Quote: (04-06-2017 12:40 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:
Quote: (04-05-2017 04:41 PM)StackGsMan Wrote:
Joe Louis? The man that is considered the greatest boxer of all time by boxing experts? Let me guess, you're going to say Louis was old when he fought or the fight was also fixed.
Joe Walcott?
Archie Moore?
But before I even get into any discussion of boxing history, why don't we talk about my "nonsense".
Have you ever even boxed beyond going to a gym and throwing some jabs at some mitts? Keep in mind that any reputable gym asks new members to practice technique, mitts, and bags for at least a few months before even allowing light controlled sparring.
I actually have boxed. I've bloodied lips and noses. I've also been hit so hard I've had a light flash before my eyes and hit the ground. I've also picked blood out of my nose the day after sparring (hint: the blood is actually black the day after).
Have you done any of that?
Don't call me out on "nonsense" when you are a boxing KJ. Gain 15 pounds then spar with a heavyweight that knows what they are doing and tell me more about how a guy that never lost a fight and was knocking guys through the ropes was fixed by the mob.
Is it because he was Italian? Or maybe because you're black and can't believe a white boxer would be that good?
I never said Rocky Marciano was the best boxer ever, and he would have been crushed by either Ali or Tyson. But that doesn't mean he was garbage either just because of his style.
Is this you, I can't tell:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LPddiQXD9c
Marciano's fights were fixed by the mob, common fact. So I would put a huge asterisk besides his name.
I am more of a fan of Jack Johnson (greatest of all time) and Sugar Ray Robinson.
I have boxed, wrestled in high school and did muay thai for one year.
I won't comment on the race angle, I couldn't care less what colour he is. You already know the best boxers are black or latino.
I am done in this discussion.
It isn't common, and it isn't a fact that Marciano's fights were fixed. I've been around boxing for years, and I've never heard that accusation. It sounds to me like you're falling for a fairy tale that Italians were somehow connected to the mob simply because they were Italian and so was the Cosa Nostra. It's kind of like the white girl at the club who thinks all black guys can rap or are thugs because Tupac wore a bandanna.
Since you're familiar with combat sports, especially Muay Thai, you should know more than anyone that a warrior spirit has nothing to do with race. Marciano wasn't a boxer, his technique was appalling. He was a warrior that could take a brick wall falling down on him.
I don't agree that the best boxers are latino or black, I think that's a ridiculous generalization that dumbs down the entire sport.
Boxers, for the most part and with some notable exceptions like Ali, are usually born of two conditions (notice I said conditions after born): poverty and access to a culture that promotes boxing.
I've never heard of, and anyone can correct me if I'm wrong, an African born and raised boxer dominating any weight class or even achieving any marked success. They are black.
I've never heard of a Jamaican dominating in boxing at the top levels. They are black, and on top of that they produce some of the most athletic Olympic athletes every four years.
I've never heard of a Chilean boxer dominating, they are Latino.
I've never heard of a Brazilian boxer dominating (not sure if they are considered Latino as well), even though they have a huge presence in many combat sports including MMA.
What's the reason?
Because their country doesn't have a boxing culture. Same reason why America dominates basketball, because you can get a game going in just about every city at the drop of a dime.
America produced a lot of boxing legends because of the boxing culture it had, and almost all of them came from the impoverished ethnic groups. When the Irish were poor, they produced boxers. When the Italian were poor, they produced boxers. When the African Americans were poor, they produced boxers. Etc.
Now that boxing is in a huge decline in the US, because of the rise of MMA, guns, and the slow movement to draw everyone into what they think is "middle class", America is falling off the map in the boxing world.
Eastern Europe, Britain, and Latin America are taking over boxing, despite the race of the boxer.
As Forest Gump said, "that's all I have to say about that".
