Quote: (02-08-2014 03:50 PM)SpecialEd Wrote:
Mikeymike, can you space a little man? Feel like I just injected something in my eyes...
I am not in denial about the widespread use of gear today. However, there's a large crowd that claims that anyone with a physique larger than a tennis player is using. It's laughable imo. There were plenty of bodybuilders/strongmen in the pre-steroid era with klokov-esque physiques. We can debate Steve Reeves but how about Reg Park or Eugen Sandow? Park was 6'1 and 250lbs lean in his prime, he was Mr. Britain is 1948, WELL BEFORE steroid usage was common.
I dont want to go into a lengthy history of AAS but it didn't really catch on in the West until the late 1950s. Then nazis were the pioneers, he soviets were giving it to their athletes and we started doing the same thing in order to be competitive. The U.S Olympic weight lifting team doctor, John Ziegler, created Dianobol and the FDA approved it in 1958. Im sure you know that unlike today it was perfectly legal and not done in the shadows.
Yeah I'll work on it for ya lol
You're just flat out lying that there were plenty of guys who were Klokov esque range in the pre steroid era, put up the pics of guys sitting 6ft 230 sub 10% bf before steroids. Reg park was not in the pre steroid era, they were around in his era. Sandow was but was just in incredible shape not a particularly big guy, with dedication and incredible attention to detail you can get in tremendously lean shape but Sandow was at most 180 pounds. If he'd be genetically elite, given 20 years later without much difference in training and food how do you explain a near 60 pound heavier Park?
You're speaking solely of dbol but test came on in the 30s. Methyltest and a few other compounds came out just shortly thereafter, the german and russian olympic programs were dabbling in steroids before pharma giants went and got these patented, they were at the forefront of steroid usage. The chemical warfare game continues today, they're years ahead of what the average guy can get so going off patents doesn't account for olympic athletes. Even then while it was freer flowing, few of those old school guys admit to using it, they'll talk about seeing others do it but they all want to keep their name clear.
I don't have a problem with you saying that way too many guys are too quick to jump to the thinking that anybody who looks half decent is using, I agree with you... it's naive however to see some of the guys today and need to see a needle before you'll believe somebody is using unless they look like Ronnie. Some of it is just painfully obvious and olympic lifters and any sort of lifter is usually not the guy you want to bank on being natty. Im sure the odd one exists but they're not at the top of the sport you just can't compare to someone who has similar genetics and is using drugs.