We all know that numbers mean nothing. But the make outs are equally worthless. From the five girls I made out in last months I got zero dates. When I say make outs of course I mean make outs in clubs and bars when girls are drunk.

Its not hard to make out with a girl when she is drunk in night life environment. The problem is when they wake up next day they don't feel anything. Unless there were connection established you are just a random guy without any value. And its almost impossible to build a connection because of their drunkenness.

Correct.
Newbies gaining social experience being the exception.
Only the bang means something.

eh, they're still fun though.

Quote: (10-19-2014 04:16 AM)Vroom Wrote:  

eh, they're still fun though.

Yes, they are but I don't consider them a success anymore.

I wouldn't say a make out was completely meaningless. Tho it means a hell of a lot less than what your average non-game Joe would think. Getting phone numbers even more so

If I left a club after having made out with a proper 9 or 10 and nothing more came of it (ie she flaked), I still wouldn't feel like I had achieved absolutely nothing. Plus I agree with Vroom, a nice makeout is a lot of fun

And you are right to do so, make out is like the runner up prize without the accolade of being "2nd best" which in relation to Buzz Aldrin still carries some weight.

If you have a newbie with you then that should be a lesson in escalation because these days making out with a girl especially drunk should not be celebrated the way I have seen it lately.

What an arms race:

A smile means nothing.
A conversation means nothing.
A number means nothing.
A date means nothing.
A makeout means nothing.

Also coming soon:

A declaration of undying love means nothing.
A marriage ceremony means nothing.
A bang means nothing.
Nothing means anything.

+1 Handsome Creepy Eel

Make out means just that. Make out.

When I started game, my first (and single) goal was to get "a" number.

Then I got the number. The second number. The third number. And suddenly, I got lots of them and they don't mean nothing. What I needed was dates. To convert these numbers to actual dates.

Then I went to the first date, the second, the third... and dates no longer means nothing. I need to convert to make out.

Then I got the first make out, the second, the third... and make outs are not enough. I need to convert to bangs.

You see the logic. I still in the make out phase, so I don't care about bangs much at the moment. Your game is just progressing and you are looking for more.

This is like the guy that just bought the BMW and telling his friends: You know, the real car is a Porsche.

Quote:Quote:

You see the logic. I still in the make out phase, so I don't care about bangs much at the moment. Your game is just progressing and you are looking for more.

This is like the guy that just bought the BMW and telling his friends: You know, the real car is a Porsche.

I think some of you guys missed the point. I am not neglecting a make out itself as an act. What I am trying to say it making out with a girl in club or bar( dates are different story) does not mean you will see her again. More likely you will not. Now I prefer to connect with a girl and get solid number than make out. Chances I get a date and sex from first scenario are much higher. And this is what matters in the end.

Yes Starmaze, you are bang on the money.

@eel I think you're taking it too literally.

Traditionally the value of something was intrinsically linked to the ease and/or difficulty by the means it was obtained. Credit cards used to be seen as a status symbol and the stigma and warnings associated with them reflected that. These days credit cards (as an example) are as commonplace as getting semi to full nudes from a girl you just met.

How it ties to game is to see it for what it is; a great thing (and fun) but not the pinnacle anymore - for newbies it should be seen as a stepping stone but here I still see some guys walking around like peacocks because they made out with a drunk chick.

I've experienced this multiple times with Tinder dates.

Make-outs that turned to nothing, even after an excellent date.

The reason is that the competition with Tinder is so fierce, your "price" had plummeted since substitutes are readily available. Therefore you must always attack, attack, attack.

Secure the BANG ASAP, and make sure to blow your load in her face.

Quote: (10-19-2014 04:16 AM)Vroom Wrote:  

eh, they're still fun though.

yeah, that's what I was thinking. You just gotta realize it doesn't mean anything in the West at least as you were both drunk at the time (or at least she was).

However, it does typically mean something in Russia and Ukraine and other places where dating culture still applies and ONS are not the norm.

Since the OP is speaking from a Polish perspective I assume it's continuing to get worse there re the spread of American cultural normal & values?? I got a few of these when I was in the Czech Republic earlier this year so sure seems more like the US there now.

In any case need to be clearer on where this is, and isn't, applicable.

I agree, it is like that in most cultures, not in Asia though, where a kiss usually means you're in, but that's because it is only taking place on your couch and good girls don't kiss in public.

This is actually one of the lessons I had to learn first, that makeouts do not guarantee you're getting laid. It obviously does mean a lot more than nothing though. Girls judge a man on his ability to kiss and think it says everything they need to know. An inexperienced kisser will show it, a deep tongue down from first second also says thirsty, inattentive dude. A kissing session that builds gradually with suspense building, a bit of domination by pulling her head back, grabbing the back of her head/hair, takeaway and a bite, says she's going to get fucked good, since being a good kisser only comes from experience and most girls prefer to go slower, which means you must have been around enough women to figure it out. Get her good and hot.

I'll go as far as saying anal sex means nothing. I've had girls slobbering on my cock then
getting plowed in the ass. It has no correlation on whether she likes* you or wants to date you
or even wants a relationship you. She may or may not flake on you next time you call her. It's
rough out there fellas. Especially for those looking for a nice* girl or an LTR.

Nice girls are just as bad and flakey as slutty girls. They like what they like and it's all subjective
and in the moment and you can't judge them for it. It's a seller's market.

Quote: (10-19-2014 08:07 AM)ElJefe Wrote:  

Secure the BANG ASAP, and make sure to blow your load in her face.

Inb4 'Blowing load on face means nothing' thread.

Quote:Quote:

Inb4 'Blowing load on face means nothing' thread.

But it does mean nothing.

That's what I'm taking away from this thread. Here we are, hardened players and whoremongers, the kind of men the mainstream looks down upon as frivolous zeros and we're all still a little heartbroken with women and their cold-hearted emotional numbness to men who treat them both with romantic tenderness and sexual excess.

I read somewhere that every time you kiss a girl, an angel is born.

I think I've populated a small village somewhere out in the heavens, as most of us have.

In seriousness, though, sometimes it has gotten me laid to wait for the kiss all the way to the bedroom ala Tuth.

Other times, it is right and necessary to kiss and make out way before then.

Some good advise I got as a newbie in Colorado from a senior member of the PUA community there was this:

Better than a kiss, is the 'almost-kiss.' By going in and then at the last moment giving HER the cheek, you get most of the benefits of the kiss, but instead of releasing the sexual tension you ramp it up even more. Appropriate for the earlier stages.

Sex means nothing. Its her choice whether she wants to roll with you or not afterwards. So just keep gaming on.

Quote: (10-19-2014 10:15 AM)memcpy Wrote:  

Sex means nothing. Its her choice whether she wants to roll with you or not. So just keep gaming on.

I dont agree. Unless she is completely drunk good sex will make an impact on her emotional level. Dominate her, tell her to masturbate while screaming your name, drag your balls over her face and let the oxtyocin release. Make her feel good about it after sex and she will be waiting for your call.

I should also add that its my choice if I want to contact her again. Some girls, turned out to be different than what I had expected (hence the sex was just a cheap thrill). Not all, thankfully.

I like this: Existentialist Game.

Who knew that L'Etranger and The Myth of Sisyphus were essential game reading!

Make-outs only serve two purposes in my mind, either a prelude to sex, or an expression of affection for a girl you have true feelings for. If you are getting neither, sticking your tongue into the germ-infested orifice of a completely stranger is completely pointless.

Quote: (10-19-2014 04:54 AM)Irish Wrote:  

I wouldn't say a make out was completely meaningless. Tho it means a hell of a lot less than what your average non-game Joe would think. Getting phone numbers even more so

Assuming you're objective is sex with the girl at some point in the future....I'd actually say the drunk make out is worst than just getting a number.

A make out is just a makeout, but it can escalate things, why aren't you pushing for a bang ? You should be escalating fast as fuck.

You're better than an orbiter, but you aren't banging her. The point is to make a CONNECTION and keep that open.

If night life isn't getting you dates - why don't you try day gaming, not using alcohol on dates, sharpening your skills sober?

Specifically make outs are an essential part of my DATES, especially the way you initiate it.