I should be at the gym...but

So I'm reading Anti-Dump's machine - bottom of the page - http://www.mts.net/~bpony/djbible/

It's more than 10 years old. You can tell by how he talks about the nature of women that he knows his shit. But the advice is so specific to the time.

On the topic of creative dates

"Whenever you hear yourself saying "women like creativity. or 'WOMEN LIKE...' stick your finger in a light socket.

You have it REVERSED. You should be saying to her "I like skiing. Do you?" "I like bowling. Do you?"

You don't give a girl what SHE wants. YOU FIND A GIRL THAT LIKES WHAT YOU WANT. Later you ask her what she likes after she accepts you first."

That's solid, I need to incorporate more of this into my game.

*Scroll down a bit*

"NEVER cook a dinner for a woman unless you are engaged to be married! And the ring is on her finger! She has to be taken out of circulation. Imagine doing that and next week you see her with Stan the Man. "

A lot of gems in the old school stuff, but some stuff is just anachronistic.

WIA

Some of the old pick-up stuff is great.
Solomon comes to mind as being incredibly accurate.

If i'm having a issue during the pull or failing to get the bang but getting very close i look at some old material. The stuff written back then figured out a lot of things.
I've read a few places that all the game related material has been written it's just everyone else keeps rewording and putting their own spin on it.

I would go so far to state that some of the old pick-up material is BETTER on covering the fundamentals than what is "current". A lot of the stuff that's hot right now is very top heavy with psuedo-science, feminist bashing and/or race theory. To the degree that something as simple as hitting on girls becomes a political exercise.

I'm finishing up How to Date Young Women: For Men Over 35. I am actually love his style of writing a lot more than Day Bang. In fact I just may read it twice. Thrice if I can get a bang in canada (damn near impossible if youre over 35 and trying to bang a 20yo). He hits almost all the red pill elements even though it was written in the nineties. I especially like how he breaks down your chances with each age group (says to not bother with 18 year olds--not worth the hassle unless they are really into you). The other thing is how he hammers the importance of dressing well. Clothes make the man, as they say.

Some of the older stuff stands up to the test of time because it recognizes certain consistent patterns of behavior in men/women

Fortunately, these patterns rarely change regardless of new technology, fads or the passage of time

A lot of these writers were speaking from life experience and actually field tested results/hitting the pavement vs. some of the more philosophical or scientific ramblings of today (as Vicious pointed out).

There are no shortcuts on experience

I am not sure if I'd want to hit up Ross Jefferies to learn about seduction. But I'd certainly want to learn NLP, hypnosis and other jazz for general communication and persuasion skills.

Quote: (08-14-2014 09:48 AM)kinjutsu Wrote:  

Some of the old pick-up stuff is great.
Solomon comes to mind as being incredibly accurate.

If i'm having a issue during the pull or failing to get the bang but getting very close i look at some old material. The stuff written back then figured out a lot of things.
I've read a few places that all the game related material has been written it's just everyone else keeps rewording and putting their own spin on it.

I agree to an extent.

There's really only so many ways that you can engineer a one night stand. The more pickup I read, especially from guys outside of the mystery, style and Tyler, the more you see a lot of convergence.

This guy Anti Dump is adamant about getting her home phone number. And then talking to her on the phone. And as a divorced guy his bias is towards wife screening.

But there's so much gold in this stuff.

I also see a lot of jargon, which looks like personal branding. Eben Pagan affected a lot of minds.

Quote: (08-14-2014 09:52 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

I would go so far to state that some of the old pick-up material is BETTER on covering the fundamentals than what is "current". A lot of the stuff that's hot right now is very top heavy with psuedo-science, feminist bashing and/or race theory. To the degree that something as simple as hitting on girls becomes a political exercise.

A lot of the stuff I read today seems to ignore the fundamentals. Turn of the millennium pickup was very focused on being the men's response to The Rules or other books in the self help section. Women were not yet the enemy of smartphone toting, man shaming, feminazis.

But a lot of the stuff is before internet "dating" and so called hookup culture. Marginal chicks have so many options, yet so few options from their perspective. Cute chicks and sexy chicks are worse off, and you can forget about the top ten percent.

The Instagram chick in some down market like a Dallas or Atlanta can command the attention of powerful men that was once only the purview of top bitches on top markets.

The value of pussy has been greatly inflated, and the thirst keeps pushing the price up.

It really seems so quaint

Quote: (08-14-2014 12:01 PM)Soothesayer Wrote:  

I'm finishing up How to Date Young Women: For Men Over 35. I am actually love his style of writing a lot more than Day Bang. In fact I just may read it twice. Thrice if I can get a bang in canada (damn near impossible if youre over 35 and trying to bang a 20yo). He hits almost all the red pill elements even though it was written in the nineties. I especially like how he breaks down your chances with each age group (says to not bother with 18 year olds--not worth the hassle unless they are really into you). The other thing is how he hammers the importance of dressing well. Clothes make the man, as they say.

That clothes thing is hard.

Suiting up says either
- I have a little dough, so I can provide
- I'm actually a manager, supervisor, owner someplace, thus a boss.

One is not necessarily better than the other, but it's important to know which image you are presenting. Actual boss behavior is something you have to experience or learn.

Quote: (08-14-2014 12:23 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  

Some of the older stuff stands up to the test of time because it recognizes certain consistent patterns of behavior in men/women

Fortunately, these patterns rarely change regardless of new technology, fads or the passage of time

A lot of these writers were speaking from life experience and actually field tested results/hitting the pavement vs. some of the more philosophical or scientific ramblings of today (as Vicious pointed out).

There are no shortcuts on experience

Indeed, as an old man myself, a lot of what they are talking about I only learned through experience.

I'm still trying to sort through the attract mentality and the convert mentality. I'm looking for cats that really have done both. Fundamentally, that's one of the biggest schisms in the game.

Quote: (08-14-2014 12:24 PM)Heathree Wrote:  

I am not sure if I'd want to hit up Ross Jefferies to learn about seduction. But I'd certainly want to learn NLP, hypnosis and other jazz for general communication and persuasion skills.

And as a newbie, you're entitled to your opinion. But clearly you didn't even glance at the linked material. Nor do you seem to have any grasp of seduction history.

WIA

Quote: (08-14-2014 01:18 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

Quote: (08-14-2014 12:24 PM)Heathree Wrote:  

I am not sure if I'd want to hit up Ross Jefferies to learn about seduction. But I'd certainly want to learn NLP, hypnosis and other jazz for general communication and persuasion skills.

And as a newbie, you're entitled to your opinion. But clearly you didn't even glance at the linked material. Nor do you seem to have any grasp of seduction history.

WIA

Just because I am a newbie to this forum, it does not mean I have not been involved with 'PUA' for a while. People are entitled to jump to whatever conclusions they wish.

Quote: (08-14-2014 12:01 PM)Soothesayer Wrote:  

I'm finishing up How to Date Young Women: For Men Over 35. I am actually love his style of writing a lot more than Day Bang. In fact I just may read it twice. Thrice if I can get a bang in canada (damn near impossible if youre over 35 and trying to bang a 20yo). He hits almost all the red pill elements even though it was written in the nineties. I especially like how he breaks down your chances with each age group (says to not bother with 18 year olds--not worth the hassle unless they are really into you). The other thing is how he hammers the importance of dressing well. Clothes make the man, as they say.

1) In 2014 [19 years after publication] it is not hard at all for a 35-42 yr old guy to pick up 18-21 yr olds. Older guy fetish has been around forever, and texting makes it so much easier for them to keep it DL.

2)18-20 yr olds - sweetest fruit can require a bit more work. But the rewards are amazing. And they are dying to have an older guy take them out, show them the ropes. someone experienced sexually unlike the boys they know in many many cases.

Dressing well should be rule #1, 2 and 3. Both young and older women can't help but look at you and think good thoughts. Plus, if you spot them looking - instantly game on brutha.

Gold as always from this guy..

The whole cooking dinner thing can go either way.

Personally it's one of my favorites. But I'm not whipping up a 5 course meal...it's more like BBQ, beer and carefully chosen tunes

If she's into sports, grill wings and watch my or her team's game. Not rocket science.

But certainly wouldn't write off the whole cooking thing at face value.

It also opens the door for her to cook, and 9/10 times, she will put waaaay more effort into it than firing up a grill.

The biggest point I have with my game right now is...at what point does my 'keyboard/textbook alpha-ness' become some kind of blinder to just doing what I want. I can pull off some 'beta' things because they are done in the 'right' way. Plenty of guys have written about this before, I'm just now getting to that point and it's...a relief

I feel like I over-compensated for a few months while I learned the difference between being a man and being a caricature. Only experience let me realize that line myself, and honestly I'm still not even sure in some regards.

My biggest step forward was when I absorbed months worth of posts then hit the streets/ didn't touch the internet for game for a while. In my case it went a bit smoother and I felt way more alive when it was an 'original' journey rather than riding on the tracks of other people's experiences...granted I had a few mentors that still helped from time to time

Quote: (08-14-2014 01:04 PM)WestIndianArchie Wrote:  

The Instagram chick in some down market like a Dallas or Atlanta can command the attention of powerful men that was once only the purview of top bitches on top markets.

I thought Dallas and Atlanta had some decent talent compared to most other tier 2 U.S. cities. Never been to either. Just curious.

If you said Albaquerque or Cleveland I would knowingly nod.

Quote: (08-14-2014 08:11 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  

I thought Dallas and Atlanta had some decent talent compared to most other tier 2 U.S. cities. Never been to either. Just curious.

I saw a lot of PAWGs in Dallas, and Atlanta has the finest Black women in the country, only Houston rivals that talent base.

Quote: (08-14-2014 05:52 PM)horn Wrote:  

1) In 2014 [19 years after publication] it is not hard at all for a 35-42 yr old guy to pick up 18-21 yr olds. Older guy fetish has been around forever, and texting makes it so much easier for them to keep it DL.

2)18-20 yr olds - sweetest fruit can require a bit more work. But the rewards are amazing. And they are dying to have an older guy take them out, show them the ropes. someone experienced sexually unlike the boys they know in many many cases.

Dressing well should be rule #1, 2 and 3. Both young and older women can't help but look at you and think good thoughts. Plus, if you spot them looking - instantly game on brutha.

Drop a data sheet, bro!

Quote: (08-14-2014 10:12 PM)jariel Wrote:  

Quote: (08-14-2014 08:11 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  

I thought Dallas and Atlanta had some decent talent compared to most other tier 2 U.S. cities. Never been to either. Just curious.

I saw a lot of PAWGs in Dallas, and Atlanta has the finest Black women in the country, only Houston rivals that talent base.

Did you find the pawgs in Dallas to be responsive to brothers? Were you approaching? Just wondering because a white girl with a phat booty turns me on.

delete

Anyone read or re-read the Mystery Method recently?

I considered it, but got turned off as I discovered the 'sphere, and read a bunch of Heartiste instead. I will likely pick it up this week. Or at least a seminar on YouTube or something.

Some of the older stuff is interesting from a historical perspective, but of arguable usefulness. However, it does avoid some (not all) of the pseudo-scientific babble that certain people use.

To answer the above question, I read the Mystery Method fairly recently. From a framework perspective, it's okay. If you're dead set on using Mystery's techniques, download Revelation (Mystery's latest book).

Personally, I think there's better stuff out there.

Thanks for the link WIA. Good stuff.

I've posted about this before, but I really like Juggler's old stuff (maybe I'm just biased because his was the first stuff that really resonated with me, and that I used to great success). His method is based around the idea that you are the prize, which was way ahead of the likes of Mystery who was still teaching negs etc. at the time, which seems to be coming from the frame of the girl's value being higher than your own. It also teaches the fundamentals of conversational skills (make statements and ask open ended questions), how to escalate (statements of intent), and how to sexualise an interaction (sexual barriers) in a very simple, easy to apply way.

I think a lot of people were probably put off by how he encourages you to be quite open and speak in an emotional way, but it's not really about deep conversations. It's more that you give a little away to prompt her to give a little, then reward her for that investment and use it to escalate the interaction. If she doesn't want to invest, then you break rapport by vacuuming, teasing her answer, etc.

Not perfect, but well worth a look, especially for those with sub-par conversational skills.

Quote: (08-14-2014 10:21 PM)pitt Wrote:  

Did you find the pawgs in Dallas to be responsive to brothers? Were you approaching? Just wondering because a white girl with a phat booty turns me on.

Yes, people in that part of the country tend to be incredibly friendly so approaching is rather easy, maybe my view is skewed because I'm coming from Miami where everybody is a dick and a half regardless.

While I was there I got approached by a number of Mexican chicks as well, I was also surprised by the rather large Asian population that is there too, my experience was rather akin to being in L.A.

If PAWGS are your thing, then my top three cities are San Diego, Dallas, and Ft. Lauderdale, and for being Black, the easiest of those three is by far Ft. Lauderdale, the chicks there look for the Black dudes.

Most of the pick up material from the late 90s and early 00s is very interesting to read and was spot-on for its time.

However, compared to back then, the bar is now raised so much higher and that material is severely outdated. The rise of smartphones, dating sites/apps, Facebook and Instagram has made gaming significantly more difficult for the average guy.