Ok, here goes. If anything, this post is probably more of a response to the original posts I referenced above - the ones that Leonard asked to be elaborated on. I'll just quickly put them here one more time:
thread-61781...pid1531803
thread-61781...pid1535884
.........
Just with AB's posts above, this is a personal account. I posted in that thread I linked to above (my post) about 'life-changing' events. But I did not know how they would be life-changing. I've spent the last few days since posting all that, coming to terms with things, and also having a major reconstruction of thought with how I approach not just my family, but the whole world, and especially myself. It's been more deep than heavy, though it has required me to dig deeper down than ever before.
But that's enough about me! As I believe that AB's posts weren't really about him. He was exposing the anatomy of a Gamma. And what better person to do it with, than someone you know pretty well, all the while having a reference point of those around you, who you are close to?
The fact that we have both used our step-dads as source material is purely coincidental. But better that than some random bloke we just met on the street. We can see in to their 'souls' a little bit (if that is not too new age) and we can observe how they act with others, not just ourselves and what our personal experiences are with them.
I'm not looking to settle scores here (with regard to any fall-outs in my family), but if any correlations can be found in an academic sense, I'd be happy to have achieved that. That is my intention.
The one major mistake I made with my step-dad is seeing him as an Alpha. I mistook his lack of social awareness for not giving a fuck and not needing approval, all the while it turns out, he does nothing but give a fuck and constantly seek social approval wherever he can. To re-iterate, he is also gravely ill. Please see this post I linked to earlier if you want some background: thread-60905...pid1552332
Things are complicated by the fact as well, that I'm 95 percent certain he does not like me, and in fact, has contempt for me. It sounds to me like AB's relationship is one more based on respect, but I won't second-guess things more than that, and with respect to AB, just focus on what I have to say about MY relationship with MY step-dad.
Thanks once again AB - you have ventured forth where others have feared to tread. I have no doubt if you and I were in the same room at the proverbial party scenario, then you would undoubtedly be the Alpha and I would be the Beta. And I'd be perfectly happy with that. In fact, I prefer the company of a good Alpha, knowing where I stand, not having to put up with snide and snark and all that sort of thing. Not that Betas are always snide or snarkey - they are not - but it's hard sometimes to grade other men on whether they are beta/delta/etc. - with an Alpha, you and everyone else in the room knows where you stand.
In my experience, Alphas are a lot of fun, and if you humbly (but not too humbly) know your place, they'll take care of you too, and everyone gets to enjoy the party. I like this type of thought experiment scenario you often allude to AB. It has wider and deeper merit on many levels. I'm happy to run with that as a reference point.
I'm certainly not an Alpha, though I can be sometimes, and I like to think I rise to the occasion. There are times when I am way down the pecking order. But I don't want to get caught up in that now, as fascinating as it can be. It's all relative - I think that most of us would agree with that.
Back to the anatomy of a Gamma:
I mistook my step-dad for an Alpha. Maybe because he is a good bit taller and heftier than me - 6'5". He's obviously used to getting his own way, as are many men of that size, without trying to hard. Pretty sure he knows who to pick his battles with, but it's a safe assumption that the techniques that he uses for intimidation will have pretty much worked across the board for him: Silent treatment. Staring people out. Arrogant and dismissive attitude. Etc.
All the while, he was an empty shell. A husk of a man. He had a wonderful father who was a real rare gem - it made me wonder how the fuck he came from his loins. But his mother was a cold and callous bitch. A real mismatch. In my experience (I may be wrong) you can always judge a man better by his mother than his father. I won't digress on this point.
I'll just get down to the meat and potatoes and give some examples. For example, I've had several WTF? moments with him - real cognitive dissonance, but because I had no previous metric or yardstick to refer to, I've been left in the dark. Until I saw AB's posts. I am perfectly aware how my blindness might be seen as weakness, but in all honesty, it was not just trying to keep the peace and playing happy families that were my main motives. I honestly did not see the deeper game he was running. Until now.
One thing he did recently was when he was giving me a lift back home, I would say to him: Thank you for the lift [step-dad], and he would blank me - say absolutely fucking nothing at all. A pure dominance display. I thought it was weird, but then it happened again. But he never did it to me when my mum was within ear shot. He made sure he did it when it was just me and him in the car. What can you say to that? Er, I said... THANK YOU. No, it doesn't work like that - he heard, he did not respond, he is playing mind games. Ok. But not once when my mum was in the car. "You are welcome" he would say, when she was.
Another thing, going back a while now when I moved in to this house. I picked up the keys and they gave me a lift helping to drop off some stuff. I met up with the manager(ess) of the place that gave me the keys. An ill humoured woman (hair above the chin, say no more, actually she had a no.3, so there ya go). I was just grateful to have a place to live, finally, to call my own. My step-dad started making these really fucking stupid jokes. Weird. Cognitive dissonance. He never joked with me. They were embarrassing, but he repeated them, 2 or 3 times. I had no idea what was going on. It has stuck in my mind and only until the last couple of days have things made sense.
I don't think he was so much trying to dominate the situation, though he did - he totally took over, but it was more proving his self-worth to a total stranger, but to us as well, his own family. As if? It was weird, sorry no other word for it, up until now.
He did something similar the other day dropping me back home after our argument. I was carrying loads of stuff and mum was helping, he was outside ready to get the car out and he just started talking to some random woman on the street. Now, he's done this several times before, thinking about it, but this time it was fuck annoying. He kept on and on, dominating the situation, my mum and I standing there wanting to get the shit in to the car. Still did not realise I was being gamed.
My mother asked him in the car 'so how did you get talking to her then?' trying not to sound annoyed, to which he replied: oh she just said hello and we got chatting. As if. In my experience, women don't just go saying hello and starting chatting like that. True, she was a tourist (get a lot of them where we live in one of the most beautiful parts of England). But he lied. And he was ready for the question. He did not flinch. Ah, the game, when it all opens up to you.
He smiled at her, he charmed her pants off. And I realised in my long dark night of the soul triggered by Bosch's Gamma thread, he had never once smiled at me. He has also not once ever asked me an open ended question. All this time, I thought I was gaming him. Humouring him. But really, he has just been hiding his deep contempt and hatred for me. I say all this without any kind of personal injury. Please understand that.
Why would he joke with perfect strangers, but not with his own family members?
And another thing I could not understand, that gave me grave cognitive dissonance (knowing that something is very very wrong, but not being able to put your finger on it), was when he talked to his friends the other day on the phone. He has no friends at all. But he has one set of friends, through my mother. They guard them with their life. I don't know who they are or what they do, but they are proof that they are not total failures in life. Oh he was laughing and joking - I saw a side to him I had never seen before. A gravely ill man, that suddenly had come to life. They have always used their illness to emotionally blackmail me, I see that now. Again, I did not understand. Not weakness, but just total blindness on my part.
He did not force those people to swear allegiance to his political cause - he did not interrogate them to their deeper motives. He did not say to them: IT'S PEOPLE LIKE YOU!
Bear with me please brothers, I want to get this out in one go. Just a few more points...
When I talk to him at the dinner table, I am genuinely curious and respectful of what he has to say. But one thing I have noticed is, if he holds court, he will not shut the fuck up - he will drone on and on. To the point of 'ok, this was fun for a while, but it's getting a bit strange now'. If he is interrupted he will not regain composure or train of thought - he will just mooch off. This is behaviour modification. It makes people not interrupt him. If someone else is talking, he will not talk. Only arrogant snide and snark. No wonder my brother wanted to beat the shit out of him a few weeks ago, dying of cancer or no dying of cancer - he had had enough of his shit. And he got away with it too. I sided with him over my brother, for sake of my mother. I feel very foolish.
In fact, he will not even let my mother be alone with me. He can be dropping off to sleep and he will go sit in a chair and sit there with his back to us, for hours, but not go to bed, even though he has a serious health condition and is dropping off. He doesn't want my mother to get excited! And my mother facilitates him in this co-dependent narcissistic relationship (see Aurini's blog for more on this, sorry, got to roll for now).
It's not like my mother is being abused. She is constantly telling me what a saint he is. How he won't be able to 'handle much more' - how he is 'at breaking point, but soldiering on'. I wish to fuck I had seen this shit the pair of them were pulling, that they have been pulling for many years now. And I would not have seen it, except for one temper tantrum from him the other night that opened up my eyes.
Oh, and the fine work of AnonymousBosch.
Because this is very much Gamma behaviour as I understand it. This is not Alpha. Fuck, it's certainly not Beta. It's a whole other level again. Not sure I understand it totally, but it's a new framework to go with, and I think all of us here could take things a bit further should we be brave enough to venture down this path. But it's not for the faint-of-heart.
I've gone on far too long as usual and I'm just warming up. I've got a lot more to add and say, but I'll just leave it there for now.
Thanks AB, and thanks Roosh. I owe you both a debt of gratitude. As I do the majority of men on this forum.
I can't believe I've been played and gamed like a little bitch, and they nearly got away with it as well, should they have just been a little cleverer or more patient.
This says a lot more about me than anyone else, I accept that. I thought I had insight, vision. But I'm going to have to look long and hard at myself in the mirror over the next few days.
And dig even deeper again.
thread-61781...pid1531803
thread-61781...pid1535884
.........
Just with AB's posts above, this is a personal account. I posted in that thread I linked to above (my post) about 'life-changing' events. But I did not know how they would be life-changing. I've spent the last few days since posting all that, coming to terms with things, and also having a major reconstruction of thought with how I approach not just my family, but the whole world, and especially myself. It's been more deep than heavy, though it has required me to dig deeper down than ever before.
But that's enough about me! As I believe that AB's posts weren't really about him. He was exposing the anatomy of a Gamma. And what better person to do it with, than someone you know pretty well, all the while having a reference point of those around you, who you are close to?
The fact that we have both used our step-dads as source material is purely coincidental. But better that than some random bloke we just met on the street. We can see in to their 'souls' a little bit (if that is not too new age) and we can observe how they act with others, not just ourselves and what our personal experiences are with them.
I'm not looking to settle scores here (with regard to any fall-outs in my family), but if any correlations can be found in an academic sense, I'd be happy to have achieved that. That is my intention.
The one major mistake I made with my step-dad is seeing him as an Alpha. I mistook his lack of social awareness for not giving a fuck and not needing approval, all the while it turns out, he does nothing but give a fuck and constantly seek social approval wherever he can. To re-iterate, he is also gravely ill. Please see this post I linked to earlier if you want some background: thread-60905...pid1552332
Things are complicated by the fact as well, that I'm 95 percent certain he does not like me, and in fact, has contempt for me. It sounds to me like AB's relationship is one more based on respect, but I won't second-guess things more than that, and with respect to AB, just focus on what I have to say about MY relationship with MY step-dad.
Thanks once again AB - you have ventured forth where others have feared to tread. I have no doubt if you and I were in the same room at the proverbial party scenario, then you would undoubtedly be the Alpha and I would be the Beta. And I'd be perfectly happy with that. In fact, I prefer the company of a good Alpha, knowing where I stand, not having to put up with snide and snark and all that sort of thing. Not that Betas are always snide or snarkey - they are not - but it's hard sometimes to grade other men on whether they are beta/delta/etc. - with an Alpha, you and everyone else in the room knows where you stand.
In my experience, Alphas are a lot of fun, and if you humbly (but not too humbly) know your place, they'll take care of you too, and everyone gets to enjoy the party. I like this type of thought experiment scenario you often allude to AB. It has wider and deeper merit on many levels. I'm happy to run with that as a reference point.
I'm certainly not an Alpha, though I can be sometimes, and I like to think I rise to the occasion. There are times when I am way down the pecking order. But I don't want to get caught up in that now, as fascinating as it can be. It's all relative - I think that most of us would agree with that.
Back to the anatomy of a Gamma:
I mistook my step-dad for an Alpha. Maybe because he is a good bit taller and heftier than me - 6'5". He's obviously used to getting his own way, as are many men of that size, without trying to hard. Pretty sure he knows who to pick his battles with, but it's a safe assumption that the techniques that he uses for intimidation will have pretty much worked across the board for him: Silent treatment. Staring people out. Arrogant and dismissive attitude. Etc.
All the while, he was an empty shell. A husk of a man. He had a wonderful father who was a real rare gem - it made me wonder how the fuck he came from his loins. But his mother was a cold and callous bitch. A real mismatch. In my experience (I may be wrong) you can always judge a man better by his mother than his father. I won't digress on this point.
I'll just get down to the meat and potatoes and give some examples. For example, I've had several WTF? moments with him - real cognitive dissonance, but because I had no previous metric or yardstick to refer to, I've been left in the dark. Until I saw AB's posts. I am perfectly aware how my blindness might be seen as weakness, but in all honesty, it was not just trying to keep the peace and playing happy families that were my main motives. I honestly did not see the deeper game he was running. Until now.
One thing he did recently was when he was giving me a lift back home, I would say to him: Thank you for the lift [step-dad], and he would blank me - say absolutely fucking nothing at all. A pure dominance display. I thought it was weird, but then it happened again. But he never did it to me when my mum was within ear shot. He made sure he did it when it was just me and him in the car. What can you say to that? Er, I said... THANK YOU. No, it doesn't work like that - he heard, he did not respond, he is playing mind games. Ok. But not once when my mum was in the car. "You are welcome" he would say, when she was.
Another thing, going back a while now when I moved in to this house. I picked up the keys and they gave me a lift helping to drop off some stuff. I met up with the manager(ess) of the place that gave me the keys. An ill humoured woman (hair above the chin, say no more, actually she had a no.3, so there ya go). I was just grateful to have a place to live, finally, to call my own. My step-dad started making these really fucking stupid jokes. Weird. Cognitive dissonance. He never joked with me. They were embarrassing, but he repeated them, 2 or 3 times. I had no idea what was going on. It has stuck in my mind and only until the last couple of days have things made sense.
I don't think he was so much trying to dominate the situation, though he did - he totally took over, but it was more proving his self-worth to a total stranger, but to us as well, his own family. As if? It was weird, sorry no other word for it, up until now.
He did something similar the other day dropping me back home after our argument. I was carrying loads of stuff and mum was helping, he was outside ready to get the car out and he just started talking to some random woman on the street. Now, he's done this several times before, thinking about it, but this time it was fuck annoying. He kept on and on, dominating the situation, my mum and I standing there wanting to get the shit in to the car. Still did not realise I was being gamed.
My mother asked him in the car 'so how did you get talking to her then?' trying not to sound annoyed, to which he replied: oh she just said hello and we got chatting. As if. In my experience, women don't just go saying hello and starting chatting like that. True, she was a tourist (get a lot of them where we live in one of the most beautiful parts of England). But he lied. And he was ready for the question. He did not flinch. Ah, the game, when it all opens up to you.
He smiled at her, he charmed her pants off. And I realised in my long dark night of the soul triggered by Bosch's Gamma thread, he had never once smiled at me. He has also not once ever asked me an open ended question. All this time, I thought I was gaming him. Humouring him. But really, he has just been hiding his deep contempt and hatred for me. I say all this without any kind of personal injury. Please understand that.
Why would he joke with perfect strangers, but not with his own family members?
And another thing I could not understand, that gave me grave cognitive dissonance (knowing that something is very very wrong, but not being able to put your finger on it), was when he talked to his friends the other day on the phone. He has no friends at all. But he has one set of friends, through my mother. They guard them with their life. I don't know who they are or what they do, but they are proof that they are not total failures in life. Oh he was laughing and joking - I saw a side to him I had never seen before. A gravely ill man, that suddenly had come to life. They have always used their illness to emotionally blackmail me, I see that now. Again, I did not understand. Not weakness, but just total blindness on my part.
He did not force those people to swear allegiance to his political cause - he did not interrogate them to their deeper motives. He did not say to them: IT'S PEOPLE LIKE YOU!
Bear with me please brothers, I want to get this out in one go. Just a few more points...
When I talk to him at the dinner table, I am genuinely curious and respectful of what he has to say. But one thing I have noticed is, if he holds court, he will not shut the fuck up - he will drone on and on. To the point of 'ok, this was fun for a while, but it's getting a bit strange now'. If he is interrupted he will not regain composure or train of thought - he will just mooch off. This is behaviour modification. It makes people not interrupt him. If someone else is talking, he will not talk. Only arrogant snide and snark. No wonder my brother wanted to beat the shit out of him a few weeks ago, dying of cancer or no dying of cancer - he had had enough of his shit. And he got away with it too. I sided with him over my brother, for sake of my mother. I feel very foolish.
In fact, he will not even let my mother be alone with me. He can be dropping off to sleep and he will go sit in a chair and sit there with his back to us, for hours, but not go to bed, even though he has a serious health condition and is dropping off. He doesn't want my mother to get excited! And my mother facilitates him in this co-dependent narcissistic relationship (see Aurini's blog for more on this, sorry, got to roll for now).
It's not like my mother is being abused. She is constantly telling me what a saint he is. How he won't be able to 'handle much more' - how he is 'at breaking point, but soldiering on'. I wish to fuck I had seen this shit the pair of them were pulling, that they have been pulling for many years now. And I would not have seen it, except for one temper tantrum from him the other night that opened up my eyes.
Oh, and the fine work of AnonymousBosch.
Because this is very much Gamma behaviour as I understand it. This is not Alpha. Fuck, it's certainly not Beta. It's a whole other level again. Not sure I understand it totally, but it's a new framework to go with, and I think all of us here could take things a bit further should we be brave enough to venture down this path. But it's not for the faint-of-heart.
I've gone on far too long as usual and I'm just warming up. I've got a lot more to add and say, but I'll just leave it there for now.
Thanks AB, and thanks Roosh. I owe you both a debt of gratitude. As I do the majority of men on this forum.
I can't believe I've been played and gamed like a little bitch, and they nearly got away with it as well, should they have just been a little cleverer or more patient.
This says a lot more about me than anyone else, I accept that. I thought I had insight, vision. But I'm going to have to look long and hard at myself in the mirror over the next few days.
And dig even deeper again.