Quote: (11-08-2018 02:44 PM)Jefferson Wrote:
Quote: (11-08-2018 11:58 AM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:
Thanks for those stories. I hadn't heard the one about him crying for two days. Was that in a book?
The only explanation I can come up with is that Sinatra did with Ava what DiMaggio did with Monroe. They married two of the most famous women in the world and expected them to become subservient housewives.
I don't think any man could have pulled that off. As it stood, neither woman had kids or ever really settled down with any man long-term.
There are cases of female musicians giving up their careers for the domestic life. Patti Smith comes to mind. But movie stars are a different beast. Movies are visual, so there's an inherent narcissism there.
That's all I got. The plus side is that some of the greatest albums ever came from Frank's torment. Once he was over her, his music started to pale. Wonder if that press release you mentioned sparked one final bout of misery, which led to She Shot Me Down in 1981?
Yes, it was in the Lee Servers biography of Ava Gardner I think. The account about Sinatra sitting on his bed and crying and being able to only whisper after her death was by his daugther Tina, so it may be also be in her autobiography.
I think you're exactly right about what Sinatra tried to do with Ava, he did try to make her into a houswife, to get her to obey his commands. She was actually an excellent housewife, by all accounts a superb cook and actually loved to do ironing (Lee Servers again). However, after many years of the biggest names in the world of films and guys like Hughes, daredevil bullfighters like Dominguez, paying her endless attention it was understandable that Ava would be reluctant to take orders from Sinatra. And Sinatra did give her orders, like ordering her to go to events with Sam Giancana present whom she hated. One could almost argue Sinatra was too Alpha, his frame too strong, that he drove her away.
Of course Ava had two husbands who did not treat her right in her eyes before Sinatra, maybe that was a factor too.
This is interesting. You're coming at this from another perspective. I've read a lot about Sinatra and have almost all his work (all the Columbia stuff, all the Capitol stuff, half the Reprise stuff).
But the only things I know about Ava Gardner are through the Sinatra books. Never thought to read about her.
And, I never knew she'd been married twice before Frank. That, in and of itself, says a lot. The phrase "alpha widow" might apply here, depending on how she viewed one of those exes. Thanks for this info.
Being Alpha means knowing how to calibrate. Some women like men to be really dominant. Some can't stand it. It probably wasn't in Sinatra's makeup to be able to know when (or how) to chill out. Guess he left that to Dean Martin!