[amistod]

(10-04-2011 09:03 AM)Gmac Wrote:  

(10-04-2011 08:51 AM)amistod Wrote:  

lezbehonest. She was probably in such a hurry to share her sad story with the world that she didn't have time to run spell check.

It was hand-written. I guess she'll just become a drug-dealing prostitute with a college degree who can't spell. Winnar.

hahah, i know. just a reference to how everything she had to turn in wasn't.

[Gmac]

(10-04-2011 09:30 AM)amistod Wrote:  

(10-04-2011 09:03 AM)Gmac Wrote:  

(10-04-2011 08:51 AM)amistod Wrote:  

lezbehonest. She was probably in such a hurry to share her sad story with the world that she didn't have time to run spell check.

It was hand-written. I guess she'll just become a drug-dealing prostitute with a college degree who can't spell. Winnar.

hahah, i know. just a reference to how everything she had to turn in wasn't.

It's pretty stupid of her to put that out there. Any potential employer could find that image and rule her out as a new hire because of it.

[amistod]

I had no idea all of this was going on... I stay pretty out of touch with the news. I am interested to see what happens with the elections.

[Roosh]

Russia Today has the best coverage of the protests from a "mainstream" outlet.

[babelfish669]

(10-04-2011 05:26 AM)Smitty Wrote:  

The problem with a lot of the postings on that site is that they are blaming someone else for the consequences for their bad decisions. They are victims of their own decisions. The expensive tuition, the liberal arts field with no job opportunities, the mortgage under water. They try to sell their story to make the reader feel bad - "I have $40k in student debt, I'm pregnant now, and I have to choose between raising a child and paying my school debt." And? Why did you get pregnant? Why didn't you take the necessary precautions? Why did you pay $40k for a degree in Women's studies?
I agree with their point that government money should not be spent to bail out any organizations (wealthy or nearly bankrupt), but why should my tax money go to bail these people out of their bad decisions, the so-called 99%? That sounds callous because it is. I was very careful to make the "responsible" decisions every step of the way and most of the fuckers on that web site lived beyond their means or made stupid decisions. You suffer the consequences of your decisions. A nation of whiners.

Bailing out the "99%" just means you are transferring the money they owe and will be unable to repay to the wealthy that lent the money to them who would otherwise not be getting that money back. Is that really what these people want?

The problem is fractional reserve lending and bankers running the government. Same shit that has been happening for the last 100 years. As long as people believe this is a problem of rich verses poor, nothing is going to change.

[Gmac]

The whole concept of debt and interest is absurd when it comes down to it. It's just a massive interconnected web of IOU's that will never go away. If more people were financially responsible and purchased things they could actually afford, many of the problems existing in our society would vanish.

[kerouac]

(10-04-2011 12:59 PM)Gmac Wrote:  

The whole concept of debt and interest is absurd when it comes down to it. It's just a massive interconnected web of IOU's that will never go away. If more people were financially responsible and purchased things they could actually afford, many of the problems existing in our society would vanish.

Most businesses need to be able to borrow in order to function. Cash is not always on hand, so being able to borrow money is instrumental for a functioning business. And nearly ALL businesses have some sort of debt. Debt isn't a bad thing, bad debt is.

[El Rey]

(10-04-2011 12:59 PM)Gmac Wrote:  

The whole concept of debt and interest is absurd when it comes down to it. It's just a massive interconnected web of IOU's that will never go away. If more people were financially responsible and purchased things they could actually afford, many of the problems existing in our society would vanish.

Yep. A few months ago it finally hit me that interest is practically slavery. I can now see why two religions outlawed it back in the day, and Islam continues to outlaw it. In business it is practical and has its uses, but on a private level it ends up fucking most people in the ass.

The banks and financial titans have done an amazing job over the past 100 years of normalizing the concept of debt and interest. They have brainwashed society into believing it is something you need.

You NEED a car, so you NEED a car loan.
You NEED a house, so you NEED a mortgage.
You need a college education, so you NEED student loans.
Your children need college educations, so they NEED student loans.
You need a vacation house/condo, so you NEED a second mortgage (This was more appropriate pre-2008).

Just imagine how much $$$$ in interest your parents have paid to banks, financing companies, etc. since you were born.

The financiers, banksters, federal reserve chairmen, IMF/World Bank suits, etc. were all truly the Man Behind the Curtain.

And they did an amazing job of putting most of the world populace under their spell.

[MikeCF]

You actually do NEED a car, UNLESS you live in a big city that happens to have good public transportation. Yet if you live in a city, you'll pay the cost of your car/insurance in additional rent. You'll pay huge rents because rent control is EVIL.

Why is America's public transportation a joke? Because if it were good, we wouldn't need to borrow money to buy cars.

You do NEED a place to live. Why a house? For the mortgage interest rate deduction. Isn't that great...You'll pay lower taxes IF AND ONLY IF you're paying interest to a bank.

Gee, are you folks starting to see that most laws aren't random?

Are you finally starting to figure out who runs shit?

Are guys earning $30,000 in shit jobs going to stop licking the boots of their mastahs?

[Chad Daring]

Minor rant inbound:
When it comes to discussions and websites like that I see, over and over, regardless of the situation is that "These people need to face up to the bad decisions they made"

In most cases the bad decision that was made was going to college. That is what has me personally indebted, as well as many other young people. You have to understand, its fucking confusing.

All my life I was told "go to college" "Get a degree" "college graduates make X more money over their lifetime then non-graduates"

Not by dumbass friends, but by parents, teachers, counselors, grand parents, family members, those people who I looked up to.

Now these young people are graduating and having a hell of a time finding a job, and the major reply they get is "thats what you get for wasting you money going to college/X degree"

Wait what?

Or you might get the more specific answer: "you should've gone to college for something that has good career options, like engineering"

Understand, people like me who went off the beaten trail with their higher education, we are told BY EVERYONE whom we trust that its a good idea. When I told my friends and family that I was thinking about culinary school EVERYONE told me how much of a good idea it was. Male, female, young old, black, white, slice em up however you like, EVERY ADULT told me it was a good idea.

The adults in my life didn't stop and say "wait, whats that gonna pay once you graduate?" If they didn't ask that, then why would a kid ask that? Why, all of a sudden, am I supposed to be more responsible then my parents only after things go wrong?

At the age of 18 the adults in your life are who you turn to for guidance. Do not blame me for listening to the people who's advice was supposed to be good.

If you buy a product, and it sucks, you dont blame the product for sucking, you blame whoever made it. This generation, my generation, we were made and fucked by those that came before us. While there ARE plenty of young kids who do stupid shit and deserve to be poor and destitute, there are plenty like myself who did everything right (or so we were told) and got royally fucked in return.

[MikeCF]

(10-04-2011 02:59 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

In most cases the bad decision that was made was going to college. That is what has me personally indebted, as well as many other young people. You have to understand, its fucking confusing.

All my life I was told "go to college" "Get a degree" "college graduates make X more money over their lifetime then non-graduates"

Not by dumbass friends, but by parents, teachers, counselors, grand parents, family members, those people who I looked up to.

Also by the government.

People told TEENAGERS to get a degree, no matter the cost, and those TEENAGERS listened.

Imagine that.

[Gmac]

Debt isn't necessary. Just because it's the only thing we know does not mean it is the only feasible solution. I realize it is the way it is, but that doesn't mean it's the right way, or the best way. People are not perfect, they tend to overextend themselves all the time. Maybe it will be a few hundred years before the rest of humanity catches on, or maybe I'm just too much of a present realist / futurist idealist.

Or it could turn out like Idiocracy.

[Smitty]

(10-04-2011 02:59 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

Minor rant inbound:
When it comes to discussions and websites like that I see, over and over, regardless of the situation is that "These people need to face up to the bad decisions they made"

In most cases the bad decision that was made was going to college. That is what has me personally indebted, as well as many other young people. You have to understand, its fucking confusing.

All my life I was told "go to college" "Get a degree" "college graduates make X more money over their lifetime then non-graduates"

Not by dumbass friends, but by parents, teachers, counselors, grand parents, family members, those people who I looked up to.

Now these young people are graduating and having a hell of a time finding a job, and the major reply they get is "thats what you get for wasting you money going to college/X degree"

Wait what?

Or you might get the more specific answer: "you should've gone to college for something that has good career options, like engineering"

Understand, people like me who went off the beaten trail with their higher education, we are told BY EVERYONE whom we trust that its a good idea. When I told my friends and family that I was thinking about culinary school EVERYONE told me how much of a good idea it was. Male, female, young old, black, white, slice em up however you like, EVERY ADULT told me it was a good idea.

The adults in my life didn't stop and say "wait, whats that gonna pay once you graduate?" If they didn't ask that, then why would a kid ask that? Why, all of a sudden, am I supposed to be more responsible then my parents only after things go wrong?

At the age of 18 the adults in your life are who you turn to for guidance. Do not blame me for listening to the people who's advice was supposed to be good.

Your comment is a good one and the best way I can answer is by using my own experience as an example. I grew up poor - I mean fucking dirt poor (we didn't have a phone, our electric was always getting turned off etc). I started working before I was a teenager and never stopped. Couldn't afford the typical university life so I worked two years out of high school and went to community college. Then two years at a local university (in state tuition) where I commuted 40 miles one way every day to avoid living on campus so I could hold down my full-time job.

I didn't have all those classic university experiences - the frat parties, beer pong, threesomes with college girls, staying up all night and getting high in the school library, etc. I had to trade those experiences off to live within my means and get an education without being completely in debt. I walked away from college with $5k in loans and I've rocketed up the corporate ladder since then. The downside is I've missed out on so much of the "fun" stuff. The positive side is I don't have a penny in debt, a pile of cash reserves, and I'm quitting my job next year to take a long absence and travel the world at 35.
I see kids coming out of state universities now with manageable debt. There is simply no reason someone who can't afford a $100k literature degree from yale should even attempt it.

Chad Daring, you hit the nail on the head when you said you got bad advice from family, friends, and all other adults -- people are stupid. Look around you. The world is a colassal fucking mess right now because your parents (and mine) fucked it away living beyond their means and politicians passed laws to encourage that bad behavior. I feel bad for the younger generation only because they are inheriting this shithole, but if they got off their fat asses, took the chalupa out of their fat little mouths, stopped playing xbox 14 hours per day, and got a job while in high school, then maybe they would build some maturity and develop the ability to make a prudent decision...like how to avoid paying the price of a house for a degree in latin american studies.

[Chad Daring]

@Smitty

I couldn't find a job under the age of 17, and I Tried. I desperately wanted to be independent at a young age and even McDs wouldn't hire me. The only work I got was working for my dad every now and again.

With America's butthole getting tighter every year, I cant really imagine any place wanting to hire teenagers, especially when there's a line of mid 20s and early 30 somethings that'll do that same job because they're just as fucked as the rest.

The trend of older people taking typically younger jobs (every, and I mean EVERY fast food location has one senior working the register) is part of whats fucking everything up. The old folks aren't able to retire because the company they worked for went belly up, now they have to take the job that some kid should have at 16. That 16 year old could climb up the ladder at McDs get a management position and live okay while going to college, but now he cant. And the old guy isn't going to get the management positions because he's to past his prime.

[Smitty]

(10-04-2011 04:22 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

The old folks aren't able to retire because the company they worked for went belly up

Chad Daring, that's where I disagree. If the "old folks" (fucking baby boomers) had not lived beyond their means their entire lives, they wouldn't be forced to take a position at a fast food restaurant because they would have a savings or even a retirement to fall back on.

The retirement crisis is the next big boom in this country. With all the pensions gone these days, and the average 401k account at well under $100k, guess who ain't retiring any time soon? Me thinks baby boomers is royally fucked.

[Roosh]

Big bankers make criminal mistake over the course of several years: trillion dollar bailouts OKAY

Homeowner makes a financial mistake: no bailout, eat cake and accept personal responsibility

American who got sick and can't pay medical bills: no bailout, eat cake and accept personal responsibility

Either you bail out everyone or bail out no one.

[Chad Daring]

I'll give you that, but regardless, some guy who's balding is asking "would you like fries with that" When it should be some kid in braces. Youth have no starting, no place to run the race, yet they're still being expected to cross the finish line. This is very aggravating, and soon enough (I think Roosh is dead on with next summer) aggravation is going to turn into anger and rage.

@Roosh

I dont want a bailout.

I just want opportunity.

If rent is going to be sky high, college tuition is gonna be near criminal, and interest rates on everything are going to be double digits no matter what, then at least just give me the option of a job that pays more then 35k/yr

[Smitty]

(10-04-2011 05:00 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Big bankers make criminal mistake over the course of several years: trillion dollar bailouts OKAY

Homeowner makes a financial mistake: no bailout, eat cake and accept personal responsibility

American who got sick and can't pay medical bills: no bailout, eat cake and accept personal responsibility

I see your point Roosh, but I don't think you're entirely correct because the Obama administration has bailed out many homeowners with money from TARP and through the FHA, and they even extended unemployment to TWO YEARS for those who can't find work. And they've done a whole lot more than that - cash for clunkers, etc - and it hasn't done shit for the people except make them feel entitled to even MORE.
Now, I absolutely disagree with the trillion spent on the banks, but the American people have certainly had their share of bailouts.

Quote:

Either you bail out everyone or bail out no one.

That's not the way the "system" is set up. The gov't makes everyone pay into a system of social care (unemployment, social security, medicaid, etc) and essentially gambles that the consumers of that system will always be equal to or less than the contributors. Problem we're seeing is that the consumers are starting to take more than the contributors put in, and the money is drying up (pensions in almost every state, social security, etc). So it's impossible to bail out everyone and it's not politically or socially acceptable to bail out no one. So the gov't has to set standards on who receives money (female, single parent with no job, etc).

On a somewhat related note, I pay well over $50k in taxes every year. What do I get for that? I have to pay for someone's bad mortgage decision or health problem because they have diabetes from eating like a fucking pig and can't afford health insurance.
If I hit a streak of bad luck tomorrow, the gov't would tell me to go piss in the wind because of the value of my personal wealth. So I'm stuck paying my whole life for services at the state and fed level that I will likely never be (under) qualified to receive. But those without money are always quick to say we need to "spread the wealth around" and completely disregard the hard work successful people have put in to achieve their financial accomplishments.

[Smitty]

(10-04-2011 05:01 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

I'll give you that, but regardless, some guy who's balding is asking "would you like fries with that" When it should be some kid in braces. Youth have no starting, no place to run the race, yet they're still being expected to cross the finish line. This is very aggravating, and soon enough (I think Roosh is dead on with next summer) aggravation is going to turn into anger and rage.

@Roosh

I dont want a bailout.

I just want opportunity.

If rent is going to be sky high, college tuition is gonna be near criminal, and interest rates on everything are going to be double digits no matter what, then at least just give me the option of a job that pays more then 35k/yr

Chad Daring, if you look past our history from the Great Depression all the way through the recession in the 70's and early 80's, you'll see the same sentiment - I just want opportunity. Opportunity was NEVER a given for young people. You had to go out there and work YEARS to get ahead. You spent a lifetime building a career. We got spoiled in the 90's and 00's. Kids were graduating and making money right away, moving into management at 25, and branching out on their own by 30.
I'm not saying that shouldn't be the case, but historically it has not been the norm. I think this nation needs to adjust it's standards and expectations a little. Home ownership is not an entitlement. A job opportunity is not an entitlement. It takes hard work and climbing the proverbial career ladder to move up.
I don't mean to come across condescending -- I'm not implying you're not a hard worker. But I truly do believe we're in different times now than what you were raised to believe. The good times are gone and there is no cure to this disease on the horizon.

[Chad Daring]

There is the problem, the bailouts for individuals have been largely targeted at people who have put themselves in a situation to need bailed out. Rather, they need to be bailing out citizens are circumstantially fucked, like the recent college grads who finished college to enter a world of shit jobs and debt, or the small business owner whose store went belly up because the economy took a dive.

Conspiracy Theory: make citizen bailouts fail (by targeting shitty assholes rather then struggling hardworkers) thereby demonizing citizen bailouts all together.

[MikeCF]

(10-04-2011 05:23 PM)Smitty Wrote:  

On a somewhat related note, I pay well over $50k in taxes every year. What do I get for that? I have to pay for someone's bad mortgage decision or health problem because they have diabetes from eating like a fucking pig and can't afford health insurance.

Funny that you don't mention the trillions paid to Wall Street.

Class warfare is great. The elite, through the use of media, has convinced you that you have more in common with the elite than with the proles you mock.

50K in taxes is not rich. You're not elite. You're a case of cancer away from ruin.

No one will bail you out, as you said.

The government could have paid off every mortgage while saving money, if they hadn't bailed out the banks.

The recession created an opportunity to enslave Americans into debt.

The elite get more elite.

Enjoy slavery.

[kimleebj]

(10-03-2011 09:51 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

as a college grad with 50k a debt ..., I struggle ...to pay ungodly rent in the DC burbs.

(10-03-2011 10:06 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

This site does make me rethink the validity of my culinary degree

I'm not hating, just a little exasperated. Most of the 99% posts involved student loan debt and unemployable degrees. I even posted culinary school ... jobs pay poorly and school is expensive. I sincerely hope you like your culinary work and I appreciate your tips on cooking for singles. Also, you choose to live in a very expensive city. Maybe I'll buy you some expensive drinks.

Notwithstanding all this, I concur with displeasure at the TARP bailouts orchestrated by my old boss under G. W. Bush.

[Chad Daring]

I was pushed into culinary by my mother after highschool with no real options she always told me I'd made a good chef (I cooked for the both of us all through highschool) I listened to her because I thought I should, she didn't know about the shit pay I was looking forward to in the future, how would I at 18?

This is my point.

You judge people like me, now, now that we've made the mistakes, but the mistakes were really made years ago when I was still under the supervision and care of someone else. I'm not now 23 and reading these forums AND THEN deciding to go to culinary school, that would make me stupid. I'm suffering at the hands of poor parental guidance.

And give one more point to mom, she's the one that told me to move to DC. I could've stayed in Ohio but she told me to move here because "the cost of living will mean higher paying jobs" Thats a verbatim quote I'll never forget because its teh one that got me to move here and got me stuck in this position.

Now that I am smarter and I do know better, I'm getting the fuck out of DC as soon as my lease is up.


Also welcome to being the perfect example of incited class war. I bet at most you make 100k more then I do, this puts you in a position to look down on my choices, though in the grand scheme we're in the same class because its and us and them thing, there are no tiers to this system.

[Smitty]

(10-04-2011 05:35 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  

Funny that you don't mention the trillions paid to Wall Street.

See comment #43 above where I said "Now, I absolutely disagree with the trillion spent on the banks"

Quote:

Class warfare is great. The elite, through the use of media, has convinced you that you have more in common with the elite than with the proles you mock.
50K in taxes is not rich. You're not elite. You're a case of cancer away from ruin.

You are bringing up elite, when I was talking about wealth. Just the fact that you refer to those who have wealth as "elite" shows how much the media has brainwashed you into believing that money=elite=evil.

Quote:

The recession created an opportunity to enslave Americans into debt.

The recession did not create an opportunity to enslave Americans into debt, Americans created the recession by enslaving themselves into debt.

[Gmac]

(10-04-2011 06:36 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  

I was pushed into culinary by my mother after highschool with no real options she always told me I'd made a good chef (I cooked for the both of us all through highschool) I listened to her because I thought I should, she didn't know about the shit pay I was looking forward to in the future, how would I at 18?

This is my point.

You judge people like me, now, now that we've made the mistakes, but the mistakes were really made years ago when I was still under the supervision and care of someone else. I'm not now 23 and reading these forums AND THEN deciding to go to culinary school, that would make me stupid. I'm suffering at the hands of poor parental guidance.

And give one more point to mom, she's the one that told me to move to DC. I could've stayed in Ohio but she told me to move here because "the cost of living will mean higher paying jobs" Thats a verbatim quote I'll never forget because its teh one that got me to move here and got me stuck in this position.

Now that I am smarter and I do know better, I'm getting the fuck out of DC as soon as my lease is up.


Also welcome to being the perfect example of incited class war. I bet at most you make 100k more then I do, this puts you in a position to look down on my choices, though in the grand scheme we're in the same class because its and us and them thing, there are no tiers to this system.

Chad hit me up on twitter or at [email protected]

I might have something for you.