[Roosh]

I first come across Paul Mooney in his Negrodamus skit on Dave Chappelle's show. I was surfing around on Youtube the other day and came across a couple bits of his act, which led me to downloading one of his sets:

http://thepiratebay.se/torrent/4798459/P..._Cleopatra

He's kind of like a comedic Malcolm X, pointing out America's enduring race issues while providing some laughs. Here's a couple clips from the set I linked above:

If you're wondering why you don't hear about him much, I believe it's because his hatred for whites comes across pretty clear. In the show a white couple actually gets up and leaves. It seems like he's been resigned to writing for the bigger comedians.

[Basil Ransom]

(07-29-2012 07:24 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

If you're wondering why you don't hear about him much, I believe it's because his hatred for whites comes across pretty clear. In the show a white couple actually gets up and leaves. It seems like he's been resigned to writing for the bigger comedians.

I don't have any desire to watch more of it, if only because the bitterness overshadows the humor.

If a bunch of whitey hating black people (or any other race) want to have a comedy set, let 'em, I couldn't care less. But I just know the same people who'd watch comics like this would get real pissy real fast if anyone else started talking shit about them. I'm a fan of free speech, hateful or not, it just has to be consistent.

The reason why guys like him hate Africans is because Africans don't hate whites, they don't harbor much animosity towards white Westerners, at least among the Africans I've met. In college, of all the internationals, Africans were the sweetest, classiest people I met. One of my closest friends was African, and a huge player to boot - the only guy I knew that could be super-nice to American girls and not suffer for it. They were the upper upper crust of their countries I'm sure, so they may not be representative.

[hypesession]

Quote:

If you're wondering why you don't hear about him much, I believe it's because his hatred for whites comes across pretty clear. In the show a white couple actually gets up and leaves. It seems like he's been resigned to writing for the bigger comedians.

Some dude on here taught me the word polemic. That's polemic right there. "just another race troll" He's been doing comedy for forever. Whether you think he's funny or not is your prerogative but obviously he is a voice for black people. He's both racist by definition and hilarious in my opinion.

[Timoteo]

Mooney has always written throughout his career, even while performing his own stuff. He wrote for Redd Foxx and Richard Pryor, and I believe he was the head writer on Pryor's show and gave breaks to a lot of comics, including white ones. You have to take into account where a man is from and what he's experienced. He was born in the 40s in Louisiana, and I think he grew up in Oakland. Those experiences seem to have molded him more than others. I'll admit that some of his material is pretty rough, and not for the sensitive. I believe he hates racism and its part in the history of this country, but I don't believe he hates all whites in general. He's had a pretty extensive career in television and movies, so he's had to work with and for whites. He's actually highly respected. I just think his time has passed in terms of performing. He's 70 years old now.

[speakeasy]

(07-29-2012 08:18 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  

He's 70 years old now.

No homo but the dude looks great for 70. I thought he was in his 40s.

[Gmac]

He's pretty funny, I've always loved Paul Mooney... racist or not.

[Andy_B]

http://img.filmous.com/static/photos/52043/poster.jpg

'nuff said.

EDIT: and that first video is lame as fuck... not that I really care about Mexican "rights" much one way or the other, but seriously, the idea that Mexicans don't have it as bad as blacks in America TODAY is pretty ridiculous. I'm pretty sure they make less money actually, and their plight is rooted in deep history as well. I mean if you want to tie everything to long term historical narratives, wasn't the Mexicans' land stolen by Texas or something? Is being deprived of your farmland and livelihood not much like being enslaved?

[Timoteo]

(07-29-2012 08:01 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

(07-29-2012 07:24 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

If you're wondering why you don't hear about him much, I believe it's because his hatred for whites comes across pretty clear. In the show a white couple actually gets up and leaves. It seems like he's been resigned to writing for the bigger comedians.

I don't have any desire to watch more of it, if only because the bitterness overshadows the humor.

If a bunch of whitey hating black people (or any other race) want to have a comedy set, let 'em, I couldn't care less. But I just know the same people who'd watch comics like this would get real pissy real fast if anyone else started talking shit about them. I'm a fan of free speech, hateful or not, it just has to be consistent.

The reason why guys like him hate Africans is because Africans don't hate whites, they don't harbor much animosity towards white Westerners, at least among the Africans I've met. In college, of all the internationals, Africans were the sweetest, classiest people I met. One of my closest friends was African, and a huge player to boot - the only guy I knew that could be super-nice to American girls and not suffer for it. They were the upper upper crust of their countries I'm sure, so they may not be representative.

I think it's all about the experience. Africans have had a different experience in their own country, and there's really no connection between them and American blacks. As with almost any immigrant, they have no connection to the history of the country, and you could say they see mostly positives, while someone that grew up here has a different perspective. The issues between African and American blacks really isn't about blacks here hating them - a lot of it is them not really seeing us as black like them. Many Africans actually look down upon American blacks. A good friend of mine was down in Sydney for the Olympics in 2000, and encountered some African guys down there. They were treating him kind of disrespectfully, so he called them out. They hashed it out though. Apparently, the Africans harbored animosity towards him as an American black, because he saw us as lazy, etc. etc. They had a particular perception of blacks here, and simply applied it broadly to whoever they met. Just like some of the discussions on this forum, guys can be quick to go on and on about races and cultures when they really haven't had any contact or experiences. The assumption that blacks hate whites is also off base (sure, there are exceptions, but we don't sit around talking about white folks this, white folks that. Just like anyone else, we're trying to get through the day). I only know of one guy that I can say hates whites, and that's really more distrust due to bad experiences. But much like Mooney, he carries it every day with him, and he ends up hurt more than anyone else. Every other brother I know is cool with whoever is cool with them, but as blacks we find that it's whites that largely avoid us and don't want to associate. Depending on your heritage and particular experiences, your perception may be different.

[the chef]

His shit on the Chappelles Show was funny as fuck.

"Everybody wanna be a nigga but nobody wanna be a nigga." - hahahahaha.

[MikeCF]

He's funny, and whites who can't laugh at white racism suck just as badly as the feminist who threw a fit over the rape jokes.

[Basil Ransom]

(07-29-2012 08:38 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  

The assumption that blacks hate whites is also off base (sure, there are exceptions, but we don't sit around talking about white folks this, white folks that. Just like anyone else, we're trying to get through the day). I only know of one guy that I can say hates whites, and that's really more distrust due to bad experiences. But much like Mooney, he carries it every day with him, and he ends up hurt more than anyone else. Every other brother I know is cool with whoever is cool with them, but as blacks we find that it's whites that largely avoid us and don't want to associate. Depending on your heritage and particular experiences, your perception may be different.

Fair points. Just to be clear, I wasn't making any blanket statements implying all blacks resent whites, just speaking about those that do, a category to which Mooney seems like he belongs.

I don't know what is and isn't his work. From what you guys are saying, about him writing for others, it sounds like he's extremely talented. But it also seems like when he's striking out on his own, his material takes a naturally different tone, where the actual humor is marginalized. I make off-color jokes all the time, about myself, my group and everything else, but Mooney has a bitter manner that's off-putting - it doesn't make me want to laugh. Whatever, he has his niche, his audience clearly enjoys it, and I'm not his audience. I just would want the white, red, yellow, brown equivalent of Mooney to have the freedom to do the same thing, and not get ostracized for 'being racist.'

Quote:

He's funny, and whites who can't laugh at white racism suck just as badly as the feminist who threw a fit over the rape jokes.

Hmm, I get the sense that if the situation were reversed you wouldn't be so quick to mock black guys for not laughing at an act resentful of blacks. Whatever.

[Screwston]

(07-29-2012 08:01 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

But I just know the same people who'd watch comics like this would get real pissy real fast if anyone else started talking shit about them.

I don't think he's funny. Redd Foxx and Richard Pryor were funny as hell though.

[delicioustacos]

I have a pet theory, substantiated by nothing, that Paul Mooney caused Dave Chappelle to fall off the face of the Earth.

According to a script I read about Richard Pryor, Mooney got into Pryor's head in the 70's about his use of the word "nigger," bits that white people thought were funny because they were racist, etc. He got Pryor to revamp his act and made him more political.

Decades later, Chappelle is similarly successful, similarly criticized, and similarly hanging out with Paul Mooney. He then bails out of a multimillion dollar deal to go to Africa, saying later “The bottom line was, white people own everything, and where can a black person go and be himself or say something that’s familiar to him and not have to explain or apologize?”

Maybe Chappelle already felt this way before Mooney, but maybe Mooney's true genius is proselytizing his views to more successful comedians.

[Divorco]

Maybe a genius race troll? After seeing him on Dave Chappelle, I went to see him live. Yes, there is an undercurrent of racial bitterness. For example, the idea that modern African-Americans deserve leisure because "they" were slaves is ridiculous. It's especially ridiculous considering most of them have mixed ancestry.

But Dave Chappelle is hilarious. I am glad to tolerate a little bitterness for his humor.

On that note, I have particularly appreciated the racial perspectives on this forum (e.g., Athlone). Issues of womens' attitude, obesity, and game seem magnified in the African-American community. But mens' issues cut across races, so it is great to see guys share skills for dealing with their tough situations.

[Timoteo]

(07-29-2012 09:19 PM)delicioustacos Wrote:  

I have a pet theory, substantiated by nothing, that Paul Mooney caused Dave Chappelle to fall off the face of the Earth.

According to a script I read about Richard Pryor, Mooney got into Pryor's head in the 70's about his use of the word "nigger," bits that white people thought were funny because they were racist, etc. He got Pryor to revamp his act and made him more political.

Decades later, Chappelle is similarly successful, similarly criticized, and similarly hanging out with Paul Mooney. He then bails out of a multimillion dollar deal to go to Africa, saying later “The bottom line was, white people own everything, and where can a black person go and be himself or say something that’s familiar to him and not have to explain or apologize?”

Maybe Chappelle already felt this way before Mooney, but maybe Mooney's true genius is proselytizing his views to more successful comedians.

Chappelle's issue was more about the direction of the show. He was signed to a huge deal based on what he had done in the first two seasons. Some of the stuff in those shows was very edgy, and truly pushed the boundaries. He felt pressure to really up the ante in the third season, and management got really uncomfortable, thus he was forced to stand up in front of a group of white execs and have them ask him about the use of certain words, etc. Most white guys will never find themselves in a similar situation - having to explain themselves to a room full of black guys. Bottom line, they wanted him to tone down what he was doing, and he felt that if he couldn't do what he does the way he wants to, he'd rather walk. Granted, most people would have taken the $50 million and mailed it in, but he isn't one of those guys. We're not used to seeing it, but some people REALLY don't care that much about the money. Chappelle can get a comedy special anytime he wants. He'd rather chill on his farm in Ohio.

[Andy_B]

(07-29-2012 09:27 PM)Divorco Wrote:  

Maybe a genius race troll? After seeing him on Dave Chappelle, I went to see him live. Yes, there is an undercurrent of racial bitterness. For example, the idea that modern African-Americans deserve leisure because "they" were slaves is ridiculous. It's especially ridiculous considering most of them have mixed ancestry.

But Dave Chappelle is hilarious. I am glad to tolerate a little bitterness for his humor.

On that note, I have particularly appreciated the racial perspectives on this forum (e.g., Athlone). Issues of womens' attitude, obesity, and game seem magnified in the African-American community. But mens' issues cut across races, so it is great to see guys share skills for dealing with their tough situations.

Yeah, that's my thinking too. A little bitterness actually helps you in comedy, but when your comedy is NOTHING BUT bitterness, that's just lame.

[Timoteo]

A lot of comics will tell you that their comedy grew out of pain or despair of some sort. And the nature of what they do is difficult. Comics, regardless of color, have so much respect for each other and look out for each other because they all know how tough it is to make it out there on the road. When one of them makes it, they try to give jobs to as many others as possible.

[Basil Ransom]

(07-29-2012 09:30 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  

Chappelle's issue was more about the direction of the show. He was signed to a huge deal based on what he had done in the first two seasons. Some of the stuff in those shows was very edgy, and truly pushed the boundaries. He felt pressure to really up the ante in the third season, and management got really uncomfortable, thus he was forced to stand up in front of a group of white execs and have them ask him about the use of certain words, etc. Most white guys will never find themselves in a similar situation - have to explain themselves to a room full of black guys. Bottom line, they wanted him to tone down what he was doing, and he felt that if he couldn't do what he does the way he wants to, he'd rather walk. Granted, most people would have taken the $50 million and mailed it in, but he isn't one of those guys. We're not used to seeing it, but some people REALLY don't care that much about the money. Chappelle can get a comedy special anytime he wants. He'd rather chill on his farm in Ohio.

Not doubting you, but that's interesting stuff - do you have any links?

If anything, I'd figure the opposite - that the white (probably mostly Jewish) execs would ask him to turn the controversy up a notch, make it more offensive, making him more uncomfortable. Either way, it's kind of surprising they'd interfere like that and kill their billion dollar baby. Then again, Hollywood is famous for pushing its brand of liberalism even when it costs them.

Quote:

A lot of comics will tell you that their comedy grew out of pain or despair of some sort. And the nature of what they do is difficult. Comics, regardless of color, have so much respect for each other and look out for each other because they all know how tough it is to make it out there on the road. When one of them makes it, they try to give jobs to as many others as possible.

Related to that, comics have the utmost respect for free speech for each other, because they know they'd never want to have to change an act due to some hater's sensibilities. Even when say, a comic is bashing female comics, there are plenty of female comics who won't get their digs in, because they wouldn't want the PC police coming down on them either.

[El Rey]

I love Paul Mooney, he's great. His 'bitterness' makes me laugh my ass off. He actually believes everything he says and isn't really joking (He had a good interview on the Foxxhole - Jamie Foxx's XM radio show that shows this). Funny dude and a veteran of comedy.

[Timoteo]

(07-29-2012 09:50 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

(07-29-2012 09:30 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  

Chappelle's issue was more about the direction of the show. He was signed to a huge deal based on what he had done in the first two seasons. Some of the stuff in those shows was very edgy, and truly pushed the boundaries. He felt pressure to really up the ante in the third season, and management got really uncomfortable, thus he was forced to stand up in front of a group of white execs and have them ask him about the use of certain words, etc. Most white guys will never find themselves in a similar situation - have to explain themselves to a room full of black guys. Bottom line, they wanted him to tone down what he was doing, and he felt that if he couldn't do what he does the way he wants to, he'd rather walk. Granted, most people would have taken the $50 million and mailed it in, but he isn't one of those guys. We're not used to seeing it, but some people REALLY don't care that much about the money. Chappelle can get a comedy special anytime he wants. He'd rather chill on his farm in Ohio.

Not doubting you, but that's interesting stuff - do you have any links?

If anything, I'd figure the opposite - that the white (probably mostly Jewish) execs would ask him to turn the controversy up a notch, make it more offensive, making him more uncomfortable. Either way, it's kind of surprising they'd interfere like that and kill their billion dollar baby. Then again, Hollywood is famous for pushing its brand of liberalism even when it costs them.

Quote:

A lot of comics will tell you that their comedy grew out of pain or despair of some sort. And the nature of what they do is difficult. Comics, regardless of color, have so much respect for each other and look out for each other because they all know how tough it is to make it out there on the road. When one of them makes it, they try to give jobs to as many others as possible.

Related to that, comics have the utmost respect for free speech for each other, because they know they'd never want to have to change an act due to some hater's sensibilities. Even when say, a comic is bashing female comics, there are plenty of female comics who won't get their digs in, because they wouldn't want the PC police coming down on them either.

I recall him discussing this on "Inside the Actor's Studio." It was one of the better segments. Actually, some of the skits in that third season made Chappelle himself uncomfortable, and he wanted to rethink what he was doing. I got it backwards. It was the direction of the show that caused him to walk, but he wasn't comfortable with some of the writing and it created conflict with management.

[Timoteo]

Comics have always been able to get away with saying what other public people can't, because it's under the guise of comedy. They can give raw social commentary. Lenny Bruce became one of the symbols of free speech, in that he pushed boundaries and took heat. They've always been able to mine subjects of race and sex without repercussion because it's entertainment. Before he got married and started having kids, Eddie Murphy was part of the great tradition. Now that he's been through the marriage wars and his kids are old enough, I love to see him put together some new material and hit the stage again.

[joehoya]

Paul Mooney is a ridiculously talented guy, but he is also extremely bitter. Yes he grew up in some fucked up times for blacks, but so did every comic of his era. Different people handle adversity differently. What makes him great as a writer (better than when he actually performs standup) is that the comic he is writing for can filter out some of the really angry/over the top stuff. Think about it, Paul Mooney wrote jokes for Richard Pryor, Redd Fox, AND Dave Chappelle, easily 3 of the 10 best black comics in history. Hell, Pryor and Chapelle alone are in the top 5. He is that good. Yet he hasn't had 1/100th of the success those guys have had. That says something.

Joking about white people and racism is common and was EXTREMELY common in the 70's and 80's. Yet even in that era, Mooney's standup was seen as too much. There is just a level of anger in his standup that is unappealing.

[rudebwoy]

(07-29-2012 09:19 PM)delicioustacos Wrote:  

I have a pet theory, substantiated by nothing, that Paul Mooney caused Dave Chappelle to fall off the face of the Earth.

According to a script I read about Richard Pryor, Mooney got into Pryor's head in the 70's about his use of the word "nigger," bits that white people thought were funny because they were racist, etc. He got Pryor to revamp his act and made him more political.

Decades later, Chappelle is similarly successful, similarly criticized, and similarly hanging out with Paul Mooney. He then bails out of a multimillion dollar deal to go to Africa, saying later “The bottom line was, white people own everything, and where can a black person go and be himself or say something that’s familiar to him and not have to explain or apologize?”

Maybe Chappelle already felt this way before Mooney, but maybe Mooney's true genius is proselytizing his views to more successful comedians.

Chapelle talks about why he went to Africa and it is NOT because of Mooney. The "industry" was trying to control his material, in one movie they wanted him to wear a dress and he was not down with it.
He wasn't ready to sign a deal with the devil.

[Timoteo]

Paul Mooney really is less comic, and more social critic. George Carlin was really providing more social commentary than telling jokes per se. Redd Foxx and Richard Pryor also, as does Chris Rock now. The black guys' material will always have some racial stuff sprinkled in because that's their experience. Paul Mooney has done most of his work in small comedy clubs, and not HBO specials. He still appears at Caroline's and clubs like that. His bread and butter has always been his writing, and the fact that he didn't become as large and popular speaks to choices he's made himself. He could have made the choice to tailor his material to the marketplace, just like any number of artists have chosen to do. Chappelle walked because there were limits to what he was willing to do. Also, when Pryor and Foxx were traveling the south doing club dates, they performed for black audiences exclusively - the "Chitlin' Circuit." For them to achieve any kind of mainstream success, their material couldn't be angry. They joked mostly about black life to their audiences, about things their audience could relate to. Even their racial material was more funny than angry or bitter. Today's black comic has a lot more power and say over what gets into the marketplace with the advent of cable television, where content is largely unedited and as raw as you want it to be.

[RawGod]

While I'm not exactly the target audience, guy's problem is that he's just not that funny.