[dog24]

Talk about hate!
Whats up with the forum lately? It has become a place were "international playboys" come in to say yeah +1, virtual high five dude, yeah cool.
But then some guy comes and asks about something specific and people are hating on him calling him a newbie and shit. Like many in this post have said if it doesnt help you get laid why bother?
Does saying this thread needs to die helps you get laid?
Go approach and dont reply if you are not here to help someone.
Its not about being antisocial or not, it's about adapting game to someone personality.

"There are an infinite number of methods to have sex with women, but any game teacher will only teach you one—the game that works for him. That game may still increase your results, but it’s not personalized for your unique personality and look. It’s not even personalized for the city or country you live in"

[Sebastian]

I agree with 'it depends on where you are'.
I met this indian guy at a club. Right off the bat, I knew he wouldn't have a chance at a club even though he was well dressed and articulate.
He just had this naive and too nice look on his face. he said he was teaching at university at 26 years old of age. But at a club, this white trash woman working as a waitress would just ignore him with a bad look on her face. A guy with a same job as her with a better Swag will do a lot better than him.
What if this indian guy was having a dinner at nice restaurant with his colleagues and she was the server there? who has the more power?

So if you go to places full of trash people, it doesn't really matter who you are. you will be considered one of them.
I have seen many guys getting frustrated 'WTF she is unemployed but she rejected me' 'she rejected me over that douche bag working for minimum wage WTF?'

[kolovrat]

I have to give this some thought. For a long time my division has been fivefold:

Alpha - natural alphas, alternatively jerkish and playful, dark triad personality.

Beta-alpha - beta who mimics alpha traits (kinda like Sigma?)

Beta - i.e., your standard AFC

Beta-minus - the AFC who doesn't get laid at all but doesn't become an omega.

Omega - the total creeper losers

[KorbenDallas]

I just don't look at life the same way I guess. I'm fine with everybody unless they attack me in some way. Classifying everything and everybody down to a science of who's the alpha or beta I just don't get it. Just do what you want and if you can't work to get there. I enjoy life because I enjoy the things I do everyday. I like having sex, making money, reading, playing sports, watching sports, drinking, and
occasionally video games, and nature shit, and occasionally weed.

I have lived in Eastern Europe and now I prefer those women. That doesn't mean I diss on the girlfriends of my friends or the guys I interact with everyday or treat girls I know here in the states bad. There are good girls here in STL where I live too, so, I don't avoid American women altogether, I just know in the back of my mind I'm only going to be here for 8 more months. I think improving posture is good and improving yourself to be more like an alpha (a MAN) is good, but you gotta enjoy life. I think overanalyzing this stuff is un-healhty I really do.

[Icarus]

Heartiste recently wrote a post on the sigma male. An excerpt:

Quote:

An ample supply of cute girls are attracted to him, and some of those girls want to be with him exclusively. He oozes badboy allure, and he’s been known to make a girl or two cry in despair, and perhaps to have had his heart broken in return. So he is, by most men’s paltry standards, a successful predator of poon. (A noodle-armed emo crooner fronting an indie band is a well-known Renegade Alpha archetype.) But he doesn’t have the broad social leverage that a traditional “leader of men” alpha male has at his disposal, and this somewhat limits the Sigma Male/Renegade Alpha from monopolizing the attentions of a large pool of 9s and 10s, or of enjoying the distaff fruits of a wide and deep social circle of admiring friends and accomplished business partners eager to play matchmaker.

However, that same outsider status and rule-breaking dereliction of the Renegade Alpha also frees him from having to live up to the expectations of an insular social group. This freedom is especially nourishing if that group is a cult of winners with an unforgiving, judgmental distaste for deviance from the norm.

Nomadic introverts who are successful with women would be sigma, then. Acquiring a reputation and high social status is a hell of a lot of work. If you don't spent too much time in the same city, why bother acquiring status if you can't use it when you move to the next city? Local status is not a liquid asset, you can't trade it for money, you can't even trade it for high status in a new city. When you move, you start from zero.

[Therapsid]

(10-27-2013 01:34 AM)Icarus Wrote:  

Heartiste recently wrote a post on the sigma male. An excerpt:

Quote:

An ample supply of cute girls are attracted to him, and some of those girls want to be with him exclusively. He oozes badboy allure, and he’s been known to make a girl or two cry in despair, and perhaps to have had his heart broken in return. So he is, by most men’s paltry standards, a successful predator of poon. (A noodle-armed emo crooner fronting an indie band is a well-known Renegade Alpha archetype.) But he doesn’t have the broad social leverage that a traditional “leader of men” alpha male has at his disposal, and this somewhat limits the Sigma Male/Renegade Alpha from monopolizing the attentions of a large pool of 9s and 10s, or of enjoying the distaff fruits of a wide and deep social circle of admiring friends and accomplished business partners eager to play matchmaker.

However, that same outsider status and rule-breaking dereliction of the Renegade Alpha also frees him from having to live up to the expectations of an insular social group. This freedom is especially nourishing if that group is a cult of winners with an unforgiving, judgmental distaste for deviance from the norm.

Nomadic introverts who are successful with women would be sigma, then. Acquiring a reputation and high social status is a hell of a lot of work. If you don't spent too much time in the same city, why bother acquiring status if you can't use it when you move to the next city? Local status is not a liquid asset, you can't trade it for money, you can't even trade it for high status in a new city. When you move, you start from zero.

Heartiste is worthless.

By this definition, any man who travels internationally for pussy is a sigma.

I'm glad to see that guys are gradually realizing that Chateau Heartiste is a sham. That Roissy - not even the original man apparently, but who knows - is a joke.

You can read a few months of his blog and extract all of the meager value there is to take from it.

Heartiste - king or HBD white nationalist chatter, text message aloof alpha game, and pop psychology navel-gazing.

As far as game goes? He has next to nothing.

[UrbanNerd]

You all know my feelings on the Alpha/Beta debate.

It is the DUMBEST subject to discuss. I care about bottom-line practical RESULTS. I could care less about following some corny alpha, beta, sigma, theta, espilon guideline.

[Glock]

(10-27-2013 01:39 AM)Therapsid Wrote:  

(10-27-2013 01:34 AM)Icarus Wrote:  

Heartiste recently wrote a post on the sigma male. An excerpt:

Quote:

An ample supply of cute girls are attracted to him, and some of those girls want to be with him exclusively. He oozes badboy allure, and he’s been known to make a girl or two cry in despair, and perhaps to have had his heart broken in return. So he is, by most men’s paltry standards, a successful predator of poon. (A noodle-armed emo crooner fronting an indie band is a well-known Renegade Alpha archetype.) But he doesn’t have the broad social leverage that a traditional “leader of men” alpha male has at his disposal, and this somewhat limits the Sigma Male/Renegade Alpha from monopolizing the attentions of a large pool of 9s and 10s, or of enjoying the distaff fruits of a wide and deep social circle of admiring friends and accomplished business partners eager to play matchmaker.

However, that same outsider status and rule-breaking dereliction of the Renegade Alpha also frees him from having to live up to the expectations of an insular social group. This freedom is especially nourishing if that group is a cult of winners with an unforgiving, judgmental distaste for deviance from the norm.

Nomadic introverts who are successful with women would be sigma, then. Acquiring a reputation and high social status is a hell of a lot of work. If you don't spent too much time in the same city, why bother acquiring status if you can't use it when you move to the next city? Local status is not a liquid asset, you can't trade it for money, you can't even trade it for high status in a new city. When you move, you start from zero.

Heartiste is worthless.

By this definition, any man who travels internationally for pussy is a sigma.

I'm glad to see that guys are gradually realizing that Chateau Heartiste is a sham. That Roissy - not even the original man apparently, but who knows - is a joke.

You can read a few months of his blog and extract all of the meager value there is to take from it.

Heartiste - king or HBD white nationalist chatter, text message aloof alpha game, and pop psychology navel-gazing.

As far as game goes? He has next to nothing.

I avoid heartiste these days because it seems more and more focused on issues of race (and taking a view I don't agree with).

[aphelion]

(08-16-2012 01:25 AM)ImWaitingForTheMan Wrote:  

I'll have to think about this in depth. But I do know that Beta, Alpha and Sigma gets shortened to B.A.S. which also stands for...

BITCHES AINT SHIT

I don't believe this got enough love. Please forward your adoration to this gentleman.

[Ingocnito]

(08-18-2012 01:53 AM)kolovrat Wrote:  

I have to give this some thought. For a long time my division has been fivefold:

Alpha - natural alphas, alternatively jerkish and playful, dark triad personality.

Beta-alpha - beta who mimics alpha traits (kinda like Sigma?)

Beta - i.e., your standard AFC

Beta-minus - the AFC who doesn't get laid at all but doesn't become an omega.

Omega - the total creeper losers

From my experience, there probably aren't as many "genuine" naturally born alphas out there as you might think. Very rare actually.

And I mean that regarding the alpha types that have broad-spectrum alpha status: gets laid by who he targets, high quality and high numbers at will. Has scratch, has a sound career, wit, character, social circle abundance, unique, interesting, well known in community (fame), pretty much everything's on lock. Not that common.

The so called "alphas" I meet the most of - in appearance - tend to be alpha in career but not with women, or alpha with women and not so much in career or money, or great looks and physic, but average with everything else.

A strong sigma type can wreak havoc on other alphas or at times slip in and out of alpha-ness at will. Id say I'm probably 60% sigma, 20% alpha, and 20% beta (not by choice, that's the 20% I'm working on constantly).

The problem with being super-alpha in any one regiment, is there will come a time when expectation of broad-spectrum proof will be called upon, and if you don't have it, you'll look phony to someone important.

The whole beta-alpha concept comes to mind, and these cats are the ones you DO NOT want to become closely associated with, as they will stab your ass in the back, good actors in society, fake it till you make it types, that can climb the ladder quite far and become dictators in later years...

...They don't have the ability to step far away from a situation into sigma-zone, they're either 95% alpha, or rarely 95% beta, and will sacrifice anyone to maintain their false alpha image.

[Icarus]

Sigma vs Alpha reminds me of Venkat Rao's post on cats and dogs. An excerpt:

Quote:

I am a cat person, not in the sense of liking cats more (though I do), but actually being more catlike than doglike. Humans are more complex than either species; we are the products of the tension between our dog-like and cat-like instincts. We do both sociability and individualism in more complicated ways than our two friends; call it hyper-dogginess plus hyper-cattiness. That is why reductively mapping yourself exclusively to one or the other is such a useful exercise. You develop a more focused self-awareness about who you really are.

Our language is full of dog and cat references. Dogs populate our understanding of social dynamics: conflict, competition, dominance, slavery, mastery, belonging and otherness:

Finance is a dog-eat-dog world
He’s the alpha-dog/underdog around here
He’s a pit bull
Dhobi ka kutta, na ghar ka, na ghat ka (trans: “the washerman’s dog belongs neither at the riverbank, nor at the house;” i.e. a social misfit everywhere)
He follows her around like a dog
He looks at his boss with dog-like devotion

Cat references speak to individualism, play, opportunism, risk, comfort, mystery, luck and curiosity

A cat may look at a king
She curled up like a cat
A cat has nine lives
Managing this team is like herding cats
Look what the cat dragged in
It’s a cat-and-mouse game
Curiosity killed the cat

There is a dark side to each: viciousness and deliberate cruelty (dogs), coldness and lack of empathy (cats).

[soup]

(10-27-2013 01:39 AM)Therapsid Wrote:  

(10-27-2013 01:34 AM)Icarus Wrote:  

Heartiste recently wrote a post on the sigma male. An excerpt:

Quote:

An ample supply of cute girls are attracted to him, and some of those girls want to be with him exclusively. He oozes badboy allure, and he’s been known to make a girl or two cry in despair, and perhaps to have had his heart broken in return. So he is, by most men’s paltry standards, a successful predator of poon. (A noodle-armed emo crooner fronting an indie band is a well-known Renegade Alpha archetype.) But he doesn’t have the broad social leverage that a traditional “leader of men” alpha male has at his disposal, and this somewhat limits the Sigma Male/Renegade Alpha from monopolizing the attentions of a large pool of 9s and 10s, or of enjoying the distaff fruits of a wide and deep social circle of admiring friends and accomplished business partners eager to play matchmaker.

However, that same outsider status and rule-breaking dereliction of the Renegade Alpha also frees him from having to live up to the expectations of an insular social group. This freedom is especially nourishing if that group is a cult of winners with an unforgiving, judgmental distaste for deviance from the norm.

Nomadic introverts who are successful with women would be sigma, then. Acquiring a reputation and high social status is a hell of a lot of work. If you don't spent too much time in the same city, why bother acquiring status if you can't use it when you move to the next city? Local status is not a liquid asset, you can't trade it for money, you can't even trade it for high status in a new city. When you move, you start from zero.

Heartiste is worthless.

By this definition, any man who travels internationally for pussy is a sigma.

I'm glad to see that guys are gradually realizing that Chateau Heartiste is a sham. That Roissy - not even the original man apparently, but who knows - is a joke.

You can read a few months of his blog and extract all of the meager value there is to take from it.

Heartiste - king or HBD white nationalist chatter, text message aloof alpha game, and pop psychology navel-gazing.

As far as game goes? He has next to nothing.

How wrong you are.

The blog posts good breakdowns of game and gets past a lot of crap.

Sometimes it's too political, but his game analysis is spot on, and he's a good writer.

To say that blog is "worthless" is hyperbole, to say the least.

[Screwston]

Can you be an alpha if youve never been in a fight?

[soup]

(10-27-2013 05:14 AM)houston Wrote:  

Can you be an alpha if youve never been in a fight?

Yes.

You are talking about man to man alpha.

When I say alpha, I'm talking about a guy's ability to attract women.

You could look at the flip side of what you are saying and say: can you be alpha if you aren't that smart?

Truth is that the great men in history were great more for their brain power than their muscles. These were the leaders. Not saying leaders couldn't be fighting warriors etc., but you don't need to be brawler to be alpha, and actually a lot of tough guys are subservient to higher social powers, so alpha can they really be?

[w00t]

(10-27-2013 01:41 AM)UrbanNerd Wrote:  

You all know my feelings on the Alpha/Beta debate.

It is the DUMBEST subject to discuss. I care about bottom-line practical RESULTS. I could care less about following some corny alpha, beta, sigma, theta, espilon guideline.

Its super dumb because people cant even agree on a definition what these terms mean. Everyone has their own picture in mind when they talk about it.

[Altair]

interesting discussion

[Icarus]

(10-27-2013 01:41 AM)UrbanNerd Wrote:  

You all know my feelings on the Alpha/Beta debate.

It is the DUMBEST subject to discuss. I care about bottom-line practical RESULTS. I could care less about following some corny alpha, beta, sigma, theta, espilon guideline.

Why does caring about results imply that one cannot engage in building taxonomies?

For a man to act effectively, he needs to understand the world. He needs to have the most dispassionate, cold, and objective interpretation of reality. That is what enlightenment actually is: to kill all the ghosts of the mind, to identify all the rationalizations, until one has contact with raw reality. The degree of self-awareness one obtains is amazing. I am still at the beginning of this process, and it allowed me to have access to thoughts and emotions whose existence I was not even aware of.

Building taxonomies is useful if one uses them properly. Why? Because one does not treat all people the same way. One does not talk to one's boss the same way one talks to one's minions. One does not seduce a HB8 the same way one would seduce a plain jane. One adjusts one's body language depending on the situation.

One needs survival skills. To navigate the dangerous waters of office politics. To avoid being abused by women. One needs to know what kind of predators there are, what their strengths and weaknesses are. One must know how to charm them. One must be able to identify them in order to defend from them. To identify them, one must have a taxonomy.

A simplistic analogy is dealing with felines. Cats and tigers are felines. Treat a tiger like you would treat a cat, and you won't live long. Some humans are harmless, but some are very dangerous. The quicker one identifies them, the better.

[The Beast1]

(08-16-2012 02:14 AM)dog24 Wrote:  

(08-16-2012 01:17 AM)soup Wrote:  

Instead of trying to be the Alpha leader of society, might it not be better to just embrace the more mysterious Sigma/solo side?

Sigma, loner, late bloomer, baby face, introvert, ectomorph checking in. I think most of us possess one if not all of those traits.
For me society used to reject me when i was omega in my teens, then i matured in a lot of ways, and society kind of invited me to join. Suddenly the cool guys tried to befriend me, bishes stop treating me like garbage and acknowledge my existence.
After learning game, and reading about social dinamics/status wars i decided i wasnt going to play that game. Once you understand why your "friend" is trying to amog you in front of the whole group or why the prettiest girl is looking down on you because you dont have enough "social proof" it just becomes stupid, i personally sometimes see this people like poor animals that dont understand their primal instincts so they live their lives trying to rationalize their shitty actions in behave of the almighty status.
Dont forget that most people arent as self-aware as all of us at this forum.

For my point of view i can tell you people treat me in a very black or white way. Some respect and even admire me, some outright hate me, usually the no value leeches.
My brother and some friends come to tell me from time to time that some bish finds me "intriguing". I doubt they would think that way of me if i was rightdown ugly, i know cause ive been there, if youre not phisically attractive then youre just creepy loner guy.
Some of my friends used to joke about me being autistic, but when i get one on one with a female they always tell me that im not how they imagined me to be, and even after getting to know each other they think i have a misterious/dark side.

So to answer your question NO, social alpha beats sigma everyday.
Some girls would fuck you just for status, if youre a sigma you cant give her that.
If any of you want to enlarge the pool of women willing to meet you without cold approach, you must play the social game and try to climb the latter.
I prefer not to, but it definitely makes things harder.

Dude, your life story is almost a mirror 1 to 1 story of mine. Including the ectomorph bit!

I think we're all social climbers here. I know true alphas who have some sort of charismatic edge to them which is a gift that some of us may not have. My one friend was definitely in that boat. I would classify that as alpha.

Most people I view as below me or at my level, but there is a unique type of person who is a step above me regardless of the actual things i classify as important markers in the game we call life (eg status and money). These guys are all over the place and can clearly get pontang. in my mind if you have charisma you're above me on the hierarchy, but most of these charismatic guys don't have a single shred of self preservation in their body. They're stars that burn brightly and will eventually fade out quickly when their youth fades in the mid to late 20s.