[Menace]

Unfortunately, I fall into this category due to just being a lazy ass, relying on my metabolism not to gain weight, and living a sedentary life style for too long.

Although I have (re)-started weights (Starting Strength), I wonder, is it better (easier) to just bulk up to where I want then cut down and be lean, or to try and have lean gains?

[Newb#3]

If you're skinny-fat and completely out of shape, you'll be able to do both with a pretty basic routine.

Once your newb gains are out of the way you have to choose. Personally, if you can manage the planning, go for a relatively lean bulk. Unless you need to get to a certain level quickly, then it can pay to get somewhat sloppy.

[Menace]

(05-31-2012 02:22 PM)Newb#3 Wrote:  

If you're skinny-fat and completely out of shape, you'll be able to do both with a pretty basic routine.

Once your newb gains are out of the way you have to choose. Personally, if you can manage the planning, go for a relatively lean bulk. Unless you need to get to a certain level quickly, then it can pay to get somewhat sloppy.

Alright, that sounds reasonable. I will try the lean gains/IF method once the newbie gains are done.

[Chad Daring]

Depends on how fat. If you're pretty chubby I'd do lite lifting and polish up your diet and drop a few THEN get under the bar. If you're just carrying around a little extra with minimal muscle then I'd go straight for the deadlifts and squatz

[the chef]

yea if you're chubby enough to see some man titties then you need to clean up your diet first; then start lifting. if you've just got a little flubber on your stomach then lift away.

[sixsix]

@the chef

Why wait with training until having lost weight? Weight training is actually a great tool in slimming down your body. It burns a lot of fat and it tightens the looseness.

Start eating like a man (no shit that's wrapped in plastic) and start using your muscles (compound). Skinny fat is not a terrible place to start. Your muscles will grow while extracting energy from your fat. After a while the muscles will appear as the fat melts away and you'll get a mirror boner. Bravo!

[Menace]

Chad,

Don't know if you remember, but you saw me that night with Badger, VK, Gmac, and Bronan @ St. Ex. I'm not chubby by a long shot. Biggest problem is the belly. My diet is mostly ok, but I'm not strict with carbs and I'm probably not eating enough.

[at350zguyy]

Running and sprinting will complement your weightlifting and get you slimmed down even faster.

[MikeCF]

If you follow a clean diet and lift weights, your body will figure things out for itself.

Check back in 3 months, which is about the time it takes for new gains to stop.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

How do you estimate if you're just skinny or skinnyfat? Are there any official guidelines?

[_DC_]

(06-01-2012 03:13 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

How do you estimate if you're just skinny or skinnyfat? Are there any official guidelines?

Its pretty easy. There is fit and athletic skinny, pretty much every professional soccer player.

   

Super skinny. You basically have to just have bad genetics to be this skinny IMO. Lots of guys can not work out for years and still have a few inches on the biceps of this poor guy.

   

Skinny fat. Take the guy above, and gain 20 pounds. Not pretty.

   

IMO, guys with decent basic muscle tone naturally, would only have to get down to 7-8% bodyfat, and maybe a couple months of lifting to get like the guy in the first picture. Dudes arms are probably barely 12-13". This very low bodyfat isn't easy at all however (I'm been getting there slowly myself with IF), but its very difficult when your career/life doesn't revolve around running several miles a day. Some people are just genetically really small, like #2, and worse of all is if that person doesn't even attempt to get bigger and eats chips and plays video games and becomes #3.

OP, I think its smarter to get lean first, even if you're skinny. The reason being that with a month (or three) depending on how overweight you are, you can get to around 10% bf and look much better. Getting muscle takes a much longer time, so you might as well look better first, then start the slow climb to even better. As an added bonus, your swift beginner gains should be much easier to notice.

[Screwston]

^^ I don't think ANY guy can hit the weights hard and not start putting on muscle eventually. Number 2 has probably never touched a weight in his life. Gonna have to pull out the Henry Rollins pictures again to get the skinny players motivated to work out

Similar to number 2 before he started working out. Scrawny and he's 5'8





Years later after dedication and patience






I'm no expert but I just don't see how it's possible to work out HARD a few times a week and not start putting on muscle and looking different. i'm pretty sure number 2 would look a lot different after a year of non stop gym time.

[WanderingSoul]

(05-31-2012 07:16 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

If you follow a clean diet and lift weights, your body will figure things out for itself.

Check back in 3 months, which is about the time it takes for new gains to stop.

This. All of the "Should I get lean first, or bulk first?" debate is just going to lead to you not doing jack shit. If you follow Starting Strength and drink plenty of milk you will gain a TON of muscle and strength and your body will look much better.

Bottom line, do the program and don't worry about the other horseshit info you will hear from people, because they don't know dick.

[Pacesetter20]

(05-31-2012 01:20 PM)Menace Wrote:  

Unfortunately, I fall into this category due to just being a lazy ass, relying on my metabolism not to gain weight, and living a sedentary life style for too long.

Although I have (re)-started weights (Starting Strength), I wonder, is it better (easier) to just bulk up to where I want then cut down and be lean, or to try and have lean gains?

You're not pushing the intensity level high enough in your workouts and thus not burning any fat.

Sample workout to do for 4-6 months:
- Hanging Leg raises: 5 sets x 5 reps @ SLOW
- Renegade Rows: 5 sets x 3 reps (each side) gradually increasing dumbell weight
- Ab wheel: So two times per week. The cheap ones are fine. From your knees, roll out the ab wheel one foot at a time...holding each position for 10seconds...then roll back in one foot at a time. You aren't aiming for a certain amount of sets...simply do this for 10 minutes.
- Hip Bridges: 3-5 minutes after each ab workout.

Some other considerations: You can spice in planks and bent knee to bar raises once you get more strength for variety.

Also, If someone is skinny fat they should also include some
type of HGH boosting interval training. Either circuit training or HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training). This will boost HGH which will strip away the excess body fat. Again...it needs to be the intense stuff.

[Nudge]

I've got a layer of flab over my gut that I have had all my life and just cant seem to get rid of. Even when I used to be super super skinny with chicken arms I still had it. Lately been doing a brutal High intensity boxing classes (1 hour) once a week plus another high intensity tabata workout once or twice a week. I bike ride to work most days, then I try to go for a jog once a week and I also play tag rugby. My diet, although not perfect, isnt too bad either - dont eat too many carbs and usually have chicken breast or fish and salad for dinner. The only thing is I party quite a lot and love my beer.

Anyone got any ideas? Am I just gonna have to accept that if I want to get rid of it I have to 100% commited and cut out the beer? Not sure thats possible living in London

[AlphaTravel]

I guess I'm skinny fat too. I'm pretty short, absurdly thin arms they are so boney, fairly thin legs but a fat belly and flabby upper body also a bit of a chubby face at the moment. Had the belly for as long as I can remember. Weighed myself yesterday and have put on a few pounds during my 4 months in Thailand due to daily beer consumption.

Starting next week I'm on a healthy eating plan, trying to lose as much weight as possible quickly and doing some well needed exercise.

[Neo]

(05-31-2012 01:20 PM)Menace Wrote:  

Unfortunately, I fall into this category due to just being a lazy ass, relying on my metabolism not to gain weight, and living a sedentary life style for too long.

Although I have (re)-started weights (Starting Strength), I wonder, is it better (easier) to just bulk up to where I want then cut down and be lean, or to try and have lean gains?

The best way is just start in one direction and monitor yourself week to week to see if you like the results. Begin the starting strength program, and do some research on diet. Calculate your BMR, there are a bunch of equations on this with pros and cons. Keep it simple. I use this one:

66 + (6.3 x weight in pounds) + (12.9 x height in inches) - (6.8 x age in years)=BMR

This should work well for most average sized people. It doesnt include lean body mass so it's not perfect. If you're leaner you'll need more calories since muscle burns a lot of cals at rest, if you're not that lean you'll need less. So keep that in mind.

Multiply the answer you got by an 'activity factor.'

Sendentary x 1.2 Workout a 1-2x a week.

Moderate x 1.4 Workout 3-4x a week.

Active x 1.6 Workout 4-6x a week.

Memorize this number.

If you want to lose weight subtract around 500 cals a day. Bulk add.

So to start I'd go through this process and pick a goal, let's say lose weight. Then get yourself these.

http://www.sequoiafitness.com/metacal.html

Track yourself every week. If you are doing starting strength and making no diet changes and you like how things are going keep at it. If you don't make adjustments.

[Walnuts]

(06-01-2012 04:54 AM)Nudge Wrote:  

I've got a layer of flab over my gut that I have had all my life and just cant seem to get rid of. Even when I used to be super super skinny with chicken arms I still had it. Lately been doing a brutal High intensity boxing classes (1 hour) once a week plus another high intensity tabata workout once or twice a week. I bike ride to work most days, then I try to go for a jog once a week and I also play tag rugby. My diet, although not perfect, isnt too bad either - dont eat too many carbs and usually have chicken breast or fish and salad for dinner. The only thing is I party quite a lot and love my beer.

Anyone got any ideas? Am I just gonna have to accept that if I want to get rid of it I have to 100% commited and cut out the beer? Not sure thats possible living in London

Cut out the beer. Too much starch, goes straight to your stomach. I prefer brandy on ice.

I'm in London too, pm me if you wana go out.

[reaper23]

"IMO, guys with decent basic muscle tone naturally, would only have to get down to 7-8% bodyfat, and maybe a couple months of lifting to get like the guy in the first picture."

Jesus- this is why these threads are often so worthless.

only have to get down to 7% body fat? do you know what percentage of the US population who isn't literally starving to death has 7% body fat? less than 1%. far less.

lets be realistic here. 12% is very fucking low for most people.

i also guess that most people have no real idea what body fat %'s look like. spend $80. go get a DEXA scan and then come back and say "only have to get down to 7%" like it AINT NO THANG

[Hades]

Don't fuck around, get on SS as fast as possible and start eating shitloads.

Once you have put on forty pounds, continue lifting (though maybe a little less intensely) and supplement it with 30-45 minute long walks every morning before breakfast.

[el mechanico]

[Menace]

As much as I hate to do it, I think I will stop drinking beer from now on. I will give this 3-6 months and see what happens to my belly. Probably best to just keep it simple, eat mostly paleo/Atkins, and lift.

[_DC_]

(06-01-2012 10:28 AM)reaper23 Wrote:  

"IMO, guys with decent basic muscle tone naturally, would only have to get down to 7-8% bodyfat, and maybe a couple months of lifting to get like the guy in the first picture."

Jesus- this is why these threads are often so worthless.

only have to get down to 7% body fat? do you know what percentage of the US population who isn't literally starving to death has 7% body fat? less than 1%. far less.

lets be realistic here. 12% is very fucking low for most people.

i also guess that most people have no real idea what body fat %'s look like. spend $80. go get a DEXA scan and then come back and say "only have to get down to 7%" like it AINT NO THANG

Easy was the wrong word for it. I mean fast. If you really want to get sub 10% with really hard work you can. If you're not that overweight, a couple of months. That's all I was getting at.

If you want to be big and muscular, well, that's hard too and it takes FOREVER.

The Henry Rollins photos are definitely inspiring though. It is amazing what some people can do in just one year.

[Sonofzeus]

(06-01-2012 01:04 PM)_DC_ Wrote:  

(06-01-2012 10:28 AM)reaper23 Wrote:  

"IMO, guys with decent basic muscle tone naturally, would only have to get down to 7-8% bodyfat, and maybe a couple months of lifting to get like the guy in the first picture."

Jesus- this is why these threads are often so worthless.

only have to get down to 7% body fat? do you know what percentage of the US population who isn't literally starving to death has 7% body fat? less than 1%. far less.

lets be realistic here. 12% is very fucking low for most people.

i also guess that most people have no real idea what body fat %'s look like. spend $80. go get a DEXA scan and then come back and say "only have to get down to 7%" like it AINT NO THANG

Easy was the wrong word for it. I mean fast. If you really want to get sub 10% with really hard work you can. If you're not that overweight, a couple of months. That's all I was getting at.

If you want to be big and muscular, well, that's hard too and it takes FOREVER.

The Henry Rollins photos are definitely inspiring though. It is amazing what some people can do in just one year.

I dont think Henry did that in 1 year...

Getting sub 10% in a couple of months is not as easy at it sounds, I dont know anyone who has accomplished that without being muscular to begin with and near 10%. Bodyfat% is the total weigh of a persons fat dived by their total weight. Getting sub 10% also requires a decent level of muscular weight.

[amity]

word of warning for anyone who's going paleo and who's also naturally skinny like myself
i haven't done much in the way of weights since i started it, apart from here and there, however any excess baggage i've had (which isn't much) has fallen off me, which considering i'm underweight as it is (bodyfat %age of 7.5), gives me a slightly emaciated look (not really a good look and am finding that most women don't dig underweight dudes!)
reckon i've gotta rethink things a bit, definitely need to eat more (but will still try and stick largely to paleo and get on the protein shakes too) and get onto the weights regularly and see if there's an improvement