[Basil Ransom]

How do you acquire the tonality of the Alpha Male?

I've seen a number of films and television series in which the protagonist is an Alpha Male, with the voice and tonality to go with it. It's always been striking to me, an object of envy. The primary characteristic, in my mind, is that air of finality - I'm thinking of James Bond, and esp. Don Draper in Mad Men. The tonality says, "You will obey, no questions asked," and implies he has your full attention at his disposal. Campbell Scott in Roger Dodger (a funny pickup-type movie) is another, perhaps flawed, model.

I have a deep and relaxed voice, but it's a bit weak. Strangely, it strengthens when I drink, which makes me think it's mostly mental. I took a couple voice lessons, which consisted of being taught how to exercise my diaphragm, which seemed to just deepen my voice more. I have some instructional videos on my computer, but didn't keep to the regimen in them. Maybe I just have to get used to taking a slightly commanding tone with my friends.

I'm reminded of something I saw in one of RSD's videos - that Aussie guy mentions three modes of communicating, seeking rapport, neutral rapport, and breaking rapport, in which you have rising (eg, when asking a question, people often raise their tone towards the end), neutral, and falling tonality, respectively.

[duncanidaho]

(09-06-2008 02:56 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

...Strangely, it strengthens when I drink, which makes me think it's mostly mental...

If you're getting closer to the tonality you're seeking with a little booze, it could be you just need to relax a little more while speaking from your center.

Funny thing to me about Aussie's, I feel like they end most sentences with a rising up pitch so almost every sentence sounds like a question.

[Roosh]

Choose someone for the kind of speaker you want to become, watch that speaker a lot, and then pick the things he does and do it yourself.

This is something that takes a long time to change.

[GMoney]

(09-06-2008 07:45 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Choose someone for the kind of speaker you want to become, watch that speaker a lot, and then pick the things he does and do it yourself.

This is something that takes a long time to change.

I agree, I just watch a Vin Diesel movies all the time. Especially "Pitch Black" before he came out of the closet. Clint Eastwood and John MF Wayne for old school. Just make sure you don't sound like Christian Bales in The Dark Knight. I say you have it or you don't, anything else is fake. Go with what you have. Johnny Depp can get any chick he wants, he is skinny, sort of feminine even, doesn't hurt his game one bit. If you sound like Michael Jackson, go with it, there are chicks that like whatever voice you have. Just don't get fat man. You can look like a Homeless Dude and still get laid regularly, but gain 50 lbs, and you will become invisible to the opposite sex. Can't blame them, we are the same way. You don't have to be a bodybuilder or have a deep voice, just target chicks that are into you. Don't waste time on the chicks that are hard to get, get the chick that is primed and ready to go, the low hanging fruit is just as sweet as the one at the top man. You need a six pack of beer or a six pack. Liquor them up or show them some abs.

[Steve Lurkel]

my voice is kinda nasal, and efforts to sound gruffer, "more alpha" have been mostly unsuccessful. So now I'm working on a portable talkbox rig. I'll be like the bastard child of Roger Troutman and Stephen Hawking.

It may sound weird, but the music industry's outright abuse of vocal effects lately (T-Pain, Lil Wayne...hell, go back a couple years and even Cher was rocking the vocoder effect) leads me to believe that this is an idea whose time has come. Besides, it'll probably still be fun even if it fails miserably.

[twigman]

Aquiring tonality - maybe rough up the back of your throat with a steel toothbrush

[The Dude]

I have a feeling that you could become practiced in how you would like your voice to sound. Maybe talk to a speech therapist or an acting coach.

I feel like this doesn't have much to do with being a player though. As Roosh alluded to in another thread, Neil Strauss has a nasal voice and I know plenty of total loosers who have deep voices.

I wouldn't discourage you from seeking more information if your voice makes you feel bad about yourself, but personally I think there are more important things you could focus your time on first.

[Yappy T McYapperson]

One tip I learned from public speakers is tape yourself and listen to your own voice. Try to find what you don't like about it, then try change it. Then tape yourself speaking again. Also works for trying to slow down your speech patterns.

I'm working my way through a book at the moment by Oren Brown called 'Discover your voice - How to develop healthy voice habits.' He was a voice coach at the Julliard School of Music.

I'll post the notes from the book to this thread as I'm going through the book (I also ripped the CD accompany the book if anyone wants the MP3s). Most of the book (and CD) is for singers, but it can be applied to public speaking and general talking.

The main theme of the book is that there is a 'primal tone' to be found in each, and everyone's, voice. The exercises found in the book try to elicit that tone.

First notes from the book: How to find the primal sound exercises.

Oren recommends five exercises (done in short sessions).

(Ex 1) Say "Huh!" as if reacting in surprise to an astonishing statement. Then say "uh huh" as in an expression of agreement. Then say "Huh-Huh" like laughter. Then make the sound people make when they don't know what to say: "uh". Then extend that sound into a long sigh "huh".

(Ex 2) Prolong the "huh" and let the sound slide up and down. As the tone goes up it seems to get lighter or brighter. As it goes down it'll seem heavier and darker.

(Ex 3) Take a comfortably full breath and start a crying or whining sound, prolonging it until you are out of breath and letting it slide around, up and down: "huuuuh ..."

(Ex 4) If you succeed in exercise three then say "huh" in an extended downward sigh.

(Ex 5) Now see if you can produce a light laugh and prolong the last sound.

What these exercises do is produce a neural bridge between the lower brain that releases emotional expression and the upper part that thinks. This makes your natural sounds become a willed action on your behalf.

The exercises sound kinda douche-like, but Oren also uses a fair few sources from scientific studies of the larynx to back up the exercises.

I'll post more when I get time. Practice that for the meantime.

[Basil Ransom]

Yappy, Thanks for the tips.

I mentioned earlier I have a deep voice. I only got it about a year ago, when I was 19, so it was clearly not puberty. I noticed I began to speak from my throat rather than my mouth. I think my voice got deeper because of an increase in confidence, and more importantly perhaps, singing. I honestly feel like a pussy when I talk like how I used to, from the mouth.

I don't sing professionally at all, I suck I'm told, but I sang "Fly me to the moon" by Frank Sinatra, and the Broadway tune "Springtime for Hitler" incessantly to myself last year, and I'm sure it helped deepen my voice. Maybe the songs forced me to hit a low pitch within easy reach, but I was just not accustomed to speaking at that level. I also recited some memorized shakespeare from time to time, to test out my voice. I also tried speaking in a certain way, don't know the name where it sounds almost as if there's constant sound coming from your voice, and gives you a bit of an English accent, like "daaahling" "leeeeeeeehsure" "yeeees," sort of an aristocratic slurring, and frankly preposterous.

I've read that the longer your vocal chords, the deeper your voice, so height correlates to some degree to pitch. I'm 6'1"

My main issue now is a lack of projection/resonance. Alpha tonality would be the finishing touch.

[soup]

I think it's best to always frame things in a way that you don't need anything from the girl.

This can be done by lowering the cadence at the end of every sentence, even if it is a question.

It's like the verbal equivalent of typing a question, but putting a period at the end instead of a question mark. It makes everything a statement.


Also, I notice that my voice gets lower after I do chin-ups.

[Laner]

I took opera classes for two years and since then I use my voice as one of my best features.

When it comes to getting close to a girl, I can drop my voice down to a near bass level and do my Barry White seduction. Normally I am a baritone, but I could sing a decent tenor.

So much of the voice is from the diaphragm as already mentioned. Shifting the weight of your chest and stomach area to use gravity to force out the sounds. It is why so many opera singers are larger. Its not necessary to be bigger, but when they drop their fat down they can get some serious force.

Also intonation is key when using the core muscles. When using the core to strengthen the vocal tones, breathing is everything. At first it might be tough to get it to all gel, but after some practice (video, audio recording) it becomes natural. Now I dont have to think about it much, it just happens (unless I am nervous).

[The Fantasist]

The RSD video mentioned earlier in the thread. Worth a watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VDslvC4_...re=related

[the_conductor]

Would you guys say that the improvement in tonality of the men in this before and after video, if used in a pick up setting, would warrant going through the course? (Voicing It)

http://www.voicedynamic.com/before.htm

[soup]

(05-06-2012 12:15 PM)the_conductor Wrote:  

Would you guys say that the improvement in tonality of the men in this before and after video, if used in a pick up setting, would warrant going through the course? (Voicing It)

http://www.voicedynamic.com/before.htm

The voices def sound better, but here are some more tips I found with a basic google search: http://public-speaking.in/guide/10-tips-...ing-voice/

[Basil Ransom]

(05-06-2012 11:45 AM)Vorkuta Wrote:  

The RSD video mentioned earlier in the thread. Worth a watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VDslvC4_...re=related

I'll embed it for everyone:

I think this is one of the biggest parts of it. Almost no cool guys do rising tonality anyway. But if you are, then What works best for me, personally, is a semi-breaking tonality in the earlier phases, and skew a little more neutral but playful as the seduction proceeds.

Being jaded about women is another. When you think that most women are dumb sluts, and have demonstrated as much with your past experiences, you tend to withhold your approval from the girl right next to you. You treat her like a second class citizen, which she can feel instantly. On a subconscious level, this dark vibe from you suggests you're a man who's had his fair share of women. A hallmark of the beta is that he gets excited from merely talking to a girl, and nurtures dreams of happiness ever after with the girl at "hello".

I also really just don't give a fuck about anyone's feelings. I don't try and anticipate whether someone will be hurt or offended by something I might say. I don't wonder whether she likes me or not. Don Draper is a good example of this.

Your body language will show minimal investment in the conversation as well. You can simultaneously kino and still appear aloof. For instance, last night, I was talking to this chick, my back against a wall, her facing me with both feet, while my attention was diffused between her and the club. She'd have her groin pointed directly at mine, touching, but my groin is not facing directly hers.

Plus I'd look at her in a patronizing, condescending gaze, as if she were some mildly annoying but amusing child who wandered up to me, the optical equivalent of breaking rapport.

What works for me:

Neutral to breaking tonality
Condescending, patronizing judgmental gaze, sometimes with a smirk
Aloof body positioning
Limited fidgeting
Chin held slightly high
Never giving her your full sustained attention
Instead of expecting something to happen, my mindset is, "let's see how far I can take this."
Using the same lines over and over - you learn to pause and show emphasis in all the right places, with maximum confidence.

Also, Strength Training may help your voice out in two ways:

1. The male voice contains cues to upper body strength. Link. The study doesn't indicate whether the effect only applies to people who are naturally strong, or also to those who have gotten stronger from training. But I have my suspicions.

2. Heavy barbell squats, especially with a weight belt, force you to make use of your diaphragm. You suck in air, and then squat down with hundreds of pounds on your back, using the tension in your diaphragm to support the weight. Using a belt will work the diaphragm even harder, as the diaphragm will have something to push against, in addition to allowing you to use more weight.

Also, bulking up makes you feel more powerful and primitive. It helps develop the ruthless animal inside you.

[dulst]

Speak low and slow, and believe what you're saying with 100% conviction.

[Scott]

(09-08-2008 07:46 PM)Steve Lurkel Wrote:  

my voice is kinda nasal, and efforts to sound gruffer, "more alpha" have been mostly unsuccessful. So now I'm working on a portable talkbox rig. I'll be like the bastard child of Roger Troutman and Stephen Hawking.

It may sound weird, but the music industry's outright abuse of vocal effects lately (T-Pain, Lil Wayne...hell, go back a couple years and even Cher was rocking the vocoder effect) leads me to believe that this is an idea whose time has come. Besides, it'll probably still be fun even if it fails miserably.

[bacan]

I think when you say Alpha tonality, you mean Alpha tough/serious guy tonality. I could not take myself seriously having a voice like Don Draper. I would rather just be funny, cocky, always teasing, always laughing. Do be honest, Don Draper doesn't seem like a fun guy at all.

[void]

(05-06-2012 12:54 PM)bacan Wrote:  

Do be honest, Don Draper doesn't seem like a fun guy at all.

"go get me a sanwich" isnt supposed to sound funny

[Basil Ransom]

(05-06-2012 12:54 PM)bacan Wrote:  

I think when you say Alpha tonality, you mean Alpha tough/serious guy tonality. I could not take myself seriously having a voice like Don Draper. I would rather just be funny, cocky, always teasing, always laughing. Do be honest, Don Draper doesn't seem like a fun guy at all.

I agree, Draper does have a very limited range of emotion. But you can still do all that, being funny, cocky and teasing, and still be dry and masculine about it. Roosh is a good example.

This has become a cornerstone of my game - saying the most ridiculous shit in a dry, conceited tone, leavened with a subdued smirk here and there. I don't always do it, but I do it a lot. This style is great, because your lack of expressiveness gives you a dignified air, and keeps you out of dancing monkey territory, but you still get to joke around. Plus, not a lot of guys are funny like this, you will stick out in her mind.

I do try to avoid laughing much at what girls say. Not that I'm suppressing that many laughs anyway.

Look up the concept of 'Gravitas.'

[HiFlo]

I was in the army and for 3 months was constantly berated by drill instructors for not using my "big boy voice." That sorta developed my commanding bellow when I need it. Singing has helped with vocal agility for sure as well.

[Blackhawk]

Is this alpha male tonality?

[Blackhawk]

double post. Please delete.

[Architekt]

Just watch TV all day every day..

Learn to be like Abed.

[soup]

(05-11-2012 12:37 AM)Architekt Wrote:  

Just watch TV all day every day..

Learn to be like Abed.

Women are the worst actors.