[Dirkus]

(11-03-2017 08:21 AM)bucky Wrote:  

(11-03-2017 03:37 AM)Dirkus Wrote:  

^Russian Accelerator. It destroys Pimsleur. But hey .. this argument is mental masturbation for the most part. The fact is the deciding factor on whether you’ll learn the language or not won’t be whether you use one system or another - it will be your staying power and willingness to show up day after after day after day until such time it’s a part of you. You’ve clearly proven you’re in that category bucky - so no matter what avenue you took you’d still learn it simply cause you have that staying power.

How fast were you able to get to a basic conversational level with Russian Accelerator? By basic conversational I mean able to introduce yourself, ask directions, order things in restaurants, do a simple approach with a receptive girl, and understand most of what native speakers said to you in reply. I find that getting to that basic level in a foreign language is the hardest thing, and I still strongly doubt there's anything better for that than Pimsleur. Once you're at that basic level you just keep working at it every day and you get proficient in the language eventually (usually takes a year or so for me, depending on the difficultly of the language).

I've only spent 10 days in Ukraine before and purely met with English speaking girls (at that time I could barely say anything) so pretty much zero experience with natives.

Basically I consider learning this language something perhaps equivalent to what a 3 year University / College degree would be in terms of amount of work required to get to "reasonable fluency" (probably at the level you're at). So let's say 6 semesters in total or 1000-1200 hours. To that end, I would say I'm just about to enter second semester. Probably not quite ready to get much value out of native conversation, but not far off.

Like you said, I think getting to the "basic" level you describe is the hardest part - and perhaps the hardest part of any new endeavour, the first let's say 200-300 hours of learning. Because let's be honest, there's nothing really "fun" about that. You're in the trenches, you're grinding, you feel like nothing makes sense, you're like a child again and it seems maybe it'll never click. That's where most will give up. But I think being comfortable with the confusion is the point, you're always going to be encountering the unfamiliar anyway, the key is just continuing to show up. I'd certainly say that for when I first started learning piano and reading music. After putting in that initial leg work okay now you can start to really enjoy the process, start "playing" with the language. That's when the learning process becomes easier, cause now you feel like you're starting to actually understand some things and progress is happening in a linear fashion.

To be honest, Russian Accelerator has been the difference for me - he's actually (Mark, the instructor) a pretty cool guy, having spent a lot of time in Russia and Ukraine and knows on the ground what kind of things a foreigner should expect and encounter. And when I look at him, and I look at his wife (you see pictures of them through the course as he explains concepts) .. I'd say he's done well. So perhaps he's a living testament to the value of learning the language.