.

Many men get to thinking about their legacy at some point in life. Most of us want to leave something behind to be remembered by. Some may be fortunate or good enough to do this through their life's work, but most will be remembered mainly through their family. This is one of a man's major motivators in having children, though I don't hear many talk about it on this board. Also, people on here talk about men as primitive beings (sleep, eat, fuck, fight), but the primitive motivation for sex has always been reproduction. The whole issue of offspring seems to be missing for a lot of people on here. Maybe it's just me, but I've always wanted to be a dad, along with all the responsibility that comes with it.

[Vicious]

(10-22-2012 05:00 PM)Sabra Wrote:  

(10-22-2012 04:18 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  

(10-22-2012 04:06 PM)Vicious Wrote:  

I don't understand this pathological limiting belief that family is something only possible inside the boundaries of marriage.

It's tradition. It's also a way of staking your claim to your woman. Problem is these days
women see male support and protection as a right instead of a privilege as it should be

I wouldn't call belief in a traditional family structure a 'pathological limiting belief', or a simple tradition. It's worked well enough for a few thousand years.

Why are you assuming that not being married equals being separated?

You are essentially proving my point, it's this brainwashing that marriage is the only way that a true family can exist.