http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/rap...story.html

It's one party's word against the other as to how drunk this girl is. She claims she was too drunk to consent, the boys say otherwise. I honestly don't know if she was blacked out or not, but I say be very careful about sex with drunk girls. Touching them in any way could mean a prison sentence if she decides she was raped the next day.

Brian Banks redux.

Quote:Quote:

Prosecutors argued that the victim was so intoxicated she couldn’t consent to sex that night, while the defense contended the girl realized what she was doing and was known to lie.

The girl testified she could not recall what happened but woke up naked in a strange house after drinking at a party.

Yeah because she's going to admit to the world that she wanted to get with the team.

Quote:Quote:

“It was really scary,” she said. “I honestly did not know what to think because I could not remember anything.”

How can you be scared if you don't remember anything?

It's a shame these two men have their lives ruined to protect the honor of this slut. They'll be on sex offender lists for the rest of their lives while in a couple months she'll be sending nudie pics to one of their teammates.

If she drove a car when getting drunk she would be locked up, but because she was with a guy, she's not at all responsible for what happened.

The way, I look at it, they deserved it. The parents should be ashamed of themselves too for not acknowledging their childrens' horrid actions and not showing any sympathy towards the girl. Actually, I'm pretty sure the parents are the ones who provided the drinks. Rape is rape. If a drunk guy murders someone he should be arrested right? Same principle applies here. Just my two cents.

She was unconscious when they assaulted her

She was in no position to consent to anything

There is a photo of them swinging her unconscious body around

Disgusting behaviour they deserve what they got

Quote: (03-17-2013 04:57 PM)ozzyyooo Wrote:  

The way, I look at it, they deserved it. The parents should be ashamed of themselves too for not acknowledging their childrens' horrid actions and not showing any sympathy towards the girl. Actually, I'm pretty sure the parents are the ones who provided the drinks. Rape is rape. If a drunk guy murders someone he should be arrested right? Same principle applies here. Just my two cents.

Troll much? I fingered a girl last week that had a few drinks in her, was that rape too? Should my parents be ashamed of my horrid actions?

This was one of the most bizarre cases in recent memory. How they took her from party to party as entertainment, and how people just watched and took pictures and taped it. She may have truly been impaired and unable to consent to what was being done. However, we tend to ignore a major question in these types of incidents - was she FORCED to drink so much that she blacked out? That doesn't absolve the behavior of others who may have taken advantage of the state she was in, but at the same time, who's responsible for HOW she got in that state? We tend to be afraid of a blame the victim mentality, but no lesson is taken away from this by young women if we tell them it's fine to drink until it's possible for someone to carry you from place to place all night like a blowup doll and do unspeakable things to you, then not take any responsibility for the position you placed yourself in.

Quote: (03-17-2013 04:45 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Brian Banks redux.

Thankfully I didn't start this thread. The Brian Banks story differs in two important respects. Brian Banks did not even have sex with the false victim, but he pleaded no contest. In other words, Brian Banks was innocent and stupid.

Quote: (03-17-2013 04:57 PM)ozzyyooo Wrote:  

I'm pretty sure the parents are the ones who provided the drinks.

No, the New York Times says "the 16-year-old girl told her parents that she was going to a sleepover at a friend’s house that night. She then headed off to those parties, too."

Edit: Frequent poster and football player Athlone also reported being falsely accused. His story reinforces the Brian Banks lesson that you don't need to have sex to be falsely accused. Indeed, I suspect men with strong "game" are less likely to be falsely accused. Women will not falsely accuse a man they want to see again. Instead they will blame an anonymous stranger or unlucky chump.

Oops, I didn't know she was completely unconscious and they were dragging her around like a doll.

These guys had their day in court. They made the case for their defense and the judge didn't buy it. None of us know any better than the judge what happened and he decided that the girl was too drunk to consent. Maybe I'm wrong, but I see no need to second-guess his decision. As much as I hate the whole rape culture argument and am wary of false rape claims, there's no need to just side with every man no matter what the situation.

These guys fucked up. I don't have any pity for them (unless of course they really got set up). If a chick is so drunk that you even have to think twice as to whether what you're doing is wrong, you're best just moving on and finding some other girl.

There are a couple important things to keep in mind:

1) "Rape" doesn't have to be forced penile penetration which is what most of us think of when we hear of a rapist. Using your hands on a girl's vagina can also get you prosecuted for rape. I had previously thought such would be was labeled "sexual assault" which is a bit of a lesser charge.

2) There is no firm line defining how drunk a girl can be to give consent:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-5...nt-to-sex/

Quote:Quote:

"Unlike the legal limit for a DUI, there is no "bright line" for how intoxicated a person has to be to be considered impaired enough to be unable to say yes - or no - to sex, says Jennifer Gentile Long, a former prosecutor and the director of AEQuitas, an organization the provides research and assistance to law enforcement prosecuting violence against women.

The issue is further complicated because sexual assault victims don't typically report to a hospital or police until hours and sometimes days after an assault, making an accurate measurement of their impairment impossible."

I'm just putting this out there just to show what's going on and how the law works. I'm sure we've all had sex with girls who were intoxicated to some extent. You guys will have to judge on your own how drunk a girl is when you're about to get down to business. Just realize that under the law, you're playing in the danger zone. Even if she weren't unconscious. If she consented while drunk I wonder if the courts could throw that consent out the window because her judgment was chemically impaired?

So i guess now in America we are responsible for the welfare of drunk bitches? wtf? what happened to personal responsibility?

Quote: (03-17-2013 05:34 PM)j r Wrote:  

These guys fucked up. I don't have any pity for them (unless of course they really got set up). If a chick is so drunk that you even have to think twice as to whether what you're doing is wrong, you're best just moving on and finding some other girl.

OH MY GOD, TEENAGE BOYS BEING STUPID! THE HORROR!

LOCK THEM UP! DESTROY THEM! RUIN THEIR LIVES!

I am surprised people are making excuses for what these guys did.

Quote: (03-17-2013 05:57 PM)PrimeTime32 Wrote:  

So i guess now in America we are responsible for the welfare of drunk bitches? wtf? what happened to personal responsibility?

There is a pretty big gulf between being responsible for someone and not fingering them.

I'm sorry, but I don't think it's that difficult to keep on the right side of the line. Here's an example. A few years back I met a chick in a bar. We came back to my place and were fooling around on my couch. She went to the bathroom and I passed out for about twenty minutes. I woke up and had no idea where she was. I found her passed out on the bathroom floor with her pants half off. Was it stupid for this chick to get drunk and pass out half-dressed on some strange man's floor? Absolutely. She got lucky. I'm not really into messing with passed out chicks. I put her in bed and passed out. We fooled around in the morning, but I never got the bang. Oh well.

Of course, you can do the right thing and still get accused by some chick who doesn't want to take responsibility for her actions or who just wants to get back at you, but the shadier your actions, the more likely you are to get caught up in some shit.

Quote: (03-17-2013 06:10 PM)MrLemon Wrote:  

Quote: (03-17-2013 05:34 PM)j r Wrote:  

These guys fucked up. I don't have any pity for them (unless of course they really got set up). If a chick is so drunk that you even have to think twice as to whether what you're doing is wrong, you're best just moving on and finding some other girl.

OH MY GOD, TEENAGE BOYS BEING STUPID! THE HORROR!

LOCK THEM UP! DESTROY THEM! RUIN THEIR LIVES!

There is a fine line between stupid and raping an unconscious chick and making a video afterwards bragging about raping her.

Quote: (03-17-2013 06:10 PM)MrLemon Wrote:  

Quote: (03-17-2013 05:34 PM)j r Wrote:  

These guys fucked up. I don't have any pity for them (unless of course they really got set up). If a chick is so drunk that you even have to think twice as to whether what you're doing is wrong, you're best just moving on and finding some other girl.

OH MY GOD, TEENAGE BOYS BEING STUPID! THE HORROR!

LOCK THEM UP! DESTROY THEM! RUIN THEIR LIVES!

Your all caps doesn't impress me. This forum is about what it means to be a man. Part of being a man is taking responsibility for your actions. If you're just going to mindlessly side with men in any and all situations, you're no better than the Amanda Marcotte's and Jessica Valenti's of the world.

Quote: (03-17-2013 04:58 PM)Kentucky Wrote:  

She was unconscious when they assaulted her

She was in no position to consent to anything

There is a photo of them swinging her unconscious body around

Disgusting behaviour they deserve what they got

Exactly---this girl was completely unconscious when they went to work on her. Not sure these guys are guilty of rape--sexual assault seems like the right charge--but there is really no question that these guys should be going to the slammer.

Yeah these guys are tards and deserve to be punished. They also got off pretty lightly considering-they were charged as juveniles which means they'll probably only serve a year or two in a juvenile detention center and there's a good chance they'll get off the sex offenders registry if they behave and show the appropriate remorse.

http://www.opd.ohio.gov/Juvenile/JV_SB10Overview.pdf

Idiocy all around for these two. Between the incriminating text messages and taking a pic of the chick while she was unconscious with piss/semen on her, can't say they deserve any sympathy.

Quote: (03-17-2013 06:10 PM)MrLemon Wrote:  

LOCK THEM UP! DESTROY THEM! RUIN THEIR LIVES!

One defendant's best friend was there warning them not to do it, yet they proceeded.

At one point, the girl was on the ground, naked, unmoving and silent, according to two witnesses who testified. Mays, they said, had exposed himself while he was right next to her.

Richmond was behind her, with his hands between her legs, penetrating her with his fingers, a witness said.

“I tried to tell Trent to stop it,” another athlete, who was Mays’s best friend, testified. “You know, I told him, ‘Just wait — wait till she wakes up if you’re going to do any of this stuff. Don’t do anything you’re going to regret.’ ”

He said Mays answered: “It’s all right. Don’t worry.”

New York Times

Actually this has me wondering how much culpability should the teens who didn't stop them have? I'm not sure I would have realized the implications of what was going on when I was 15.

Quote: (03-17-2013 07:37 PM)Divorco Wrote:  

Quote: (03-17-2013 06:10 PM)MrLemon Wrote:  

LOCK THEM UP! DESTROY THEM! RUIN THEIR LIVES!

One defendant's best friend was there warning them not to do it, yet they proceeded.

At one point, the girl was on the ground, naked, unmoving and silent, according to two witnesses who testified. Mays, they said, had exposed himself while he was right next to her.

Richmond was behind her, with his hands between her legs, penetrating her with his fingers, a witness said.

“I tried to tell Trent to stop it,” another athlete, who was Mays’s best friend, testified. “You know, I told him, ‘Just wait — wait till she wakes up if you’re going to do any of this stuff. Don’t do anything you’re going to regret.’ ”

He said Mays answered: “It’s all right. Don’t worry.”

New York Times

Quote: (03-17-2013 06:15 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

I am surprised people are making excuses for what these guys did.

This. They weren't trying to counter last minute resistance here or get with a girl who only had a a drink or 2 in her. They were fingering an unconscious girl while they bragged about it over text messages and there was picture evidence.

You can't get any dumber than that. These guys deserve their punishments.

Quote: (03-17-2013 07:04 PM)iWin Wrote:  

Idiocy all around for these two. Between the incriminating text messages and taking a pic of the chick while she was unconscious with piss/semen on her, can't say they deserve any sympathy.

I didn't see anything about piss or semen on her. The article said she was fingered but didn't hear anything about bukakke going on.

These are the two guys convicted:


Can't find any pic of the girl other than this pixelated one.

Quote: (03-17-2013 08:21 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Quote: (03-17-2013 07:04 PM)iWin Wrote:  

Idiocy all around for these two. Between the incriminating text messages and taking a pic of the chick while she was unconscious with piss/semen on her, can't say they deserve any sympathy.

I didn't see anything about piss or semen on her. The article said she was fingered but didn't hear anything about bukakke going on.

It was in another article I read a few days back on Yahoo, can't find it now, but its mentioned here too:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar...uilty-rape.

where was the Indian Rape Troll to take the blame? Wherefore art thou IRT????