[Off The Reservation]

(07-09-2017 04:14 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

Sorry to be Captain Raincloud but there are generally laws against buying land and subdividing it without the express permission of the local authorities.

Town planning is a big deal for a reason. Libertarian land laws end in shitfits when 1000 people suddenly move to the newly checkerboarded block of land upstream of the town and start shitting in the river for example.

The OP idea is likely a bad idea because while you may expect some really cool town or facility out of it you likely just get either the branch dividians or a bunch of no-account people who have put out a lot of effort and achieved zero results like:

https://freestateproject.org

[philosophical_recovery]

This has been tried more than once. Also, the Free State Project

The most recent one, in my memory, was by the founder of The Dollar Vigilante, Jeff Berwick.

It's worth looking into what happened there. For the reference, I don't know much about it. All I know is that he was setting up a private space and seeking donations to build a Galt's Gulch in Chile.

It didn't work out. People have been accusing him of all kinds of stuff. It's unclear what is true and what is not. It'd be interesting to see if someone else has some real information or could digest it.

The Free State Project went...where? I haven't kept a pulse on it. I was originally interested in it 10+ years ago, or whenever it was started, but haven't kept up with anything real since.

I'd rather just make more money and move around more than try to set up a utopia. There's just too many things to keep track of.

Community is needed first, then finding a place to grab land and take over is warranted.

But these guys all tried to grab land first, while trying to also attract new members to a community. Even on a small scale, try getting 5 people to agree on something in an office environment. Then imagine a much more difficult situation with dozens of people with families and pressures of children that now all LIVE in the same community.

As of now, it's much easier to travel, and less risky, to be spread out and communicate online. Pockets of freedom are everywhere. And you don't have to stand on some arbitrary land mass and fight to the death. Sometimes that's warranted, but that point hasn't been reached in the U.S. I cannot speak for Western Europe, however...

[Enigma]

(07-09-2017 04:14 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

Sorry to be Captain Raincloud but there are generally laws against buying land and subdividing it without the express permission of the local authorities.

Town planning is a big deal for a reason. Libertarian land laws end in shitfits when 1000 people suddenly move to the newly checkerboarded block of land upstream of the town and start shitting in the river for example.

Yes, of course you need permission for zoning, etc., but it's still entirely possible and quite common.

Also, there's a very big difference between 10 acre lots of raw land and sub-1 acre residential plots.

[MongolianAbroad]

The entire thought process behind this is really weird.

I suppose this is how cults get started. In the end, it wouldn't actually be a community of like-minded individuals, what this would end up becoming would be a community of individuals following the mind of one guy, with enforced obedience. That's the only way you're going to get a "community of like-minded individuals," in the sense that this thread is going for.

Even after the cullings on this forum due to the Trump election, there's still a variety of viewpoints on here, albeit more right-wing than before the cullings, but in strong part, that's simply because many forum members simply abstain if they have opinions that go against the grain, in a live and let live fashion, and so the forum has found a balance point. The cost, due to the brain-drain environments like this create, has been less and less travel datasheets, and of a lower quality, being produced than prior, these being supplanted by political threads. The travel datasheets require men of action, with boots on the ground, like Scotian, Linux, and Fisto, to create, whereas the political threads simply require men who can fog up a mirror with their breath, to create. The latter is a lower class of man, and this is at the core of the transformation that this place has undergone. The political threads, to their credit, do bring traffic to the forum, the Trump election was a golden age for traffic to this site, and although some of the traffic has receded since then, it seems a lot of the gains are here to stay, so these threads serve as an introduction to the manosphere to folks that may have never stumbled upon it otherwise.

In an actual real-life scenario, that balance the forum has now wouldn't happen unless violence or some other method was used to coerce uniform group-think. Coercion would work in real life, just like the threat of banning and actual bans worked to create the group-think environment we have here now, but in real life, a place like that would create a population wearing a veil of sanity that barely covered up the madness growing within, as you could never "log off."

Think totalitarian state, not libertarian state. It's just a really weird idea, but it does make sense in the context of the environment in which it's being brought up.

[Leonard D Neubache]

^I liked this post knowing full well that I'm one of the guys in the second category mentioned, but I still believe that the perspective this forum has taken more generally is a necessary one in these times.

Spaniard is correct, though. In all regards.

On cults specifically and totalitarianism, the problem with setting up a community from scratch is that it's instantly pulled in a hundred different directions at once. Everyone wants and expects a different outcome from the guy next to them. One guy would be asking when the women and the booze are going to be trucked in while another will be complaining that nobody turned up to his lecture on how to field strip an AR15.

If there were a serious Rooshian community building experiment then it would be much better to pick a suitable town clinging to life and simply get people to invest themselves in that town to the degree they were willing.

When you make up a minority or a slim majority of a region then you'll tend to focus on the things that bind you. Game. The red pill. Whatever. There is a sense that "we have to stick together". But when there's no facade to keep up for the normals then the naked struggle for power begins. It becomes about purity tests, cliques and back-room machinations.



edit: Weambulance's note about the "lower class of man" might be a bridge too far on Spaniard's post. Having a family and a bit more time to pontificate on the internet doesn't necessarily make you a lower class of man that a guy bouncing from air-bnb to air-bnb while dicking doe-eyed peasant girls.

[weambulance]

Quote:

Even after the cullings on this forum due to the Trump election, there's still a variety of viewpoints on here, albeit more right-wing than before the cullings, but in strong part, that's simply because many forum members simply abstain if they have opinions that go against the grain, in a live and let live fashion, and so the forum has found a balance point. The cost, due to the brain-drain environments like this create, has been less and less travel datasheets, and of a lower quality, being produced than prior, these being supplanted by political threads. The travel datasheets require men of action, with boots on the ground, like Scotian, Linux, and Fisto, to create, whereas the political threads simply require men who can fog up a mirror with their breath, to create. The latter is a lower class of man, and this is at the core of the transformation that this place has undergone. The political threads, to their credit, do bring traffic to the forum, the Trump election was a golden age for traffic to this site, and although some of the traffic has receded since then, it seems a lot of the gains are here to stay, so these threads serve as an introduction to the manosphere to folks that may have never stumbled upon it otherwise.

[MongolianAbroad]

That's fair guys, an edit then:

"The latter is a lower class of man (on average)."

Also, present company excluded, of course.

[MongolianAbroad]

(07-09-2017 08:15 PM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

On cults specifically and totalitarianism, the problem with setting up a community from scratch is that it's instantly pulled in a hundred different directions at once. Everyone wants and expects a different outcome from the guy next to them. One guy would be asking when the women and the booze are going to be trucked in while another will be complaining that nobody turned up to his lecture on how to field strip an AR15.

Exactly! Half the guys would be trying to rack up notch counts of 100 and the other half would be trying to find a wife while also attempting to protect their sister's virginity from the first half!

[Enigma]

(07-09-2017 06:56 PM)Spaniard88 Wrote:  

The cost, due to the brain-drain environments like this create, has been less and less travel datasheets, and of a lower quality, being produced than prior, these being supplanted by political threads. The travel datasheets require men of action, with boots on the ground, like Scotian, Linux, and Fisto, to create, whereas the political threads simply require men who can fog up a mirror with their breath, to create. The latter is a lower class of man, and this is at the core of the transformation that this place has undergone.

The travel section's biggest problem is that there are thousands of people that read it without providing any value at all and most long-term travelers don't want:

- their favorite venues swamped by hundreds of thirsty dudes who will never provide anything approaching equal value in return

- their painstakingly collected and typed data and observations buried and disappeared under waves of low quality posts

There's also the issue of people like LINUX having his former bangs contacted and shown his posts by random beta males, Roosh being stalked around Europe and having women warned not to sleep with him, Fisto having his travel memoirs stolen and sold without his permission, etc.

In short, no, the travel section is not filled with some "higher class of man" on average, it's filled with a bunch of leechers with 5 posts and 0 reps. That's not to mention the downright weirdos.

But let's blame it all on those pesky "right-wing" political posters for scaring everyone away!

P.S. Fisto is one of the more active posters on political topics (and a damn good one), which shows me that you haven't even taken the time to read the threads that you've already dismissed as "below" you.

As for the supposed disconnect between travel, game, and politics, here's the thing:

Some of us aren't so totally self-absorbed that we can live in developing countries for months or years and think "politics don't matter".

Some of us aren't so utterly deluded that we can take the immense wealth of our home countries for granted, neither in how it was created nor in how long it will last.

Some of us aren't so filled with cognitive dissonance that we can go to socially conservative countries to meet and even marry women while trying to paint any form of social conservatism in America as a racist, right-wing, hate group, filled with losers who can't get laid.

Game and travel is what got many of us into politics.

Your own, self-admitted plan is to meet a woman from a socially conservative country and bring her back to your rich home country.

How did you country become rich? Politics. How did those women stay socially conservative? Politics.

The "right-wing" of American politics, specifically, aims for, get this, economically liberal and socially conservative policies. How is it shocking that men from rich countries who like socially conservative women would want to live in a rich country with socially conservative women? It's common sense.

From a more classical or international "right-wing" perspective, the countries that guys here love to travel to (Asia, South America, Eastern Europe) are much further "right" than the US is.

It's funny how many foreigners have no problem living in military-ruled Thailand, for instance, while decrying the American "right" and Trump's "fascism". Of course, this is because they all live in their little foreigner bubbles and never give their home or host country's politics any real thought, other than the usual platitudes of "poverty bad", "fascism bad", "you racist".

The problem is, you and many others want to eat a whole plate full of hot dogs, without anyone having the audacity to tell you how they're made.

If you feel comfortable totally ignoring everything that's going on around you, while you "enjoy the decline", feel free.

But some of us have personalities that simply won't allow us to dismiss reality and pretend like modern America and Europe aren't in the middle of a few-decades-long period of respite from the thousands upon thousands of years of utter violence, chaos, and suffering that has filled the rest of human history and can rear its ugly head again at any moment.

And many of us also enjoy reading, writing, and discussing topics that we find intellectually stimulating, such as politics, history, philosophy, psychology, etc.

As for the obvious allusions to "racism" that you and others like to trudge up constantly, the tiniest 18-year-old Asian girl is more "racist" than pretty much anyone on this forum. And I can discuss most of the same political topics publicly in Asia that I have to do anonymously on this forum.

The problem with your viewpoint is that you simply see what you want to see, rather than what actually is, both when it comes to the members of this forum and the countries that you travel to.

We're all just a bunch of "lower" men and poor people here for your entertainment.

You can see this mentality in the extremely shallow way you judge mens' characters.

Fisto, for example, is deemed a "man of action" because he banged a bunch of chicks and wrote about it on the forum for you to read, not because of his incredible accomplishments as a soldier and fighter or because he's intelligent guy with good opinions on a lot of subjects.

Even if the guy was a 30-year-old virgin, he'd still have a lot more "action" under his belt than most men can even dream of.

Similarly, I'd be willing to bet that Roosh doesn't consider "Bang Poland" as his defining moment as a man, but rather a small stepping stone in his journey through life. I don't think it was his idea to be attacked in Canada or have the worldwide RoK meetings shut down either.

But his non-game and non-travel writings are just "fogging up the mirror", of course. Quit trying already, Roosh, you lower class of man!

You said you were going to quit posting months ago, but here you are, still stomping your feet and trying to dictate what other men are allowed to talk about.

We're not going to stop discussing politics, nor am I going to quit traveling (going on 4 years now), simply because it doesn't fit into your schedule. And to be clear, where I've used "you" throughout this post, I'm not just talking about Spaniard88, but the other posters who've made similar comments in the past.

[Spectrumwalker]

There's another "gon' Galt" community under development near Valdivia, Chile. Havn't looked at their website in awhile, but it looks like they changed it so you need an access code to see the whole idea. Same idea more or less as the Berwick character had a couple of years ago. Though this one from what I recall wants to attract people who are entrepreneurial minded and innovators to come together and sit around and invent stuff all living in the same community.

http://fortgalt.com/

[MongolianAbroad]

(07-20-2017 11:03 PM)Enigma Wrote:  

You said you were going to quit posting months ago, but here you are, still stomping your feet and trying to dictate what other men are allowed to talk about.

I'm not dictating anything.

And I did quit posting months ago, took a break from the forum, which is super healthy, everyone of us can probably use that every now and then. The forum is super chill now too, we have far less trolls of all kinds, they get outed real quick, there's a good balance, the mods are great.

Believe what you want to believe, you'll find no objection coming from me regarding your beliefs, your mind is yours and yours alone.

[Enigma]

He really went and removed the rep point he gave me years ago (for travel data) because I responded to his comment

[MongolianAbroad]

(07-21-2017 01:01 AM)Enigma Wrote:  

He really went and removed the rep point he gave me years ago (for travel data) because I responded to his comment

Not because you responded.

Because you showed you can really fog up a mirror.

[Going strong]

(07-21-2017 01:12 AM)Spaniard88 Wrote:  

(07-21-2017 01:01 AM)Enigma Wrote:  

He really went and removed the rep point he gave me years ago (for travel data) because I responded to his comment

Not because you responded.

Because you showed you can really fog up a mirror.

Well, why shouldn't he? Only corpses and vampires don't fog mirrors... Walking corpses and spirit-cooking vampires, Hillary and Podesta: damn, we're back into politics!

[debeguiled]

(07-21-2017 01:01 AM)Enigma Wrote:  

He really went and removed the rep point he gave me years ago (for travel data) because I responded to his comment

Talk to Kona, he tosses around rep points like candy on Halloween.

[h3ltrsk3ltr]

I get what Spaniard88's saying about the politics thread. I enjoy fogging those mirrors but it requires very little skin in the game.

That said, our forum personas are a simple picture of the men here. The Galt's Gulch (Roosh Ranch?) would probably be more like a conservative town.

Someone would move to a small town, host tribe meetups, the word would spread organically though tribal text/slack etc., people would pass through, some would stay, the community would grow around a reputation for masculine values, more would move there, we'd elect roosh-minded officials, mayors, sheriffs...our influence would grow, we'd get Quintus in the senate, the state would become a bastion of manly values and higher thought! We'd elect a president who wears inconspicuous Roosh-head cufflinks!! AMERICA WOULD BECOME THE TECHNOLOGICAL, PHILOSOPHICAL AND ECONOMIC CULTURAL CENTER OF THE WORLD...THEN THE GALAXY...!!!!!



Damn, this is some good pre-workout...

[christpuncher]

What's most needed is a group of shitlords that have money to spend to take over the city councils of a medium sized college city, and ruthlessly persue a hostile agenda towards SJW causes and immigrant issues, while deviously supporting freedom loving, family values Christians.

Essentially, the reverse of current municipal practices... Throw the book at the liberals and obstruct their actions, while letting the conservatives get away with whatever they want to do, on the downlow.

To fuel the changes, concurrently get some rich guys to open their operations, and selectively hire the right kind of men only, as well as take over the service industry to ruthlessly cull the worst of the SJW college girls and drive them out of town with underemployment. This will aid the political side of thing by bringing in the right kind of voters.

With the local red pill government and business leaders in place, supplant the high level university administration, police administration and judiciary with worthy picks.

It will take initial external seed money for the political campaigns and business startups, but once the ball is rolling with supportive government and business infrastructure/practices in place, capitalism will work its magic for the city to thrive and profit.

Rich and/or motivated men should work in concert to target a specific city and turn it, then expand to bigger nearby cities.

[puckerman]

This book has many stories of "new country" projects, although its last release was in 1999. It's way out of date. I read an earlier edition and found it very informative though. Most of these ventures have collapsed, often due to dictatorial personalities emerging.

https://www.amazon.com/How-Start-Your-Ow...wn+country

The Free State Project is still very much alive, although they don't do much more than sponsor Porcfest every year. The goal of this project is to get people to move to New Hampshire and then get enough libertarians there to take over the state legislature. It's already one of the more libertarian states in the country anyway.

One thing I brought up during discussions of states for the Free State Project is that all nine states that were in the running were cold-weather states. I think this is one thing that has kept it from doing more.

Jeff Berwick has moved on to other things. He is an Acapulco now trying to get a bunch of libertarians to move there. I don't know how this will work out for them. It's more a case of people just getting together and doing their own thing though. He is Canadian, by the way, so he has never had any attachment to the USA.

[debeguiled]

So it seems to me that the whole problem with this kind of project would be finding a strong source of loyalty to bind a community together.

Race and ethnicity work to a degree. Look at the gypsies and the Jews.

Religion even better. Amish, Mennonites, etc.

You need some value that people will be loyal to that will keep them invested when the going gets tough and everyone is thinking fuck it at the same time.

I was part of a church for a while that had a strong traditional faith to hold it together, and yet it also had an openness to trying new ways of doing things.

It was kind of a mess, because while you may be able to get a couple hundred people in a room agreeing on general principles, trying to nail down specifics and getting anything done is completely another story.

The open, amorphous nature of the church also killed it because it was like every person had a different version of what the church was meant to be in their heads, and we'd get together for these brainstorming sessions about where we wanted to go, and it was like each individual was having their own little private fantasy that they talked too long about and then got their feelings hurt when everyone else didn't jump on board and make them king.

I have seen this problem in activist groups I was involved in as well. We might have only about twenty regular group members working on a project, and we would have three or four splinter groups.

Madness.

The problem was put succinctly by an old preacher I once heard (Not from that church!):

"We can get a man on the moon, but put five people in a family and ask them to get along? Can't do it."

So it would almost seem like a good idea would be to spend a lot of time investigating different personality traits and temperaments, trying to figure out a good mix, and then teaching everyone effective communication skills, conflict mediation, and how to get things done as a group.

Then you would be putting things in the hands of the psychologists, and when does that ever turn out well? Let's face it, a bunch of techniques and strategies cooked up to get along seem dry and dusty and disconnected compared to the shared practices of an ethnicity or the shared beliefs of a religion.

So what are we left with? I wrote this post after I came across an article by Jack Donovan who bought some acreage in the Pacific Northwest and is trying to put together a community of, it seems, manly pagans.

http://www.jack-donovan.com/axis/2017/07...damage.com

Now, don't get me wrong. I have liked some of his writing, and I listen to his infrequent podcast.

And the idea of a back to nature, shared spirituality, masculine community is kind of the thing we are talking about.

But when I look at the pictures of this, it makes me think of a bunch of gay satanists posing for each other in the forest.







I recognize that they are trying to solve the problem of finding true community in an atomized modern world, and there is value in that.

It's just that, well, you saw the pictures.

Seems to me like masculinity shouldn't have to try this hard.

This could easily end in mugshots.

[Leonard D Neubache]

Living in a small country community myself, I find this idea of having to structure the whole thing bizarre.

I lock horns with internet libertarians from time to time because I find they tend to be over opinionated gasbags who in the absence of an ability to assert their independence IRL insist on jetting about the internet screaming "respect my rights!"

But a smoothly functioning community typically relies on genuine, real life libertarians that simply come from a common culture with a common understanding of what it means to not be an asshole.

It's not complicated. My sleepy little community ticks along quite nicely without endless meetings and charters and constitutions. Sometimes people want to organise a refurbishment of this or a replacement of that. A small team will get together and hold a fundraiser. If people think it's worthy they chip in their money or other resources. If it's something that's not worthwhile then no resources come in and life goes on.

There's nothing wrong with sending out the call for people to move to a certain region or town, and beyond that just chilling out and enjoying each others company. People need to start thinking Wild West. Not hippie commune.

[911]

(07-26-2017 07:53 PM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

People need to start thinking Wild West. Not hippie commune.

(07-26-2017 12:39 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

So it seems to me that the whole problem with this kind of project would be finding a strong source of loyalty to bind a community together.

Race and ethnicity work to a degree. Look at the gypsies and the Jews.

Religion even better. Amish, Mennonites, etc.

You need some value that people will be loyal to that will keep them invested when the going gets tough and everyone is thinking fuck it at the same time.

I was part of a church for a while that had a strong traditional faith to hold it together, and yet it also had an openness to trying new ways of doing things.

It was kind of a mess, because while you may be able to get a couple hundred people in a room agreeing on general principles, trying to nail down specifics and getting anything done is completely another story.

The open, amorphous nature of the church also killed it because it was like every person had a different version of what the church was meant to be in their heads, and we'd get together for these brainstorming sessions about where we wanted to go, and it was like each individual was having their own little private fantasy that they talked too long about and then got their feelings hurt when everyone else didn't jump on board and make them king.

I have seen this problem in activist groups I was involved in as well. We might have only about twenty regular group members working on a project, and we would have three or four splinter groups.

Madness.

The problem was put succinctly by an old preacher I once heard (Not from that church!):

"We can get a man on the moon, but put five people in a family and ask them to get along? Can't do it."

So it would almost seem like a good idea would be to spend a lot of time investigating different personality traits and temperaments, trying to figure out a good mix, and then teaching everyone effective communication skills, conflict mediation, and how to get things done as a group.

Then you would be putting things in the hands of the psychologists, and when does that ever turn out well? Let's face it, a bunch of techniques and strategies cooked up to get along seem dry and dusty and disconnected compared to the shared practices of an ethnicity or the shared beliefs of a religion.

So what are we left with? I wrote this post after I came across an article by Jack Donovan who bought some acreage in the Pacific Northwest and is trying to put together a community of, it seems, manly pagans.

http://www.jack-donovan.com/axis/2017/07...damage.com

Now, don't get me wrong. I have liked some of his writing, and I listen to his infrequent podcast.

And the idea of a back to nature, shared spirituality, masculine community is kind of the thing we are talking about.

But when I look at the pictures of this, it makes me think of a bunch of gay satanists posing for each other in the forest.







I recognize that they are trying to solve the problem of finding true community in an atomized modern world, and there is value in that.

It's just that, well, you saw the pictures.

Seems to me like masculinity shouldn't have to try this hard.

This could easily end in mugshots.

That's exactly what it is. Neo-paganism is the final nail on the coffin of the long-standing social engineering campaign, those communities are very much the equivalent of 1960s hippie communes. It's also part of the fight against Christianity, the pillar of western traditionalism, paganism being the antichamber to satanism (not much daylight there with the blood sacrifices and archaic pre-Christian polytheistic deities).

At the root of the hippy movement is the weaponized anthropology concept of archaic revival, taking people back to a primitive state (but without the family structures) and making them anti-technology*. Hippy society conditions people to a de-industrialized future. Globalists are steering humanity towards this future through increasingly aggressive CO2 regulations and the new cult build around Catastrophic Anthropologic Global Warming, with people being made to feel guilty about using technology or of having children. That's also one of the messages with survivalist movements and media programs like Naked and Afraid, the concept that modern life is fundamentally unsustainable and that we're going to revert back to an archaic stage.


David Crosby and his father (a deep state operative)

Dave McGowan, Joe Atwill, Jan irvin, Jay Dyer did some great work documenting this, linking the hippy movement and most of its leading figures (including pop stars like The Grateful Dead, Byrds, Doors etc) to the deep state. !960s counter-culture was a tremendously successful social engineering project to destroy traditional society and debase/dumb down a whole generation.

With people like Jack Donovan, and other pagan neo-masculine movements, you see a new permutation of the hippy movement. Their leaders look more like Sonny Barger than Reagan or Trump. This is the leader of Quebec's La Meute, Beaudry:




*the other extreme is an all-embracing worship of technology at the expense of humanity, as in transhumanism, which globalists are also pushing, as part of their polarized dystopian future. You have that same dichotomy in works like HG well's Time Machine or The Planet of the Apes

[debeguiled]

You're preaching to the choir, 911, I listen to those guys too. Especially like Tim Kelly.

[ColSpanker]

As far as the deep state connection with hippies, all I can say is to never assume a conspiracy where stupidity will suffice. A lot of California hippies were from deep state families because they had the cash to let little Moon Star spend his formative years traveling up and down the coast smoking pot in search of himself. The dudes I knew from this time period were drafted or went to work in an auto plant.
Yeah, those Jack Donovan pictures look weird beyond belief. I've listened to some of the recent "Operation Werewolf" talks on YouTube and the guy has a lot of common sense to lay on people. Sounds as if he's learned the hard way about violence prone individuals in his organization. In the words of Pogo, "We have met the enemy and he is us". I don't see a lot of future for howling in the woods.
But I think the idea of founding an intentional group is a good idea, if nothing else but to push yourself. My problem is that I'm not much of an organization man, so I prefer to stay home. Even to work-out I like to hike by myself. Not much of a hunter, so I'm not interested in joining a local gun club.
As of late, I've looked into alt-spiritual groups to see what can be found. What I'd like to tell guys who are thinking about "Odin" or any of the Ald Godz, keep in mind most of these groups came out of the 60's and were founded by hippies. They still have that Woodstock mentality at the upper levels. I've found plenty of women in them, so there is that, although maybe not up to your standards. Most are filled with the worst kind of lefties imaginable. You only have to look at the Facebook accounts of some of these people to cringe. Plenty of the other groups are stuffed with "White Power" types, so be careful.

[debeguiled]

It's easy to dismiss permaculture as hippie shit.

This farm is impressive.

[fktax]

(09-05-2017 05:36 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

It's easy to dismiss permaculture as hippie shit.

This farm is impressive.

I don't really want to join a farm with a bunch of other forum members but I like this 1 acre small farm thing.

Anyone have experience with this permaculture stuff? Does it take a lifetime to learn or could I get set up in a few of years?