[Brotein]

(10-23-2011 07:04 PM)Mr.GM Wrote:  

Hey Guys, Last week I resumed weightlifting after I time off (I lost weight and volume considerably) and started doing this stronglifts 5x5 program that I've found on the Net (http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-b...g-program/) . Anyone here knows this method?
It supports squatting every workout ( 3x a week)

This is not a good routine.

This sort of routine will make you look blocky and not a good physique.

Power lifting is a myth and is a poor way to train.

[Brotein]

(02-11-2012 02:17 PM)Donald Duck Wrote:  

Any workouts on how to grow forearms with this program?

the best means to grow the forearms is the wrist roller. I made one myself.

http://www.joinfit.hk/?product=joinfit-wrist-roller

[gadabout]

This 5x5 seems like a sure-fire way to give yourself a serious injury. Especially if you are just starting out. Building a good physic is about fine tuning individual muscle groups.
My reps start at 15 with a lighter weight to ease me in then end with 6-8 reps on the heaviest weight I can possibly lift (5 sets). Then one drop set for good measure. I cannot see how consistently lifting your maximum capacity 5 times is even possible?

[roberto]

(01-07-2015 09:11 AM)gadabout Wrote:  

I cannot see how consistently lifting your maximum capacity 5 times is even possible?

Because it's your maximum for 5x5. Not your 1RM.

'Fine tuning' is all well and good if you're at the state where all there is left to do is that. Very few are.

[civpro]

Two articles against 5x5:

http://nattyornot.com/5x5-workouts-effective/

http://nattyornot.com/5x5-barbell-workouts-truly-suck/

[H1N1]

It is a good program for a beginner, at the point you know nothing. You are lifting light enough weights to recover between workouts, and it encourages you to get to grips with the core lifts and their techniques. Beyond that though, I would encourage you to build your own program around your own goals. It doesn't have to be complicated. Sometimes the internet, and personal trainers with a product or service to sell, make things much more complicated than they seem.

The way I train, that has seen me make the most progress in years, is simply to have a few principles that I adhere to with my exercise selections, and then use these to decide how I go after my goals. I actively try to forget everything I have read on the subject, and just think 'if I knew nothing, how would I go about making this stronger, or these muscles bigger, or getting better at X'

It is important not to be dogmatic, and to have fun in the process. Lots of people hate training because they are sat in a gym doing 5 x 5 on an exercise they don't like. Take squats, for example. I hate doing 5 x 5 on squats. For my goals, I prefer to work with lower reps, from pins, to develop brute strength from disadvantaged positions, and partials to build tendon strength, and strength through limited movement planes. It works for me because I don't want my legs to grow, and I do want to develop maximum power at my current bodyweight (I have naturally large legs & arse muscles). If you can still fit into your sisters jeans, you will probably want to train differently from me. You can only really learn what works for you through experience.

[Dark Knowledge]

I tried this 2 years ago and ended up hurting my shoulder.

I would say it's an interesting program to do maybe once a year for a short period of time, but you have to be in some shape already. I would not recommend for noobs

[Thatdude]

The workout is a good strength and base builder. Use good form, follow the program to a T, and eat a high protein diet. In 3 months you'll have a good base to build on. From there do more isolated exercises or jump to a different program.

[Beyond Borders]

(01-07-2015 06:11 PM)civpro Wrote:  

Two articles against 5x5:

http://nattyornot.com/5x5-workouts-effective/

http://nattyornot.com/5x5-barbell-workouts-truly-suck/

I agree with this guy. In fact, while I do 5x5 in my workouts, I'll also often show up at the gym and do a 3x10 instead on random days. I think it's good to expose the body to different types of workloads. Or I cap off my main workout with spontaneous accessory work (just working what I feel needs work, in other words) consisting of 2x10.

I think 3x10 is definitely better for beginners who are working on form and trying to avoid injury. Studies I've come across that compare rep setups also seem to point at staying between the 8-12 range as producing best results.

None of this is to rally against the program in the OP, though. I didn't even look at it.

Just do it. It all works.

[Beyond Borders]

(02-15-2012 05:57 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

(02-14-2012 10:39 PM)velkrum Wrote:  

The real key to success is to learn the compound lifts instinctively and observe how it effects your body over time. I do not advocate following anyones work out program.

Completely agree.

I'll study other guys workout programs for days, but when it comes to when, what, and how I lift thats my choice and my choice alone.

I make it a point to vary my workout outside the regimin I follow, largely based just on how I feel that day, so I do agree.

That said, following a workout program is a smart move for a beginner because if you don't know anything about working out at all you don't know enough to vary what you're doing in anything resembling an intelligent manner. I think it's good to follow some structure for a while to learn the ropes.

Problem is guys give way, way, way too much credence to which structure that is. The important part is doing something and getting the ball rolling instead of looking for the perfect program.

[Wreckingball]

I reached a point were i can no longer do 5x5 most of the lifts.

Even though in the past i managed to squat 100kg 5x5, I cannot 5x5 95kg anymore.
I hit plateau at OHP 40kg (5x5), as well as at Bench Press 65kg (5x5). Row is at 75kg (and almost ending the 5x5 as i need to drop it between reps). Deadlift is at 115kg. I feel i can get more, but I still need to get a stronger grip, which has been improving.
On these plateuing lifts i'm going to 3x5 plus 2 warm up sets. (much like reg park).
I went from weighting 72kg to 80kg, (i'd recon about 3kg are fat). I think that if I get more weight I will start to look worse. Also, I have big difficulty loosing weight, so i'll keep my bodyweight here.
I know everybody is different, but I would like to know what do the more experienced lifters think about these numbers. I have been lifting for a year (due to work I had a couple of breaks, where i noticed my form and strength decreased (and weight increased), which made me to take some of the weight of).
I think my diet is OK, I eat enough protein, fat and on training days I get more carbs. I don't count calories.


On the other hand, I'm thinking to myself:
Do i really need to squat more than 100kg? My legs are already big and muscular (not "ripped") and if I squat more i will need to buy new trousers and suits (which I definitely do not want to) and I don't think it will improve my look much more.



I have also tried to learn the clean/power clean, but that thing is difficult. Any brotips?

[Saweeep]

Wreckingball,

It's impossible to offer you advice without knowing what your goals are.

You seem unhappy with your strength but I get the feeling from your post that you aren't massively bothered about it at the same time; if you get what I mean. I have had similar issues in my head myself over the years; do I want to get any bigger? do I want to be stronger? do I want to be fitter? etc etc. Not having clear goals can stall progress dramatically.

What do you want from your training?

[WanderingSoul]

Wreckingball,

Your strength is still pretty weak, to be honest. I can't imagine your legs are as big and muscular as you think they are. I was at 85ish KG bodyweight and squatting 365lbsx3 reps and I would gets lots of comments on my legs when I'd bang chicks. It was also hard to fit into most jeans, my thighs were too big. At that point, I felt I didn't need to squat much heavier or get bigger legs. If you weigh 80 kilos and you only squat 100kilos, you are not very strong and I can't imagine your legs being that muscular.

I'd continue to follow the program until you get your lifts up, and then move onto a different type of program if you want. But benching 65 kilos and squatting 100 kilos isn't going to lead to much hypertrophy, and you don't have much strength either, so definitely keep building your strength.

[KC4]

How's squatting 3x5 100 kilos if you weigh 72 kilos? My bench increased to 75 kg (form issue, thanks for pointing that out Rio) deadlift is about 135 kg. I think i am on the right track but i think i could do better.

[Wreckingball]

Thanks for the replies!
When I started, I wanted to be stronger. I wanted to squat 140 5x5 (which i think it's pretty hardcore). With the progression, and also when i reached the mental barrier of the 100, I thought that I was overdoing it and it would be too much.

I have been reading and trying to research on what to do to get more, because I feel that I am very close to exhausting the 5x5 stronglifts. Perhaps that may be the problem, too much literature confuses my head.

I'm pretty confused with myself and my goals at the moment. I want, what everybody wants. Gains with 100%muscle and 0% fat, which I know it's impossible. So, i'm am definitely wandering around a bit, but I try to keep the intensity on my workouts. EDIT: I'm a recovering fat guy. And I'm terrified of gaining weight.

[Saweeep]

Well, if I were you I'd move away from 5/5. I don't think it's all it's cracked up to be; the volume is too high, especially at a fixed weight.

For me, 3 rep sets work best for strength training; working up to a 2 set max weight then back down again.

Do you have a training partner? I've always struggled with rapid strength gains without a spotter (who knows what they're doing).

[H1N1]

(01-12-2015 08:57 AM)Wreckingball Wrote:  

Thanks for the replies!
When I started, I wanted to be stronger. I wanted to squat 140 5x5 (which i think it's pretty hardcore). With the progression, and also when i reached the mental barrier of the 100, I thought that I was overdoing it and it would be too much.

I have been reading and trying to research on what to do to get more, because I feel that I am very close to exhausting the 5x5 stronglifts. Perhaps that may be the problem, too much literature confuses my head.

I'm pretty confused with myself and my goals at the moment. I want, what everybody wants. Gains with 100%muscle and 0% fat, which I know it's impossible. So, i'm am definitely wandering around a bit, but I try to keep the intensity on my workouts.

A few things that spring to mind:

1. Stronglifts, in my view, having run it, is a great beginner program for the first few months. After that, it is boring and repetitive, and consequently hard to make progress on. It's purpose is to build a base level of strength, and a basic understanding of how to develop it. Once you have that, it's time to have fun.

2. Goals are more specific than '100% muscle, no fat'. Do you have someone you want to look like, physique wise, or perhaps your physique is incidental to concrete performance goals.

For example, one of my current goals is to be able to do a full range of motion handstand pressup, starting from bottom position, so anything that lets me pressup to a handstand from a lower position than the last time is proof of my training working. I also want to increase my back musculature, so anything that adds millimetres to my back measurement, without adding to my waste, is working. I am already able to squat 180kgs from a dead start (pins) in the bottom position, below parallel, and deadlift just over 200kgs. I do not want my legs to grow as they are fairly big already, so I am careful with exercise selection and the type of set/rep scheme I use, so that any hypertrophy is directed towards my upperbody. I need to be able to do all of this whilst running under a 9 minute 1.5 mile - my weights cannot compromise my fitness.

If you're training because you just want to look nice for girls, and you don't care about being bigger or stronger, or tougher, then you can choose your exercises differently than those of us with military/athletic goals. But, you do have to have a measure for progress. What muscles do you lack that you think will help you get girls? If you think they like big pecs and shoulders, you need to go after those muscle groups and see whether in 3 months you are getting better reactions.

Concrete goals let you make progress. Working out because someone on the internet said it was a good thing will cause you to lose focus. What do you want to have/be able to do in 3 months, 6 months, and a year, and why is it important to you? For example, don't squat if you don't care about being strong, or if you want a very favourable hip to waist ratio. It's your training, you must get from it what YOU really want, not what anyone tells you you should want.

[roberto]

I have a spreadsheet for 5x5 which you guys might like. Enter your bodyweight plus the weight you use on either side of the bar (bar is 8kg for me but you can change that) and it does the maths and then gives your current workweight as a percentage of your bodyweight.

Figures in the screenshot below are for the 54kg guy I mentioned in another thread. It's like watching a stick man do squats Impressive BW%s for a kid whose only been lifting four weeks, but he needs to start eating! '1kg' just means he hasn't recorded anything for that exercise yet.

If anyone wants a copy just PM me your email address.

[WanderingSoul]

You may have maxed out the 5x5, at which point the program has you drop to 3x5. I'd run it until you are at 275-300lbs squat and then move on.

My squat is weak as hell right now, I don't even know what it is. After Starting Strength and then Madcow I got to 365lbs, pulled my hamstring doing leg curls, and haven't squatted in months. Squatting heavy for 7-9 months, 3x per week, burnt me out on them.

[civpro]

^ What have you been doing for legs in the interim?

[WanderingSoul]

(01-12-2015 05:33 PM)civpro Wrote:  

^ What have you been doing for legs in the interim?

Zero. It's pretty bad actually. Full on Johnny Bravo right now.

[Switch]

I've been doing a variation of 5x5 where I squat only once per week, don't deadlift, and replaced rows with pullups. For my bench, OHP, and squat, I've been seeing some very nice gains in the three weeks I've been going. OHP up 25 lbs already, bench 15, squat 10. I imagine I started way too light on my lifts, but it is good to be on a program that I'm confident in and can see the path. Squat now at 170, bench 150, and OHP at 90. I'm feeling stronger and looking bigger, especially in legs and pecs. For beginners to intermediate lifters, I strongly recommend 5 x 5 or some variation of it. Simplicity is king.

[WanderingSoul]

Switch, throw a max, or close to max, set of 3-5 rep deadlift on your squat day.

[Wreckingball]

The main reasons I started SL were:
-Simplicity. 3 exercises a day.
-Time. Workout 3 times a week . I don't have time (nor patience) to go 6 days to the gym. I would, if I didn't have a job.
-Compromise. Not the usual: get ripped in 6 days bullshit

[H1N1]

(01-13-2015 05:58 AM)Wreckingball Wrote:  

The main reasons I started SL were:
-Simplicity. 3 exercises a day.
-Time. Workout 3 times a week . I don't have time (nor patience) to go 6 days to the gym. I would, if I didn't have a job.
-Compromise. Not the usual: get ripped in 6 days bullshit

Those are reasons for picking a particular program, not overarching reasons for training in the first place. There are lots of other programs, based around 3 days a week, that would be better choices if, for example, the main reason you go to the gym is because you believe it will help you with girls. For example, if looking pretty whilst being respectably strong is your goal, the stuff put out at kinobody.com would be FAR better for you than Stronglifts, however, if being the best fighter you could be were your goal, both of these programs would be less than optimal to say the least.