Quote: (01-01-2019 09:46 AM)CharmingPsychopath Wrote:
Quote: (01-01-2019 07:11 AM)Irish Wrote:
Can you give more details on this? What specifically did they do to turn you off them so much? Not doubting you, just interested to hear first hand experiences of dealing with commercial dating coaches etc so we can understand what it's really like behind the veener of the youtube videos
Yes, sure.
BTW If what I will write will sound weird, even bizarre, then I'm describing it correctly, because that's how it was.
They both had a weird, unpleasant vibe and behaviour, which was especially bad in case of Owen.
Their vibe/behaviour was outgoing and social, but actually unfriendly, mean and socially "abrasive". They were kind of mean, rude to people and you could tell that they consider it cool and expected good reactions from women by doing this.
It was vaguely similiar to "Cocky & Funny", but I would call it "Cocky & Rude/Mean & Weird". In Julien's case there was more humor there, but it was still bad.
I don't remember the precise lines, but I can try to convey the impression using my own words:
Let's say we two would meet in real life and I would say somehing like: "Man, you look shitty, you look like an incel, hahaha. You're Irish, right? I hate Irish, all the Irish people I've met were stupid, hahaha".
What I'm trying to convey here, is behaviour (and vibe), which doesn't make friends among normal people.
They were extroverted, outspoken in a bad manner, similiar to a rude drunk guy, who's walking a street and shouting, saying rude stuff to girls. It was shameful and unattractive, like a drunk guy's behaviour. Plus it was additionally weird, as the guys were supposedly master of "social dynamics".
Somebody could say that maybe they were "building value", "buying temperature" or something like that. But whatever they were doing, it didn't work too well. The girls were looking at Owen with revulsion, reacting to him in a "get lost creep" manner. Their reactions to Julien seemed mixed, but I think they would be much worse if he wasn't a tall, good looking guy.
It was shocking to see how bad they were, but another shocking thing was how they seemed to be totally, and I mean totally oblivious to how bad their behaviour/vibe is and how badly it's affecting the girls. They seemed to think that what they're doing is awesome, the best thing ever. It looked like they do not evaluate what they're doing according to the results, impact on girls they've having, but instead according to some "we are the best" dogma.
My impression was that Julien is a weird, unpleasant guy, but Owen was much worse, to me he looked completely delusional.
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I've met some seriously weird dudes from pickup forums, particularly daygamers. But RSD fanboys take weird to whole new heights.
Compare your "take weird to whole new heights" to what I wrote above. I really don't think it's coincidence that such "gurus" attract (perhaps also create?) that kind of fans.
Based on the last time I interacted with Julien and Owen, I can see the vibe you're trying to describe. I think a huge cause of the abrasive douchebag vibe is due to their ever increasing celebrity-guru status, the fact that they spend a great deal of time bossing underlings around due to their positions in their company, and the fact that they're immersed in the culture of Los Angeles. Those circumstances require them to not only be socially extraverted, but to also adopt the male version of a 'bitch shield.' Think - how would you need to conduct yourself if you were a celebrity getting approached multiple times a day by people asking for your autograph. You've mentioned that they seemed to "consider it cool and expected good reactions from women by doing this" and the reason for that is they *have* gotten good reactions from women by doing this, which leads them to habitually keep it up even when faced with girls who aren't giving them good reactions. It also doesn't help that these guys can just pick and choose from a wide array of attractive women from their high status social media anyway, which means that they couldn't care less about cold approach girls giving them a 'hard' time.
Of course, I can understand expecting more from so-called masters of social dynamics. I do still regard PIMP+Shift from Julien and Tyler's old stuff from way back in the day as stellar guides though. I wouldn't be surprised if their cold approach skills have gotten rusty due to the fact that
1. They don't even need cold approach anymore
2. These days they're focused much more on generic self help and spirituality than on teaching cold approach pickup
How long were you observing them and in what place did you run into them? I'm not surprised that there were girls reacting negatively, although you might have been focused a little too much on that part because of your possible overly high expectations. You also may be overemphasizing it in order to prove a point in your writing. In their defense... continuing to obliviously act like they were hot shit despite getting poor reactions is, at the very least, a better look for them than slinking away in defeat. It's very possible that they *were aware* that it was offputting, but that they've gotten to the point where they'd lazily just keep it up because they know they're getting laid with an attractive woman/women at the end of the night anyway.
Did you eventually see Owen and/or Julien get very positive reactions?